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  1. #401
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostile View Post
    Those years and years were actually a bit over 3 years.

    - - - Updated - - -


    It's kinda funny when you think about it, by the time of cataclysm, 90% of the people who tried wow had quit.
    Dude, time changes. MMOs were the hit of 2000-2010 decade, I remember that every month or so a new MMOG was thrown out in the market.

    WoW would not have retained 10 millions sub even if the post WotlK exps would have been a blast in what people think would have been the “right” direction.

  2. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    Dude, time changes. MMOs were the hit of 2000-2010 decade, I remember that every month or so a new MMOG was thrown out in the market.

    WoW would not have retained 10 millions sub even if the post WotlK exps would have been a blast in what people think would have been the “right” direction.
    Indeed. part of the MMOC community seem to think wow could have retained all those 10 million players if the game was good, when in reality at the "best time" it lost 90% of the people who tried it.

  3. #403
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    you rly cant make an argument for retail lvling being better than classic,in the recent expansions the way the story is presented has improved and quest variety has improved but the 1-60 or until 80 ish,you rly cant claim retail has it better,you go entire levels gaining nothing,you barely ever feel that you are getting stronger,granted they are looking to fix this in SL,but the slow tediousness of classic isnt coming back,some people rly prefer that,because for them classic isnt just about endgame like these days
    One man, one different thought.

    I vastly prefer retail leveling. Because I’ve seen everything countless times and if I want to try a different class 1-120 with looms is quite fast.

    It takes way less to do 1-120 in ret than 1-60 in Classic. And it’s also far less boring because you have not to waste hours running here and there or farm countless mobs because you ran out of quest or die every 3 seconds because you pulled -wow- 3 mobs at once?

    I respect of course people that love Classic leveling but I don’t miss it at all.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostile View Post
    Indeed. part of the MMOC community seem to think wow could have retained all those 10 million players if the game was good, when in reality at the "best time" it lost 90% of the people who tried it.
    I see it with my son and friends: no way they’ll stick to a mmog, too time consuming, too much dedication.

    The genre simply lost appeal, regardless how cool (or not?) WoW still is.

  4. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by chiddie View Post
    One man, one different thought.

    I vastly prefer retail leveling. Because I’ve seen everything countless times and if I want to try a different class 1-120 with looms is quite fast.

    It takes way less to do 1-120 in ret than 1-60 in Classic. And it’s also far less boring because you have not to waste hours running here and there or farm countless mobs because you ran out of quest or die every 3 seconds because you pulled -wow- 3 mobs at once?

    I respect of course people that love Classic leveling but I don’t miss it at all.
    oh I agree with the speed thing,I cant imagine doing anymore 1-60 in classic either,but I still see the philosophy behind classic leveling to be better,even if i personaly dont want to do it anymore,I dont want to do it in retail either but im glad its atleast faster,that doesnt mean i think its better,hopefuly in SL it will feel better with speed and a sense of progression

  5. #405
    Quote Originally Posted by Evielution93 View Post
    I mean, let's be entirely fair. The whole reason these bosses took so long back in the day was a mixture of people not knowing what to do, less resources to teach them what to do, and Blizz overtuning the everloving fuck out of them, cough cthun cough. Now players have done all these bosses before, and Blizz is releasing them in a way where they were toned down from their initial insanity so they can be easier managed.
    If you go like this lets compare C thune with lfr N zoth.

    Both not killable on release. Later nerfed and free loot. I dont see the difference

  6. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    So, where are all these doomsayers now?
    From what I've seen they are saying Classic is dead now. Since no one has access to any numbers I think both camps are retarded.
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  7. #407
    Quote Originally Posted by Huggykaze View Post
    some sort of soft attunement weaved into things you'd have done anyway.
    i mean... that's good right? cause right after that you say:

    The attunements for Kara and Suramar dungeons were honestly extremely annoying. They didn't feel good neither in scale nor in giving you a sense of accomplishment, but they were there.
    you can say the same about MC/BWL attunements and a lot of TBC attunements in particular.

    So if you asked me, I'd say that in 15 raid tiers we've had 1 tier worth of actual attunements. Even if I agree to there being 3 tiers, it's still not enough to say "attunements haven't gone anywhere, they are just different now".
    depends how strict your definition is. you can go all the way from "quest that reward a literal key to open the door" to "a flag on your account". or if you think the words attunement and unlock are synonymous enough, you can go all the way to thinks like essences, neck level, world quests, etc being in a similar vein.

    like you may not have to attune yourself to instances on retail, but there sure is a lot of stuff you have to unlock on each individual character before it's "ready".

    but i still think it's just the evolution of attunements. just like quest have evolved over the years, dungeons have evolved, etc. A lot of features of the game have changed so dramatically over the years that they are only comparable on a very basic level.

    and ultimately: while i like the idea of (old style) attunements, the realist in me knows how big player turnover is in guilds and how big a pain of the ass it would be to constantly have to do them for new members. and i'm sure that sentiment will become prominent again once TBC classic comes around.

  8. #408
    Will pay for instant 60. End-game is where it's always at. I level multiplied toons to 60 back then, to 70, 80, 85, 90, 100, 120 (skipped Legion, bought boosts) - I don't need to spend a few weeks leveling another toon to 60 just so I can relive what was great end-game.

  9. #409
    Quote Originally Posted by Domm530 View Post
    Lol, no it has not been a huge succes. It had been what they expected, alot came to try and then 90% would quit
    That affirmation is idiotic and ignorant beyond measure.
    It's not at all what they expected (they planned for 6-8 servers at the beginning, they ended up with FIVE TIMES this number at the end).
    They expected a 90 % fall-off, which obviously didn't happen considering all but maybe two or three realms still are at above half pop (that's grade school math here). We're about regular fall-off from a retail expansion here.
    They changed how the servers are represented, medium and high has nothing to do with the amount of players are within the server.
    Actually that's the exact opposite : the servers were initially NOT about how many players are within (as pop was, weirdly, calculated relative to the highest pop server), and they did change it to reflect the actual pop of the server (due to one or two servers being so ridiculously overcrowded that they made every other look like they were at "medium" pop in comparison, even when they actually had several-hours long queue of thousand people).

    Everything you said has been factually wrong. Maybe educate yourself and stop sprouting shit before trying to lecture others.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hellobolis View Post
    And blizz definitely cashed in good. But i think long term player count, it's nothing above or below expectations.
    It's VASTLY above. Compare the number of servers they expected to start with, and the percentage of players they expected to be left with.
    They were so idiotically stingy on servers at the beginning because they didn't think people would keep playing longer than one month, and didn't want to release lots of servers that would end up empty and require a fall-back plan.
    In the end they needed FIVE TIMES the number of servers they planned initially, and EIGHT MONTHS LATER these servers are nearly all still at healthy population number (and many are still horribly overcrowded).

    If that's what you call "not above expectation", I don't know what to tell you.
    Last edited by Akka; 2020-04-14 at 08:26 PM.

  10. #410
    Herald of the Titans CostinR's Avatar
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    According to the data on Warcraftlogs over the last two weeks, you can see player counts here: https://ironforge.pro/servers/?filter=true&server=eu there's around 500.00 active raiders in WoW, and that's just the data on the logs. The person who runs warcraftlogs said there's more individual raiders showing up for classic then retail.

    There's fewer people that have done a single boss in Ny'alotha on Retail then there that on Normal.
    Last edited by CostinR; 2020-04-14 at 08:41 PM.
    "Life is one long series of problems to solve. The more you solve, the better a man you become.... Tribulations spawn in life and over and over again we must stand our ground and face them."

  11. #411
    Only trolls said classic will die, the private servers are a proof that you will always have classic or X expansion community BUT most that said the game popularity will go down after a while is right, anecdotal, but my friend list went from 15+ classic to 1/2 sometimes, not that classic is bad, the main problem is that in my opinion at the moment we are not on an MMO era of gaming, and no matter how good/bad classic/tbc, etc or shadowlands will be MMO era is done

  12. #412
    Old God Mirishka's Avatar
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    Anecdotal obviously, but my Battletag friends list atm has 86 people in retail/BFA, and 2 playing WoW Classic. Back when Classic first hit, it was pretty much the other way around, routinely saw 50+ of my friends playing it.
    Appreciate your time with friends and family while they're here. Don't wait until they're gone to tell them what they mean to you.

  13. #413
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Jackson View Post
    we playing the same game?

    stil better then EU - at least you dont have any servers on low like here

  14. #414
    just see what happens in orgrimmar on a thursday at 7 pm and tell me again, servers are dead

  15. #415
    The Lightbringer Jazzhands's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CostinR View Post
    According to the data on Warcraftlogs over the last two weeks, you can see player counts here: https://ironforge.pro/servers/?filter=true&server=eu there's around 500.00 active raiders in WoW, and that's just the data on the logs. The person who runs warcraftlogs said there's more individual raiders showing up for classic then retail.

    There's fewer people that have done a single boss in Ny'alotha on Retail then there that on Normal.
    Logs aren't really a good statistic to go off of, largely because raiding isn't as big a focus in Retail as it is in Classic, where it's nearly the only thing to do after a bit. On top of that, I'd wager a lot more Classic pugs are successful, and therefore logged and uploaded, compared to Retail, where people jump around between 4-10 groups to complete all the bosses. Pugs in Retail are rarely logged. Groups are also much smaller, typically less than 20, compared to Classic's 40, it's a lot more likely that someone will be logging in pugs. Raids are also more intimidating on live, and harder to get into thanks to strict pug requirements that typically require gear better than the raid drops. MC requires... Attunement.

    We also don't know who's an alt or not. Individual players, sure, but there are a lot of nolifers, especially right now, who have a lot of time and run a ton of alts through MC because of how easily it's pugged. The same applies to retail, of course, it's just another example of why logs aren't even accurate to get a bottom line, it could be 50,000 "individual characters" but we don't know if thats actually 50,000 people, because half of those could be alts.

  16. #416
    Quote Originally Posted by Akka View Post
    That affirmation is idiotic and ignorant beyond measure.
    It's not at all what they expected (they planned for 6-8 servers at the beginning, they ended up with FIVE TIMES this number at the end).
    They expected a 90 % fall-off, which obviously didn't happen considering all but maybe two or three realms still are at above half pop (that's grade school math here). We're about regular fall-off from a retail expansion here.

    Actually that's the exact opposite : the servers were initially NOT about how many players are within (as pop was, weirdly, calculated relative to the highest pop server), and they did change it to reflect the actual pop of the server (due to one or two servers being so ridiculously overcrowded that they made every other look like they were at "medium" pop in comparison, even when they actually had several-hours long queue of thousand people).

    Everything you said has been factually wrong. Maybe educate yourself and stop sprouting shit before trying to lecture others.


    It's VASTLY above. Compare the number of servers they expected to start with, and the percentage of players they expected to be left with.
    They were so idiotically stingy on servers at the beginning because they didn't think people would keep playing longer than one month, and didn't want to release lots of servers that would end up empty and require a fall-back plan.
    In the end they needed FIVE TIMES the number of servers they planned initially, and EIGHT MONTHS LATER these servers are nearly all still at healthy population number (and many are still horribly overcrowded).

    If that's what you call "not above expectation", I don't know what to tell you.
    and they were correct. both EU and US could easily use 5-6 servers less - it would be much healtier for game to have 5-6 servers all full then 15 servers where 3/4 are medium/low.

  17. #417
    Quote Originally Posted by CostinR View Post
    According to the data on Warcraftlogs over the last two weeks, you can see player counts here: https://ironforge.pro/servers/?filter=true&server=eu there's around 500.00 active raiders in WoW, and that's just the data on the logs. The person who runs warcraftlogs said there's more individual raiders showing up for classic then retail.

    There's fewer people that have done a single boss in Ny'alotha on Retail then there that on Normal.
    You need to remember that the most played raid difficulty, LFR, is pretty much never logged.

  18. #418
    Pandaren Monk Melsiren's Avatar
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    The only ongoing problem I see with classic is the amount of bots.
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  19. #419
    Almost a year after release and Classic haters are still mad and trying to shill that Classic is dead, stupid and nobody really likes it. I have never seen people more pathetic than Classic haters. You are literally mad that someone is enjoying a game you don't like.

  20. #420
    Quote Originally Posted by LedZeppelin View Post
    it wasnt dead on arrival and it wasnt the second coming of wow. like usual it landed somewhere in the middle and is doing just fine
    How dare you be sensible?

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