Torghast seems to be the holy grail of "rental power!"

[Omedon]

So I'm watching Towelliee streaming torghast (linked on the main page right now) and I have to say, this is rental power done right!

It's a contained environment where players can get diablo levels of overpowered, and it's literally one of the coolest gameplay features I've ever seen in WoW!

It's for one TO five players, operative and exciting word there being "TO."

It's possible that the power gain is in a testing state, but honestly, the place is infinite and is allowed to get subsequently harder and harder, *requiring* the contained, ridiculous OP player(s) to progress.

Expansion to expansion rental powers are a huge and valid talking point of much complaint/debate, but I can't help but feel that Torghast may be this concept finally applied correctly! I'm so hyped for this feature now!

[ryanmahaffe]

Torghast looks incredible. I've seen nothing but praise so far, it just seems like the best endgame system they have added in years.

For me it would be the best since heroic scenarios (I loved these okay)

[Darkeon]

It's definitely the thing I'm looking forward the most this expansion. Especially the flexible part of being able to solo it, or do it with a few friends.

Cautionated positive about it, but cautionated nonetheless. We've had good looking features implemented in the past that ended up as flops.

[FlubberPuddy]

Torghast looks incredible. I've seen nothing but praise so far, it just seems like the best endgame system they have added in years.

It needs to be a permanent endgame system imo. Alongside M+, Raids, PvP.

[Cosmic Janitor]

It's a rogue-like built on top of a pretty decent foundation. I wouldn't make this so much about rental powers and more about the fact that you can go crazy in an enclosed system when it comes to character progression.

Now I just hope I can play it on my terms in the final version and not have to beg for another run by scouring the map for carneval tickets.

[thilicen]

Contained within a single piece of content without affecting raids, pvp, etc. This is good.

[Drench]

I'm surprised so many people are excited for it. The horrific visions were super lame and felt worse than dailies.
Rogue-Likes/Lites are my favorite types of games but it seems super thin here. Looks like typically wow filler stuff for people who can only play an hour or two every few days. But is a quick fix for that addiction. Which is fine if the core RPG game is great. But it seems like they are focusing on stuff like this again and its all hype then meh when it comes about.

I hope I'm surprised and maybe I'm missing something...

[Omedon]

Now I just hope I can play it on my terms in the final version and not have to beg for another run by scouring the map for carneval tickets.

Totally agree with you on this point. The big piss-off for me with visions (which SEEMED built for me) is a) I have 30 alts and THAT UNLOCK QUESTLINE! and b) I have to "earn" my runs.

Torghast seems to be an "island expedition" level of ubiquity, and more importantly seems contained enough that there may be less reason to gate the heck out of it. Visions have the limits they do because they just flat out give you gear. I don't know how much torghast will affect the outside world beyond "run it and build legendaries," and how that will be doled out, but yeah, this is the detail to watch now, IMO.

[kamuimac]

So I'm watching Towelliee streaming torghast (linked on the main page right now) and I have to say, this is rental power done right!

It's a contained environment where players can get diablo levels of overpowered, and it's literally one of the coolest gameplay features I've ever seen in WoW!

It's for one TO five players, operative and exciting word there being "TO."

It's possible that the power gain is in a testing state, but honestly, the place is infinite and is allowed to get subsequently harder and harder, *requiring* the contained, ridiculous OP player(s) to progress.

Expansion to expansion rental powers are a huge and valid talking point of much complaint/debate, but I can't help but feel that Torghast may be this concept finally applied correctly! I'm so hyped for this feature now!

Thorgast will make rest of game feel like complete shit game to play .

when inside you will have like 2132131231 haste 1`12312312321 crit etc + milion "abilities breakers" normal game will feel boring like hell to play

will be hillarius to read forums topics like "my class feels fun only in thorgast - fix blizz"

[TickTickTick]

I'm surprised so many people are excited for it. The horrific visions were super lame and felt worse than dailies.
Rogue-Likes/Lites are my favorite types of games but it seems super thin here. Looks like typically wow filler stuff for people who can only play an hour or two every few days. But is a quick fix for that addiction. Which is fine if the core RPG game is great. But it seems like they are focusing on stuff like this again and its all hype then meh when it comes about.

I hope I'm surprised and maybe I'm missing something...

Torghast has as much in common with Visions as Warfronts have with MoP scenarios. Which is some (build upon general foundation), but being much more developed with basically a different purpose.

Visions were a testing ground to see what worked and what didn't. I wouldn't put a huge amount of hope in Blizzard doing it excellently, but many currently working systems were built on a previous testing of something similar.

[Queen of Hamsters]

Relieved to see positive feedback so far... Was sort of steeling myself for it being Warfronts and Islands wrapped up into a single disliked endgame system... <.<

[zlygork]

I'm surprised so many people are excited for it. The horrific visions were super lame and felt worse than dailies.
Rogue-Likes/Lites are my favorite types of games but it seems super thin here. Looks like typically wow filler stuff for people who can only play an hour or two every few days. But is a quick fix for that addiction. Which is fine if the core RPG game is great. But it seems like they are focusing on stuff like this again and its all hype then meh when it comes about.

I hope I'm surprised and maybe I'm missing something...

Visions are quite fine imo, their biggest flaw is requiring a grind that takes longer than the horrific visions themselves. The work to enjoyment ratio is just not justifiable.

OT: Very excited for this feature and seeing how it plays as a group vs solo

[Redroniksre]

I am glad to see people are liking it, i haven't watched anything of it so far but it is exciting news. I am waiting to see what they intend to do for the gear progression for this place.

[Powerogue]

I saw the mage "infinite blink but you move slowly" ones and it just makes me cross my fingers for monk infinite roll. Glad to hear some positivity on this.

[Omedon]

The work to enjoyment ratio is just not justifiable.

This is the best summary of visions and their biggest issue that I've seen. The whole "earn your runs" thing is just dumb. But again, I understand that it exists because visions directly pump out actual gear. Torghast's relationship with outside-tower power gain will likely be tied closely to its repeatability.

Again, Torghast seems to possess "Island expedition" level of core importance to the expansion, so hopefully there is an infinite use for it, even if there's a lockout of more gear-based rewards.

But.... Remember, if it's infinitely "useful" on a progression front, it's "mandatory to run all day" to those that will (unhealthily) do that... and Blizz have said they don't want that feeling of "mandatory to run all day."

[Vakir]

It really sounds incredibly fun, the feedback so far is terrific, and I'm really excited to try it out once I snag a key. Granted, this is how people felt about Islands at the start.

There's two things they need to get right for it to be enjoyed for the long term:

1. Make keys able to be obtained with relative ease. Daily cache? Key. Every couple of dungeons or so? You get a key. The problem with Visions isn't even earning them, it's the fact thatonly ONE source of content gives them and they're heavily capped. The source of content that does is one of the least engaging and the amount that the non-assaults give is still a pittance even after they bumped it.

I understand why they need to key them - if they give legendary reagents and possibly entire pieces of gear, it could be harmful to the game's chase if you get gear too easily, especially with them lowering the amount of gear obtained from other sources.

If too many keys means it's too easy to get gear, they should consider awarding rewards based on your "highest" floor the Tuesday reset. At least that allows people to play at their leisure and keep pushing higher without being locked out of content. There's been plenty of times I'd like to run a Vision to mess around with the system, even if I wouldn't get gear, and I couldn't.

2. Continued updates/iterations in each patch. The idea of different events (like the Beasts one in Torghast), maybe even changing them every week, will help a lot. Part of the problem with Islands besides that they weren't truly "unknown" is that cycling the reward pool ("This week is Troggs, Pirates, and Troll-boners!") isn't new content, it's just content you're missing out on. They also generally didn't touch them after initial fixes - adding a new map is not fresh takes on the same system.

It's important to remember that while a lot of systems in WoW have been a failure, sometimes they really nail it (M+). They could have another winner here.

[CerealLord]

But.... Remember, if it's infinitely "useful" on a progression front, it's "mandatory to run all day" to those that will (unhealthily) do that... and Blizz have said they don't want that feeling of "mandatory to run all day."

I believe the philosophy was that you'd need ot run it a certain amount of times to "cap" and then any runs after would contribute towards cosmetics.

[Schattenlied]

Contained within a single piece of content without affecting raids, pvp, etc. This is good.

Exactly...

This is where rental powers belong, separated from the rest of the game, so they don't effect the rest of the game, and it makes sense when they get left behind.

- - - Updated - - -

I believe the philosophy was that you'd need ot run it a certain amount of times to "cap" and then any runs after would contribute towards cosmetics.

That was for covenent stuff, Torghast was stated that once you finish your allotted runs you cannot run it further, because they believed people would feel like they needed to keep practicing so they could get further the next week.

[Omedon]

That was for covenent stuff, Torghast was stated that once you finish your alotted runs you cannot run it further, because they believed people would feel like they needed to keep practicing so they could get further the next week.

Alt armies. That seems to be the answer for those that want to enjoy more runs. With four covenants it's pretty much assumed most players will have at least one alt.

[Schattenlied]

Alt armies. That seems to be the answer for those that want to enjoy more runes. With four covenants it's pretty much assumed most players will have at least one alt.

While true, the alternative would be limiting it by account or having it be limitless, which would both be worse imo. A structured end point for each character is good.