Why cant nightborne be druids again?

[huth]

Then why give them priests? There are no Nightborne priest NPCs, named or otherwise, in the game. Like, at all. Why should the arcan'dor renew their connection to Elune and the Old Gods? There was no precedent to give them priests, aside from the gameplay one that says they need at least one healing class... which could have been solved by Arcan'dor druids.

There was a pretty big and important temple right next to it. It stands to reason that they still had some priests, even if they played no story role, since pre-sundering people are explicitly still alive. The only druids around are rather recent arrivals, and Night Elves to boot.

[Nathasil]

Then why give them priests? There are no Nightborne priest NPCs, named or otherwise, in the game. Like, at all. Why should the arcan'dor renew their connection to Elune and the Old Gods? There was no precedent to give them priests, aside from the gameplay one that says they need at least one healing class... which could have been solved by Arcan'dor druids.

Nightborne Priests are a complete lore abomination, i agree 100% with that. There is litterally nothing a Nightborne would believe in.

I still firmly believe that Nightbone as a simple skin for Nightelf mages would have been MUCH superior to this whole "allied race" BS that Blizzard vommited onto the game.

There was a pretty big and important temple right next to it. It stands to reason that they still had some priests, even if they played no story role, since pre-sundering people are explicitly still alive. The only druids around are rather recent arrivals, and Night Elves to boot.

Sorry, but you are contradicting yourself. Having a temple in front of your city that NOBODY of your race has entered for 10.000 years is a good argument to have priests, but having Val'shara on your doorstep is not for druids?

There was not a single Nightborne spirit or living NPC on the entire island of Broken Shore, let alone inside the temple. They were ALL Nightelves. Again, the exact same is true for Val'shara. So the two should have been handled exactly the same: Neither of both classes for Nightborne. There is not a single shrine or temple inside Suramar. Not a single NPC references something like a faith in any single line of the exzessive story campaign. It is obvious that Nightborne simply do not believe in the divine. They should not have priests.

Edit: I would also further add that the way in which Blizzard decided to have Thalyssra shit on Tyrande in her Horde-Bootlicking finale explicitly rules out any kind of relation to Elune at all. If you take "We will help you for now, Elune will guide us to what happens next." as an INSULT...then what kind of Elune devoted priest would join your cause?

[ravenmoon]

I mean the lore is there
Druids existed during the war of the ancients, before that dome went up and since they are night elves to begin with
They also have a thing callled botanists being researchers and users of nature. Botanist Tel'arn even turned himself into a treeant!
Like come on, they are more believeable than the harvest witches. "A group of people that use nature to help their agriculture." As far as I am aware, the first worgen were not Gilnean.
Troll druid lore isnt all that great either since it was just a guy that had a vision and suddenly he began training druids
In my opinion, the only reason there aren't any is because blizzard couldn't be bothered to make new druid forms. The nightborne has like 3 skin colors, no way they'd dedicate that amount of resources
Edit: Alright druid didn't exist till after the war of the ancients but the point still stands, even with their knowledge of nature how in the world did they become monks before druids??

There was a bit about this a whiel back. I agreed with the conclusion. It is likely that Nightborne didn't get druids because Highmountain did.. and if my suspicions are correct, Nightborne going horde came late or after Highmountain had already been developed. If they had gone alliance, they would be druids.
Could be the forms, but I dobut it, not at the rate blizzard designs stuff nowadays.
Lore wise - Night elves love nature, well all elves do. and in the early days they did all of it, nature, arcane, Elune, the nature users weren't developed enough to be called what we know as druids now, but they wre the predecessors to the fully fledged version Malfurion develops from Cenaruus' teachings. This means that Nightborne because of their past do have access, however access based on the past from something like 12/13k years ago won't be enough to qualify, especially the all out arcane life of under the shield
but then it is under the shield the botantists also advance in nature magic..
Nightborne have 2 additional lore justifications for durids which in my opinion are bigger than the first 2 mentioned above.
3. Valewalker Farodins and the Val'Sharah refugees working with the resistance :- in the Valewalker (who's druidic journey is even older than Malfurions as he was one of those pre-druids that worked with Highborne to coure addiction), the Nightborne have a very well respected friend - this is the guy whose work has saved them, literally. While prior to the events of legion, Nightborne would havelooked down on nature as no t worth the time, just like they did (i.e. all night elves) around the time of the 1st invasion), nature just saved tehir bacon, same with the sundering.. and now there is 10k years of history where Elf kind have wrought ground breaking changes with nature. Growing World Trees, guiding the evolution of the world, shrouding a continent in mist. Defeating the 2nd invasion of the burning legion, something all the arcane mastery of the night elves even in Legion with the Nightwell, wasn't able to do (actually in truth, on both occasions they never tried, having the leaders in control of the arcane power on the side of the Legion.
4. The Arcan'dor - basically the thing they now rely on, the replacement for the Nightwell, that is a balance between nature and magic. No elf in that city would turn their nose up at nature now. The aracan'dor is literally what balance druidsm is all about and combines the moon/star Night elf magical arcane expression with that of nature and solar for balance. This was 4th reason why joining the horde felt quite "not what they were meant to do" - but hey things can always change.

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They don't have any form of Druidism in their culture.

If that was the unbreakable rule for class playability, then Tauren, worgen and Troll would not be druids, cos none had druidism in their culture before they were playable. Each one had druidism introduced on the version the class became playable, not before. Before there was no trace of it. Tauren in Wc3 have no trace of it, Worgen in Silverpine forest, had none either, Trolls also had no trace of it before cata.

I think the Botanists and Gardens, followed by the Valewalker, druid refugess and Arcan'dor all in their story, would make nightborne probably the next race to get druids, because they already have these things their, not to mentiont heir kaldorie heritage - that easily explains both the nature love and the arcane affinity.

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Nightborne Priests are a complete lore abomination, i agree 100% with that. There is litterally nothing a Nightborne would believe in.

I don't think these things are set in stone, so I wouldn't go so far. It's presumptious. If you look at Night elf society in Suramar, it was the HQ of the Order of Elune, and Elune's most holy temple is what we just freed in 7.2

The Nightborne are mostly 10k years +, the societal interaction between the preist caste, the lower castes, the highborne would be something everyone is familiar. The city is littered with moon symbols, and shrines, and you can see statues of Preistesses too.

Occuleth even mentions with longing the prayers to Elune that use to ascend in the Temple at Falanaar where you do withered training.

As mage, he is not a devoted follower, only priests are, but like druids, you don't need to be a devoted follower to believe in Elune or say things like Thank Elune, where we would say thank God, or a human would say thank the Light - whether mage, hunter, warrior etc.


We also have precedent that the Highborne of Azsuna definitely had priests amongst them, as we see amongst the Farondis, these are likely highborne who became part of the horder, taking up the calling. Afterall, a noble who becomes a priest, is now considered a priest, but he is still of noble birth.

So would some be inspired to faith or pick up the faith they left behind?

Let's see:

1. The Nightwell, creat saviour of the last 10 k years - turns out was a false god, whose totally dependency actually ended up cursing the Nightborne elves to a fate worse than death.
2. The Nightwell not only gets them sick, but then is the source of the legion's attack too.
3. Priests lead the Elven charge to save your city - both Liadrin and Tyrande are priests.
4. A whole bunch of Priest refugees from the Nightmare in Val'Sharah are now amongst you once more, doing what they do best, healing and comforting.

It is very likely, with faith in the Nightwell completely shattered (at least for some), some would look to other things, like Elune and the stars (traditional kaldorei beliefs) or nature (druid beliefs) and other things.


In other words, it's not even improbable, it is plausible, and certainly ver far from impossible. And you have the class too, which is the definitive proof that this is there.

I would just end up adding that while you get a good taste of Kaldorei pre-sundering life of the invasion period when you visit Suramar in 7.0.1, you again aren't shown everything. This is always done intentionally , gives them room to add things they may need or want down the line.

[Highelf]

They don't have any form of Druidism in their culture.

Neither did humans until retcons. Think about that, Humans can be Druids...humans.

[ravenmoon]

Then why give them priests? There are no Nightborne priest NPCs, named or otherwise, in the game. Like, at all. Why should the arcan'dor renew their connection to Elune and the Old Gods? There was no precedent to give them priests, aside from the gameplay one that says they need at least one healing class... which could have been solved by Arcan'dor druids.

It's more likely that things have changed since the defeat of the Legion. And the arcan'dor.

we really don't get to see any of theose changes, or how profound ly things like the Arcan'dor, the Catehdral of Elune would have affected these peopel too. blizzard usually doesn't, you have to extrapolate using information and guess, and they may never confirm, the idea is for you to tell your story.

The only indication that the Arcan'dor replaces the Nightwell in the affection of the people is the cheer on the nightborne. There is so much that happens to them and the Night elves in legion, that it's almost negligently criminal not to explore. But it's not the first time that's been done. Look at WoD aftermath - who knows how that whole experience has shaped and changed the orcs.

what goes on in the expansion break they get in Legion? - completely forgotten in the rush for new shock factor war... this is wow story for you.

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Neither did humans until retcons. Think about that, Humans can be Druids...humans.

Haha, yes, I pointed out earlier to another fellow, that with the exception of Night elves and Nightborne, not a single race has indications of druidsm before they are added.

They are added, then backstory is added in some cases, or new lore in others.

• Tauren: WC3, not a trace or hint anywhere, 100% shaman culture from what is seen. After WC3, Malfurion teaches Hammuul = Tauren Druids
• (then Tauren are later shown to have had some Cenarius teachings after he left the Night elves (before Malfurion finds him)
• Worgen: The Gilneans have no druidsm in their history, and in fact, no curse of worgen (which was a Duskwood/Silverpine thing to give the werewolf vibe [if no one realised])/ This all came when the race was added with a druid class.
• Troll: Darkspear have no history, tie, connection or lore with druidism. Some confuse their priesthood and nature living as druidism, I'm not even going to explain, it isn't. They get lore introduced that leads druidism to happen
• Zandalari: Were never druids until they were introduced too: Naturally, the same Gonk who teaches Zentabra, also teaches his priests in Zandalar who would become druids.. but prior to that, there is no druidism.
• Kul'tiran: Never heard of the Drust, Gorak'tul and the version of Drust magic involved or associated with Kul'tiras till they were introduced. Kul'tira s has been around since WC2, nothing on that topic either.

But it's amusing to see people invent reasons why, as if "not having druidism" or any other class discipline culture in your race somehow excludes it from happening. We even got Orc mages and Tauren priests. I still haven't recovered from that.

[Syegfryed]

If that was the unbreakable rule for class playability, then Tauren, worgen and Troll would not be druids, cos none had druidism in their culture before they were playable. Each one had druidism introduced on the version the class became playable, not before. Before there was no trace of it. Tauren in Wc3 have no trace of it, Worgen in Silverpine forest, had none either, Trolls also had no trace of it before cata.

Trolls and taurens both were nature races, who had ties with the nature magic trough shamanism and wild gods/loa, we had seen trough all wow trolls turning into animals with the amani and drakkari

Rly cute people throwing away tons of reasons to elves be druids, but they don't realize those same reasons would justify things like gnomes, goblins and undead druids as well

Unless blizzard allow every race to be every class, there is no reason or logic to give druids to elves, when they are already too popular, already have most of the playable classes, and would steal the other half of the horde thematic, since druidism have shit to do with their arcane society.

[A Chozo]

Neither did humans until retcons. Think about that, Humans can be Druids...humans.

Kul Tirans can be Druids, because they have a Druid culture. Stormwind lads can't. If they introduce a new civilization of nightborne with druidism fine but until then... nope.

If that was the unbreakable rule for class playability, then Tauren, worgen and Troll would not be druids, cos none had druidism in their culture before they were playable. Each one had druidism introduced on the version the class became playable, not before. Before there was no trace of it. Tauren in Wc3 have no trace of it, Worgen in Silverpine forest, had none either, Trolls also had no trace of it before cata.

I think the Botanists and Gardens, followed by the Valewalker, druid refugess and Arcan'dor all in their story, would make nightborne probably the next race to get druids, because they already have these things their, not to mentiont heir kaldorie heritage - that easily explains both the nature love and the arcane affinity.

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You are correct. But current Nightborne have no trace of Druidism in their culture, which is the explanation why they can't have Druids. Maybe in the future. But now? Nope.

Also, botanism seems like some perversion of druidism. It's direct manipulation of flora to achieve a beautiful landscape. And even if they have druids in their midst, it doesn't mean they got a druidism culture going on.

[Trumpcat]

1. Class/race restrictions are an outdated clunky concept that needs to go as we already have numerous cases that contradict the already established lore which prohibits classes from being any race.

2. Class should be a combination of talents, interests and training for an individual, not a racial commodity. And then some races should have stronger affinity towards certain aspects of the cosmology that gives them boons for some classes. Such as elves having bonus to magic damage.

The only questionable combinations would then be Void/Light/Death, which currently exist, as well as Horde Druids that also exist. Would mention Horde Paladins too, but that would trigger 70% of the Horde players, so won't mention it.

[Gasparde]

I like how this is completely explained and you choose this of all things to say the lore doesn't make sense.

Not the island that nobody knew about cause "it had magic mist around it duh."
Not the literal demonic space army.
Not the manifestations of good and evil literally existing.

The elves who, after almost two decades, are finally starting to shed the visible effects of their former corrupting addiction, are the 'thing that doesn't make sense.'

If even evolutionary effects rooted in magic can fall off, why can't a Gnome Priest make the extra effort to become a Gnome Paladin? There's Gnome Warriors, there's Gnome Priests, after 1000000000 years alongside Humans and Dwarven, nowadays even Draenei, why is that still the part where things don't make sense?

Why does the racist idea of every Goblin is a greedy, selfish prick so you can't ever be a noble Paladin or a Druid still present to this day?

[Maljinwo]

Zandalari Druids are basically just troll who turn into dinosaurs because they worship a raptor Loa. The Balance spec also makes no sense for them either

Zandalari druids are Dinomancers, while their balance form is a result of their worship of Elune with the Lun'alai sect.
If anything, the Restoration spec makes no sense as you can't heal people by turning into a dinosaur, but game mechanics and shit

[Gasparde]

Whoever said everything made sense?

I literally said that most things don't. My point was that if literally EVERYTHING doesn't make sense, how is it that the ONE THING that does make sense is 'the thing that doesn't make sense'? Specifically, the 'moment the lore died' as you would say.

Because they keep killing the lore over and over for no particular reason.

They keep introducing new random shit that didn't make sense before they came up with a random made up whatever reasoning for it to now make sense. Like, yea, there totally are Night Elf Paladins out there, there's even a fucking Nathrezim Paladin. Seems like everyone can be a Paladin... unless the choice lies with the player, then only so many races can become Paladins.

This is just the latest attempt of them trying to shit on the lore for no other reason than why the fuck not. Blue-eyed dark-skinned Blood Elves have never been a thing - oh yea, don't worry, it's because they finally start to become clean. But still, my fucking Tauren can't become a Warlock because, apparently, Tauren can only do the good magic and are incapable of ever doing anything but that and there could be not realistic way to bend the lore to that... not even if we look at those Fel Tauren from Highmountain.

It's annoying that they're bending the rules and coming up with random made up excuses in one area while being unreasonably stubborn in areas that don't make any sense.

[RangerDaz]

you seem to think that the connection to nature magic is intrinsec to the elves, while the true is they acquired ir thrught training.

Not intrinsec, but tradition to elves, and to tribal races, somewhat similar to shamans, as Trolls and tauren have druids as well.
high elves and highborne abandoned the nature magic for arcane addiction through millennia, so they lost their druids i guess

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Horde already have 4 druid races, reg Trolls, Zandalari, HM and reg tauren.

That's my point? giving 5 druid races to horde, while alliance would have 3 would leave half of the players very unhappy lol

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Then why give them priests? There are no Nightborne priest NPCs, named or otherwise, in the game. Like, at all. Why should the arcan'dor renew their connection to Elune and the Old Gods? There was no precedent to give them priests, aside from the gameplay one that says they need at least one healing class... which could have been solved by Arcan'dor druids.

I guess priests exist in almost all races (orcs dont have them atm, dunno why).
Probably in wow lore it isn't hard for any race to worship the light and/or the shadow, and they are the primary class that mends the wounded

[Highelf]

Kul Tirans can be Druids, because they have a Druid culture. Stormwind lads can't. If they introduce a new civilization of nightborne with druidism fine but until then... nope.

You are correct. But current Nightborne have no trace of Druidism in their culture, which is the explanation why they can't have Druids. Maybe in the future. But now? Nope.

Also, botanism seems like some perversion of druidism. It's direct manipulation of flora to achieve a beautiful landscape. And even if they have druids in their midst, it doesn't mean they got a druidism culture going on.

The point being, there are 2 cultures of humans that can be druids, TWO. Humans can be druids, period, not based on ever having a history other than a made up retcon on the spot. So if humans can be druids, at that point just make every class for every race.

[RangerDaz]

The point being, there are 2 cultures of humans that can be druids, TWO. Humans can be druids, period, not based on ever having a history other than a made up retcon on the spot. So if humans can be druids, at that point just make every class for every race.

Well, to be fair Gilneas and Kul Tiras acquired Druidism through external ways, otherwise unavailable to the other human races.

Gilneas got it from the worgen disease which gave them shapeshift and with the aid and teachings from the night elves. Kul Tiras humans became friends with the last living Drust, who became their druid mentor. Without those external aids, they wouldn't be able to become druids.

[naeblis495]

At best i can see them as being balance druids ; Ya know , stars , moon and all .

But the the 3 others specs are big nono for them thematically .

[Highelf]

Well, to be fair Gilneas and Kul Tiras acquired Druidism through external ways, otherwise unavailable to the other human races.

Gilneas got it from the worgen disease which gave them shapeshift and with the aid and teachings from the night elves. Kul Tiras humans became friends with the last living Drust, who became their druid mentor. Without those external aids, they wouldn't be able to become druids.

Yes, the question isn't how, it's why. It was written with 0 history to it other than giving balance to druids in factions, nothing more. At this point, lets have dwarves be druids since they're inside the earth and mountains so much, Stoneform bear. Ram as travel form that can run up unpassable terrain. Also, Gnome Druids: mechanical animal forms.

[A Chozo]

The point being, there are 2 cultures of humans that can be druids, TWO. Humans can be druids, period, not based on ever having a history other than a made up retcon on the spot. So if humans can be druids, at that point just make every class for every race.

Almost every race has the physical capabilities to perform as any class, but if their culture has nothing to do with those classes, they simply won't engage into it.

Think about a Gnome Druid. Could gnomes be Druids? Probably, but why would they, if they can be Mages, Warlocks, etc?

Similar to Nightborne. In their culture, they don't have Druidism, and they do have other things, so they'll instead use those other arts. If you don't differentiate between Kul Tirans and Stormwind Humans, then lets stop talking about Nightborne and talk about Night Elves - who do have Druidism in their culture.

Go make a Night Elf or wait for a relevant group of Nightborne Druids. But as it stands right now, there's no Nightborne Druid nor Druidism in their culture save for a Arcane Tree that saved their civilization and it's caretaker, who's a regular Night Elf.

[Highelf]

Almost every race has the physical capabilities to perform as any class, but if their culture has nothing to do with those classes, they simply won't engage into it.

Think about a Gnome Druid. Could gnomes be Druids? Probably, but why would they, if they can be Mages, Warlocks, etc?

Similar to Nightborne. In their culture, they don't have Druidism, and they do have other things, so they'll instead use those other arts. If you don't differentiate between Kul Tirans and Stormwind Humans, then lets stop talking about Nightborne and talk about Night Elves - who do have Druidism in their culture.

Go make a Night Elf or wait for a relevant group of Nightborne Druids. But as it stands right now, there's no Nightborne Druid nor Druidism in their culture save for a Arcane Tree that saved their civilization and it's caretaker, who's a regular Night Elf.

The same can be said for every race except NE where they chose nature and it chose them to never practice the magic that brought the legion in the first place. Think about a Human Druid. Could Humans bedruids? Probably, but why would they, if they can be mages and warlocks, etc? The lore on classes is so watered down at this point that most doesn't make sense anymore.

[chiddie]

Race/classes combinations are a total mess nowadays.

If a combination does not exist is because Blizzard simply don’t care.

Don’t waste time searching for lore or logical reasons, there are none anymore.

[A Chozo]

The lore on classes is so watered down at this point that most doesn't make sense anymore.

Just because you lack knowledge of the races' cultures it doesn't mean Blizzard will throw what remains of the lore into the gutter. They have been very consistent with the race + class combos, and while some weirdness is there (wtf is even a Nightborne Warlock doing existing after all the chaos Gul'dan caused), there are reasons why each race can be Druids - Taurens, Worgens, Kul Tirans, whatever. The lore expands to explain it.

Right now? There's no justification for Nightborne Druids. There may be one tomorrow if the devs so wish, but today is not the day.