The Last of Us Part II

[un_known]

My opinion:

1) The game tries to be original and goes the opposite way of "fan service" (or whatever is called when you try to simply appeal to the fans)
I kinda applaud that. Very brave.
But...expect fans to be mad.
Like some fans were mad with Metal Gear Solid 2....remember? Was still an awesome game

2) If you dont buy this game because of a GODAM youtube channel dedicated to talk about those forbidden topics of MMO-C...i have zero respect for you.
Dont buy into this crap youtube channels. They are a cult.

Like with films books and games I decide on my own if it’s good or not, for all I know the rest of the game that wasn’t leaked might be good, but none of us know because we haven’t played the damn thing! This game is rumored to be 100gig and the clipsbthat have been leaked only show a very small portion of that.

[ThatsOurEric]

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLastOfUs...ployee_leaked/

IF, and I do mean IF, that post is true, then Naughty Dog got what they deserve.

[Witchblade77]

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheLastOfUs...ployee_leaked/

the original comment is interesting and very plausible. links to former devs talking about crunch culture were also pretty interesting. I've also read that they get around calling it crunch, but still keeping it crunch by assigning work tasks to be done on extremely tight schedule, so people end up staying late just to finish those tasks, even though technically they weren't asked to stay late. it also helps them get away without paying overtime as far as i know.

so part I doubt a bit more is how would that employee even know that higher ups got their bonus advances early? did they overhear by accident? were told by people who got those advances? how can they be sure? it falls apart when they claim they weren't given advance, cause than they would have to give it to everyone, but if its public knowledge that leads did get that advance, doesn't that kinda contradict the whole "we didn't want to give it to some, cause now it means we have to give it to all" ?

but being threatened with termination if they keep pushing for advance and not giving one despite there being an obvious need? THAT i can very much believe. unfortunately.

some of comments on that reddit thread though, dear god...


in any case. its possible that the way they handle these plot points can be very terrible. or its possible they are going to ace it, terrible working environment and all. I think that the plot points are very promising. for me, I'll know if they live up to the promise ONLY when I play the game myself.

[Kallisto]

My opinion:

1) The game tries to be original and goes the opposite way of "fan service" (or whatever is called when you try to simply appeal to the fans)
I kinda applaud that. Very brave.
But...expect fans to be mad.
Like some fans were mad with Metal Gear Solid 2....remember? Was still an awesome game

2) If you dont buy this game because of a GODAM youtube channel dedicated to talk about those forbidden topics of MMO-C...i have zero respect for you.
Dont buy into this crap youtube channels. They are a cult.

If MGS 2 was released today, instead of a small number of jokes that came out back then the internet would be in full meltdown mode with Kojima being attacked left, right and centre because he dared have Solid Snake replaced. (Hell with the right type of leaks it could be said the leaker could have it seem like Snake was the antagonist)

[Big Thanks]

Like with films books and games I decide on my own if it’s good or not, for all I know the rest of the game that wasn’t leaked might be good, but none of us know because we haven’t played the damn thing! This game is rumored to be 100gig and the clipsbthat have been leaked only show a very small portion of that.

Is just disappointing if people are letting themselves being influenced by the usual suspects of youtube.
My youtube feed was full of "AHAH look at this game AHAH so bad AHAH"
They were all from the "usual suspects" of youtube.

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If MGS 2 was released today, instead of a small number of jokes that came out back then the internet would be in full meltdown mode with Kojima being attacked left, right and centre because he dared have Solid Snake replaced. (Hell with the right type of leaks it could be said the leaker could have it seem like Snake was the antagonist)

We better put spoiler tags on this, my bad :S yeah i agree

[HailToTheKing]

[Kithelle]

I just want to say, as a trans person...I think it's totally stupid they made that character look almost like a guy because they're worried about what trans women would think.

[Witchblade77]

I just want to say, as a trans person...I think it's totally stupid they made that character look almost like a guy because they're worried about what trans women would think.

THERE IS NOT PROOF THAT ITS THE REASON OR THAT SHE IS EVEN TRANS.

just saying. that character litteraly looks like Linda Hamilton in Terminator 2. as weird as it sounds, lean ripped cis women can and do look like that!

[Life-Binder]

that character litteraly looks like Linda Hamilton in Terminator 2.

... no

[Edge-]

IF, and I do mean IF, that post is true, then Naughty Dog got what they deserve.

I generally put very, very, very little stock in "leak" posts from one-off reddit accounts that happen to jive with whatever the popular outrage opinion is.

Pay dispute: Checks out, that was part of the initial rumor.

"Hundreds of staff asking for an advance": Needs heavy citations. If this was true, I'd expect Schreier or others to be reporting on this already, or very soon. I'll wait for their reporting.

"Common industry practice to underpay workers and promise big bonuses": ...kinda sorta not really. Game developers generally make less that other software developers, but that's sadly just the nature of the game. Bonuses for sales or Metacritic milestones (the latter being less common nowadays) are common as well and they're just that, bonuses. Most studios are running on thin margins so they can't plan around every game being a big success to pay out big bonuses. The only studio I can think of that this really fits with is Gearbox, who have a pay structure that's confirmed to be far below industry standard but with far better bonuses if games do well to account for that.

"Planning big purchases around bonuses and being mad at ND when it was indefinitely delayed": Not buying this at all. The delay was Sony, who own ND. Every ND employee should, and would, know this and know that ND has no control over Sony saying "Put the game on hold until we tell you".

Advances to weather the coronavirus: Uh...they're still getting paid, they're still working. This one is confusing to me, because it seems to be conflating the alleged request for advances to pay for big stuff with requests for advances to pay for basic living stuff...despite them all still getting their paychecks every few weeks (or whatever their pay period is).

"Senior staff getting bonuses early": Again, big citations needed from the new reddit account with no other posts.

"Leaks forced their hand": Bullshit. Announcing a new global launch date is not something you can do in a matter of an hour/hours. And given that they had a PS Blog post from Herman Hulst, head of Worldwide Studios, announcing both the launch date of TLOU2 AND Ghosts of Tsushima, every indication is that this was a planned announcement and the leak was merely a coincidence.

This isn't directed at you, but just in general since there's so much about this "leak" that screams "someones fanfiction because they're mad that they just learned Ellie isn't into dicks"

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I just want to say, as a trans person...I think it's totally stupid they made that character look almost like a guy because they're worried about what trans women would think.

There is literally zero confirmation that this is actually a thing. Unless we're going to take some tabloid online rag without any sources seriously.

[Life-Binder]

because they're mad that they just learned Ellie isn't into dicks"

thats not what everyone is mad about tho

not at all

[ThatsOurEric]

that character litteraly looks like Linda Hamilton in Terminator 2.

Yeah, that's a definitely NO from me.

Look, I don't think anyone was expecting Abby, who's more than likely to be introduced as an outdoor survivor,
to look like Tomb Raider reboot Lara Croft before she had her physical changes in the later games.

Her being well built and muscular is fine. There are plenty of women who look a bit more masculine than feminine.
Sara Connor, Ellen Ripley, and even Game of Throne's Brienne of Tarth (Gwendoline Christie) are all examples of
that, but even then, there is still something about them that does still tell you, they are women.

You take a good look at Abby, and hell no, Abby looks straight up like a man. There are professional body builder
women who have muscles on top of other muscles that look more like women than Abby does.

And in all honesty, I feel that her appearance is made purposely to make her look more menacing/antagonistic
than because of her actual body-type. Which is the wrong direction to go in.

This isn't directed at you, but just in general since there's so much about this "leak" that screams "someones fanfiction because they're mad that they just learned Ellie isn't into dicks"

No offense taken. I'm taking that "revelation" with the tiniest pinch of salt, but Naughty Dog's crunch
and their methods surrounding it are notoriously terrible. I mean there's a lot going on there that
speculation of negative practices going on there isn't completely out of the question, given the many
departures.

[Tech614]

Pay bonuses are given based on reviews and sales of the game, so obviously they aren't given out in advance and even if you think the leaks only effect a tiny portion of sales or reviews it could still impact their bonus pay negatively.

So either that "reddit no source leak" is bullshit(likely) or the person that did it is a complete moron(unlikely).

More then likely it wasn't some low level employee relying on bonus to pay their bills, it was a higher up having a bigger dispute with the company and leaving. This is the type of thing that ruins your career if you get caught so I highly doubt it wasn't someone fully financially stable.

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Yeah, that's a definitely NO from me.

Look, I don't think anyone was expecting Abby, who's more than likely to be introduced as an outdoor survivor,
to look like Tomb Raider reboot Lara Croft before she had her physical changes in the later games.

Her being well built and muscular is fine. There are plenty of women who look a bit more masculine than feminine.
Sara Connor, Ellen Ripley, and even Game of Throne's Brienne of Tarth (Gwendoline Christie) are all examples of
that, but even then, there is still something about them that does still tell you, they are women.

You take a good look at Abby, and hell no, Abby looks straight up like a man. There are professional body builder
women who have muscles on top of other muscles that look more like women than Abby does.

And in all honesty, I feel that her appearance is made purposely to make her look more menacing/antagonistic
than because of her actual body-type. Which is the wrong direction to go in.



No offense taken. I'm taking that "revelation" with the tiniest pinch of salt, but Naughty Dog's crunch
and their methods surrounding it are notoriously terrible. I mean there's a lot going on there that
speculation of negative practices going on there isn't completely out of the question, given the many
departures.

I call bullshit on this because I never mistook Abby as a man at all. She looks like a built woman, not all that different from Charlotte Flair before her boob job or Rhea Ripley currently which are big ass women that are pro wrestlers. If we go all the way back to the Paris Games Week cinematic years ago where she was first shown and nobody had any clue who she was, if you're telling me you thought she was a male I'm gonna call BS on that.

[YUPPIE]

naughty dog has never made a good game other than crash bandicoot. The uncharted games were all linear cinematic goo goo ga ga flair with no soul and the Last Of Us was no different.

I miss when games were games and hopefully this crap puts more things like Souls games and Mario back on the map

[Tech614]

naughty dog has never made a good game other than crash bandicoot. The uncharted games were all linear cinematic goo goo ga ga flair with no soul and the Last Of Us was no different.

I miss when games were games and hopefully this crap puts more things like Souls games and Mario back on the map

Crash Bandicoot was linear and cinematic.

Do you have any clue what you're talking about? You think cartoony graphics suddenly changes the fact Crash was running over straight linear levels with backgrounds and obstacles to set up set pieces? Literally the exact same formula Uncharted uses except with shooting as the main gameplay feature and not platforming. Hell if anything Uncharted is far more open ended and non linear then crash(still pretty linear tho).

[YUPPIE]

Crash Bandicoot was linear and cinematic.

Do you have any clue what you're talking about? You think cartoony graphics suddenly changes the fact Crash was running over straight linear levels with backgrounds and obstacles to set up set pieces? Literally the exact same formula Uncharted uses except with shooting as the main gameplay feature and not platforming. Hell if anything Uncharted is far more open ended and non linear then crash(still pretty linear tho).

c'mon, you really can't compare platforming masterwork like Crash Bandicoot to a hallway shooter just because you don't want to admit it. It's not like I'm really disparaging Naughty Dog that much considering I do think the OG Crash games and the remaster are among the *best* out there. I just fucking hate Uncharted and Last Of Us, they're literally movies with no depth or challenge. And they set the tone for a lot of wannabe trends in gaming to follow.

[Tech614]

c'mon, you really can't compare platforming masterwork like Crash Bandicoot to a hallway shooter just because you don't want to admit it. It's not like I'm really disparaging Naughty Dog that much considering I do think the OG Crash games and the remaster are among the *best* out there. I just fucking hate Uncharted and Last Of Us, they're literally movies with no depth or challenge. And they set the tone for a lot of wannabe trends in gaming to follow.

"Hallway" is a more appropriate term to use for Crash then Uncharted. Uncharted is far more open ended then Crash is. Again I ask do you have any idea what you're talking about? Crash is literally running down a hallway for 3 entire games.

Also lol @ no challenge. Beat TLOU on grounded and talk to me, Crash being talked up as difficult with depth? Heard it all now.

[YUPPIE]

"Hallway" is a more appropriate term to use for Crash then Uncharted. Uncharted is far more open ended then Crash is. Again I ask do you have any idea what you're talking about? Crash is literally running down a hallway for 3 entire games.

Also lol @ no challenge. Beat TLOU on grounded and talk to me, Crash being talked up as difficult with depth? Heard it all now.

uncharted is not open-ended. That's something you can maybe make an argument for TLOU in terms of setpiece approach (considering it's a hallway simulator in progression). Uncharted is just going into one arena after another, killing enemies then doing a halfassed puzzle sometimes.

All I'll say is I think God of War 2018 is an excellent example of subverting the "movie game." It looked like God of War was gonna sell its soul out to be a cinematic railroad experience but turned out to be one of the best games ever made

[Tech614]

uncharted is not open-ended.

Nobody ever said it was genius. It's far more open ended then crash, which is saying something. So trying to pump Crash up as some non linear shit is the most hilarious part of this thread so far.

[un_known]

THERE IS NOT PROOF THAT ITS THE REASON OR THAT SHE IS EVEN TRANS.

just saying. that character litteraly looks like Linda Hamilton in Terminator 2. as weird as it sounds, lean ripped cis women can and do look like that!

i thought it were Ellie in the trailer that introduced Abby