Common Sense For WoW Characters 101

[Darth-Piekus]

World ends cuz alliance alone can't stop the legion from destroying the world tree in the reign of chaos.

Will it end though? That might not be nessesarily the case. Many events that happened because of the Orcish Horde wouldn't have happened and the Kingdoms could as well be more powerful and Archimonde would not have been summoned. Another example is Alternate Draenor. Our meddling there saved both Draenor and Azeroth.

[Combatbutler]

Will it end though? That might not be nessesarily the case. Many events that happened because of the Orcish Horde wouldn't have happened and the Kingdoms could as well be more powerful and Archimonde would not have been summoned. Another example is Alternate Draenor. Our meddling there saved both Draenor and Azeroth.

https://wow.gamepedia.com/The_Black_Morass_(quest)

Indeed, if the orcs never make it to Azeroth, the Alliance will never form. Eventually civil war will break out, further weakening the human kingdoms.

Ultimately the Burning Legion will invade Azeroth, destroying it in the absence of any defenders.

[Powerogue]

https://wow.gamepedia.com/The_Black_Morass_(quest)

Indeed, if the orcs never make it to Azeroth, the Alliance will never form. Eventually civil war will break out, further weakening the human kingdoms.

Ultimately the Burning Legion will invade Azeroth, destroying it in the absence of any defenders.

I forget what justification was given for why we had to help Arthas. Kill him off, prevent him from stopping Illidan when he tried to destroy the frozen throne, which would have annihilated the Lich King. Seems like a win/win to me, it's not like the bronze dragonflight have stopped themselves from retconning things when it suits them before (like us stealing the dragon soul).

So really Nozdormu should've time traveled with Murozond and asked him why they were screwing up all that stuff. Who knows, maybe Dragonblight got effed but the rest of the world was fine? No one would've missed Baine anyway.

[Beerbill Society]

Will it end though? That might not be nessesarily the case. Many events that happened because of the Orcish Horde wouldn't have happened and the Kingdoms could as well be more powerful and Archimonde would not have been summoned. Another example is Alternate Draenor. Our meddling there saved both Draenor and Azeroth.

Most likely, the horde itself was an attempted to invade Azeroth for the Legion, so it failing would still imply other attempts.

And for what I recall the events of Reign of Chaos weren't related to the Horde (except the ending where the orcs help to stop the scourge from taking Hyjal and killing Mannoroth).

So I guess the events would still happen.

And AU Dreanor is exactly that an alternate version of "ours", Blizzard did this so the events there wouldn't impact the current Azeroth timeline (like it happens with Caverns of Time), so the events of AU and even the people there don't actually reflect what would've happen (hopefully that makes sense). Although even if that was not the case the influence we made there impacted major events of Dreanor, whereas I don't see how Azeroth Horde actions would change the creation of the scourge and the events that lead to RoC.

[matrix123mko]

This is a weird statement. There's no reason to believe that any other character would have done a worse job, and Sylvanas has done next to nothing to help against the Legion (similar to any other leader really, on both Alliance and Horde side). The Class Orders, Dalaran and Illidan stopped the invasion.

She commanded defense of Horde land. She also gave a fleet to the player to use for his endeavours. Did Anduin give player a fleet?

I'm not talking about the Maw. I'm talking about her general hate for the living, wanting everyone to die and be turned. "What difference is there between you and the Lich King now, Sylvanas?" "Isn't it obvious, Warchief? I serve the Horde."

And what's wrong about it? Turning Alliance undead is actually a good thing to do. Garrosh is just a lunatic that cannot accept any kind of magic used in first war.

How is that stupid? The Horde did all they could to help defeat the Lich King. Saurfang himself lost his son and then saw him turned. As said by Garrosh himself, what she's doing is against the very nature. Any other leader would have locked her after witnessing it firsthand, but oh well... Garrosh lacked common sense in many departments.

It is terribly stupid. In what world you stop using a weapon just because someone used it against old man's son? Maybe Horde should ban swords, as Horde did all they could to defeat Alliance. Many orcs lost their children and saw them stampeded by Alliance cavalry. Any leader would have locked Lor'themar after witnessing him using sword firsthand.

The only difference between her and the Lich King was that she had boobs and her throne was underground and not in a frozen wasteland. Also I don't remember any necromancers in the Horde, at least not in the WoW's Horde.

Kel'thuzad started researching necromancy only because he saw its power during second war. The power that was used by armies of Orgrim Doomhammer, predecessor and master of Thrall.

Were there any decisions with importance on the level of appointing a new warchief, based only on "the light"? Again, can't recall.

Turalyon commited huge army to Outland because he decided that "Light cannot allow orcs to reach other worlds".

Also, didn't Alliance give all political power to one person just because of its heritage? This is a definition of irresponsible way of electing a leader.

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The portal Illidan made, back in his novel

But Velen started building Vindicaar after his son's death. I think he would have used it despite Illidan's help. If anything, it would take additional 25000 years for him to do so.

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Meh, not sure that mages who were killing each others to gain power while eating the energy of a demon and succombing to madness would be my first choice for safety.
But, well someone who attack the horde then get hit back by the logical retaliation would not be my first choice to lead a neutral group either.

Meh.

She should be. She is a human so she is always right. Especially if she wants to give power to purple elves instead of orange elves. Orange elves are evil because they have warlocks that humans don't have at all.

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Jaina: "Dismantle the horde"

Varian dismantles the horde. End of WoW. Curtain

Thrall: *casts Sundering*

[TickTickTick]

@matrix123mko You're insane. There's no point arguing with you since it's painfully obvious you're just another Sylvanas fanboy. You fail to point to any sources of your statements, and half of them are bullshit anyway. I, too, can make up shit on the run, which is not based on Warcraft's lore (or factual events in this universe), but I prefer to just discuss on a neutral ground.

When you base your opinions on actual quotes or events, I'll get back to you, boy.
[Infraction]

[ReVnX]

Thrall: *casts Sundering*

Jaina: *Laughs and floods Orgrimmar*

But I get the horde bias in this thread.

[Darth-Piekus]

Most likely, the horde itself was an attempted to invade Azeroth for the Legion, so it failing would still imply other attempts.

And for what I recall the events of Reign of Chaos weren't related to the Horde (except the ending where the orcs help to stop the scourge from taking Hyjal and killing Mannoroth).

So I guess the events would still happen.

And AU Dreanor is exactly that an alternate version of "ours", Blizzard did this so the events there wouldn't impact the current Azeroth timeline (like it happens with Caverns of Time), so the events of AU and even the people there don't actually reflect what would've happen (hopefully that makes sense). Although even if that was not the case the influence we made there impacted major events of Dreanor, whereas I don't see how Azeroth Horde actions would change the creation of the scourge and the events that lead to RoC.

You have a point but on the other hand the Old Alliance was weakened greatly by the two wars with the Horde and that also includes problems that the Horde created after they were beaten like the Scourge creation, the taxes for the camps and other events. I find it hard to believe that the Kingdoms would have destroyed each other worse than what the Horde did to them.

[matrix123mko]

Jaina: *Laughs and floods Orgrimmar*

But I get the horde bias in this thread.

Thrall can remove Jaina from existence. He is the Earthwarder, the World Shaman.

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@matrix123mko You're insane. There's no point arguing with you since it's painfully obvious you're just another Sylvanas fanboy. You fail to point to any sources of your statements, and half of them are bullshit anyway. I, too, can make up shit on the run, which is not based on Warcraft's lore (or factual events in this universe), but I prefer to just discuss on a neutral ground.

When you base your opinions on actual quotes or events, I'll get back to you, boy.

I see I won the discussion. You cannot disprove my arguments so you pretend that they do not exist.

[Halyon]

Alternative

Sylvanas uses her banshee screams to break Jaina and Alleria's concentration so they can't port away from the blight,

or Sylvanas just shoots Genn instead of playing with him, or shoots him a second time after shooting him the first time.

Or Sylvanas has Everyone infront of Orgrimmar blighted since they all lined up in neat little rows for her.

It would never have come that far if the writers had any sense on our behalf and balls on their own.

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Jaina: *Laughs and floods Orgrimmar*

But I get the horde bias in this thread.

And alliance players moaned their asses off after Sylvanas burned down 1 tree that wasn't a much larger capital city.

[Nfinitii]

Listen up, teachers! Everyone knows not every action done by the WoW's NPC characters makes sense. This is your opportunity to change a moment in history for the better, by tweaking the situation to where they don't do something stupid.

Examples:

Anduin: Why didn't you kill me?

* Saurfang crushes Anduin under his boot *


Vol'jin: Ya be no warchief o' mine! You haven't earned my respect!
Garrosh: Then how would I earn your respect, Vol'jin? Thrall once earned the loyalty of all the races of the Horde. If I must do the same so that we may crush the Alliance under our heel, then so be it.
Vol'jin: Perhaps I misjudged ya, Garrosh. I tink ya be well on your way already. I'll ready my forces. Farewell, warchief.


With all the criticism of BFA in particular I'm sure we can come up with some great ones, let's get this thread rolling!

I think what u don’t understand is people are imperfect, they don’t always do the “smart” thing.

And by “smart”, I mean the thing u think should have happened. U have more information than the character ur watching, that alone means u have a different perception on what is happening than the character in that moment. Your personality is also different, your not going to always react the same as the characters ur watching.

It’s less interesting watching a character that always makes the “correct” decision and is never wrong. Imperfections is what makes characters interesting, not perfection.

[TickTickTick]

I see I won the discussion. You cannot disprove my arguments so you pretend that they do not exist.

No, it doesn't work that way. How can I disprove your stupid statements? You say that Sylvanas raising Alliance members is perfectly fine - do you really think the Horde joined the war against the Lich King only because he wasn't part of the Horde? Since we are in a "Common Sense For WoW Characters" thread - every Horde leader would quickly realize that after defeating the Alliance and turning them all, Sylvanas would make the Horde her enemies, because they are also part of the living.

On second thought though... nevermind. You're Sylvanas fanboy, so no matter how much sense I speak (inb4 you telling me I make no sense), you'll still speak dumb shit, like demanding me disproving your bullshit statements. Feels like a typical GOP supporter (if you're from NA).

And btw - discussions aren't "won" or "lost" because it's not the point of discussion. If you go into forums with a sole purpose of "winning discussions" then you're missing the point.

[matrix123mko]

No, it doesn't work that way. How can I disprove your stupid statements? You say that Sylvanas raising Alliance members is perfectly fine - do you really think the Horde joined the war against the Lich King only because he wasn't part of the Horde? Since we are in a "Common Sense For WoW Characters" thread - every Horde leader would quickly realize that after defeating the Alliance and turning them all, Sylvanas would make the Horde her enemies, because they are also part of the living.

Not really. They are on different continent and Sylvanas wouldn't care. Her goal was to remove humanity from Eastern Kingdoms.

On second thought though... nevermind. You're Sylvanas fanboy, so no matter how much sense I speak (inb4 you telling me I make no sense), you'll still speak dumb shit, like demanding me disproving your bullshit statements. Feels like a typical GOP supporter (if you're from NA).

I could say the same about Alliance players. That's how they work.

And btw - discussions aren't "won" or "lost" because it's not the point of discussion. If you go into forums with a sole purpose of "winning discussions" then you're missing the point.

Discussion can be won. There are rules of debate that decide who wins.

[Highelf]

Alternative

Sylvanas uses her banshee screams to break Jaina and Alleria's concentration so they can't port away from the blight,

or Sylvanas just shoots Genn instead of playing with him, or shoots him a second time after shooting him the first time.

Or Sylvanas has Everyone infront of Orgrimmar blighted since they all lined up in neat little rows for her.

Nope I like his much better.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Nope I like his much better.

That's fantastic, doesn't really invalidate what I said considering the entire point of the thread was to give "if common sense was followed." The entire power rangers club would be dead, unless shouting "Nope!" makes them invincible.

[Highelf]

That's fantastic, doesn't really invalidate what I said considering the entire point of the thread was to give "if common sense was followed." The entire power rangers club would be dead, unless shouting "Nope!" makes them invincible.

You took that very personal. All I said was that I liked his better than yours.

[TickTickTick]

Not really. They are on different continent and Sylvanas wouldn't care. Her goal was to remove humanity from Eastern Kingdoms.

Lmao. I wonder why the Horde joined the fight against the Iron Horde or the Legion then. Their presence was also on different continents, or planets even! Your mental gymnastics are surely impressive, but I'm afraid you haven't heard the olympics has been postponed.

I could say the same about Alliance players. That's how they work.

Irrelevant, since I'm playing Horde from the very begining. My point still stands, and the fact your excuse is "other fanboys are doing it too" only enforces it.

Discussion can be won. There are rules of debate that decide who wins.

Discussion is not a competition - at least for an intelligent human being. Discussion is also not a debate, so don't mix those too. Of course, there are some people that feed off of some kind of weird self-fulfillment, and writing the words "I've won" surely gets them off. If you need a sense of competition so much, maybe go play some football? Although this requires actual confrontation with people and saying bullshit might actually result in a punch in the face, so be warned.

Still waiting for some references to the statements you provided, btw You've been deflecting this responsibility for 3 posts already, and we're still counting. And NO - it's not my responsibility to disprove your statements.

[Darth-Piekus]

No Sylvannas would not be able to stun all 3 powerhouses and Genn when she was surrounded in Lordaeron's Throne. She used her Banshee Scream after all during her escape and it didn't work. Sylvannas is a character that likes to monologue. It's not in her nature to Scream in the middle of a monologue. The most likely scenario is one of the powerhouses kills her instantly bin the middle of the monologue.

It would be more possible if she tried to kill Genn when he was retreating after Eyir flew away but consider the fact that she could have died 3 times in that scenario from events that would easily happen before. For example Genn doesn't talk and jumps from an alcove using a sword to decapitate her instead of talking and revealing his presence or since she was alone Genn goes with an army in there or Eyir disintegrates her the moment she's freed.

I doubt she had Blight during the Siege of Orgrimmar and even if she had Blight she would prefer two armies clashing with each other creating way more deaths for the Maw. The Blight Catapults might not have been able to hit the army from that range and that might have created disagreements and disorder in her army inside Orgrimmar.

As for the first Siege of Orgrimmar we all know the Horde leaders were surrounded. Thrall used to be the Earthwarder but he was powerless in that situation since the elements were tortured for miles around thanks to Hellscream, Sylvannas was a simple archer back then with a screech that rarely worked ,Gallywix was without his armor and pretty much useless and I doubt Baine would even fight. Only Voljin the Shadow Hunter was the strongest Horde character present but I doubt he would be able to do anything. Jaina alone could turn them into popsicles in an instant letting the guards carry the icebergs with ease to a cage or something. She's done that in Undercity and in many other situations. I don't see why that wouldn't happen again.

I know that some people do not like their characters losing but instead of creating impossible scenarios that would never happen just to avoid seeing your favorite character lose how about your argue on other more possible scenarios.

[Eucep]

Why did Deathwing just stop after 4.0? Did he need a nap? Come to think of it, why didn't he just end the world if all he needed to do was go to the Maelstorm?

Not being facetious here, I'm legit curious if we ever got an explanation.

Best clue we ever got from the game was that he at that point was already completely insane thanks to the influence of N'zoth. Likely once his initial rage was done he was back to scemer mode so forgot to use his powers. But, an insane scemer cannot really plan long term. Not to ignore that the twlight hammer worked seperate from him anyway to do the old gods bidding.

And that old god kind of had no real interest in the final cataclysm scouring life off Azeroth. Naughty Deathwing no break to many toys which could potentially speed up breaking his jail.

The dragon soul was simply a means to get rid of a hard to control toy after it sowed what was needed for the old god.

[Super Dickmann]

And that old god kind of had no real interest in the final cataclysm scouring life off Azeroth. Naughty Deathwing no break to many toys which could potentially speed up breaking his jail.

The dragon soul was simply a means to get rid of a hard to control toy after it sowed what was needed for the old god.

While "lol he's insane" is crap and I don't quite buy it, I do think your version is the closest we can get to it making some sense. Essentially, they wanted Deathwing to pop the Cataclysm to damage the mortal races, lead them into conflict and loosen the bonds of his prison. But Deathwing actually succeeding wasn't in their interest, since a destroyed world couldn't have its world soul nabbed by N'zoth to become the Void Titan they were after. Hence Murozond mentioning that this isn't the true Endtime. It's just a world where Deathwing succeeded, and where the Old Gods killed him because he'd run his course and had ultimately failed. It's just that it was a destructive enough scenario that it'd get the Aspects to depower themselves to stop it and take one more group off the board.

Yeah, that'll do as far as intended explanation goes. A shame N'zoth got sidelined to a patch.