Should the government do another round of stimulus checks?

[Not A Cat]

I'll take it one step farther, give me the locality and I will show you the 5 surrounding area's that either govt agencies or corporations have started programs that allow you to defer monthly payments on things like Rent and utilities.

its really not that big of an assumption when they publish how much money each week is being paid out in both aggregate and averages. Sure there are still a lot of people whom have not got their first check on unemployment but how many of them have also not received the 1200+ and deferrals on expenses? I bet that number is a lot smaller than you think.




Most people in your area?

Well good thing "your area" has suspended all evictions
https://www.boston.com/news/local-ne...ns-coronavirus

The Massachusetts Legislature put out an emergency declaration that prevents evictions by sheriffs and constables as well as foreclosures of residential property.

They are even funding programs to help those whom do not get unemployment
https://www.boston.gov/departments/n...al-relief-fund


What about all those other expenses you have to pick and choose?
Like electric? How about the two companies and their subsidiaries that cover most of the state you ask?

National grid:
Effective March 13, 2020, National Grid has temporarily suspended collections-related activities, including service disconnections, to lessen any financial hardship the COVID-19 pandemic may have on all of our customers – whether residential, commercial or industrial. This includes temporarily suspending interest and penalties for late payments. These policies will remain in effect in alignment with the respective executive orders issued in MA, NY and RI, and we will evaluate their continued need in consultation with state regulators.

Eversource: We are:
Suspending disconnection of service for non-payment
Eliminating late payment charges
Offering a special, flexible payment plan — with no down payment — for any past-due amount.

These companies also provide much of the population with gas as well.


So what else? Food? Food stamp processing seems to be humming along with not much relative issue like unemployment has.





you assuming I am getting aid?
LOL and you talk about my assumptions.
I have not had a day since this started where I was not working (though I have worked 8 straight years with only 2 days off so its normal)

and I never said "everyone"

You realize that was only until the end of April. You want to come into my neighborhood and tell everyone with their power shut off that they should just turn a light on? You keep saying, "you should be fine with what's given" but I'm telling you that it's not enough. You have the fortune of being able to work. What do you think people just want handouts? No, they want to work, but can't, but still want to pay their bills. It's not that complicated.

Again, just because from your perspective everything should be fine doesn't mean everything is fine. Take a look outside.

[Zan15]

It comes from the fed, or countries willing to buy up our debt (china). How about stop assuming I don't know where things come from because I'm not going to bother covering the entire topic to shore up any loose ends and just fucking assume I know all the general basic bitch knowledge, k?

As for your actual statement, riddle me this: If we generate so much money, why does our debt keep going up YOY?

Hard to not make assumptions when you miss huge buckets of money being "loaned" to the US.

Fed is sitting on about 8 trillion as of Aprils report.
About the same (7.5 trillion) comes from individual investors, mutual funds, private pensions, etc
Social Security 3 trillion
US govt pensions 2.5 trillion

Foreign countries have about 6.8 trillion
lol china and their massive 1.1 trillion dollar pile (not even the largest). Based on whom is buying treasuries right now we do not even need China.

As for your actual statement, riddle me this: If we generate so much money, why does our debt keep going up YOY?

Because we Choose to spend it instead of paying it down because it is not an issue to keep issuing debt yet and the return on this investment outweighs the benefits of paying down the debt.

No different than investing money somewhere while you are sitting on a 200k mortgage at 3% for 30 years. Or a car loan for 25k.
The benefits of investing more in your 401k outweigh the benefits of paying down the mortgage or the car loan.


The fact is we have carried a much larger burden in the past and came out just fine.
Of course that required when things do get back to normal that you change and not give ridiculous tax cuts to corporations or increase military spending by double digits. Something our current President does not understand or for that matter any republican.

[BeepBoo]

Hard to not make assumptions when you miss huge buckets of money being "loaned" to the US.

All of those buckets are who is currently debt holding, though, no? I'm talking about upping it another 10t. No way would we even be able to SELL that in bonds even if we issued them. We don't have enough people interested in that.

No different than investing money somewhere while you are sitting on a 200k mortgage at 3% for 30 years. Or a car loan for 25k.
The benefits of investing more in your 401k outweigh the benefits of paying down the mortgage or the car loan.

That's fair, but our loan keeps going up because we keep rolling in more negative equity. Keeping it simple is the best way. Being one of those fools who takes out huge term car loans and then rolls it into their next huge term car loan is just that... being a fool. It's too risk for my taste. Simple > all. Leave financial voodoo to wall street.

The fact is we have carried a much larger burden in the past and came out just fine.
Of course that required when things do get back to normal that you change and not give ridiculous tax cuts to corporations or increase military spending by double digits. Something our current President does not understand or for that matter any republican.

In terms of percentage of household income or in terms of actual numerical values? Pretty sure the percentages currently don't favor your view, but I could be mistaken. I haven't done much research on that front.

[Zan15]

You realize that was only until the end of April. You want to come into my neighborhood and tell everyone with their power shut off that they should just turn a light on? You keep saying, "you should be fine with what's given" but I'm telling you that it's not enough. You have the fortune of being able to work. What do you think people just want handouts? No, they want to work, but can't, but still want to pay their bills. It's not that complicated.

Again, just because from your perspective everything should be fine doesn't mean everything is fine. Take a look outside.

I figured I would not have to keep doing the work for you in your own state but here goes.

https://www.mass.gov/info-details/covid-19-dhcd-website

On April 20, 2020, Governor Baker signed into law legislation that imposes a temporary moratorium on evictions that goes beyond previous DHCD guidance
This includes:
A new $5 million special fund under the RAFT (Residential Assistance for Families in Transition) program for eligible households (families and individuals) who may face eviction, foreclosure, loss of utilities, and other housing emergencies. Full details on this under the RAFT tab below.

A moratorium on all non-essential evictions for tenants who cannot pay rent due to a COVID-19 related hardship. Full details on the moratorium with forms and instructions and emergency regulations can be found on the tab below.

https://www.mass.gov/info-details/co...massachusetts-

For a limited time, in most cases, this law prohibits your landlord from:
Filing for eviction (“summary process”) in court; or
Sending you any notice terminating your lease or demanding that you leave your unit.

ETC ETC ETC....

Unless extended by Governor Baker, this protection will end on August 18, 2020 or 45 days after the end of the Massachusetts state of emergency, whichever comes first.



Who got their power shut off with your two biggest providers not shutting people off?
I am going to have to require a tad bit more information since your last few Reponses were full of …. ummm… and misinformation.

Again, just because from your perspective everything should be fine doesn't mean everything is fine. Take a look outside.

You can look at my history to confirm what I am going to say as well as pictures to prove it but I volunteer working with low income and individuals that need help filing for things like Taxes, unemployment, housing, food stamps, welfare programs, insurance, etc etc etc...

I am more than aware of everything that is going on around me. I have already filed more than 24 unemployment forms for people who needed help and every sunday/monday I have 11 people whom come over to see me file their continued claims for them.

my specialty is insurance and I have filed over 80 submissions to get people Medicaid/ACA while they are unemployed.

I have also helped countless people submit deferral request for their utilities and credit card payments.

So ya, I know full well what is happening out there. I have spoken to many people who volunteer their services like I have throughout the country and have a good handle on what is going on.

- - - Updated - - -

All of those buckets are who is currently debt holding, though, no? I'm talking about upping it another 10t. No way would we even be able to SELL that in bonds even if we issued them. We don't have enough people interested in that.

.

I am sure you have a source that told you all this right?
Let me know when there is a failure to sell treasuries anytime in the near future I will be waiting....


LOL, there is so much interest in treasuries right now that they are even reintroducing the 20 year issuances.

https://home.treasury.gov/news/press...article_inline

The treasury and if you google it, most economist and investors think there will be no problem absorbing the massive amount of debt that will be needed to fund this uptick in debt. This is very evident by the yields and trading you can see on a daily basis.

the influx of monies in fixed income investment funds could almost cover most of the new required issuances without the need for foreign investments.

In terms of percentage of household income or in terms of actual numerical values? Pretty sure the percentages currently don't favor your view, but I could be mistaken. I haven't done much research on that front.

Percentage of GDP, Percentage of income, household, etc etc.
Wars are expensive as fuck you know

You ain't seen debt issuances/debt levels like WW1/2 and you might never see that level again.
Those investments were responsible for the biggest boom in US economic history.

[breadisfunny]

It comes from the fed, or countries willing to buy up our debt (china). How about stop assuming I don't know where things come from because I'm not going to bother covering the entire topic to shore up any loose ends and just fucking assume I know all the general basic bitch knowledge, k?

As for your actual statement, riddle me this: If we generate so much money, why does our debt keep going up YOY?

it's called INTEREST and the fact that we keep borrowing more money. for someone who supposedly knows basic concepts you seem to not understand well any of them.

[Zan15]

it's called INTEREST and the fact that we keep borrowing more money. for someone who supposedly knows basic concepts you seem to not understand well any of them.

I think you misunderstood his attempt at a question. I think it was A rhetorical question/Known Answer Question that he was trying to see if I knew.

its a trap, fbi fbi fbi!!

[breadisfunny]

I think you misunderstood his attempt at a question. I think it was A rhetorical question/Known Answer Question that he was trying to see if I knew.

its a trap, fbi fbi fbi!!

no i'm just bored.

[BeepBoo]

I think you misunderstood his attempt at a question. I think it was A rhetorical question/Known Answer Question that he was trying to see if I knew.

Correct lol

The treasury and if you google it, most economist and investors think there will be no problem absorbing the massive amount of debt that will be needed to fund this uptick in debt. This is very evident by the yields and trading you can see on a daily basis.

I sincerely hope you're right and that we don't get fucked in the long run, because I suspect this is how we're going to attempt to handle it. Again, money is only one concern, and one I don't think will be a true concern very long once prod shortages hit (this is my complete speculation).

Percentage of GDP, Percentage of income, household, etc etc.
Wars are expensive as fuck you know

I know

But I do think we're well on our way to ww2 levels. We're pretty much there already.

[Zan15]

Correct lol


I sincerely hope you're right and that we don't get fucked in the long run, because I suspect this is how we're going to attempt to handle it. Again, money is only one concern, and one I don't think will be a true concern very long once prod shortages hit (this is my complete speculation).

I know

But I do think we're well on our way to ww2 levels. We're pretty much there already.

well I never liked the debt to gdp comparison since its one year of GDP to 30 years of debt.

the average person who has a mortgage is almost always over 100% and they are considered great credit even at 200-400%+ of 1 years earnings.

[xenogear3]

well I never liked the debt to gdp comparison since its one year of GDP to 30 years of debt.

the average person who has a mortgage is almost always over 100% and they are considered great credit even at 200-400%+ of 1 years earnings.

GDP is not government's earning.
The tax is government's earning.

This public debt doesn't even include state's debt.
Before the Pandemic, many states are already in trouble.
Thanks to Pandemic, they get bailed out by Federal Reserve.
If these states know the bailout, they should borrow more.
This is crazy.

[Logwyn]

GDP is not government's earning.
The tax is government's earning.

This public debt doesn't even include state's debt.
Before the Pandemic, many states are already in trouble.
Thanks to Pandemic, they get bailed out by Federal Reserve.
If these states know the bailout, they should borrow more.
This is crazy.

The banks are making billions of dollars!

[xenogear3]

The banks are making billions of dollars!

Yes, the banks make money when the interest is lowered.
However, if it stays at 0%, banks have no growth.

[Logwyn]

Yes, the banks make money when the interest is lowered.
However, if it stays at 0%, banks have no growth.

You do realize that the stream of "small business" loans the banks made billions off them already and have not collected the first payment yet right? Then did so by collecting fees to process the loans. They made a crap ton of money right off the bat millions by just charging a processing fee. Banks can make money by having 0% interest rates if they really want too. In this case, it wasn't even the bank's money!!!!!!!

You also do realize that banks can loan out more money than they have on deposit. In fact if you go stick 100 bucks in your savings account. The bank can then loan out not only 100 dollars BUT they can loan out a higher amount of money than 100 dollars. Banks can basically create more money to loan out to make more money.

[breadisfunny]

You do realize that the stream of "small business" loans the banks made billions off them already and have not collected the first payment yet right? Then did so by collecting fees to process the loans. They made a crap ton of money right off the bat millions by just charging a processing fee. Banks can make money by having 0% interest rates if they really want too. In this case, it wasn't even the bank's money!!!!!!!

You also do realize that banks can loan out more money than they have on deposit. In fact if you go stick 100 bucks in your savings account. The bank can then loan out not only 100 dollars BUT they can loan out a higher amount of money than 100 dollars. Banks can basically create more money to loan out to make more money.

your wasting your breath he's just posting random shit to generate posts. or he's like 12. it's like he just discovered this shit.

[xenogear3]

your wasting your breath he's just posting random shit to generate posts. or he's like 12. it's like he just discovered this shit.

How do we know you are not 12 yourself?

[BeepBoo]

Didn't want to follow the full conversation, so my thoughts might not be perfectly injected. Take it for what it is.

No no, they make sense and are entirely appropriate. And I'm not saying we shouldn't use debt to our advantage. I think we just disagree on what an appropriate amount of debt to carry is. I'm conservative (and I don't mean in a political sense, because the term "conservative" is now synonymous with "republican" and they are most DEFINITELY not conservative when it comes to gov't spending) when it comes to gov't spending and debt. The fact that we're anywhere close to WWII levels is alarming to me and I think we should be chilling out.

[Gaidax]

People seem to think it's some free money.

The pain will come later.

[xenogear3]

China is printing money like crazy to uphold its real estate bubble.
Don't fell for it.

I will never see a balanced budget year in my life time !
We should feel lucky if the budget deficit is less than $3 Trillion next year.

[Logwyn]

your wasting your breath he's just posting random shit to generate posts. or he's like 12. it's like he just discovered this shit.

Thanks for the heads up!

[xenogear3]

your wasting your breath he's just posting random shit to generate posts. or he's like 12. it's like he just discovered this shit.

I see that you have 25,279 posts. WoW !