Phase 7: Classic+

[Naraga]

opinion my dude.

new spells, tier sets by specs rather than one by class (itemisation as a whole) were steps in the good direction.

but leaving azeroth for a tiny continent of about half the size of kalimdor, turning all previous content obselete overnight rather than building on the old world was a big dissapointement for me, and IMO, a huge waste.... and they kept doing it with every xpac (except cata, which was also a big waste of ressources in revamping the old world that was only used for lvling at that point, out lvling any zone before the end of questlines/storylines....).

so yes, even if BC gave us nice improvements on some parts of the game, for me it was a huge step in the wrong direction.

A new expansion is always going to make previous content obsolete. Can't honestly expect people to still raid MC to prepare to raid Karazhan can you?

In fact not just expansions, new raid tiers generally make previous content obsolete.

[Gavll]

- New cosmetic rewards for Heroic Dungeons: armor/weapon recolours, pets, mounts, tabards, titles, bigger backpacks, etc.

No. Cosmetic crap is antithetical to WoW Classic.

[Beuargh]

A new expansion is always going to make previous content obsolete. Can't honestly expect people to still raid MC to prepare to raid Karazhan can you?

In fact not just expansions, new raid tiers generally make previous content obsolete.

a new expension is always going to make previous content obselete because it's the way blizzard decided to take. my point was that IMO this was a step in the wrong direction... I would have preferred that they build on top of what already existed. there was a lot of room for it..... but like I said in the post you quoted, opinions....

and what would have been the problem to raid naxx (not MC dude) to prepare to raid karazhan? that's how it was at that time. you raided MC to prepare BWL, you raided BWL to prepare AQ, etc.... in TBC you raided karazhan/gruul/maghteridon to prepare to raid serpenshrine cavern and so on.... this is progression

new raid tier making the previous one obselete only came with the tournament after ulduar in wotlk. and it was another step in the same wrong direction IMO. they killed ulduar (one of the greatest wow raid) by doing that. just like they killed naxx with tbc when only 2% (I believe) had the chance to clear it.

making previous content obselete with every xpac is a waste of content. we lost 90% of azeroth content and a HUGE part of the world with TBC. only things that was left was org/stormwind for the AH, a short attunement questline for karazhan, karazhan itself, and cavern of time just to acces a dongeon and a raid. everything else was blasted through, powerleveling to get to outland as fast as possible.

[Queen of Hamsters]

No. Cosmetic crap is antithetical to WoW Classic.

Sure it is, it's not as if players show off full sets in cities that they won't wear when doing actual content, collected pets, pursued cool looking mounts or anything back then and right now...

Not that Classic+ is happening in that form in any case. TBC = the next step. Can't wait!

[Kagthul]

Hey, look, a new and interesting topic that will surely have new and exciting information about a total imaginary thing.

right?

[Sevrah]

I think down the road some project that branches directly off of wow classic could be neat, could be a waste of time, could be whatever- im indifferent as long as they keep each project game separated and dont overwrite it's foundation.

[crusadernero]

yes they should create classic+ so the classic game & servers are once again gone. Then they just gotta wait a few years and relaunch new classic servers and rake in the dollars once again!

[Kallor]

I already played TBC to death, don't want to do it all over again. Classic + would be far more appealing to me. But not like this with just added difficulty to already existing stuff. Multiple difficulty levels is a retail thing, it doesn't fit with the spirit of classic.

Instead, rework and add planned stuff from Vanilla, as well as relevant zones in EK and Kalimdor. Of course, a new storyline would have to be written. They could either go with "Horde and Alliance sent large armies into the Dark Portal, it's up to us to defend Azeroth from dangers", or just ignore the overall story, and just have minor storylines in the new zones that was added.

New zones could be: Hyjal, Uldum, Twilight Highlands, "Empty" zones fixed with new questlines.
New raids could be: Karazhan, Dragon Isles
New dungeons could be: Grim Batol, Uldum dungeon, Hyjal dungeon
New battlegrounds could be: Azshara Crater, Silvershard Mines

Balance changes to make non-viable speccs SOMEWHAT viable, but still keep Classic balance similar to what it was.

Only a few new pets and mounts. Don't make this into retail where everyone becomes a collection-completionist instead of actually playing the game.

[alt-ithist]

I'm in favor of classic plus, but not this. I don't like running multiple versions of the same instance whatsover.

I would love to see some interesting and original content that was perhaps planned for the original game but never finished.

They already released that. They titled it “The Burning Crusade”.

[Will]

I would not mind a Classic+ provided it had absolutely no impact on them doing TBC. I don't care about Classic+, I want TBC. If they are happy to pursue both avenues, fine. If Classic+ means no TBC, then it can sod off.

[Gavll]

Sure it is, it's not as if players show off full sets in cities that they won't wear when doing actual content, collected pets, pursued cool looking mounts or anything back then and right now...

Not that Classic+ is happening in that form in any case. TBC = the next step. Can't wait!

The key difference being those things are worth showing off because everyone knows what they are and everyone knows what they represent.

Got the ZG tiger or Baron's mount? Everyone knows what they are and how special they are.

Once you introduce endless streams of cosmetics, a la retail, then they're not really worth showing off and nobody even knows what they are or where you got them, so nobody cares and it becomes meaningless.

The reason showing off your full Netherwind or Nemesis is cool is because everyone understands what it represents. Also, it's useable gear. You're probably using at least a few of those pieces as opposed to them being purely cosmetic fluff.

[ek0zu]

I am not playing Classic because i played Vanilla WoW at its maximum when it was current, but between Classic+ and TBC i would prefer Classic+.

I understand that in terms of development it is far easier for Blizzard to bring TBC back, which on the same time has a far greater ROI, but i don't know Classic+ concept appeals to me more and i believe that most people that returned to play Classic and keep playing it like the concept of the game as it was then not because of the belief that in a few years TBC will come. Don't forget that TBC brought most of the things that the larger chuck of Classic playerbase detests.

I strongly believe that there is a huge gap between the playerbase that likes classic and that who don't that cannot be bridged, but i also believe that both of their volumes is large and justifies separate entirely games. In my ideal universe i could see two iterations of the game that look the same but are different.

But then again what Classic+ could be? Storywise, there are many stories that can be told, they could continue the exact same path they had so far with Retail or they could explore other things, frankly it all depends on how much money they want to invest, i think that a new Timeline would be the best that goes a lot slower compared on how fast Retail went.

Gameplaywise and this is the most difficult aspect going forward should be a blend of classic mentality of how the classes play and how TBC managed to make more speccs viable in both PvE and PvP. The fact that WoW has so many classes and so many speccs is something that should not be neglected and we should praise. TBH, i would love to see 40 man raid groups with the composition of the raid groups that we saw from TBC-onwards with such a variety of speccs, for me it is fascinating to try and make as many speccs viable as possible.

QoLwise i think things should not change at all no lfr, no layering of any kind, no dungeon finder, no flying mounts or meriad mounts, i would also revert some qol changes with bgs to be only server based and i would on the other hand like to see server vs server premade bgs containing both functions.

PvPwise as i said above premades and non-premades should be separated, farming casuals should not be a thing.

Professionswise new recipes, new materials along the progress of the game, more work needs to be done on this aspect of the game in general to cater for those that enjoy it but at the same time not make it mandatory for raiding.

[Vorkreist]

The problem with that nonsense called Classic+ is that the concept of Classic+ is different in everyone's head: no one will be happy.

The biggest problem that doesn't register inside the Classic- crowd is the investment required for new content. There's literally 2 dedicated devs on the entire project with the retail team doing some stuff when they are bored. Its the reason why Classic even happened in the first place: they had all the assets and even found an actual build to have a reference for numbers tuning cutting the entire money investment to a joke. They are cutting costs as hard as they can on retail itself let alone the detached from reality dream of new classic content. Even if Classic blasted past 20 mil subs the goblin overlord Kotick would still had been like " Hmm I'm not sure man, seems like a risky investment"

[Queen of Hamsters]

The key difference being those things are worth showing off because everyone knows what they are and everyone knows what they represent.

Got the ZG tiger or Baron's mount? Everyone knows what they are and how special they are.

Once you introduce endless streams of cosmetics, a la retail, then they're not really worth showing off and nobody even knows what they are or where you got them, so nobody cares and it becomes meaningless.

The reason showing off your full Netherwind or Nemesis is cool is because everyone understands what it represents. Also, it's useable gear. You're probably using at least a few of those pieces as opposed to them being purely cosmetic fluff.

Haha, if you say so.

The behaviour of players on Retail in regards to cosmetics, says differently. Not to mention that the ZG and Baron's mounts can still be obtained. The ZG mount is MORE special on Retail than in Classic since it cannot be readily farmed anymore, only the most dedicated collectors pursue it.

No, you don't decide what's cool or not. Players love cosmetics on Retail, that's why Blizzard can't add them fast enough. And that behaviour started in Vanilla, whether you like it or not. Whether it be the latest Mythic/Gladiatior Elite sets, latest and most difficult-to-obtain mounts, rarest mounts, players still get them and players with an interest in such things, still know what they are and where they came from.

This whole "it used to be speciulz"-crap does not reflect in-game, and as such is a bold-faced attempt at yet again pretending that Classic has something in regards to player mentality that Retail does not. Humans don't change in a flash between logging into a different game, just look at the horrid elitists.

- - - Updated - - -

I would not mind a Classic+ provided it had absolutely no impact on them doing TBC. I don't care about Classic+, I want TBC. If they are happy to pursue both avenues, fine. If Classic+ means no TBC, then it can sod off.

My sentiment exactly at this point.

Got my shit ready for TBC, can't frickin' wait!

[Linkedblade]

nope, id rather classic stay as close to vanilla as possible.

Once Naxx releases, Classic should be as close to Vanilla as it can possibly be.

[vindicatorx]

Would you be on board with a Phase 7 like this? It'd mostly be numbers tuning and adding in rewards that are already on file. It'd also keep the integrity of the rest of the game in tact as any changes are within their own bubble.

No, just stop it. It's classic everyone got what they asked for. I'm ready to move into BC and have no interest in the same thing that ruined retail being added to classic.

[Mosha]

Dungeons
- All dungeons (including non-60 ones) now have a level 60 (Heroic) option
- Substantially increased HP and damage in Heroic Dungeons
- New cosmetic rewards for Heroic Dungeons: armor/weapon recolours, pets, mounts, tabards, titles, bigger backpacks, etc.

Raids
- All raids now have a level 60 (Heroic) option
- HP and damage of all raid mobs increased by up to 100% (earlier raids buffed more than later raids)
- New cosmetic rewards for Heroic Raids: tier recolours, pets, mounts, tabards, titles, bigger backpacks, etc.

Class balance updates
- Underperforming specs are given a damage/healing/tanking aura buff that works in Heroic Dungeons and Heroic Raids only.


Would you be on board with a Phase 7 like this? It'd mostly be numbers tuning and adding in rewards that are already on file. It'd also keep the integrity of the rest of the game in tact as any changes are within their own bubble.

That honestly sounds so fucking boring I almost fell asleep just reading this.

"So guys instead of releasing tbc with a bunch of content and fun stuff for you guys to experience, let's just have the exact same shit we have been playing for god knows how long but let's just tweak the numbers and stuff".

[Romanthony]

Why would they do that, You will get Tbc classic, you will get Wrath classic, and so on. I would rather them focus on making new content for retail, then new content for classic. You get what you asked for.

Personally, I wish it remains as just classic, because where does it end? When we have BFA classic? Are they gonna run a Classic server, a Tbc server and classic? Are people in the future going to ask for a Classic classic server?

[justandulas]

No more classic wow expansions please. Just add to the current classic aka +

As much as I love the idea of classic+ and would die on that hill, it won’t happen for several reasons

1) the cost of development is not the same as the cost of server maintenance. Tbc makes more sense since they have it all and won’t have to have an entirely different team designing future classic wow content

2) the hardcore purists would complain about any change, no matter how cool, would taint the base game

3) they will not have a second alternate reality WoW with new content at a time when they desperately need shadowlands fo succeed. Makes no sense to undercut shadowlands considering there’s already “meh” minimal hype, coming off the worst expac in bfa, and retail is where they generate all the mtx money. Classic would need a cash shop that outsells retails for it to be considered and A) purists don’t want a classic cash shop B) no telling if it would sell well to begin with

[Zarator8]

I understand that in terms of development it is far easier for Blizzard to bring TBC back, which on the same time has a far greater ROI, but i don't know Classic+ concept appeals to me more and i believe that most people that returned to play Classic and keep playing it like the concept of the game as it was then not because of the belief that in a few years TBC will come.

Not sure where this confidence comes from. If we go by historical numbers, TBC was significantly more popular than Classic. If we go by pserver numbers (not counting the fact we never had a single good TBC server), WotLK servers have always been by far the most popular. I'm not really sure where all this faith into the Classic-only playerbase being the biggest chunk comes. Every person I've met in-game is stoked at the idea of TBC coming and won't stay on Classic once TBC comes out.

Don't forget that TBC brought most of the things that the larger chuck of Classic playerbase detests.

Don't forget that a lot of people who're playing Classic hate lots of the things Classic has - including world buffs, class balance, the PvP rank system etc. It's just that, even with all these flaws, it's still a good game and far preferable to Retail for many people.

You don't have to believe me, ofc. Just wait until TBC comes out and you'll see how many ppl will stay on Classic and how many will make the jump, instead. Heck, once Vanilla TBC and WotLK Classic are all available, I wouldn't be surprised if Vanilla turned out to be the least popular of the three, especially if none of them gets periodic resets like on the pserver scene.