Ion is reaching out to the wrong demographic with his interviews

[Porimlys]

OP you seem confused in thinking that the developer interviews are part of an advertisement campaign, as opposed to increased communication during testing (having been brutally - and rightfully - criticized for not doing in BFA)

[Evaddon]

So you think; the things most people LOVE to skip or not even get is the priority instead of getting feedback from people who play the game, know the game, and having general open communication about the current development and state of said game is: A) Reaching the wrong demographic B)A waste of potential resources?

1)There's zero correlation between what you're talking about
2)They're reaching their intended audiences, without shilling out advertisement prices and while having general communication about their development and whats to come
3)Ion isn't in charge of advertisements...so..theres that
4)What the hell are you talking about?

[Beefhammer]

Any data to support your claim other than "gutfeeling" or "stuff I came up with while alone in quarantine". I mean..your word agains a company that actually collects ad has data on everything we do in game?

But yeah...maybe you wanna write a letter to Ion or address this on the wow official forums? What is your agenda here to just put out the free advice that could save WoW on an unofficial forum?

Of course he doesn't. This is the same guy in the political forum spouting conspiracies about civil war coming.

[Gaidax]

Radio and TV commercials? Man that's just like in the old days! Can I get newspaper ads with that please?

Kekw.

[khazmodan]

Ion is reaching out to the wrong demographic with his interviews

The people that have been turned off from WoW are the social people. The extroverts. The casuals that liked to play in groups. Touting Torghast is a tremendous mistake. They need to try to grab people who are stuck indoors during Covid-19. I think some radio commercials, maybe a TV ad or two, to sell the general idea of playing, is the correct approach. Also, I'd have rushed out some social content for people to enjoy during the quarantine. These websites are hardcore gamers are there isn't a lot to new audience to capture from that.

They are making a pretty big mistake here.

The first thing they need to do is get WoW on Steam along with the other mmo's already there which includes; Final Fantasy, Elder Scrolls, Black Desert, EVE Online,etc. At this point Blizzard does not have the reputation for people to come running to try there game because players are not recruiting for them anywhere near what they used to. On Steam its a targeted advertisement to PC players which makes sense when you think about the investment that has to be made in a decent gaming pc to play WoW. The problem with radio is that its too easy to forget what is advertised by the time you get where you are going and TV is for people still stuck in the 90s that want passive entertainment.

The problem with Torghast is that on its surface it doesn't look exciting; dark gloomy emo environments that looks like more grind than fun and epic. This may be awesome after you get in there but at this point WoW needs something that gets the ex-players to check there loss of trust of Blizzard at the door and that means ads that overwhelm that meh attitude brought on by years of cash grabs and mind numbing grinds. Just watch the Shadowlands features trailer; the first half is just showing a brief shot of each zone with a name then choose a covenant...what the hell does that mean to a new player?, then tower of the damned which is also visually vague, and they also mention new dungeons and raids...Go back and watch the reveal trailer for Wrath of the Lich King, even though its a bit rough it still looks far more exciting to play and still to this day makes me want to play the Death Knight again.

[Mojo03]

Extroverts don't really play MMO's...

Grab people by talking about old content in interviews? Grab the people that aren't watching the interviews because they don't follow the game anymore? The extroverts that barely exist in a game that is mostly unsocial now days?

I'm sort of lost on pretty much all of your logic.

[Drusin]

I can't say no one listens to the radio but I'd bet a whole hand not as many people listen to the radio in 2020 as there were listening in 2004. And same with t.v, streaming is the way now, if I saw a fucking commercial on Netflix I'd cancel right then and there lol.

[Jastall]

Do you have any statistics or facts to back up this statement?

I can say I've heard, rarely, video game adverts on the radio, because the two generally don't overlap.

But to say it's less popular without any definitive proof seems wildly silly. Can I say they're still popular? Yes, because if you look up the listing of radio stations in any large city, there's a truck-load of them (AM and FM). The only places where radio is 'dying' is out in the rural areas, and I won't tinfoil hat those because I don't have any proof on hand.

They're two different demographics -- people who listen to the radio don't necessarily want to pay for Pandora or whatever else is out there. Or they enjoy their morning talk-shows which are only provided by the on air personalities for that particular station.

But when a radio station can give out money (anywhere from $100 to $2000) just for guessing eight songs right, or give out concert tickets (which are normally good seats that cost a mint), you can't honestly say they're 'on their way out' or 'less popular'.

Especially now, with everyone quarantined at home -- the people who listen to radio aren't going to magically upgrade to something you perceive as better, they're going to go along with what makes them feel a modicum of normalcy.

The point isn't that radio is not popular. It is. But 1) people who listen to their radio over consuming other forms of media are usually older folk, less likely to play video games and 2) more importantly, games are a visual medium. They're not very well represented by a radio ad at all, which as someone else said is why radio ads mostly concern services that you hardly need to see or be able to visualize.

[BeepBoo]

And I completely disagree. Holding on to current players should be the priority. If new people join in or old players come back, that's a nice bonus, but it should not be the focus a decade and a half into the game.

I disagree. They eroded the actual majority of the game in favor of catering to the current audience, and now that audience is as monolithic as ever. It's biased, but that audience is also my least favorite type of audience in literally every video game ever.

Here's the thing with the mobile market (the current wow audience): They will play basically regardless of anything. They're looking for something to serve the same purpose that television did back in the 90s. They're looking for passive entertainment so suck their time and distract them from reality. So long as blizzard tosses them basically any kind of garbage content, they will stay subbed.

The current casuals are essentially the inelastic demand.

Where you can actually rake in more money is by growing the audience past this current one. However, I'm not sure activision, nor the devs at blizzard, have any desire or passion to do so. I view wow devs as the equivalent of some mid-sized corporation's drone squad. They have no real concern for their career or performance. They just want an 9-5 with stability, 401k, etc, that they can keep their heads down at and enjoy their lives outside of work instead. How most people do it. That's not what I want out of my game devs, though.

[Villager720]

So talking to informed community members (with large audiences) to garner feedback < just random advertising ....
Nah brah. Not a great plan.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

Disagree. Anyone who quit over social issues are people who don't play the game seriously enough to be worried about.
People will always come and go, but make sure the people who WANT to play the game regularly are happy.

[Michael Jackson]

Who actually even listens to the radio anymore in 2020 other than people who have bought their first car that was built in the late 90's or early 2000's?

that's a really idiotic mentality, i leave the radio on at home or in the car all the time, you always catch a bit of news you might otherwise not get, or even some promotion happening in town that you wouldn't know about

you're like the people who say "who still reads the newspaper"? i don't know, the people who want to be informed by professionals, and not some dipshit with an idotic haircut who call himself a "youtuber"?

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I disagree. They eroded the actual majority of the game in favor of catering to the current audience, and now that audience is as monolithic as ever. It's biased, but that audience is also my least favorite type of audience in literally every video game ever.

Here's the thing with the mobile market (the current wow audience): They will play basically regardless of anything. They're looking for something to serve the same purpose that television did back in the 90s. They're looking for passive entertainment so suck their time and distract them from reality. So long as blizzard tosses them basically any kind of garbage content, they will stay subbed.

The current casuals are essentially the inelastic demand.

Where you can actually rake in more money is by growing the audience past this current one. However, I'm not sure activision, nor the devs at blizzard, have any desire or passion to do so. I view wow devs as the equivalent of some mid-sized corporation's drone squad. They have no real concern for their career or performance. They just want an 9-5 with stability, 401k, etc, that they can keep their heads down at and enjoy their lives outside of work instead. How most people do it. That's not what I want out of my game devs, though.

you're talking as if wow was anything other than a meaningless distraction filled with mostly grind and a few cool things
hell it was even worse in pre-bc (just play it, it's fucking there, live, for the world to see, no more rose tinted glasses bullshit I've had to endure for over a decade)

the few games that aren't like this are games like Myst and maybe Mass Effect, but even games like Witcher 3 are more like TV shows with on the rails action on the side, which you could easily skip and not miss out on anything

[TheRevenantHero]

that's a really idiotic mentality, i leave the radio on at home or in the car all the time, you always catch a bit of news you might otherwise not get, or even some promotion happening in town that you wouldn't know about

you're like the people who say "who still reads the newspaper"? i don't know, the people who want to be informed by professionals, and not some dipshit with an idotic haircut who call himself a "youtuber"?

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you're talking as if wow was anything other than a meaningless distraction filled with mostly grind and a few cool things
hell it was even worse in pre-bc (just play it, it's fucking there, live, for the world to see, no more rose tinted glasses bullshit I've had to endure for over a decade)

the few games that aren't like this are games like Myst and maybe Mass Effect, but even games like Witcher 3 are more like TV shows with on the rails action on the side, which you could easily skip and not miss out on anything

I have never once, in all my years existing on this planet, ever met someone who decided to buy something because it was on the radio. Everyone I've encountered literally tunes out ads. Radio ads haven't really been successful at selling products since like the early 80's. But sure. Get nasty with me because I pointed out that people who listen to the radio are a minority.

[Paperfox]

The problem that I see with advertising now (during the stay-at-home) is that the game won't be released until the last part of the year - probably November. It seems to me that if you're going to advertise it, it must be available now or soon.

The only commercials I watch are ones that are advertising someone I'm already interested in - like my car brand for example - otherwise I skip them, and if I can't do that then I will mute it.

[exochaft]

Who actually even listens to the radio anymore in 2020 other than people who have bought their first car that was built in the late 90's or early 2000's?

It may seem surprising, but if you don't listen to the radio at all, you're actually in the VAST minority (at least in the US, but I imagine it's pretty similar worldwide). While you'd expect the older generations to listen to radio, even roughly 90% of the younger generation is listening to the radio on at least a weekly basis. TV, streaming, podcasts, etc. are all lower than radio listening crowds. If you sit at your computer watching streams/videos that have advertisements, that's actually one of the smallest demos out there.

If you want to hit as many people as possible with an advertisement, then radio's the way to go. However, WoW is super niche, which is why the PR for the game is typically confined to the super niche markets where much of their fan base is. Despite how gamers may feel about themselves as their own market, they're likely in the vast minority while thinking they are mainstream. That isn't to say the demo isn't expanding, but it's still relatively small despite expansion.

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I have never once, in all my years existing on this planet, ever met someone who decided to buy something because it was on the radio. Everyone I've encountered literally tunes out ads. Radio ads haven't really been successful at selling products since like the early 80's. But sure. Get nasty with me because I pointed out that people who listen to the radio are a minority.

I can guarantee you could probably rattle off commercials that happen in the background even if you aren't really paying attention to them, or you know what the product is. The sneaky thing about well-made commercials is that you internalize them and they alter your way of thinking if you don't think they do. Conditioning is a huge part of advertisement... heck, it's a large part of influencing people's way of thinking. Besides, if radio ads weren't successful, people wouldn't be using them. No company is going to waste revenue on an advertising venture that's pointless and won't yield results. If what you claim about yourself is even true, you're part of the vast minority, but if you surround yourself with similar-thinking people you may incorrectly think you're part of the majority.

[khazmodan]

Disagree. Anyone who quit over social issues are people who don't play the game seriously enough to be worried about.
People will always come and go, but making sure the people who WANT to play the game regularly are happy.

Dude...it's a massive multiplayer game, which means you don't just try to get the no life social burnouts to play the game and the people that only play for a few months each expansion pack is still a ton of cash that Blizzard will not turn down. I remember playing WoW back in Vanilla in 40 man Molten Core when there was always a few class clowns in the raid and I laughed so hard I ended the raid with a perma grin. Social experience matters and it helped WoW get to be the biggest mmo in the world and the erosion of that social experience has led to an ever shrinking online friends list.

[BeepBoo]

the few games that aren't like this are games like Myst and maybe Mass Effect, but even games like Witcher 3 are more like TV shows with on the rails action on the side, which you could easily skip and not miss out on anything

The difference is, those games have some semblance of difficulty to them (if you play them appropriately on anything other than scrub mode). Wow overland is literally just doing chores. "Go pick 10 herbs." "Go kill 10 boars." etc. No actual engagement required to complete it. Magnitude matters, and if you can teach a monkey to do it, it's not engaging.

[TheRevenantHero]

It may seem surprising, but if you don't listen to the radio at all, you're actually in the VAST minority (at least in the US, but I imagine it's pretty similar worldwide). While you'd expect the older generations to listen to radio, even roughly 90% of the younger generation is listening to the radio on at least a weekly basis. TV, streaming, podcasts, etc. are all lower than radio listening crowds. If you sit at your computer watching streams/videos that have advertisements, that's actually one of the smallest demos out there.

If you want to hit as many people as possible with an advertisement, then radio's the way to go. However, WoW is super niche, which is why the PR for the game is typically confined to the super niche markets where much of their fan base is. Despite how gamers may feel about themselves as their own market, they're likely in the vast minority while thinking they are mainstream. That isn't to say the demo isn't expanding, but it's still relatively small despite expansion.

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I can guarantee you could probably rattle off commercials that happen in the background even if you aren't really paying attention to them, or you know what the product is. The sneaky thing about well-made commercials is that you internalize them and they alter your way of thinking if you don't think they do. Conditioning is a huge part of advertisement... heck, it's a large part of influencing people's way of thinking. Besides, if radio ads weren't successful, people wouldn't be using them. No company is going to waste revenue on an advertising venture that's pointless and won't yield results. If what you claim about yourself is even true, you're part of the vast minority, but if you surround yourself with similar-thinking people you may incorrectly think you're part of the majority.

Here's the thing. Times have changed. Cars typically have some form of a radio but a lot of satellite stations offer ad free because you have to subscribe to the service. An Alexa doesn't have ads. When people use Spotify, ads are there to squeeze out services meant to get rid of those ads. "Hate your music being interrupted? Throw us a monthly fee and never get ads again!" In this day and age, ads are no longer something most people hear and say "Oh man I should buy that thing!" It's typically viewed as a nuisance people are willing to spend money to get rid of. People, me included, download extensions for web browsers that block ads.

I don't know a single person that still has a radio in their home but that's just my own experience. I only know people with radios in their cars. And any time I've heard someone talk about ads, it's always in a negative light and how they would rather spend $10 a month to never hear an ad again.

[EbaumsTipster]

This thread is proof of how out of touch MMOC is from not only the fanbase but the video game industry as a whole.

[Veldoranz]

Having multiple dev interviews a week is one of the better things they could do to restore faith in their IP. It's refreshing to see the WoW team put themselves out there like this after the PR nightmare that was BFA.

I've got respect for Ion, he seems to genuinely care and take the responsibility seriously.