Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Felya]

Great, now I can't unimagine some Weekend at Bernie's Mar-a-Lago shit going down with McConnell and Barr in the roles of McCarthy and Silverman.

One of the two carrying him, has to be Kushner. Just to add to the confusion of which one actually looks dead.

[PhaelixWW]

One of the two carrying him, has to be Kushner. Just to add to the confusion of which one actually looks dead.

Then it should be Jared Kushner and Stephen Miller.

[Felya]

Then it should be Jared Kushner and Stephen Miller.

Well, I just comedied to completion...

[Kaleredar]

It might be because I'm in a bit of a funk right now, but it's not like this even matters. When was the last time anything he said had meaningful consequences?

You've hit the nail on the head here.

As much as I like being right about things, being right about Trump proving to be both a terrible president and a terrible human being while the years he's been in charge have resulted in the slow dissolution of America, as I and numerous others had quite easily predicted would be the case, doesn't make me so much happy as much as it fills me with a bemused sort of anger. As such, I don't really care to engage in these discussions all that much because, while most of the condemnations of Trump are dead-on right, specifically because of the reason you mentioned:


Nothing he does or says or any of that stuff will matter. No matter how stupid, no matter how illegal, no matter how pants-on-head obviously idiotic it is. None of our comments or consternation will, in it of themselves, do anything to unseat him or dissuade his followers. At all. We might as well be complaining that a fire burning down a building is hot, extremely damaging and very dangerous, and expect that those complaints will extinguish it. They will not.

All that will matter to him or his base is whether he is removed or not. That is the single most important issue in ensuring that The Trump Shitshow comes to an end.

[Benggaul]

86,912 dead, 1,715 on the 14th (GMT). Still hasn't gone back up to 2k (and I'm feeling charitable enough to not blame that entirely on numbers being withheld by GOP government officials), but we're still on track to hit 90k by the end of the weekend and 100k before the end of the month.

Further, new cases has spiked upwards by 27,246 and ACTIVE cases has also risen by 10-15k cases. That dip a few days ago is looking to be just an anomaly. Illinois once again has the most new daily cases as New York continues trending down (though still high). California and Texas also continue to be in the top 5-10 in terms of new cases. Hard to say how much of all of this is due to increased testing or actual flare-ups, but it almost doesn't matter; a new case is a new case regardless.

But hey, at least people will be able to have their meat, right? Wouldn't want this TRUMP SHITSHOW to continue without plenty of bacon.

Stay safe, folks.

[Breccia]

Once again, it's time for Guess the Speaker!

We have the best testing in the world. Could be that testing’s, frankly, overrated. Maybe it is overrated

"...no."

Yes. It was just before

We have more cases than anybody in the world, but why? Because we do more testing. When you test, you have a case. When you test you find something is wrong with people. If we didn’t do any testing, we would have very few cases. They don’t want to write that. It’s common sense. We test much more.

which some of you already pointed out, but man, just think about it: "testing is frankly overrated" was just the second stupidest thing Donald Trump said in one breath.

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So Dr. Bright actually testified (I called that wrong) and said what everyone thought he'd say: Dr. Bright begged Team Trump to take action and they didn't, then fired him.

Well, let's see what FOX News has to say.

This is significant testimony today. Obviously, he has a long history in the job that he was in. The president calls him a disgruntled employee but whether he’s that or not, he does have a lot of experience and he’s telling the story about not being prepared for this pandemic

...what?

He is not discredited easily, this Rick Bright, and in fact, his whistleblower report was very detailed to the point where the federal government itself said that he had standing to make this testimony. I think it’s one worth watching today because Democrats obviously will pounce on this as an example of the administration dropping the ball.

--Fox News’s "Special Report" anchor Bret Baie

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The federal government is distributing faulty coronavirus testing kits.

"You already posted that."

No no, these are other ones. They're giving false negatives -- inherently far more dangerous than false positives.

"Well surely it's as simple as testing for antibodies, meaning you're immune."

Um, about that.

Given that SARS-CoV-2 is a novel virus, there is much we do not know about what, if any, immunity it may confer to those exposed and recovered from infection. According to the WHO, there is no currently available evidence showing immunity to COVID-19 after infection. While individuals typically develop some type of immune response after exposure to most viruses, it is not yet clear when an immune response develops after COVID-19 infection, how strong this immune response may be, and how long the immune response may last.

That's the AMA, saying you don't know if you're immune. Not yet.

[Captain N]

Building on the above post by @Breccia -- It seems that those false negatives come up 48% of the time when the dry test is done.

https://www.newsweek.com/abbotts-rap...zjA-Yc0B79po6U

They found that the rapid Abbott test produced 48 percent false negative tests when the nasal swab used for the virus sample was dry and roughly 33 percent when the swab was placed in liquid solution. The company recommends the dry method to its customers.

[Edge-]

Building on the above post by @Breccia -- It seems that those false negatives come up 48% of the time when the dry test is done.

https://www.newsweek.com/abbotts-rap...zjA-Yc0B79po6U

They found that the rapid Abbott test produced 48 percent false negative tests when the nasal swab used for the virus sample was dry and roughly 33 percent when the swab was placed in liquid solution. The company recommends the dry method to its customers.

We'll have to wait for the paper and to see if others can replicate, but if that's accurate then it sure explains why it's running rampant in the White House.

[pathora44]

Building on the above post by @Breccia -- It seems that those false negatives come up 48% of the time when the dry test is done.

https://www.newsweek.com/abbotts-rap...zjA-Yc0B79po6U

They found that the rapid Abbott test produced 48 percent false negative tests when the nasal swab used for the virus sample was dry and roughly 33 percent when the swab was placed in liquid solution. The company recommends the dry method to its customers.

Serious? There is a possibility that the test the WH is using has a 50% fail rate if a person has the virus? I am completely ignorant on disease testing kits but do most have this high of a failure rate or is even more apparent how utterly clueless we are with Covid-19?

[Dontrike]

Consumer confidence. Thats why. If people see a hike confidence falls and this attempt fails off the jump.

No, you said heat would kill it. There's plenty in Florida, and if heat did in fact do it and slowed the spread then there wouldn't be terrible numbers to hide. That's my point. Phoenix Arizona would also be one of the safest places on Earth from the virus too, right next to the equator and various volcanoes.

[Thepersona]

No, you said heat would kill it. There's plenty in Florida, and if heat did in fact do it and slowed the spread then there wouldn't be terrible numbers to hide. That's my point. Phoenix Arizona would also be one of the safest places on Earth from the virus too, right next to the equator and various volcanoes.

Can i add some info? Santiago has 27K cases and had a 1.8k+ daily increase for the last 5 days. Now, we're in fall, but the temperature of our capital has been around 70-90F, and only recently has gone below that.

And we still see a fuckton of cases.

[Dontrike]

Ok I get that but there was a lot of misinformation floating around at the time. People now can see the data. Also if people want to risk it and are to dumb to follow its on them. We need solutions not the blame game right now. We have a virus and a dying economy and we need to find a balance and right now we are failing at one miserably and the other we keep moving the goal posts.

And we could have knowledge and that much needed balance, but we have a president that constantly spouts that misinformation. The other issue being is that right now people find wearing a mask to be so unbearable that they are willing to shoot each other because they can't go in somewhere without a mask. Right now the general populace has to be willing to put up with basic precautions if they really truly want to get back to work, and of course they need to stop spouting that it's all a hoax, that would help too.

The "goalposts" are being moved because that is what is necessary. If people did what they needed to in the beginning (from the president to your neighbors) then those "goalposts" would not have needed to be moved in the first place. Blame the idiots waving signs about getting a haircut and various Nazi slogans and those pushing misinformation (Trump) for why the U.S. is still playing catch up to this virus and the world.

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The only group that benefits from posting numbers daily is for political gain. We have enough data now to know how to handle this virus and the choices are limited. So you would rather see daily numbers because its a scare tactic. Im sorry but at this point thats all it is. We have reach the plateau in most area, saddly way after predictions said we would so now its time for democrats to move that goal post further down the road.

To call having all the information a "scare tactic" is one the dumbest fucking things I've heard today, and that is really saying something. If people get scared having the proper, truthful information in front of them then that is on them because hiding that info only breeds ignorance and makes people not take this shit seriously, which is why we have idiots grouping together in the dozens calling it a hoax.

While yes, sometimes hiding some info is necessary, to hide that info now has no purpose other than, like you said, for political gain. Now who would be the one to gain the most from lack of information and numbers being lower? Well gee, I wonder.

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You seem to just want to attack Trump with no looking into the future. How is he wrong in trying to find a way to get the economy going with minimal cost on the government?

Because that is literally all he cares about. He feels nothing for those that were lost and those that will be lost. He wants the stock market higher so he can point and go "biggliest ecahnahmy evar" because that's all he has at this point. He has no other major win to his name. He isn't looking to compromise what needs to be done for the health of the people and the economy at the same time, just the economy.

He needs to man the fuck up and be a normal human being and an actual leader for once in his life. The fact you equate this to "what's so wrong with getting the economy open?" means you are so blind to what has been going on and what will happen if the proper precautions are not taken.

We can have an open economy and the correct precautions.

[Zaydin]

Because that is literally all he cares about. He feels nothing for those that were lost and those that will be lost. He wants the stock market higher so he can point and go "biggliest ecahnahmy evar" because that's all he has at this point. He has no other major win to his name. He isn't looking to compromise what needs to be done for the health of the people and the economy at the same time, just the economy.

He needs to man the fuck up and be a normal human being and an actual leader for once in his life. The fact you equate this to "what's so wrong with getting the economy open?" means you are so blind to what has been going on and what will happen if the proper precautions are not taken.

We can have an open economy and the correct precautions.

Lets be honest, we all know why Trump cultists/conservatives in the US don't want the accurate death numbers and it has nothing to do with people being afraid. It's because having accurate testing and an accurate death toll makes Trump look worse and worse and serves as a proof he botched this. Trump himself admitted why he doesn't want widespread testing again today.

[Dontrike]

Why does the public need the numbers? What does it at all change? We are not free to make decisions based off them so what use are they? Wow we get to see that people are dying. Thats called a scare tactic. The government is the only one who needs the daily updates. Even if we open up now we have people to scared to go out.

Holy fucking shit. You don't understand what a scare tactic actually is, do you? Hell, for that matter the idea that honest information is a scare tactic is so unbelievably stupid that it would take me hours to properly tell you why, but let's try anyways.

Think of this. Say we had zero data about who is dying or how many, so we all think that zero people are dead. Life would go on, no precautions are taken and we'd spread the virus like wildfire and more people than currently would die. People would still be dying and we'd be oblivious to it. How does ignorance and lack of knowledge help?

How about this example. The general populace has zero data and we "know" there are zero deaths. Suddenly the government shuts everything down. Now then we suddenly think the government has gone mad with power (not that it would be too surprising given who the president is) and we have riots in the streets while the virus runs rampant still. Then of course we have people probably killing each other in riots and that almighty civil war that Trump's base has been prophesizing happens, which he'll probably spin the whole situation as the Dems fault and more people die. How does ignorance and lack of knowledge help?

The data shows us that the virus is serious and that the social distancing and temporary closings are necessary, that way people can better understand what is happening and why it needs to. The issue here is that we have a political party (the party of Trump) politicizing this entire process. We have Trump hiding numbers to better his reelection (there's that political gain you talked about) and constantly lying about the virus. This is why we have his base believing this is all a hoax and drinking fucking bleach.

Once again, to say that having knowledge is a scare tactic is so literally retarded's second cousin. It is stupid with a capital FUCKING.

The blame is on both sides. They literally made a pandemic political because its an election year. There is no working together all both sides do is blame bad decisions instead of praising good ones.

That's not true one bit. Previous presidents were able to work together across the isle. Trump and Moscow Mitch has done everything they can to make it political. Instead of helping America they are in it for themselves and themselves only. Of course folks like yourself don't help one bit by agreeing with them.

[Felya]

No, you said heat would kill it. There's plenty in Florida, and if heat did in fact do it and slowed the spread then there wouldn't be terrible numbers to hide. That's my point. Phoenix Arizona would also be one of the safest places on Earth from the virus too, right next to the equator and various volcanoes.

I don’t know why I feel the need to keep saying this. But, the earth is round, tilted on an axis. This results in a southern and northern hemispheres. This causes places like Australia, to be 6 months behind places like America. When it’s January and February in US, in Australia is more a kin to our July and August. We knew what happens in the summer, because it did happen in the summer.

Oh and the hottest place on earth is in US... not close to equator. Biomes on the equator are varied:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biome

Edit: Sorry, I watch too many flat earth debunking videos.

[Nellise]

I don’t know why I feel the need to keep saying this. But, the earth is round, tilted on an axis. This results in a southern and northern hemispheres. This causes places like Australia, to be 6 months behind places like America. When it’s January and February in US, in Australia is more a kin to our July and August. We knew what happens in the summer, because it did happen in the summer.

Two of the best contained areas are Australia and New Zealand. So maybe it helps?

[Paranoid Android]

NEW: The U.S. government has paid at least $970,000 to @realdonaldtrump's businesses since Trump took office.

That includes at least **1,600** nightly room rentals at Trump properties.

https://t.co/lJbUeMU2My

https://twitter.com/Fahrenthold/stat...014280193?s=19

This is called stealing from the taxpayers.

So Trumpkins this corruption must upset you? Plus the salary he donates is not covering the profit he makes.

[Trunksee]

Holy fucking shit. You don't understand what a scare tactic actually is, do you? Hell, for that matter the idea that honest information is a scare tactic is so unbelievably stupid that it would take me hours to properly tell you why, but let's try anyways.

Think of this. Say we had zero data about who is dying or how many, so we all think that zero people are dead. Life would go on, no precautions are taken and we'd spread the virus like wildfire and more people than currently would die. People would still be dying and we'd be oblivious to it. How does ignorance and lack of knowledge help?

How about this example. The general populace has zero data and we "know" there are zero deaths. Suddenly the government shuts everything down. Now then we suddenly think the government has gone mad with power (not that it would be too surprising given who the president is) and we have riots in the streets while the virus runs rampant still. Then of course we have people probably killing each other in riots and that almighty civil war that Trump's base has been prophesizing happens, which he'll probably spin the whole situation as the Dems fault and more people die. How does ignorance and lack of knowledge help?

The data shows us that the virus is serious and that the social distancing and temporary closings are necessary, that way people can better understand what is happening and why it needs to. The issue here is that we have a political party (the party of Trump) politicizing this entire process. We have Trump hiding numbers to better his reelection (there's that political gain you talked about) and constantly lying about the virus. This is why we have his base believing this is all a hoax and drinking fucking bleach.

Once again, to say that having knowledge is a scare tactic is so literally retarded's second cousin. It is stupid with a capital FUCKING.



That's not true one bit. Previous presidents were able to work together across the isle. Trump and Moscow Mitch has done everything they can to make it political. Instead of helping America they are in it for themselves and themselves only. Of course folks like yourself don't help one bit by agreeing with them.

I am going to try and explain why moving the goal posts is hard for people to swallow. It started as if we lockdown for 2 weeks we can slow the spread. 6 weeks later most are saying we are at the plateau. Now this was the scientists. Next it was we are doing this to allow hospitals to ramp up. We create all the pop up hospitals that never get used and we are not even counting them as capacity now. Cuomo also sent away the naval ship and is giving away ventilators. It came across as we were doing this to prepare hospitals for the surge. Now we again move the goal posts to say we can contain it, yet there is no indication that that is possible anymore with the amount of infections we have. Why are we staying closed instead of opening now? This virus isnt going to be gone according to Bright for at least if we go by ebola 5 years at a minimum from now. 10 years more likely for the vaccine and it may not work. Now if we eradicate it by quarantine will we ever open the borders? Other countries could reinfect ours. 5 to 10 years with that 12 to 18 months now being another science lie. We need to get these hospitals back open and survive 5 to 10 years and accept that death is inevitable

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https://twitter.com/Fahrenthold/stat...014280193?s=19

This is called stealing from the taxpayers.

So Trumpkins this corruption must upset you? Plus the salary he donates is not covering the profit he makes.

Not really. Can you give me a comparison to what Obama spent for his hotels? Whats the spending difference? Also I would stay at my own place if i could. So the only thing that would make you happy iis if he just stayed some where else? Would it be ok if it was 3000 a night rooms as long as it wasnt his? How much do you expect him to give?

[Trunksee]

Funny how things work out, isn't it?

So if you have any relationship to Trump your business does not qualify for anything from the government. Ive seen a weak argument before but this is grasping at straws. As a small business owner it was up to the banks to distribute and im sure his relationship with the bank that played the biggest role.

[Felya]

Two of the best contained areas are Australia and New Zealand. So maybe it helps?

I’d say it’s likely population density and their reaction to it. But, that’s just my opinion. While regardless of that, Trump saying it will disappear in the summer, is demonstrably false. Regardless of my opinion...