The Doom of the Warlock

[FelPlague]

wrong

Demonic Embrace
Requires Warlock
Requires level 63
Stamina increased by 10%.

thats blizzards compensation for our lack in mobility (they did the same with DKs, by giving dps specs veteran of the third war)

But... dk also gets that 10%, and still has mobility, they have a thing called deaths advance...

[Angrie]

It’s not about meters the class isn’t fun to play anymore...

What class is fun? I'd say none. Every class is just a reskin of a different class. If all you saw on your screen was the damage numbers, no spell effects or animations, you could not tell what class you were observing. That's the homogenization people have been complaining about forever.

What needs to happen is spell effects need to be revamped desperately. I personally main a shadow priest. Think about their terrible spell effects. It's on par with Affliction with horrible spell effects. Dots don't really have an effect - compare to Moonkin, Mind Blast/Haunt both have terrible animations. Mind Flay/Sear // Drain Soul/Drain Life is a skinned line that doesn't look cool.
I raided as a mage for a long time, and whenever i log on my mage i'm reminded of the fun i had because their spell effects are just satisfying to look at (exclude arcane).
When i log on my warrior, again, i'm satisfied with how the animations bring depth. They do get a little stale after awhile - they should have different animations based on the previous ability.

Point here is, these effects keep me playing a class. That's where change is needed.

[Shandalar]

No please, Life Tap no.

Life Tap was a retarded spell. No sense that Warlocks have to mantain 2 different resources. One of the worst parts of Legions Demonology was the Life Tap spam (with the Demonic Empowerment spam).

[Saltysquidoon]

What class is fun? I'd say none. Every class is just a reskin of a different class. If all you saw on your screen was the damage numbers, no spell effects or animations, you could not tell what class you were observing. That's the homogenization people have been complaining about forever.

What needs to happen is spell effects need to be revamped desperately. I personally main a shadow priest. Think about their terrible spell effects. It's on par with Affliction with horrible spell effects. Dots don't really have an effect - compare to Moonkin, Mind Blast/Haunt both have terrible animations. Mind Flay/Sear // Drain Soul/Drain Life is a skinned line that doesn't look cool.

What does homogenisation have to do with spell effects? Like at all? If anything spell effects are more differentiated now then basically ever.

Also, your opinion about DL and DS is, unfortunately, an opinion. The 'new' DL looks badass and DS is fine, if you love spell effects so much why are you playing a dot spec?

No please, Life Tap no.

Life Tap was a retarded spell. No sense that Warlocks have to mantain 2 different resources. One of the worst parts of Legions Demonology was the Life Tap spam (with the Demonic Empowerment spam).

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with tap. It was perfectly fitting when all casters had a conserve phase and locks could choose the risky option of exchanging health to skip conserving mana (very flavourful).
The problem was in legion they tried to shoehorn it back in after removing mana managment from every other dps so it was just a feels bad 'let me get back to playing' button, not a greedy feels good button.

[Amariw]

Well, that's what I get for being too lazy to login and check my warlock. Instead I relied on wowheads talent calculator, which also displays your class abilities... Guess not all of them.

But your point about lifedrain is wrong. You can't spam lifedrain, it costs 3000 mana per second (15.000 mp5), you have 5000 mp5, meaning you will run out of mana eventually, which is the same as other classes, like druids, paladins, priests, etc, who can heal in their damage spec, but at the cost of mana.

And yes, I like being tanky. I liked Legion's Affliction, where you didn't really need a healer. And I don't really want to give any of that up.+

But I am willing to manage my mana via lifetap. Lifetap is the sole reason, why warlocks are survivalists in the first place. You needed the heal/shield, because you drained your own life. I am willing to do that again. Coming from Legion our survivalbility was gutted. Drain Soul went from 20% cap to 10%, and the leech rate was lowered. Affliction lost drain life as filler (which is okay imo). Demonic Armor was turned into a PvP talent.

I don't care about whether a dCD has 3min or 1.5min cooldown. I want options. I want the Legion pets back. The Option to sacrifice my pet and not just get a random proc every now and so often. I want the firey water walking mount glyph. Pets, that talk to me. Real options in talent rows. That sort of thing.
The question is always "What do you give up?", let me ask the following: How did we get compensated for the things we lost (absolute and relative)? Why is 2 stack backdraft a talent? Why is Shadowburn a talent? Nightfall, Drain Soul, instant Shadowfury, Haunt, Dark Soul, Demonic Circle (yeah, it's back to baseline in SL), FnB, Doomguard? All turned into Talents or gone over the years. Did you forget how they removed the ember mechanic at the start of BfA? Which spells did we get in return? Sow the seeds was nerfed, Havoc was nerfed, and so on. What did we get in return? Oh, yeah, the Darkglare, which turned Affliction into a single target burst spec.
So, I don't understand the question about what we want to give up. There really isn't anything more to give.

Don't get me wrong. Warlocks are not dead, they are not doomed. But they could use a push in M+, because every warlock spec relies either on ramp up or cooldowns (or both) and besides the felhunter we bring little utility in M+. Is an instant shadowfury on less than a minute CD really too much to ask? Would it break PvP? I doubt it. Is some filler spell for movement situations really too much to ask? Felflame, that just extends out DoTs, for example. Survivalbility is nice and all, but a warlock can not ignore M+ mechanics, because those are designed to be avoided, not tanked.

So, my wish would be the option to choose your talents for the situation you're facing: Raid? Better survivalbility. M+? Something to cast on the move (like felflame).
That's what the talent systems was changed for: Meaningful options. Our current talents are mostly not meaningful options, there's either a clear winner or three talents that do basically the same.

Quoted for truth. Adding that giving up stuff like MoP fire and brimestone and soul swap make the speccs far less intelligent,(a big problem of class design in general since Legion focusing too much on dps and less on decisions). You dont really have many decision making when multiple mobs pop. You just press aoe. Aff might get some of it back now with rupture, but you simply cannot compare destro's current "click rain of fire at 3 shards, incinerate without" aoe rotation mop's satisfying, decision involving and awesome Fire and Brimestone toggle.

[valky94]

But... dk also gets that 10%, and still has mobility, they have a thing called deaths advance...

while true, DA is a joke compared to pony and leap

atleast were getting baseline circle in SL

- - - Updated - - -

Well, that's what I get for being too lazy to login and check my warlock. Instead I relied on wowheads talent calculator, which also displays your class abilities... Guess not all of them.

it does show on wowheads talent calculator https://prnt.sc/skwefa

[FelPlague]

while true, DA is a joke compared to pony and leap

atleast were getting baseline circle in SL

- - - Updated - - -



it does show on wowheads talent calculator https://prnt.sc/skwefa

DA also makes them perma unable to be slown by more then 30%

[LordVargK]

it does show on wowheads talent calculator https://prnt.sc/skwefa

Huh, guess I'm just stupid then...

[valky94]

DA also makes them perma unable to be slown by more then 30%

imo its a worse version of burning rush

[Bigcountry11782]

Locks were beasts almost all expac or close to top damage in one spec or the other...besides demo so weak is not the word i would use.If you want to talk weak we can talk about sub rogues lol

[FelPlague]

imo its a worse version of burning rush

Burning rush eats up our health, and if you get cc'd it keeps going and you can't turn it off. It also is a movement ability, our only one, that hurts you. And shares a row, with the two defensive talents.

Oh also burning rush only stops you from being slown when used. DA is Perma.

[Recovery]

Their relationship with reality is often questionable.

Yeah evidently. lol.

[valky94]

Burning rush eats up our health, and if you get cc'd it keeps going and you can't turn it off. It also is a movement ability, our only one, that hurts you. And shares a row, with the two defensive talents.

Oh also burning rush only stops you from being slown when used. DA is Perma.

1. its the best talent in the tier as we rly dont need more survivability (unless we are asigned to soak something) and we need mobility
2. you can cancel it when CCed (just tested it while being cycloned)
3. with DA you cant be slowed under 70% passivly, 100% when active

[Lulbalance]

Locks were beasts almost all expac or close to top damage in one spec or the other...besides demo so weak is not the word i would use.If you want to talk weak we can talk about sub rogues lol

At least with sub rogue you trade dmg for high control. What do you trade damage for with demo lock?

[Gaidax]

Burning rush eats up our health, and if you get cc'd it keeps going and you can't turn it off. It also is a movement ability, our only one, that hurts you. And shares a row, with the two defensive talents.

Oh also burning rush only stops you from being slown when used. DA is Perma.

Ma boi, are you trying to hype up Death's Advance lul? That's the shittiest mobility increase ingame period, while Burning Rush is one of the best ones due to its no cd, no limit nature.

I guess it also helps that Warlock is ranged, while DK is melee.

DK is the worst class when it comes to mobility period. There is even no contest.

[haediff]

Literally just revert Warlock to MoP play style and I’d be happy. Idk why they bothered changing past that besides fear of things becoming “stale.” Incinerate while running, Fel Bolt spam, Chaos Bolt Multistrike and the animation looked better back then TBH.

[Mayhem]

What class is fun? I'd say none. Every class is just a reskin of a different class. If all you saw on your screen was the damage numbers, no spell effects or animations, you could not tell what class you were observing. That's the homogenization people have been complaining about forever.

What needs to happen is spell effects need to be revamped desperately. I personally main a shadow priest. Think about their terrible spell effects. It's on par with Affliction with horrible spell effects. Dots don't really have an effect - compare to Moonkin, Mind Blast/Haunt both have terrible animations. Mind Flay/Sear // Drain Soul/Drain Life is a skinned line that doesn't look cool.
I raided as a mage for a long time, and whenever i log on my mage i'm reminded of the fun i had because their spell effects are just satisfying to look at (exclude arcane).
When i log on my warrior, again, i'm satisfied with how the animations bring depth. They do get a little stale after awhile - they should have different animations based on the previous ability.

Point here is, these effects keep me playing a class. That's where change is needed.

Wow, now that's random.

[Orwell7]

Tbh if you want a good gameplay experience in WoW, just look up private servers - wotlk, cata, mop, maybe even wod servers...

It seems like Blizzard makes WoW like someone mods a car: shiny new headlights, new paint job, installing a sun-roof... except it's a Lada from 1980.
Blizz needs to see what players see: HOW playing your spec for a looong long time feels. No variation, pidgeon-holed into a spec for 2 years without any changes.

Let's have class revamps every few months, those alone will shake up the meta for good - players can try out different things, nothing is set in stone for a while. Staleness and boredom while doing necessary boring tasks is what kills the game for me.

[koalafarmer]

been playing since May 2008. its not about NO1 DPS. More about class fiction and fun. I truely feel they need to break the class apart. they can not handle a pure 3 dps spec and give it fun play style without limiting it. Any new demons? appearance? so much in game fantasy can be done for the class. The greenfire quest shows you what can be done.

I'd love to see demo the spec its meant to be. New class, Necromancer / Demologist. Master of summoning / control. One is undead. The other is demons. New armour, which u make / forge Demon skin based armour / bone armour. Druids have leather. (no idea why, being from nature, wearing animal skins) its armour rating in between cloth / leather. so then this gives blizzard the easier task to focus on warlocks as the Dots or cleave spec. and the new Necro/demo spec as the master of summons & control. and so much more you can do. As I repeat again. they can not balance Pure dps class like warlocks.

[FelPlague]

Ma boi, are you trying to hype up Death's Advance lul? That's the shittiest mobility increase ingame period, while Burning Rush is one of the best ones due to its no cd, no limit nature.

I guess it also helps that Warlock is ranged, while DK is melee.

DK is the worst class when it comes to mobility period. There is even no contest.

Atleast they have mobility baseline. We are the only class without a baseline mobility.