Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Frenchvince]

But do not worry !
There will be something for everyone, Blizzard will make customization additions to all races even after shadowlands.

[Unlimited Power]

Question though - what is the point of giving Blood Elves blue eyes?

Blizzard's stance on High Elves was always that Blood Elves were for all intents and purposes High Elves that had changed their name to honor the fallen when the scourge attacked the Sunwell.

Why would Blizzard give Void Elves blue eyes and Blood Elven skin colours without giving Blood Elves blue eyes? Void Elves are only getting High Elf customization as a direct result of Blood Elves getting it, seeing as Void Elves are just supposed to be void afflicted Blood Elves.

People can roleplay whatever they want when Void Elves have Blood Elf customizations, but at the end of the day Void Elves will still have Void Elven racials because they're no more High Elves than Blood Elves are.

[Traycor]

hardly since they were already few and some of then were killed there and apparently many survivors got killed anyway later

While the definition can vary, a squad is generally considered to be between 2-12 members. At the very most, that's a few dozen void elves. There are probably many dozens if not hundreds of high elf survivors of Theramore alone.

- - - Updated - - -

The runes from the blood elf expansion box are different from Alleria's warpaint, thought.
I think it would be cool if the styles were different for each race: blood elves with arcane-like runes, void elves with celtic-like patterns.
But I'm not picky, I'm just trying to predict things rather than say what is acceptable or not. I just want some warpaint, that's all.

Exactly this.

[Edward Wu]

Warpaint for high elves would be beyond awesome. Would love to see that included some day.

[Ardenaso]

When Void Elves get blonde hair, and the BE hairstyles instead of the tentacles they call hair now, and new voice lines and racials, then we have High Elves.

ayyy this is the part where become a naysayer

[Unholyground]

They just gave you high elves with those new skins, just be happy about that. you can probably make an add-on that changes the display of your race to high elf too!

[Edward Wu]

They just gave you high elves with those new skins, just be happy about that. you can probably make an add-on that changes the display of your race to high elf too!

Why do you care so much that people keep requesting improvements to things they care about? Why does it personally bother you so much?

High Elves have arrived. Blizzard is on board with it. The HE fanbase is dedicated to making sure the update ships with as many features as they can get. This is completely normal and acceptable fan behavior. Get the fuck over it already.

[protip]

The runes from the blood elf expansion box are different from Alleria's warpaint, thought.
I think it would be cool if the styles were different for each race: blood elves with arcane-like runes, void elves with celtic-like patterns.
But I'm not picky, I'm just trying to predict things rather than say what is acceptable or not. I just want some warpaint, that's all.

I don't think it's okay to restrict blood elves from any part of the high elf legacy. They are the continuation of high elf society, and they have gone through considerable effort to maintain their way of life. I like the idea of arcane runes, and Warcraft 2 style warpaint could be interesting, but if the story behind any of these options is that it comes from their history as high elves, then blood elves should have access to it as well.

[Kyriani]

You can't say you like lore, then say you're a high elf on the alliance. The two are literal contradictions.

I take some issue with this.

Ok let's first establish a fact I think we can all agree upon. However small their number, there are High Elf members of the Alliance. We see and interact with them in game. This is indisputable.

Now, indulge me with a hypothetical. An Alliance High Elf civilian loses a family member in the fourth war to attacks by the Horde or from one of N'zoth's invasions. Feeling powerless and lost, he turns to Alleria Windrunner and the Ren'dorei to teach him their ways so he can protect those he loves and not be powerless in the face of danger again. He trains under Alleria and Locus Walker using similar techniques that Alleria herself used. Eventually he completes his training and takes on a void form for the first time. He still retains his usual High Elven appearance when not in void form. His history as an Alliance High Elf has not changed even if the direction his life is taking has. He now fights for the Alliance under the banner of the Ren'dorei. He has crossed over from being an NPC to a Player.

Is he not allowed to consider himself both an Alliance High Elf and a Ren'dorei? Unless something changes, the game mechanics will of course identify him as a Void Elf just as the game identifies Horde High Elves as Blood Elves, but that doesn't completely erase his history as an Alliance High Elf, nor do I believe it takes away his right to call himself a High Elf.

[Broflake]

However small their number, there are High Elf members of the Alliance

I've not denied this and pointed it out in several of my posts Kyriani.

Now, indulge me with a hypothetical. An Alliance High Elf civilian loses a family member in the fourth war to attacks by the Horde or from one of N'zoth's invasions. Feeling powerless and lost, he turns to Alleria Windrunner and the Ren'dorei to teach him their ways so he can protect those he loves and not be powerless in the face of danger again. He trains under Alleria and Locus Walker using similar techniques that Alleria herself used. Eventually he completes his training and takes on a void form for the first time. He still retains his usual High Elven appearance when not in void form. His history as an Alliance High Elf has not changed even if the direction his life is taking has. He now fights for the Alliance under the banner of the Ren'dorei. He has crossed over from being an NPC to a Player.

Is he not allowed to consider himself both a High Elf and a Ren'dorei? Unless something changes, the game mechanics will of course identify him as a Void Elf, but that doesn't completely erase his history as an Alliance High Elf, nor do I believe it takes away his right to call himself a High Elf.

I would say....no.
The reason for this is to become a void elf, is different from changing your name to blood elf. You are leaving behind much of what defines the high elves. You inundate yourself with the void and change entirely. Your thoughts and philosophies may be the same, but on this fundamental level you are now different.
To give an example I would like to point at nightborne. Thalyssra was a night elf, and then she changed because of the nightwell.
So she isn't a night elf any longer even if she is the same person she used to be.
This applies for the trolls who became night elves.
Or the highborne who became high elves.

The name change is to reflect they have become something entirely different. Let alone they have also chosen to inundate themselves with arguably the most powerful and most dangerous power They've given up an important aspect of their views and belief to become a void elf. Just as how demon hunters have fundamentally changed the way they view things to become a demon hunter. It is a radical change, and not an easy one.

[Unholyground]

Why do you care so much that people keep requesting improvements to things they care about? Why does it personally bother you so much?

High Elves have arrived. Blizzard is on board with it. The HE fanbase is dedicated to making sure the update ships with as many features as they can get. This is completely normal and acceptable fan behavior. Get the fuck over it already.

I honestly didn't know high elves existed until a few years ago and it never bothered me to play blood elves lmao. I really don't care it is just this thread has gotten to like a bazillion pages of bitching lmao.

[Broflake]

Actually there are High Elf Paladin NPC's (e.g. Rulen Lightsreap) that depending on your level and faction can probably get them to kill you but High Elf Paladins are very rare lorewise so it may not be easy . However High Elf Paladin's don't necessarily know how to use Arcane Torrent since it is an ability that is taught to Blood Elves (during the quest "Thirst Unending"), not innate to Thalasian Elves.

Yes...yes they do. It is stated the high elves always had the knowledge of drawing magic from objects, but that they never knew how to do it to a living being which is what Illidan taught them. It was why the quel'lithien elves had such an issue with it. It took what they could normally do and turned it against others.

So even though Blood Elves and High Elves are both Thalasian Elves it doesn't mean they need to have the same racial abilities.

Yes...yes it does. Your racial abilities are essentially your innate birth abilities. Both blood elves and high elves are the samepeople with a difference in only name and political views.

Void Elves were Blood Elves yet they don't seem to use Arcane Torrent anymore. Arcane Torrent clearly is an arcane type of magic that Void Elves would have no problem using. It seems unlikely to me they wouldn't know how to do it.

That is because void elves were transformed by the void and they no longer can use such an ability. Arcne torrent is its own type of magic. It is only capable of being down by this race. We never see trolls, orcs, or other mage types performing such a thing. It is exclusive to their race.

High Elves according to the still canon Warcraft Encyclopedia never used mana tap: "Blood elves no longer truly consider themselves high elves, and they tend to have different priorities and behaviors than their high elf kindred. Unlike high elves, blood elves have decided that in the absence of the Sunwell, they will feed their hunger for arcane magic by draining that magic from alternative sources."

There is no information in the encclopedia stating they never used mana tap. They never used mana tap on living things which was the point of contention. Taela, whom you quote below, is amongst the group that has you steal arcane artifacts for this purpose. It is also stated the reason Alleria was not bothered by the detruction of the sunwell was because outland was filled with so much magic that she absorbed it.
The statement in your paragraph that you underlined said blood elves have DECIDED.
This means choice, not inability.

This is also made clear by Taela Everstride in the Allerian Stronghold: "I'm a HIGH elf, not a blood elf. Don't worry, I'm not going to suck all of the magic out of you.".

This is a philosophical statement born from the fact you don't know if someone is a high elf or blood elf.

So if High Elves didn't have the Mana Tap racial ability during TBC it seems to indicate that High Elves and Blood Elves already at the time of TBC had different racials.

NPC's dont use racials dude. That is a false argument

We see the same with other species. Stormwind Humans and Kul'Tiran are the same species but have different racials.

There is the whole "human potential" thing that comes into play, and the fact that their racial abilities aren't mof a magical nature.
THere is also the fact that the stormwind humans and kul'tiran humans existed separate for such a long period of time that variation can occur
HIgh elves bred slowly and lived very long lives and they all live together until 30 years ago with the events of TBC representing a separation of 13 years. The circumstances are not equivalent.

The same with Gnomes and Mechagnomes,

THey've replaced the mass majority of their body Unless you're saying it makes sense for gnomes to have the omnipurpose tool derived from mechanical arms?

Orcs and Mag'har Orcs.

One is from prime azeroth and the other is from an alternate universe.

Racial abilities don't determine your race

They're literally called racials for a reason.

they are there to give extra flavor to your character and the faction they represent. Racials are not necesarily innate to a race. Lore-wise they can be learned abilities such as Stoneform and Mana Tap or cultural such as the Dwarf "Explore" racial or some of the Goblin racials. Wildhammer Dwarves are the same species/race as Bronzebeard Dwarves yet they wouldn't have an "Explore" racial ability since they are not interested in archeology, nor would they need to know how to use Stoneform which as far as I know lorewise is an ability rediscovered by the Explorers' League when they were researching their titan origins, something the Wildhammers have no interest in.

Wildhammer dwarves and other creatures cannot mana tap.
Many other races cannot perform stoneform either.

Certainly there are cultural aspects, but those for the blood elves represent innate abilities used to take advantage of what they can already do.
Let alone it has been statedhigh elves can mana tap, the only difference is they wont do it on aliving thing, not that they will not use it on magical bjects (which they have).

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

I mean... I think you are nobody to tell others to 'go read the lore' when the request has always been directed at High elves existing in the Alliance, isn't that 'loreful' enough for you? Then I'm sorry, but I think someone else should be the one 'reading the lore'.

Hah, at least it's there already, and devs will see players with High elves in the Alliance, and also those who opposed it will have to swallow their pride and accept how wrong they were by opposing such thing so hard.

I mean, it could even be blamed that it isn't an allied race (for now) to those who opposed it so hard, so yeah, if for you this is the worst thing that could have happened, good job sending your feedback, you did it to yourself.

Now all of you will get High elves shoved down your throat, no matter the way they got in the game, you all will just have to accept it, sorry.

The reason this compromise is terrible is because you deserve a fully fleshed out and articulate story for your favorite race despite my disagreeing with it. This half measure is an insult to us both.

As far as gameplay goes this will return faction balance to pre-BC levels. Elves were the only thing that gave the horde a fighting chance.

Also just want to point out that Nightbourne or w/e don't really belong on horde either. Elves are going to ruin this game just like they do every other fantasy genre.

Don't forget to like and subscribe.

[Broflake]

Why do you care so much that people keep requesting improvements to things they care about? Why does it personally bother you so much?

Because the Horde basically just lost a race to a minority of alliance players who non-stopped demanded them for 15 years. Why does it personally bother you that others are unhappy about this change? Or want to maintain what little uniqueness they have left?

High Elves have arrived. Blizzard is on board with it. The HE fanbase is dedicated to making sure the update ships with as many features as they can get. This is completely normal and acceptable fan behavior. Get the fuck over it already.

High elf fans are dedicated to literally ripping the entire blood elf race from the Horde, while the Horde has literally gotten nothing comparatively.
Did they get better nightborne? Or a night elf model?
You aren't qualified to determine what is normal fan behavior by cursing at people to get over it just because you are upset at them being upset. You want to thump your chest and say "im important and i should get this" then you need to respect others who say "I am important too and I DONT want this.".

[Magnagarde]

I actually agree with you here... whiles i've accepted nihgtborne and blood elves on the horde, it's weird that the alliance night elves don't have more nightborne like features for their highborne NPCs and in player customisation - like the skinnier body which fits a caster more, the arrogant pose and arcane runes.

Gone will be most of the high elf threads, and most of the highborne night elf threads.

I've read your entire post, but this part stands out in relation to what I originally posted, which is why I'm quoting this part only. Indeed, most threads might go away or they might not. I believe it is flat out wrong to generalize players' opinions behind one thing and keep going with that dynamic, as is witnessed with this hot topic. Most of those who voiced their support for seeing playable Alliance high elves seem to have only wanted the look and aesthetic of a high elf and that's perfectly fine with me. More power to them as far as I'm concerned.

As someone who has voiced his support towards playable Alliance high elves, I've always had a bigger, panfactional image and idea behind it as the driving motive, rather than the individual race, the eyecolor or whatever. As much as the Alliance high elves have to offer themselves, from individual thematics and lore to recycled fantasy tropes(I am not against tropes), I've also seen and continue to see a lot of Alliance identity behind it. Ogres and/or Mok'nathal are my personal most-anticipated addition and they too carry the same thematic weight for the Horde in my opinion. I can honestly say that lot of that is the reason why I want them playable in the first place.

It is flat out wrong to now come forward and tell everyone that they've got their good-looking, blue-eyed elf and attempt to bash any further conversation about this subject, justifying it with the generalized take that pretty elves is something everyone who supported this idea wanted. It is even an even greater error to think someone's gotta stop talking about a subject because of arbitrary stops being put in place by some members of the wider Warcraft community. I personally care about faction identity rather than pretty additions, which is why - once again - ogres are on my playable wishlist for more than 15 years. The fact that high elves and most Alliance races appear prettier than some other races - mostly Horde ones at that - goes to tell me that many have picked the Horde side of things because of the accessibility towards pretty elves, in turn trying to break other people's reasoning down to their own.

[DeicideUH]

I don't think it's okay to restrict blood elves from any part of the high elf legacy. They are the continuation of high elf society, and they have gone through considerable effort to maintain their way of life. I like the idea of arcane runes, and Warcraft 2 style warpaint could be interesting, but if the story behind any of these options is that it comes from their history as high elves, then blood elves should have access to it as well.

I'm not opposed to blood elves getting anything, but I think showing that each branch of the high elf legacy took different paths is better. Just like I don't think it would be a smart move to give void elves the blood elf hair styles and colors, despite it making sense since both share the same legacy. Investing in different styles for each would help make them feel apart. While both share origins, each took its own spin on them.

(To be frank, I never expected void elves to get all belf skin colors either, so that move from Blizzard did surprise me.)

[Edward Wu]

Horde whine about Nightborne shipping out unfinished and lazily done: Completely ok.
Helfers whine about Void Elf-High Elf customization pass shipping out unfinished and lazily done: Pure greed.

You gotta love it.

[funklink]

I'll do your black ass with my pointy ears

Do you really have to sidetrack interesting threads like this with disgusting nonsense?

[Magnagarde]

The reason this compromise is terrible is because you deserve a fully fleshed out and articulate story for your favorite race despite my disagreeing with it. This half measure is an insult to us both.

This is the best way of putting this situation in perspective.

[Kyriani]

Then we are at an impasse because I don't agree with you assessment that this hypothetical individual has lost the right to call himself an Alliance High Elf.

I will also say that despite your reasoning, I dont see any actually contradiction of the lore for said hypothetical individual to call themselves an Alliance High Elf. If that individual considers himself an Alliance High Elf that uses void powers after joining the Ren'dorei, I don't think anyone has the right to tell him different. Especially for those who weren't part of Umbric's squad who were physically transformed by Durzaan's ritual which this hypothetical elf has not.

In Ion's own words:

Blood Elves are pretty much High Elves... Void Elves are also pretty much another flavor of High Elves

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4BsxB4NJIBs