Blizzard should release BfA Servers

[munkeyinorbit]

While this expansion has been hated by the very small vocal minority, a lot of people actually love BfA's formula and content.

Just LOL and million times LOL. Azerite sucks, corruption, borrowed powers suck, island exp sucks, warfronts suck, PVP is just trash now, storytelling is the worst ever. What blizz should do is that delete BFA totally and say that we go from Legion to shadowlands

You just wait. When we are in 10.1 you will see dozens of "I wish we could go back to BfA. All the specs were way better then and I could level extra things like esscences and get TF gear. The hunt for Sylvanas is shit." This is a guarentee. Happened with Cata and with WoD. It's called rose tinted glasses and it's a shame cause you get abominations like Classic if there's money in it

- - - Updated - - -

Class balance and encounter design isnt the same as class design.

Class design is about rotations and complexity in the specs. Vanilla/tbc might have been simpler/more boring then what we have now, but wrath literally rivaled it. Since then it got better and it peaked in MoP with some complex and fun specs to play.

3-4 button rotations with extremely simple encounters like Nyalotha has is not good class design

Remember when panda was universally panned? The same thing will happen to BfA. People will start to look at BfA in the same light as panda in a couple of years.

[Kralljin]

Happened with Cata and with WoD.

Nah, Cata and especially WoD are still hated.

The very fact that people are discussing whether WoD or BfA is the worst expansion of WoW is proof of that.
You're spreading this terrible myth, despite the fact that by this myth, WoD must be seen as a "good" expansion by now, yet it isn't.

[Soon-TM]

isnt this the same guy who said, we need corruptions in shadowlands, made a pool and %92 says fuck off with corruptions? lmao

Well, the poll in this thread is the same then. It's actually hilarious, but you gotta commend OP's trolling skills: he managed to get a troll thread going for at least 8 pages, without any mod warning or shenaningans alike. Gotta give credit where it's due

[munkeyinorbit]

Nah, Cata and especially WoD are still hated.

The very fact that people are discussing whether WoD or BfA is the worst expansion of WoW is proof of that.
You're spreading this terrible myth, despite the fact that by this myth, WoD must be seen as a "good" expansion by now, yet it isn't.

You are new here. You can actually search through the forums and find what I stated.

Tip for new people: When you are proven wrong it is usually expected that you would apologise for your mistake. I will be waiting.

[Kralljin]

You are new here. You can actually search through the forums and find what I stated.

Some else posted this poll:
https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...Expansion-Poll

Check the date, may 2018.

4(!) years after WoD.
8(!) years after Cata.

Both are still considered the worst by a long shot.

Also, telling someone with the exact join year / month, that they are "new" is somehow funny.

[kosajk]

Have you ever actually played a character with good corruptions and essences? Judging by your posts it doesn’t seem like you’ve ever given it even a chance just BFABAD BLIZZDUMB

actually i did and i find system awfull and expecially it should be off in pvp in the first place or reduced to 10-20% of its normal dmg, having one off your top 3 dmgs (sometimes 2 and in the end prabobly more as back resistances will lvl up) from random procs gotten from items that are random drops with random coruptions is fucking disgusting dropception, posibility to buy it is making things a bit better although not touching core of the problem triple true for pvp which bacame joke with preanuancing of coruption

[Shiza]

You just wait. When we are in 10.1 you will see dozens of "I wish we could go back to BfA. All the specs were way better then and I could level extra things like esscences and get TF gear. The hunt for Sylvanas is shit." This is a guarentee. Happened with Cata and with WoD. It's called rose tinted glasses and it's a shame cause you get abominations like Classic if there's money in it

- - - Updated - - -



Remember when panda was universally panned? The same thing will happen to BfA. People will start to look at BfA in the same light as panda in a couple of years.

Mist of Pandaria was never unpopular due to how classes played though. People where skeptical and a bit butthurt about the change of the talent system, but the biggest criticisms where the daily grind at the beginning of the expansion to unlock the gear vendors as well as flying and the setting, with a bit of whining later on about the rebellion storyline, but nothing comparable to the negative reception of the BFA Story. People didn't really complain about how the classes played, just about how you would skill them. In BFA, people are unhappy with how classes play in direct comparison with Legion which has nearly the same class design and about the obnoxious grind and rng for the various systems Blizzard implemented over the course of the expansion.

[Nuggsy]

So once Shadowlands comes around, Battle for Azeroth is going to be done and dusted. This sucks, like really bad. While this expansion has been hated by the very small vocal minority, a lot of people actually love BfA's formula and content. There's been so much awesome stuff so far in BfA and it's gonna suck to have it all disappear.

Blizzard release BfA servers upon Shadowlands launch. I know I'd rather go back to playing 8.0 than ever touch 9.0, considering how shit Shadowlands looks so far. So, do you agree that Blizzard should release BfA servers? Tell me why you think so down below, I love having these community discussions.

Judging by polling data, you seem to be in the minority, my friend. Also, lets stop asking blizzard to basically re release the entire game for nostalgia reasons. I'd rather time effort and resources be put into the current game. Aside from that, no idea how people could be happy with the 100 different systems/currencies added in BFA to fix the previous broken currency/system. The whole foundation of the expansion, Azerite armor, was a flop on lauch and for a long while after launch. The amazing warfronts they hyped up turned out to be objectively terrible. Like.. everyone has their own opinions and that fine but it boggles my mind that someone can look at BFA and say 'yeah, that expansion is so good it needs its own servers.' Yeeesh.

[BeepBoo]

BfA has literally sooo much content.

You're confusing "things that give meaningful rewards" with "content".

Content is that activity... once. Then it's no longer novel content. Repeating the same thing 100 times doesn't mean they made 100 pieces of content. One quest repeated 100 times is not the same as 100 different quests.

This is AWESOME to have so much to do, it means you'll never be finished and that you can always tackle something when you logon. A good game never runs out of things to do.

Some of us abhor the idea of "reasons to do things" means "content". Some of us hate fucking grinds. Some of us want to cap out things and invalidate other forms of "content" because that content is bottom tier, easiest-to-make-for-devs, generic, faceroll garbage that we'd rather not HAVE to do to stay on the bleeding edge. Some of us just want the only reason we're logging on to play the game to be because we enjoy whatever it is we're going to do and would do it even if it didn't give a reward at all.

Also, just because it's all in new zones or areas doesn't mean that type of "content" is new to BFA. Legion had all of that minus islands and warfronts, which both suck nuts as far as entertainment value goes.

You derive enjoyment from character progression, which is not content in-and-of itself.
I derive enjoyment from ACTUAL large swathes of content and stroking my epeen so I can lord myself over other people within the confines of my own head.

[Nachtigal]

There is no "trend" and anyone who thinks that releasing TBC means that they *therefore must* release the others is being deliberately obtuse.

- - - Updated - - -



So you're saying you don't know what is up with folk who have a different opinion to your own?
I could just as easily turn around and say "Dunno what is about the folk who can't comprehend other people have a different opinion to them". It would be a stupid thing to say, but I only say it to mock how silly you sound in return.

And also, don't assume people feel 'mentally obligated' to hate BfA. Some people, again, have the opinion, and it's different to your own. Seriously, how can you not actually comprehend that others have different opinions?

- - - Updated - - -



Well that logic of yours was proven to be absolute trash after WoD, so I don't know what basis you're using for that claim.

Except half, nay, 3/4 of the clowns around here simply mask their hate with opinions. Sure, on the surface, they’re opinions... but really at their core, it’s nothing more than hate for Blizzard, because said clowns only find their “fun” in being number #1 and shit talking down on everyone they’re “betters than.

And now they’re mad because they can’t be number 1 all the time, because little
Johnny got more procs than him. Johnny is on your team, and if you’re good, you’re progressing. You’ll have good parses and bad parses. It’s not a big deal.

The world first race is long gone, because you had bad rng one pull is NOT the reason you’ve wiped. Nobody is wiping because they didn’t get enough IS/TD procs.

[Dungo]

You're confusing "things that give meaningful rewards" with "content".

Content is that activity... once. Then it's no longer novel content. Repeating the same thing 100 times doesn't mean they made 100 pieces of content. One quest repeated 100 times is not the same as 100 different quests.




Some of us abhor the idea of "reasons to do things" means "content". Some of us hate fucking grinds. Some of us want to cap out things and invalidate other forms of "content" because that content is bottom tier, easiest-to-make-for-devs, generic, faceroll garbage that we'd rather not HAVE to do to stay on the bleeding edge. Some of us just want the only reason we're logging on to play the game to be because we enjoy whatever it is we're going to do and would do it even if it didn't give a reward at all.

Also, just because it's all in new zones or areas doesn't mean that type of "content" is new to BFA. Legion had all of that minus islands and warfronts, which both suck nuts as far as entertainment value goes.

You derive enjoyment from character progression, which is not content in-and-of itself.
I derive enjoyment from ACTUAL large swathes of content and stroking my epeen so I can lord myself over other people within the confines of my own head.

I respectfully disagree. I think content is content regardless of how you look at it.

[BeepBoo]

Except half, nay, 3/4 of the clowns around here simply mask their hate with opinions. Sure, on the surface, they’re opinions... but really at their core, it’s nothing more than hate for Blizzard, because said clowns only find their “fun” in being number #1 and shit talking down on everyone they’re “betters than.

Almost none of the people I know that stroke epeen shit talk anyone in any other place than these forums because people here ask for it by being such obvious weakling bottom bitches. Stop acting like they're just running around spamming allchat "BOW TO ME MORTALS."

Never happens.

And now they’re mad because they can’t be number 1 all the time, because little
Johnny got more procs than him. Johnny is on your team, and if you’re good, you’re progressing. You’ll have good parses and bad parses. It’s not a big deal.

To you, but it is fucking stupid to have swings in damage upwards of 30% when you do the exact same thing. Raids being downed is basically a given (unless your raid is filled with one too many scrubs), and it's fun to try and be perfect. Hard to do that when you have less and less control over your performance, which blizzard is doing intentionally btw. Same reason fighting games have been systemically reducing the skill ceiling by allowing more random upsets.

- - - Updated - - -

I respectfully disagree. I think content is content regardless of how you look at it.

Again, reasons are not content. Content is the stuff you do, not the goals you have. An album isn't unlimited content just because you can listen to it a million times and not get tired of it. It's a set amount of content that is recycled, nothing more.

Unless you're telling me everyone with a single book has an unlimited library. Everyone with a song has unlimited music, etc.

[GucciWarr]

Calls major essence a passive, ok clown, you literally don’t know anything about BFA just what the other circle jerk hive mind tells you to think, really hope you don’t come back

[CaptainV]

You still did Karazhan for those that needed the gear / badges, new players / alts just didn't hop into BT, or not?
Were you still doing Naxx when 3.3 came out? Nope, you didn't even bother with Ulduar.

Throughout TBC, every single Raid was relevant, because all of them still provided gear for anyone that wasn't playing at the cutting edge.

Wotlk pretty much continued with Arena being the focal point of Arena, if you're critizing TBC for that, you need to put Wotlk into the same boat.
And if you ignored Arena as far as gearing is concerned, your (PvP) gear was pretty bad in Wotlk.

And Wintergrasp was a total shitshow on any server where factions were not balanced, Tenacity says hi.

There is a difference between "making it less impactful" and essentially neutering the entire mechanic.

Like it or not, threat was one of those mechanics that made the more of team game, rather than a game where everyone operates within their own box.
If you have a person that fails to play properly, the rest suffers, rather than the game compensating for the shortcomings of one person.

Tools such as Soulshatter or Misdrection really took a huge hit with Wotlk, because threat just wasn't a big deal anymore.

I disagree with calling Wotlk a "vanilla experience" because Wotlk was the turning point for the game where it definitely turned away from the Vanilla approach in many aspects.
Wotlk is leagues away from Classic / Vanilla in terms of design, TBC didn't change the game's structure as much.

Kharazan actually destroyed the 40 man raid scene and forced raiders to literally disband guilds in order to form new ones, as did the 25 man raid scene that was the focus of TBC, raid sniping was a common problem which was seen as a big issue back then, I recall the stink about it.

Everyone remembers TBC because it was that expansion that "raiders" became relevent content especially because blizz hyped how epic it was to see who could kill X or Y first, but it neglects to mention that it killed raid guilds and destroyed smaller ones so that bigger guilds could thrive.

Vanillia was more casual friendly, and WOTLK returned to form by making 10 mans a content choice for people. It was a pretty nice compramise because it meant guilds that were struggling for numbers didnt need to worry while they absoleutley did in TBC because it did require you to push through multiple runs of X or Y to get geared to do Z.

The issue with that logic is that nobody that was a raider at that time actually had the patience, or compassion to help other players progress, it was a "dog eat dog" world, when back in Vanillia you literally NEEDED to help people progress or you WOULD be unable to do so yourself.

WOTLK was definatley not when things went wrong, tbh if you really wanna say that, TBC was the time they started pruning raids, bringing in arena's as I said before, which brought in the worst pvp stat ever (ressilience) making literally all other stats completley irrelevent for pvp save ressilence.

TBC is honestly one of the most rose tinted expansions in the game, it was definately "not" that great in terms of its over all content, you spend more time grinding than any other expansion combined and it also had a very harsh "Either get on the band wagon or be left behind" mentality towards new players, which meant alot of people trying to catch up couldnt.

Another major problem was faction imbalance, Blood Elf Paladins had the best retribution paladin seal at the time since seal of blood, despite taking 10% of your own hp in damage did more damage than *any* paladin seal in the game and made ret fairly decent for once in dps rotations while seal of truth was significantly less effective in comparison.

Gift of the Naaru was also pretty weak back then as it didnt really offer efficent sustain while blood elves had an ability that literally destroyed people in pvp. It became one of the BIS for anti caster dps in pvp.

Wintergrasp was far from the only time faction imbalance was a problem. Nagrand was an issue too as were the world pvp zones in TBC but the difference is that in Wintergrasp you had equalisers for a lack of dps or numbers, you could still win with a 10 man group if you knew exactly what you were doing and where to go.

As I said, its a rose tinted glasses game, people like to remember TBC fondly as this amazing game where crafting was amazing cause you could make upgradeable weapons, or the fact that the new races were amazingly well designed and looked way ahead of the others in comparison.

Yet they forget TBC was when raiding became an obsession for blizzard and they ignored the rest of the game, which Vanillia was NOT about raiding purely, yes, raiding was the main content of some patches but even without it, they had other content too, new battlegrounds, new world content, new world pvp.

TBC started to prune back the PvP Scene, WOTLK brought it back for a time, then Cata put the nail in the coffin and id honestly say by MoP and WoD it basically died completley.

The BIGGEST mess BFA made? Is that an expansion about the faction war that SHOULDNT have had a warmode but instead just had world pvp zones like Wintergrasp, did not execute this and instead focused TOO much, on the raiding again.

Ion's a failure of a director, hes been so since WoD and hes definatley *not* a good leader for the games development, even Legion while it had a good story introduced some of the WORST RNG dependance in the game.

So going back to what this topic was about?

Yeah no, BFA can *stay* dead I dont think ANYONE regardless of if you loved Wrath, TBC or Vanillia would MISS Cata, WoD, BfA.

[ClassicPeon]

You just wait. When we are in 10.1 you will see dozens of "I wish we could go back to BfA. All the specs were way better then and I could level extra things like esscences and get TF gear. The hunt for Sylvanas is shit." This is a guarentee. Happened with Cata and with WoD. It's called rose tinted glasses and it's a shame cause you get abominations like Classic if there's money in it

- - - Updated - - -



Remember when panda was universally panned? The same thing will happen to BfA. People will start to look at BfA in the same light as panda in a couple of years.

You say that but whenever you get presented with evidence of the exact opposite kind you just stop responding.

Pandaria, wrath and legion are considered the best expansions.
WoD, Cata and BFA the worst.

[TickTickTick]

Yes. If people want TBC servers, then BfA servers are as much warranted. It would also be fair because different parts of the community preffer different expansions.

So I say just make a server for each expansion and let's split the community even further. After all, the idea of having TBC servers opened this can of worms, and hopefully it will be the reason of this franchise death, otherwise people won't be able to realize how extremely dumb this idea was.

[ClassicPeon]

Yes. If people want TBC servers, then BfA servers are as much warranted. It would also be fair because different parts of the community preffer different expansions.

So I say just make a server for each expansion and let's split the community even further. After all, the idea of having TBC servers opened this can of worms, and hopefully it will be the reason of this franchise death, otherwise people won't be able to realize how extremely dumb this idea was.

No its not. And "warranted" isnt a word you can use in this context. Blizzard decides what they want to do, regardless of what you think is warranted.

[Niwes]

seems like the „small vocal minority“ voted „no“
funny

[froschhure]

I feel like the people who claimed to "love BFA" are the same ones who defend Blizzard's predatory business practices on games like Hearthstone and Overwatch.

def. heartstone, but OW has its own pathetic developing (they sold their engine to riot)

[Kralljin]

raid sniping was a common problem which was seen as a big issue back then, I recall the stink about it.

"sniping" as already an issue in Classic, especially towards the end (Four Horsemen).

but it neglects to mention that it killed raid guilds and destroyed smaller ones so that bigger guilds could thrive.

That doesn't make sense, any "smaller guild" that had a roster of 40 people by default had enough people to man at least one 25man raid.

Vanillia was more casual friendly, and WOTLK returned to form by making 10 mans a content choice for people.

It wasn't.
TBC gave you a multitude of paths to gear yourself without even touching raids.
PvP? Offered decent gear even for casual players.
Professions? Offered extremely strong items - without ever entering a raid.
Dungeons? Both normal and heroic also offered valueable loot.

Matter of fact, Karazhan loot had to be buffed because it some cases it was worse than 5man heroic gear.

Like, it's fucking hilarious to hail the 10man difficulty as a good thing when TBC was the that actually introduced it - while also shitting on TBC for downsizing raids.
This is some next level hypocrisy.

bringing in arena's as I said before, which brought in the worst pvp stat ever (ressilience) making literally all other stats completley irrelevent for pvp save ressilence.

Again, all of this was continued in Wotlk as well, if you want to blame TBC for that, do that, but stop hailing Wotlk because it continued this trend.

"Either get on the band wagon or be left behind" mentality towards new players, which meant alot of people trying to catch up couldnt.

Pretty similiar to Vanilla.

Another major problem was faction imbalance, Blood Elf Paladins had the best retribution paladin seal at the time since seal of blood, despite taking 10% of your own hp in damage did more damage than *any* paladin seal in the game and made ret fairly decent for once in dps rotations while seal of truth was significantly less effective in comparison.

Gift of the Naaru was also pretty weak back then as it didnt really offer efficent sustain while blood elves had an ability that literally destroyed people in pvp. It became one of the BIS for anti caster dps in pvp.

You really want to talk about faction balance and racials in regards to Classic?
Like, some racials in Classic were straight up garbage and there you even had Paladin and Shaman completely separated.
And the Blood elf racial wasn't nerfed until recently (was also there in Wotlk).

you could still win with a 10 man group if you knew exactly what you were doing and where to go.

You couldn't, you were a raid boss but regular CC still worked, people just spammed every school of CC onto you and killed you with numbers.
It may be possible in theory, but it's extremely difficult to get people to coordinate, let alone you have any insurance that those people are actually decent players on their own.

Yet they forget TBC was when raiding became an obsession for blizzard and they ignored the rest of the game, which Vanillia was NOT about raiding purely, yes, raiding was the main content of some patches but even without it, they had other content too, new battlegrounds, new world content, new world pvp.

As seen above, it wasn't.
Professions were relevant (which made the outdoor world matter more) and Dungeons.
If anything, Wotlk forced you more into raiding because Professions became a joke and 5man dungeons were nothing but a stepping stone towards raiding.

TBC started to prune back the PvP Scene, WOTLK brought it back for a time, then Cata put the nail in the coffin and id honestly say by MoP and WoD it basically died completley.

Okay mate, stop talking about rose tinted glasses when you spew this nonsense.

What "pruning of the PvP scene"?
Before TBC, you had the Honor system, which is probably the most broken system this game has ever seen.
You didn't even get any remotely decent rewards out of this system unless you took part in for weeks aside from AV Rep (and the blue gear wasn't necessarily good for every class / spoec), not to mention that unless you were part of a Pre made group, a sizeable chunk of your games were auto losses because you went up against a Pre made.
At a certain point, you had to basically no life in order to reach the actually valueable gear.

Just as a note, even under perfect circumstances (meaning you get Standing #1 every week), it takes no less than three months to from 0 to Rank 14.

If you want to tell me Arena was worse than that, then you're just being a contrarian.

And let me remind you, the fact that Blizzard made PvP gear weaker than PvE gear in Wotlk led to the fact that a lot of more casual players stopped doing PvP entirely, whereas in TBC you had a more healthy mix between more casual players, who just wanted to get their 10 wins for the week and more hardcore players.

Also, WoD didn't kill PvP, WoD is generally seen as one of the better PvP expansions (besides Ashran) because it was easy to gear yourself.
Legion had a massive dip in PvP participation, not WoD.

Holinka tweeted during WoD that Rated PvP has about as many participants as Heroic raiding.

Ion's a failure of a director, hes been so since WoD and hes definatley *not* a good leader for the games development, even Legion while it had a good story introduced some of the WORST RNG dependance in the game.

Ion became Game director shortly before Legion, meaning that WoD most was not his fuckup, but Chilton's.


Like dude, most of the criticism towards TBC also holds more than true for Wotlk, if you want to list every change from Vanilla to TBC and call it "bad", then at least be honest enough to continue that criticism towards Wotlk (because a lot of the changes you're pointing out still hold true in Wotlk).
Yet for some reason, when Wotlk did something different, you call good, when TBC deviates from Vanilla, you call it bad.

It's completely silly, especially that "Blizzard focus on raiding started in TBC" is proof of that, you could gear your character quite well in TBC without ever stepping into a raid.
In Wotlk, you were straight fucked unless you wanted to wait until you can buy an item for 60 badges while only two per day trickled in via the daily heroic.

And i'm also repeating myself by saying: If you think Wotlk is better, that's okay.
But i stand by the opinion that TBC was structurally closer to Classic than Wotlk and that with the increase of accessability and pruning a lot of RPG elements ("Bring the player not the class") paved the way for future changes that led this game further away from its roots.