If blizzard sold transmog sets in the shop

[Raelbo]

Put people spending money on the shop DOES impact my game. Look at the mounts. Most of the coolest mounts for years now are in the ingame shop with NO way to obtain them ingame whatsoever.

You do realise that you haven't explained at all how these shop mount impact (presumably negatively) on your game.

Yes, there are a bunch of cool mounts that cannot be obtained ingame. By definition that means they have zero impact on your game whatsoever. You could choose to ignore them entirely and literally nothing in the game would change for you.

Queue Transmog Sets. People will buy them no doubt. They will make MILLIONS with it. Why rely on 100 people with the monthly sub if you have one whale paying more than all of them combined.

It's not clear exactly the point you're trying to make, but it seems to me like you might be trying to argue that Blizzard would stop paying attention to the rest of the game and focus only making xmogs to sell to these "whales".

Now, while I cannot authoritatively say that won't happen, I can't see any reason why it should. Because for Blizzard to do so would be utterly retarded.

Apart from the fact that your quoted number of one whale spending the same as 100 subs being utterly absurd, even if they did, the "whales" you talk about would be unlikely to bother spending money on WoW if the other 100 players all lost interest in a game that no longer catered to them. Yes, the shop may represent lucrative, easy money for Blizzard, but it relies on a healthy game to provide the market for its products.

So no, the shop is clearly not a deterrent to Blizzard investing keeping the game good. It's an incentive.

Good for the game? No. Good for Blizz? Yes. Transmog goes brrrrrr
In the end you will have amazing T-Mog Sets every month with half assed sets ingame.

What a crock of nonsense. I know you like to complain about "all the coolest mounts are in the shop", but the fact is that, in spite of whatever is in the shop, the game continues to produce awesome in-game mounts - in a variety far greater than ever in the history of the game. If your argument is that the shop has resulted in us getting less unique mounts in-game, then the numbers prove you categorically wrong.

I see zero reason why we wouldn't continue to get great transmog sets in-game. It's not like there is a limit on how much fashion can be invented. The only limit is how many creative people you can pay to come up with awesome ideas. And with the money that the shop brings to the game, that limit can only be bigger than it would be without the shop.

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Yea, you may not be poor but you're still paying into shitty business practices.

What exactly is "shitty" about this practice? A lot of you guys like to make the claim, but I still haven't seen any actual proper reasoning to back it up.


As far as I am concerned, the shop is an excellent business practice. It allows the game to continue generating sufficient revenue to maintain their development team by providing optional stuff for willing buyers, while allowing those who don't want to pay more to keep playing with no penalty, all the benefitting from a better game made possible by the bigger development budget.

Seriously, why the hate?

It's like complaining about McDonald's charging you an extra $2 (or whatever it costs in your country) to upsize your meal for you, and that you should be entitled to the biggest size for the base cost.

[Stardrift]

You do realise that you haven't explained at all how these shop mount impact (presumably negatively) on your game.

Yes, there are a bunch of cool mounts that cannot be obtained ingame. By definition that means they have zero impact on your game whatsoever. You could choose to ignore them entirely and literally nothing in the game would change for you.



It's not clear exactly the point you're trying to make, but it seems to me like you might be trying to argue that Blizzard would stop paying attention to the rest of the game and focus only making xmogs to sell to these "whales".

Now, while I cannot authoritatively say that won't happen, I can't see any reason why it should. Because for Blizzard to do so would be utterly retarded.

Apart from the fact that your quoted number of one whale spending the same as 100 subs being utterly absurd, even if they did, the "whales" you talk about would be unlikely to bother spending money on WoW if the other 100 players all lost interest in a game that no longer catered to them. Yes, the shop may represent lucrative, easy money for Blizzard, but it relies on a healthy game to provide the market for its products.

So no, the shop is clearly not a deterrent to Blizzard investing keeping the game good. It's an incentive.





What a crock of nonsense. I know you like to complain about "all the coolest mounts are in the shop", but the fact is that, in spite of whatever is in the shop, the game continues to produce awesome in-game mounts - in a variety far greater than ever in the history of the game. If your argument is that the shop has resulted in us getting less unique mounts in-game, then the numbers prove you categorically wrong.

I see zero reason why we wouldn't continue to get great transmog sets in-game. It's not like there is a limit on how much fashion can be invented. The only limit is how many creative people you can pay to come up with awesome ideas. And with the money that the shop brings to the game, that limit can only be bigger than it would be without the shop.

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What exactly is "shitty" about this practice? A lot of you guys like to make the claim, but I still haven't seen any actual proper reasoning to back it up.


As far as I am concerned, the shop is an excellent business practice. It allows the game to continue generating sufficient revenue to maintain their development team by providing optional stuff for willing buyers, while allowing those who don't want to pay more to keep playing with no penalty, all the benefitting from a better game made possible by the bigger development budget.

Seriously, why the hate?

It's like complaining about McDonald's charging you an extra $2 (or whatever it costs in your country) to upsize your meal for you, and that you should be entitled to the biggest size for the base cost.

The game is $15 a month, on top of the cost of its expansions, and not to mention the token.

You purchase a $50 expansion to keep paying a subscription to a game that doesn't even offer you every single thing that it has.

Whatever happened to just receiving everything with one single purchase? Other subscription based services at least offer you everything they put out.

[Thagrynor]

So theres 0 gameplay value they add then. No reason to go farm a rep to unlock one, or farm a dungeon, or rare mob, nothing, just make some gold and buy it.

ORRRRRR they could be in the GAME and we can unlock them as part of PLAYING the GAME that we already pay $410 per expansion for, thats a freaking WILD concept though I guess.

To be fair, it is transmog sets. There is 0 gameplay value to begin with.

The reality is only things like heritage armor or a set like the Dark Shaman set from Siege of Orgrimmar has any sense of "lore" or "thematic" sense for where it comes from. Even the PvP sets are .... just sets. They have no real thematic or lore wise link to the gameplay you get it from. Some of the tier sets fit, but most don't, from where they come from.

Playing the game to grind rep to then spend gold to buy the transmog set or playing the game to grind gold to buy a token to spend the token on the transmog set isn't really any different, imo.

I am not a fan of the shop, but it honestly doesn't bother me that much. Most of the stuff they have isn't necessarily anything I feel like I "need". There are a total of 4 mounts that I use, 1 from RAF from ages ago (the Obsidian Nightwing), the Skygolem, the transmog Yak and the Brutosaur. All of them are for specific functionality of the mount (carrying someone, herbing, transmog or an AH/repair).

[Halfaheart]

It always comes down to "lol I'm not poor" hey? Lmao

Yea, you may not be poor but you're still paying into shitty business practices. Congrats

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With a story and gameplay to last a handful of hours. Not really comparable to a static single purchase of a new set of paint, now is it?

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"Broke" is all you can come up with if you're made fun of for being mindless with your money and paying into shit business practices?

Sounds like someone doesn't like being told they're irresponsible.

bro anybody can do what they want with their money lol if im bored and wanna buy a $20 mount im going to. If I want to buy a coin or two, I will. If I want to order food, I can. Are you going to go stand outside of your house and tell all of your neighbors that they're morons for paying a delivery fee when you see a food order pull up to their house? No, because that's idiotic and anybody would look at you like you're an asshat. Just like I am now lmao

[Drusin]

It always comes down to "lol I'm not poor" hey? Lmao

Yea, you may not be poor but you're still paying into shitty business practices. Congrats

Hey thanks, I'm glad I can do what I want with my money.

[arkanon]

people play the game for rewards in the form of reward

What an entirely confusing statement.

That aside, i would caution making sweeping statements regarding people motivation for playing a game of any genre.

[Darvaeh]

I think it's a great idea, but (and I'm sure others have said this) it might get stale super fast. So, I spend $5 on a nice looking set, but uhh...then see a zillion others with the same set? With SO many items to collect in game to put xmog sets together with, it also seems odd. As an upsell for xpacs and big events in the game? Hells yeah!

[VinceVega]

One. It is not just your game. You are just one of the many people who plays the game.

Two. How many mounts do you own? How many rare mounts do you have? How much time do you spend on farming the mounts?

Three. Having them in game make it obtainable for you would be okay. It may not be obtainable for them. And that is okay?



So people spending extra money on transmog gear is not good for the game? Please explain how that is the case.



So, There I though people wanted tier set from mythic raids to look different so they can show they better than other people who does not raid mythic. And how you are arguing it is just for looks, not for actually beating mythic. So if they made it available from WQ, you would be okay with that. Because it is available ingame and everyone can acquire it.

Of course it is not just my game. But i don't play a sub based game for a virtual H&M. Remove sub do what you want with the shop.

What does my mount count have to do with anything? No matter what i say you won't believe it so i won't even say anything to it.

Yes. Playing the game and getting stuff from it is how it is supposed to be in a SUB BASED game. I can't obtain everything. I will never have the full Gladiator set. And i am fine with that. People should stop expecting handouts.

As i said. Look at other games. Swtor for example. The ingame stuff is so worse than anything in the shop.

Of course mythic sets should be different. As should be heroic and so on. The difference itself is minuscule at that point exactly because people complained about mythic raid giving the most elaborate sets. They toned down the difference and now every set looks nearly the same for raids and pvp for one whole patch.

The sense of accomplishment and the rewards you get with it is a big part of the game. Don't play that down to much. If i can get the Mythic Transmog set of the current raid (or any non soloable raid) in the ingame shop there is nothing to distinguish you in any way.
I know people hate everyone who likes to accomplish stuff on MMOChampion apparently but come on. No one can deny the feeling of getting cool shoulders ingame for the first time to wear.
That would be utterly destroyed by this.

And i still can't believe people actually fight for microtransactions now... that just baffles my so immensely

[Sansnom]

Of course it is not just my game. But i don't play a sub based game for a virtual H&M. Remove sub do what you want with the shop.

Then don't. It is transmog. Like you said. It is not a virtual H&M. So why care?

What does my mount count have to do with anything? No matter what i say you won't believe it so i won't even say anything to it.

If you are a mount collector and spend time farming for mounts, then having them in the shop is a problem if you do not want to spend the money to collect every mount. But if you do not collect mounts, then why does it matter? Because whether it is in the shop or not you will not get it.

Yes. Playing the game and getting stuff from it is how it is supposed to be in a SUB BASED game. I can't obtain everything. I will never have the full Gladiator set. And i am fine with that. People should stop expecting handouts.

And this is a problem I see in many games and in many players. They expect rewards. It is as the idea of PLAYING the game is not enough. There needs to be a rewards attach in order for people to play it.

The sense of accomplishment and the rewards you get with it is a big part of the game. Don't play that down to much. If i can get the Mythic Transmog set of the current raid (or any non soloable raid) in the ingame shop there is nothing to distinguish you in any way.

Of course it is. The sense of achieving a goal is important. What is being argued there is not the achievement. It is the acknowledgment from other players that some are seeking. To be seen as a cut above others.

This is why I have said in the past. The best way to do this is a league table of sort. Where you are in the big table of things. How you compare with the others. When everyone wears the same gear, you cannot tell. And this bothers some people. Are you world first, world 10, world 10000 or world last.

A league table would solve that. Want to show how you are in the game. Show your position in the league table. A number next your favorite title. Tier X 10 or Tier X 100000. Then you can brag about your position in the table.

[Hellobolis]

The average salary of Blizzard employees was $88K per year (ranging from about $60K - $130K for their professional staff). That would put the salary bill in the region of $90M (or 5x greater than your "napkin" math).

88k sounds extremely unbelievable.

average california salary is lower than that, and a lot of their employees are in cheaper areas. no way some low level position makes that much, especially with all the horror stories you hear abotu blizz employment conditions for that personell bracket.

[Raelbo]

The game is $15 a month, on top of the cost of its expansions, and not to mention the token.

You purchase a $50 expansion to keep paying a subscription to a game that doesn't even offer you every single thing that it has.

Whatever happened to just receiving everything with one single purchase? Other subscription based services at least offer you everything they put out.

Well would you prefer that the monthly sub was increased by $10 and you were given everything on the shop for free?
Or maybe you'd prefer that there was no shop and they reduced the size of the dev team by 25% (with a consequent reduction in content)?

Because I think those are the only real two alternatives to the current situation.

As I've said before, it just strikes me that a lot of people who are critical of the shop feel entitled to more for what they pay than is actually realistic.

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88k sounds extremely unbelievable.

average california salary is lower than that, and a lot of their employees are in cheaper areas. no way some low level position makes that much, especially with all the horror stories you hear abotu blizz employment conditions for that personell bracket.

Step 1: Open a new tab in your browser
Step 2: Google "Average Blizzard Salary"
Step 3: (for advanced users only) follow some of the links to see what this number means

If you still have issues, take it up with Google. But from where I am sitting, it looks like you simply don't want actual facts because they would clash with your narrative.

[Hellobolis]

Step 1: Open a new tab in your browser
Step 2: Google "Average Blizzard Salary"
Step 3: (for advanced users only) follow some of the links to see what this number means

If you still have issues, take it up with Google. But from where I am sitting, it looks like you simply don't want actual facts because they would clash with your narrative.

it's probably true for actual blizz employees. but a lot of the people we are counting won't be employed by blizzard directly, but by companies blizzard hires. they will drag down the average.

anyways it quickly becomes a mess if you start accounting for other stuff. better to just multiply the directly involved staff by a all inclusive number. Heard someone make a good argument that an employee in california cost $10k per month all inclusive (rent, training, equipment, catering, events, etc), but that was almost a decade ago by now and i have no clue what a good estimate is nowadays.

[Soeroah]

I'm just glad that experiment failed.

IMO they should give players a token for two months they are subscribed over a year that can be redeemed for one item from the shop but whatever.

[Hollycakes]

Not really, thanks. Even if they're really cool I think they should be obtainable via quests, achievements, scenarios, events, etc. in-game.

While we're on the subject of adding new transmog sets and not necesarily 'gear'

I'd be thrilled if they expand on ‘normal-themed’ mogs

I’d like to suggest adding in some transmog outfits such as pocketed vests for adventurers, scroll-stuffed satchels for scholars and tome-toting travel bags for our trades. Simple yet worldly gear such as profession-pouched belts and backpacks. And hats! I think lots of players would have fun collecting and crafting these clothes, and I think the WoW community would love a wardrobe of civilian, profession and explorer outfits to dawn when relaxing from honing skills, from saving worlds, when going to the market, performing our trades, visiting cities, etc.

I've always wanted a satchel.

Potion bottles and vile-studded belts for rogues and alchemists, embroidered herb waist-purse and dangling seed pouches for herbalists and druids, knifes tucked into waistband for leatherworkers and hunters. Aprons, hammer and tongs for blacksmiths, tool belts and goggles for engineers and inventors, refined gem-clasped jc waist-kit and intricate glasses/goggles.

With their great work creating 3-d objects on our gear in very recent years, I think these articles could look quite appropriate and wonderful and add to your fun and immersion without it being 'gear' or epic looking.

I have been playing for many years and have witnessed longed-for additions such as pocketed and pouched belts, feathered hats (rogue), and finally moggable books that appear at your side (a handful of them. We still need all offhands viewable on our characters please, especially the useful ones such and the medicine/seed/coin pouches, potion bottles, vial, more of the different book models, etc. please!) and it looks like some of the shadowland tiers incorporate some of these pouches, vials, knives, etc, which I very much look forward to. Keep’m coming!

But I’d also like;

Culture and race themed outfits that aren’t epic

silk robes embroidered with shimmering cloud serpents and/or with tall Pandaria sea-cliffs and bonsai-topped mountain landscapes for pandaren,

Puffy sleeves, fine vests , and potion bottles and wine flasks attached to waste like the nightborne citizens in suramar have,

Beaded gowns, feathered clothing, upper armbands, for Tauren, with a medicine pouch and drum, wood flute or a mighty horn,

An unbuttoned hawaiian and/or sleeveless white shirt for goblins, and maybe a pair of large, singed, ski-mask-like goggles/visor (single wide lens) with a neon frame, for welding/workshopping (yes with lightning bolts and rocket decals)

bone or tooth necklaces for orcs, voodoo / talismans for trolls, feathered and beaded necklaces for tauren, though these ideas could be customization options as well.

Just some simpler outfits fitting the race, profession and civilian that isn’t hero-looking suits, or heritage armor or epic tier sets. simpler stuff that many races already have in their societies.

Thank you for reading! Peace all!

This post is <3

[Cathbadh]

I'd spend gold to do it, but sure. I bought those shiny helms around Christmas time when they were on sale. I'd never spend actual cash on anything in that store other than services.

[pmkaboo]

No, unless they want to drop monthly sub and replace it with mtx store, which i hope never happens.

[aimmachine]

i liked to buy some items in dota/cs go, i bought all of crowns in WoW, so if it will really decent and beautifull sets, why not?

[Lora]

I mean there is no reason not to put cosmetics in game in the shop. They already did that with those 3 helms a long time ago although they retired them. Right now you can effectively get a transmog set with the shadowlands preorder. As long as the shop is purely cosmetic it's whatever. I mean blizz already screwed the game into making it p2w with tokens so even if they did add actual gear, not just transmog, it wouldn't be that shocking.

[Ghostile]

I mean there is no reason not to put cosmetics in game in the shop. They already did that with those 3 helms a long time ago although they retired them. Right now you can effectively get a transmog set with the shadowlands preorder. As long as the shop is purely cosmetic it's whatever. I mean blizz already screwed the game into making it p2w with tokens so even if they did add actual gear, not just transmog, it wouldn't be that shocking.

Considering people have always bought gold, has the game been P2W all along?

[Smol Potat]

They should, all will still be available in game anyway as you can always sell gold for wow tokens.

It would just be instead of grinding that one boss for months, you can grind whatever you wanted to gold to trade for these sets.