Blizzard just suspended 74,000 accounts for botting.

[Huzzaa]

What's weird is, that you're keeping your strong point on the belief that all these toons in those instances are legitimate players.

Again, allow me to laugh. So, let's say I do make you a video or a SS of me pointing them out, and checking their armories. Would you believe it? No, you'd call me "not proving anything" again.

Yet logical thinking deducts that the only obvious reason why these characters are in there and have been for days and leveled up/were created about 5 or so days ago, is because they are botting/hacked accounts.

In fact, some of these are quite ridiculous, how long they've been active now that I did check some of their backgrounds out.


Anyways. I believe none of you are going to change anyones(my) mind(s) here as you're set in stone in your fortress of defending your opinion and that's that.


The funny part is that you believe for the sake of defying me and my statements of pathetic performance on Blizzards side, on claiming them all to be legitimate players.

[tangers58]

That's freaking astronomical. Good to see they are doing things about botting in WoW, though.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...ameplay/558339

Assuming they are botting, I've never touched one and been 3-day banned twice for "botting". One of which was the day WoD launched (kinda lucked out since Frostfire was unplayable anyway) when all I had been doing was grinding archeology achievements

[Stickiler]

What's weird is, that you're keeping your strong point on the belief that all these toons in those instances are legitimate players.

Again, allow me to laugh. So, let's say I do make you a video or a SS of me pointing them out, and checking their armories. Would you believe it? No, you'd call me "not proving anything" again.

Yet logical thinking deducts that the only obvious reason why these characters are in there and have been for days and leveled up/were created about 5 or so days ago, is because they are botting/hacked accounts.

In fact, some of these are quite ridiculous, how long they've been active now that I did check some of their backgrounds out.


Anyways. I believe none of you are going to change anyones(my) mind(s) here as you're set in stone in your fortress of defending your opinion and that's that.


The funny part is that you believe for the sake of defying me and my statements of pathetic performance on Blizzards side, on claiming them all to be legitimate players.

Just because there's dozens of identical characters in farm locations doesn't make them bots. It's far more likely that it's just a Chinese gold selling company, where they'll have hundreds/thousands of real people who do nothing but farm instances etc all day, every day. Until those accounts participate in gold selling, there's nothing in the ToS that bans them.

[rrayy]

What's weird is, that you're keeping your strong point on the belief that all these toons in those instances are legitimate players.

Again, allow me to laugh. So, let's say I do make you a video or a SS of me pointing them out, and checking their armories. Would you believe it? No, you'd call me "not proving anything" again.

Yet logical thinking deducts that the only obvious reason why these characters are in there and have been for days and leveled up/were created about 5 or so days ago, is because they are botting/hacked accounts.

In fact, some of these are quite ridiculous, how long they've been active now that I did check some of their backgrounds out.


Anyways. I believe none of you are going to change anyones(my) mind(s) here as you're set in stone in your fortress of defending your opinion and that's that.


The funny part is that you believe for the sake of defying me and my statements of pathetic performance on Blizzards side, on claiming them all to be legitimate players.

Not what is being said at all. What we are saying is that they can very easily be legitimate players and that you have yet to prove any proof that they are indeed bots. You, on the other hand,have immediately declared them bots despite that complete lack of proof.

What we are saying is that we do not know if they are bots or not. We NEVER calimed they were all legitimate. We only claimed they COULD BE legitimate. It''s also hilarious that you accuse us as being "set in stone in your fortress of defending your opinion and that's that because you are guilty of it.You are the pot calling the kettle black.

[deenman]

Suddenly the amount of active accounts drop by 75%.

75%?LOL ya right,more like 0.5%,there are proly still a few milion bot accounts active

[Huzzaa]

Just because there's dozens of identical characters in farm locations doesn't make them bots. It's far more likely that it's just a Chinese gold selling company, where they'll have hundreds/thousands of real people who do nothing but farm instances etc all day, every day. Until those accounts participate in gold selling, there's nothing in the ToS that bans them.

Looks like to be the case. Either or.

May as well redefine the term eh?

And oh suddenly it wouldn't fit my narrative according to rrayy. Alright, I concede to that, there are some bits and bobs that can be coded, and often enough I'd say they are coded.

But this is still ridiculous, these guys should be banned either way.

Anyway, here's the "proof": https://www.twitch.tv/videos/655793142

We can now discuss if they're chinese/indian workers or botters. To me, it doesn't matter, either way. ALL of these people/characters, should be banned.

[Stickiler]

We can now discuss if they're chinese/indian workers or botters. To me, it doesn't matter, either way. ALL of these people/characters, should be banned.

It may not matter to end users(in terms of they both are disruptive to our normal play experiences), but it matters a lot when talking about actions Blizzard can take to mitigate them.
For the actual bots, the actions they take(in terms of collecting evidence and determining how they work and then banning in waves), is the most efficient tactic thus far, as evidenced by how many company's use it.
The gold farming company's are much harder to fully eradicate, and Blizzard tends to be more immediate, banning people who buy or sell gold immediately, instead of doing it in waves, I'm assuming because as it's not as simple for the gold farming company to change how they route their gold, and to ensure the gold doesn't disseminate out further where it would be harder to remove.

[Huzzaa]

I think I'm going to retract naming them as potential chinese/indian workers.

You can clearly discern a difference in how they operate.

Certain bots have a random jerk after they exit and then sell their stuff by mounting.

Certain bots have implemented a random wait timer before mounting and selling.

Certain bots have no wait timer at all, mount instantly, sell and reenter.

And most if not all of them have a very discernable repeating pattern of movement on how they 180 and reenter the instance. It's identical on a lot of them.

Here's another video of proof: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/655914782

I doubt there's any debate. Looking at this alone, long enough. Granted if I were an admin, and had a glimpse into the instance as well, that they're running. It's material enough to ban people.

EDIT: PS. A lot of these guys, have a set waypoint pattern along with positioning and character angles on how they mount up. If you follow a character more than one loop through his run inside, you'll see it. In fact, several guys are caught on that video.

EDIT2: In fact, almost all benefits of a doubt I mumbled to the 104s etc. on the video, are just bots who've implemented a keyboard turn using the signal sent with the arrow key.

So now my point stands. This is poor work Blizzard. Why are these people not banned?

EDIT3: A really long ramble: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/656012077
Truth be told. In my opinion there's nobody dealing with these bots on the spot, if there ever was. They caught 74K bots by autoflagging them through some other mechanism in the game.
A hypothetical element that I mention in the long ramble. My guess as to why they are flying away from Botanica to sell their shiz at another vendor and then come back and go at it again is to dodge some sort of a counter on blizzards end regarding selling to the mounts vendor too many times in a row. All of that to avoid getting flagged for something. Because otherwise, their entire flight there, was absolutely pointless. Meaning that the bot-makers are actually winning the race here if they're dodging their bans by doing that. It's really pathetic if that's the case, which I think it is. Blizzard...

[LanToaster]

Looks like to be the case. Either or.

May as well redefine the term eh?

So, They are either Bots, or GoldFarmers? (Or Players)

But this is still ridiculous, these guys should be banned either way.

This is interesting. So, you now flatout say that people that behave like a Bot should be Banned?

Okey, I believe your account is Guilty of Botting, Its easy to write a Bot that flys around, makes /who commands, and opens Websites of their Armory. That means you have to be banned.

Anyway, here's the "proof": https://www.twitch.tv/videos/655793142

Yea, sorry to actually say it, but that is not real Proof, it just proves that these Accounts have all these Traits you listed.

What we are trying to tell you is, that while its like 90% likely that the Characters you are speaking of actually are Bots, you have no real Proof.
And the thing is that blizzard wants/needs real proof.

And this is not as easy as you make it out to be.

We can now discuss if they're chinese/indian workers or botters. To me, it doesn't matter, either way. ALL of these people/characters, should be banned.

And this is the problem here:
Botting = Against the ToS
ChinaFarming = Not so much.

The offending part of the Usual ChinaFarmer is to sell stuff for Real Money. Farming a Dungeon like a Mindless drone is not against the ToS.
I mean, see the other thread about the 50 Dungeon Lockout how many people complained about that, because they cant Mindlessly Grind that anymore.

EDIT2: In fact, almost all benefits of a doubt I mumbled to the 104s etc. on the video, are just bots who've implemented a keyboard turn using the signal sent with the arrow key.

Again, a baseless Assumption. How do you know how their Bot works, assuming they are Bots.

Truth be told. In my opinion there's nobody dealing with these bots on the spot, if there ever was. They caught 74K bots by autoflagging them through some other mechanism in the game.

Thats because its the Policy to ban Bots in Waves.

Just look at Nature, if you slowly kill things with poison, the things will adapt much faster to the Poisen. If you kill alot of them at once, they will adapt much slower.

A hypothetical element that I mention in the long ramble. My guess as to why they are flying away from Botanica to sell their shiz at another vendor and then come back and go at it again is to dodge some sort of a counter on blizzards end regarding selling to the mounts vendor too many times in a row. All of that to avoid getting flagged for something. Because otherwise, their entire flight there, was absolutely pointless. Meaning that the bot-makers are actually winning the race here if they're dodging their bans by doing that. It's really pathetic if that's the case, which I think it is. Blizzard...

Thats the first thing I will agree with you:
Bots are coded to Avoid detection. Thats why they Ban in Waves to not give away that they detect them to soon.

But also to that, what you dont seem to understand is, while your concerns with these Characters are conclusive, and (probably) no one says they are in fact not Bots, you dont have hard Proof.

Neither I nor You have any Idea about the Security of Blizzard, and how they decide to Ban someone, (Because its Policy to not tell) no matter how much thought you put into Theorys, we only know what Blizzard tells us, and what we see. Much of it boils down to: "No sane Person would do that". But again as I made fun of earlier in this Post, you spend 1,5 Hours sitting in front of the Dungeon and watch Bots, I dont think any normal person would do that either.

The point is: Blizzard has probably set some rules about what "Proofs" Botting to them. But they want to make sure to be as close as possible to 100% sure, because even if 99% of the 74000 Accounts were Bots, and 1% False Banns, that would still be 7400 Accounts, imagine if the QQ for that.

Shallow guesses like yours dont cut it for that. No matter how conclusive they seem.

[Laughingjack]

Does it matter?

Gold is now sold by blizzard itself what harm if any do these bots inflict now?

[LanToaster]

Does it matter?

Gold is now sold by blizzard itself what harm if any do these bots inflict now?

Thats an Interesting Question. I guess the biggest problem would be the Actual Inflation of the Prices due to the Abundance of Ressources.

[Xalvia]

Next banwave in 7 months boys, time to set a bot up

[Mosotti]

Those suspentions are pathetic. They should close any botting account for good.

[Thzz]

If whatever they did were to have any impact you would have seen (at least a temp) increase in herb prices for example.

There was no change in herb prices in my realm.

Whatever they did , did not have any impact.

[LanToaster]

Again though, you can't legitimately be online and actively farming 24 hours per day 7 days a week. You do understand that this is how botters get caught right? right?

...

There is "people do weird shit" and there is "laws of nature say this can't happen". An account cannot be actively farming 24/7 for months with no downtime and no afk time. This is evidence of either sharing the account (illegal) or botting (illegal). Are we clear or do you need to argue further just because this is MMOC and you somehow MUST win the argument at all costs?

Well, I dont have to Win any Argument. You just bring non Arguments.
You claimed all 104 DHs in Botanica are Bots. We say you have no Evidence.

Now you mumble about AccountSharing, well. While AccountSharing is not exactly "Allowed", its a "NonIssue" with Blizzard. As long as you dont use AccountSharing for shit like Selling Gold, or getting ahead in the Competitive scene Blizzard doesnt really care.

Which is made clear in the FAQ about Account Sharing. Also, still AccountSharing != Botting. So, my point still stands, you cannot judge people to be Bots with 100% certainy.

Thats why there is no "Report Bot, and its Gone" feature.

EDIT:
Oh, also. Did you conduct an Investigation that the Alleged Accounts are actually playing 24/7?

I mean, you cant be legitimately be online and watch them 24 hours on 7 days a week. *laugh*

[kaminaris]

Does it matter?

Gold is now sold by blizzard itself what harm if any do these bots inflict now?

Gold is not sold by blizzard. They are acting like a middle man and making a cut in normal money.

[rrayy]

I was very clear that you can do what you want and that COULD lead to your account being flagged. If you are not botting you have NOTHING to worry about what part of what I wrote was too difficult for you to understand that we have to regurgitate the same thing.

Again though, you can't legitimately be online and actively farming 24 hours per day 7 days a week. You do understand that this is how botters get caught right? right?

I am only using your logic against you. You said if you are in an instance for an abnormal interval, you are a bot. Well I just gave you an example of a legit abnormal interval and by your logic I am a bot. And how do you know they are farming 24/7? Unless you yourself are on for 24 straight hours, you cannot prove they were on for 24 hours. For all you know they take breaks while you are offline. Nothing you wrote is too difficult to understand about your post because I easily showed how asinine the logic is.

There is "people do weird shit" and there is "laws of nature say this can't happen". An account cannot be actively farming 24/7 for months with no downtime and no afk time. This is evidence of either sharing the account (illegal) or botting (illegal). Are we clear or do you need to argue further just because this is MMOC and you somehow MUST win the argument at all costs?

Prove they are on 24/7. YOu can't unless you sit there for 24 straight hours watching them. Also, you are the one trying to win the argument at all costs.

[Laughingjack]

Gold is not sold by blizzard. They are acting like a middle man and making a cut in normal money.

Do you really see that as a difference so important it really needs to be noted?

[glowpipe]

and 60 000 of them are already back in the game botting. Only ones really effected by this ban is the few that botted on their main accounts. Botting networks just get new accounts and keep going with new bot software

[XDurionX]

In other words.

Rrayy, here believes that our friends in Botanica are all legitimate good customers.

I'll leave it at that.

Strawmen aren't helping your cause.