The Last of Us Part II

[Stormdash]

but its totally ok to have done that full sweep of a hospital, because then it would have "nipped that Abby problem in a bud" and prevented death of Joel and others Abby killed? right?

No, I said that she lived at all because he didn't do a full sweep of the hospital, not that he should have. I was pointing out a false premise in you saying he 'slaughtered an entire hospital'. She is manifest proof that Joel didn't. Separately, I did say it was unfortunate she wasn't one of those fool enough to take up arms - that way she'd have never been able to betray and ambush someone who saved her life.

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Yes, it is very easy, the save the majority by pulling the handle. Anything else is deaths of more numbers. Which is all that it boils down to. Humans are of equal worth each and that in essence, the actions that lead to fewer deaths is always the right path to take.

If it wasn't a morally important question of intentionally killing or not, the trolley problem wouldn't have one lever, it would have two. It was conceived before society had degenerated to a point where people didn't distinguish between "bad things happening" and "intentionally making them happen by your own hand".

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Yes, it is very easy, the save the majority by pulling the handle. Anything else is deaths of more numbers. Which is all that it boils down to. Humans are of equal worth each and that in essence, the actions that lead to fewer deaths is always the right path to take.

Only if any particular individual life is of no irreplaceable value, sure.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

The writers have some GoT S8 level of hubris. Abby's arc is the answer to a question nobody asked. So, you get to sit thru all this maiming and butchering about the 'cycle of hatred' and then Abby gets away with it lmao.

Abby doesn’t even get away with it she’s left in the same state ellie is. people she loved and care for killed by some one else and the killer still being out there. The different is after killing Joel Abby reflected on how it effected her and the people around her while ellie doesn’t do the same after she kills abbys friends. Abby lets go and moves on with lev but ellie doesn’t do the same and loses what she has left because of it.

[Magnagarde]

I take it you missed the 'There's a difference between' part of my post?

I didn't miss it, I simply think you were addressing the fact that people who haven't bought the game and played it themselves are leaving negative reviews. In turn, I am simply saying that people who haven't spent even one minute playing the game can still leave negative reviews over the story and what was done with the characters. The story is out there and not liking it doesn't mean one can't just go ahead and vote negatively.

If you didn't mean to talk about players who haven't played, then I misunderstood it.

[Stormdash]

I didn't miss it, I simply think you were addressing the fact that people who haven't bought the game and played it themselves are leaving negative reviews. In turn, I am simply saying that people who haven't spent even one minute playing the game can still leave negative reviews over the story and what was done with the characters. The story is out there and not liking it doesn't mean one can't just go ahead and vote negatively.

If you didn't mean to talk about players who haven't played, then I misunderstood it.

That's without even pointing out how many superlative reviews it was getting before it was even released.

[Magnagarde]

But I'm not on Twitter screeching death threats at the writer/director of the game, or running down Laura Bailey (who is an awesome person) because she happens to voice the character people aren't happy about. It was her fucking job to say words. It isn't like she showed up and was like 'hey what if this character I'm voicing kills <spoiler>? Wouldn't that be rad?'

The people doing shit like that? Those would be the manbabies I was talking about it.

While nobody deserves to be sent death threats, I have to say I haven't seen even one and I actually followed her Tweet that caused the backlash at her specifically. I think the whole "being sent death threats" is grossly exaggerated and is a way to deligitimize legitimate backlash. Laura Bailey's work is something I appreciate, especially in WoW, but she discredited a lot of gamers and people who are passionate about the game and franchise, who were let down by the characters and story related to them.

Many are giving negative reviews right off the bat, there's no doubt about it, but the game absolutely isn't a 95 as the critics rated it because a game that deserves such a rating would've resonated with the playerbase; refer to God of War, RDR2 and The Last of Us itself if we want to go closer to home. Laura Bailey had no issue with the "bot"-like reviews that the critics gave to this game, clearly having opinions that have very little resonance with a huge number of gamers. Hell, the critics even have collusion of interests when rating because they do want access to whatever ND and Sony have to offer, which is why there is no doubt in my mind that the rating the critics gave this is completely unreal and disingenous.

This game isn't a 95, but it sure as hell isn't a 3.3 either.

[Mirishka]

I didn't miss it, I simply think you were addressing the fact that people who haven't bought the game and played it themselves are leaving negative reviews. In turn, I am simply saying that people who haven't spent even one minute playing the game can still leave negative reviews over the story and what was done with the characters. The story is out there and not liking it doesn't mean one can't just go ahead and vote negatively.

If you didn't mean to talk about players who haven't played, then I misunderstood it.

Not sure why you replied twice to that post, but okay I guess?

You explicitly mentioned a difference between having played it and being a manbaby. I played it and I haven't finished it, but many have simply read the leaks and haven't played it, waiting for others to post on YouTube or play on Twitch in order to see whether the leaks are actually true. Having confirmed the leaks, these players reviewed it. For a game that's heavily story-driven, with all the gameplay being out there, that is more than enough to review the game negatively. Most of the 0 and 10 ratings on Metacritic specifically seem to be either emotionally driven or are simply doubling down, but as someone who has played the game I can definitely understand a lot of the seemingly valid criticism posted and criticism of the story is valid regardless wether someone played through the story or simply saw it unfold on the internet

[Magnagarde]

That's without even pointing out how many superlative reviews it was getting before it was even released.

Didn't the game get hundreds upon hundreds of amazing ratings on PSN weeks before the game even launched?

Not sure why you replied twice to that post, but okay I guess?

I don't know, I accessed the quote through the notification tab. I am pretty sure however that I didn't reply to your post about Laura Bailey in the past.

Edit: I guess I double quoted you, but I wanted two quotes in one reply.

[Stormdash]

Didn't the game get hundreds upon hundreds of amazing ratings on PSN weeks before the game even launched?

Thousands.

It's funny, I only saw yesterday that Laura Bailey and Ashly Burch - two favorites - were in the cast and then looked up to see who they were and was like "... oh". Honestly all this game was missing was Gideon Emery and Jennifer Hale.

But I can't fault Laura Bailey, her work is compelling as always. Much like some of the WTF with writing choices for Jaina, it's not her fault.

[Saltysquidoon]

Imagine being Neil Druckmann and thinking you're such a galaxy brain auteur that "bruh what if the good guy was like the bad guy" was such an original or interesting idea it was going to open people's third eye and create peace on earth.

Imagine thinking anyone's going to give one single shit about your subversive oc doughnut steel 'shattered reflection' fanfiction character in a fucking video game.

Imagine being one of the shills believing they're members of the enlightened elite for swallowing this nonsense like it's The Road

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Can anyone explain to me the logic of having a bunch of guns next a cell full of prisoners?

[mojusk]

remember when gaming was about games?

[Kalador]

Imagine being Neil Druckmann and thinking you're such a galaxy brain auteur that "bruh what if the good guy was like the bad guy" was such an original or interesting idea it was going to open people's third eye and create peace on earth.

Imagine thinking anyone's going to give one single shit about your subversive oc doughnut steel 'shattered reflection' fanfiction character in a fucking video game.

Imagine being one of the shills believing they're members of the enlightened elite for swallowing this nonsense like it's The Road

Jeeze you guys have strong opinion on that game...

No one thinks it's the best story ever made. Same for the first game. It was just one of the first time a video game did it. Same thing with the second one. Many people think video game is an interesting medium to see a grey character, as contrary to movies, you're actually playing as them and not just seeing their actions from a distent point of view.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

remember when gaming was about games?
https://media.tenor.com/images/11732...1160/tenor.gif

It never stopped being about games people just starting bitching about the games with a lot more exposure on the internet.

[Fkiolaris]

remember when gaming was about games?

I do and I cry when I see what's happening today. But we get what we deserve, when you have people so passionately defending this shitshow (and many others before it), we get 100% what we deserve.

[Stormdash]

I think if the studio had the courage of their convictions to the absolute moral relativism they want to express about revenge, their condemnation of Joel's actions in TLOU, and the general sense that they see Abby as ultimately the most sympathetic character in this mess to where they could cold open her doing absolutely despicable things, they'd have made player choice a factor in the game. They'd have modeled these parallel storylines and their delivery after what David Cage did with "Detroit" and have them converge in a time and manner that would essentially let the player choose whose story was the real/best/most worthy of resolving in their favor.

There are two reasons that they wouldn't do that of course - first and most obvious being that TLOU wasn't interested in player choice so it would have been a radical departure. But the second is... because they know their players would have shoved it right back in their face and all their deflections about review brigading wouldn't be able to mask the percentages.

[Witchblade77]

Sony: anime tiddies bad

Also sony: neil duckmans self insert sex scene. Going in drrrry

Like i said earlier i have no interest in tlou2 but oh man the drama has been epic.

at the risk of regretting responding to this post.

women have this ability to self lubricate when turned on. and doggy style is a pretty great position for vaginal sex, as it allows you to adjust angles to hit all the right spots in just the right way.

I don't think I even want to touch on the vibes of this post that i'm getting. no. better not.

[Verdugo]

I don't think I even want to touch on the vibes of this post that i'm getting. no. better not.

You mean the part where he makes fun of Sony and its inconsistent censorship?

[RobertMugabe]

The fact that you get to play half of the game as the character you want to see dead is the main reason why this game is garbage.

If it was all a movie it kinda would've made sense... I mean not every game or movie has to have a good and satisfying ending. The story was still shit though and had a million of plot holes... and yeah I would've wished if Abby got killed at least.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

The fact that you get to play half of the game as the character you want to see dead is the main reason why this game is garbage.

If it was all a movie it kinda would've made sense... I mean not every game or movie has to have a good and satisfying ending. The story was still shit though and had a million of plot holes... and yeah I would've wished if Abby got killed at least.

Care to point out some of the plot holes none come to mind off the top of my head.

[ZazuuPriest]

Care to point out some of the plot holes none come to mind off the top of my head.

yeah there were other playable characters besides CIS white people, personal identity "politics" cannot exist in a post-apocalyptic spore zombie world its just not realistic.

Oh and there is a buff woman in the game... plot hole because those dont exist in real life either.

A character you love dies early, plot hole because peoples feelings are hurt about it