The Last of Us Part II

[Magnagarde]

I’m stunned that a game that used fabricated scenes and model swaps to mislead the audience into thinking that Ellie is on some mission Joel shows up to help her with is selling well. I mean that looks and sounds like an awesome game, like maybe Ellie and Joel are a bit estranged but something happened and he has been keeping an eye out and won’t let her face it alone even if they have stuff to work out? GOTY lock. Especially can’t wait for that heartfelt scene when he surprised her by joining her on the road, nearly cried just at the trailer. Can’t. Wait. Who wouldn’t buy that game?

They don't realize that a huge part of the backlash is coming from players who have bought the game and seen for themselves what is going on, venting through the abysmal rating they reward this game with. The rest of the negative reviews come from players who have been fortunate enough to save their money, having read the leaks/watch the game being played on YouTube and/or Twitch.

This idea that someone has to fork out money for a game that's got an extremely disappointing story in order to rate said story is just mad, especially considering that the story and affiliated characters were the main draw for getting the game in the first place. The graphics are great, the audio is good, the gameplay is decent, yet the plot, narrative and character arc that are meant to make it all come together don't exist.

[Relapses]

I’m stunned that a game that used fabricated scenes and model swaps to mislead the audience into thinking that Ellie is on some mission Joel shows up to help her with is selling well. I mean that looks and sounds like an awesome game, like maybe Ellie and Joel are a bit estranged but something happened and he has been keeping an eye out and won’t let her face it alone even if they have stuff to work out? GOTY lock. Especially can’t wait for that heartfelt scene when he surprised her by joining her on the road, nearly cried just at the trailer. Can’t. Wait. Who wouldn’t buy that game?

This kind of trickery is present in movie trailers and rarely do people throw shit fits over it. It's really not a big deal to anybody other than the extremely incensed vocal minority you see on forums like this.

[Tech614]

They don't realize that a huge part of the backlash is coming from players who have bought the game and seen for themselves what is going on, venting through the abysmal rating they reward this game with. The rest of the negative reviews come from players who have been fortunate enough to save their money, having read the leaks/watch the game being played on YouTube and/or Twitch. This idea that someone has to fork out money for a game that's got an extremely disappointing story in order to rate said story is just mad.

"Huge part" Yea thousands of people somehow saw enough of the game seconds into it going live after buying it and rushed to metacritic to show their rage. Sure thing.

That's not to say some of those people don't exist, but no they aren't the "huge part". The "huge part" is exactly what it is and we all know what it is, don't play coy.

[Relapses]

They don't realize that a huge part of the backlash is coming from players who have bought the game and seen for themselves what is going on, venting through the abysmal rating they reward this game with. The rest of the negative reviews come from players who have been fortunate enough to save their money, having read the leaks/watch the game being played on YouTube and/or Twitch. This idea that someone has to fork out money for a game that's got an extremely disappointing story in order to rate said story is just mad, especially considering that the story and affiliated characters were the main draw for getting the game in the first place.

What...???! Are you actually saying that it's okay to give a game a shit rating if you haven't even fucking played it?! Are you fucking serious?

[Magnagarde]

"Huge part" Yea thousands of people somehow saw enough of the game seconds into it going live after buying it and rushed to metacritic to show their rage. Sure thing.

That's not to say some of those people don't exist, but no they aren't the "huge part". The "huge part" is exactly what it is and we all know what it is, don't play coy.

I played the game at my friend's and I cancelled my CE edition. The story is the main reason why the game is being review bombed. Pretending that there is something more behind is just disingenous.

What...???! Are you actually saying that it's okay to give a game a shit rating if you haven't even fucking played it?! Are you fucking serious?

Yes, it definitely is. This game is an 8 for me personally, rating all other elements besides the story, but I definitely understand where the other ratings are coming from.

[Stormdash]

Sorry I no longer reply to the person who thinks the man that disarmed a surgeon who was then helpless and proceeded to stab him in the neck is a good guy that didn't deserve his faith.

The only man Joel kills in the room no matter what? Was the only one with a lethal implement in his hand AND lethal intent - certainly toward Ellie. As the provided image demonstrates.

And he was right about Marlene. He clearly wasn't thrilled to be doing it, but he was right. These lunatics were never going to stop until they had Ellie's brain out her head.

I'm sorry you must be one of the marginal kooks that looked at TLOU 2 trailer and thought "man, I hope that guy" dies, but that was... well, marginal. Find me that streamer or YouTuber reaction. And Naughty Dog knew it, that their audience was very pro-Joel, which is why they made a bullshit trailer to sell him being part of the story.

What I'd love to see is if now that it's out, either Naughty Dog or some talented video editor would make an authentic trailer for the game - that sets up the conflict, the players, the competing POVs, the central questions about vengeance AND the plot device that sets it off. Almost every revenge movie admits up front what the inciting event is, i.e. Death Wish or Man on Fire, whatever. "Taken", great example. So no excuse like "well they couldn't reveal that something happens to Joel", that's not true at all, if he's the inciting event in a well-made revenge tale you lead with that. I would love to see that trailer and whether there's anyone who would be high-interest-to-buy on the game based solely on it.

[Relapses]

Yes, it definitely is. This game is an 8 for me personally, rating all other elements besides the story, but I definitely understand where the other ratings are coming from.

I'm sorry dude, you have a very fundamentally flawed perception of the meaning of the word "review."

[Magnagarde]

I'm sorry dude, you have a very fundamentally flawed perception of the meaning of the word "review."

If the story and characters are the main drive behind someone's decision to purchase a game or not, then a shit story is more than enough for someone to vent their disappointment. The abysmal user ratings come from a place of disappointment and anger, definitely, but that is a valid reaction.

[Stormdash]

This kind of trickery is present in movie trailers and rarely do people throw shit fits over it. It's really not a big deal to anybody other than the extremely incensed vocal minority you see on forums like this.

I'd love to know what examples you have in mind that are so fundamentally misleading. Some movies, the nature of the story itself is a secret so they are very oblique - most Chris Nolan movies, for example. But generally, movies tell with some clarity what the premise of the story is and what characters you can expect with be a part of it.

The "Infinity War" trailer, for instance - it had a fake of the Hulk running with the team, and it had extra lines for Thanos. The former was not really substantively dishonest; not only is Banner still fighting, but the Hulk actually does in fact fight Thanos in the movie. And the extra lines are to give you an abbreviated look into Thanos being bad and threatening. The TLOU 2 trailer... ain't that, not by a mile.

[Relapses]

If the story and characters are the main drive behind someone's decision to purchase a game or not, then a shit story is more than enough for someone to vent their disappointment.

You can vent your disappointment all you want but if you haven't actually played the fucking game, you're in no place to be submitting a fucking review on it.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I played the game at my friend's and I cancelled my CE edition. The story is the main reason why the game is being review bombed. Pretending that there is something more behind is just disingenuous.

Just going through this thread shows that there are a ton of people who haven’t actually gone though the story and are saying it’s awful and dismissing any story parts that disprove there incorrect ideas about the story.

The game isn’t being review bombed by thousands of people who actually went though the story and have events in context it’s people looking up one or two major plot points and ignoring every thing else or people who are just seeing memes/you tubers.

Of course there are people who have gone though it and still don’t like it but to pretend that’s the majority of the negative reviews is disingenuous.

[Gorsameth]

I watched Bahroo play through and sorry but the story is simply bad.
From an excessive use of flashbacks and lolz captured moments to completely 'yada'ing over corners they wrote themselves in.

How did Ellie & co survive the meeting with Abby/lev. Ellie is bleeding out with a broken arm. Dani has an arrow through the shoulder and her head caved in. Tommy literally gets shot in the head but lol next scene everyone is alive and living happily on a farm wtf is that for hack writing.

[Magnagarde]

Just going through this thread shows that there are a ton of people who haven’t actually gone though the story and are saying it’s awful and dismissing any story parts that disprove there incorrect ideas about the story.

The game isn’t being review bombed by thousands of people who actually went though the story and have events in context it’s people looking up one or two major plot points and ignoring every thing else or people who are just seeing memes/you tubers.

Of course there are people who have gone though it and still don’t like it but to pretend that’s the majority of the negative reviews is disingenuous.

Most of the negative reviews come from a place where people already know what is going to happen. They don't need to play the game themselves to evaluate it from this standpoint. I haven't seen any negative reviews coming in regards to the graphics, the audio or the gameplay, although the gameplay itself feels like it's a simple crossover from the first game; works decently enough.

And what you mention is actually the whole issue; there is absolutely zero broad context. Absolutely zero. Everything you do throughout the game ends up being completely meaningless because of the ending and the ending is supposedly "sending a message and teaching a lesson"; a lesson it dumps on through and through.

[Relapses]

I'd love to know what examples you have in mind that are so fundamentally misleading. Some movies, the nature of the story itself is a secret so they are very oblique - most Chris Nolan movies, for example. But generally, movies tell with some clarity what the premise of the story is and what characters you can expect with be a part of it.

The "Infinity War" trailer, for instance - it had a fake of the Hulk running with the team, and it had extra lines for Thanos. The former was not really substantively dishonest; not only is Banner still fighting, but the Hulk actually does in fact fight Thanos in the movie. And the extra lines are to give you an abbreviated look into Thanos being bad and threatening. The TLOU 2 trailer... ain't that, not by a mile.

Just off the top of my head, The Hunt's trailer sets up the movie to be something that it very much isn't.



Ironically, I think more people watched this trailer than paid for tickets to see it in movie theaters but hey. It's still a massive subversion of expectations.

[Stormdash]

A) The Hunt is incredible
B) It actually is a lot more forthcoming in that trailer than I think you are recognizing, or you just never saw it. And despite that, it still does set the premise that you don't know for sure what you are seeing, with Hilary Swank's evasive smile at (Crystal's) insistence that they are hunting humans.
C) Not sure this is the example you are looking for. And... yeah, there really isn't a twist to the thing that I don't think the trailers sets up pretty openly, it's very honest that you aren't supposed to be certain why these events are happening AND suggestive of different reasons that it might be.

What TLOU 2 did is basically advertise The Hunt, but as a survival romance between (The Hunt spoilers) Emma Roberts and Justin Hartley

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Most of the negative reviews come from a place where people already know what is going to happen. They don't need to play the game themselves to evaluate it from this standpoint.

And what you mention is actually the whole issue; there is absolutely zero broad context. Absolutely zero. Everything you do throughout the game ends up being completely meaningless because of the ending and the ending is supposedly sending a message it dumps on through and through.

There is an absolutely massive amount of context that leads into the ending through out multiple parts of the game you can’t just say you know what Is going to happen And ignore all of the parts that lead into the end and then say it doesn’t make sense. your just proving my point that people didn’t actually go though the game and just looked up key points and ignored all context.

The game is also 6 hours plus of raw story content not counting a lot of game play parts it’s in no means short and you can tell this if you just look at video lengths on YouTube.

[Magnagarde]

There is an absolutely massive amount of context that leads into the ending through out multiple parts of the game you can’t just say you know what Is going to happen And ignore all of the parts that lead into the end and then say it doesn’t make sense. your just proving my point that people didn’t actually go though the game and just looked up key points and ignored all context.

The game is also 6 hours plus of raw story content not counting a lot of game play parts it’s in no means short and you can tell this if you just look at video lengths on YouTube.

I actually got through the game and in just three bursts of playing at that. They've spent 7 years making a game that almost reached the The Order 1886 category of duration.

There is zero context and the reason why there is zero context is because the entire context for what you're doing the entire game gets thrown out of the window at least twice. You can't provide a context and then shit on said context. I played through the entire game with one purpose behind everything I did and then when I finally reach the finish line the character gives up and gets "enlightened"; it's like realizing that books are worth something after burning down the great libraries of Alexandria. The game teaches how revenge isn't the next best thing after having you plow your way through countless lives in order to take a single one.

The only context that the game ends up providing is that in order to play guitar you need a guitar and preferably two fists full of fingers.

[Sefer]

You can vent your disappointment all you want but if you haven't actually played the fucking game, you're in no place to be submitting a fucking review on it.

Sorry, but if someone watched the stream from beginning to the end of the game, and gives a rating for the story (not gameplay), his rating is 100% valid. No matter what, you are wrong. There is no difference to the story whether you watched it from start to end or played it yourself.

Didn't give a rating on any portal, just watched several streams. Glad I didn't buy the game.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I watched Bahroo play through and sorry but the story is simply bad.
From an excessive use of flashbacks and lolz captured moments to completely 'yada'ing over corners they wrote themselves in.

How did Ellie & co survive the meeting with Abby/lev. Ellie is bleeding out with a broken arm. Dani has an arrow through the shoulder and her head caved in. Tommy literally gets shot in the head but lol next scene everyone is alive and living happily on a farm wtf is that for hack writing.

On the surface Neither ellie nore Dina have life threatening injury’s they would feel absolutely regedit but barring any brain bleeding/infections would live and the game doesn’t seem to put any stock into infections. Tommy is another question it’s likely he has some spinal injury given his limp/how stiff he moves but then the question would be how they stabilized and transported him in the shape they were in.

[Relapses]

A) The Hunt is incredible
B) It actually is a lot more forthcoming in that trailer than I think you are recognizing, or you just never saw it. And despite that, it still does set the premise that you don't know for sure what you are seeing, with Hilary Swank's evasive smile at (Crystal's) insistence that they are hunting humans.
C) Not sure this is the example you are looking for. And... yeah, there really isn't a twist to the thing that I don't think the trailers sets up pretty openly, it's very honest that you aren't supposed to be certain why these events are happening AND suggestive of different reasons that it might be.

What TLOU 2 did is basically advertise The Hunt, but as a survival romance between (The Hunt spoilers) Emma Roberts and Justin Hartley

I doubt I'll convince you otherwise but The Hunt's trailer doesn't even include the MC and the movie itself doesn't really settle on the MC for the first twenty minutes anyway. I get that TLoU2 is a sequel so there's a bit of a vested interest in the character of Joel but I don't really think it's that far off... especially since you're making this inane argument that game trailers cannot subvert expectations when "muh feelings" are involved. What TLoU2 did is pretty bold but it was clear even before the leaks that this game was going to be focusing on a very different story from the first one. It's fine if you didn't like it -- I'm still floating my personal feelings about it -- but to say the trailer is "false advertising" or other pointless nonsense is just redirecting a very fundamental irritation that there may exist people who like things you don't like.