Josh removed from Method, Sascha accused of harassment

[Muxtar]

Ah , you missed the discussion.

People yell the argument, because he was such a high tier raider, and they are so young and afraid, they couldnt use the ignore function and had to keep letting him approach them.

100% using using the big ignore button was IMPOSSIBLE

It is so hard to ignore people nowadays. Much easier to make a victim of yourself 5 years later with unproven accusations.

[Bryntrollian]

Method is a raiding group, right? They have a CEO? And a co CEO? What happened to raid leaders?

They're an E-Sports Organization with teams represented in several games. As far as I know they haven't been a mere " wow raiding guild " since 2013.

[Muxtar]

Wrong. That test can only prove that sex occurred. It cannot prove consent or non consent so it cannot prove rape.

Nope. If sex was uncosented = rape, there are physical marks inside. We had here in Ukraine the case of raping of young woman by the police asshole month ago, and medical expertise proved rape did occur. I wonder what can much better western medical system do in this case.

Solicitation is still a crime. It does not matter that it was online either. It is also beyond ignorant to say it is safe to do online because you have no clue who is on the other end. IF that was a minor, that is a serious crime if the minor is under the age of consent and still a crime even if they are not.

You really did not think anything through at all.

I did think, and I still do, and I don't see a crime in ignoring some moron online if he annoys or offends me. I have FB ban list like of 500-700 people, and can still breathe good, as you can see.

[Flurryfang]

I would not call sexual assault or harassment 'being weird' but ok.

Why is the world like this? maybe somewhat of a counter reaction to the centuries where sexual harassment/assault was considered 'ok' or 'normal'.
Because people are imperfect, because its often he said/she said, because there is often a lack of real evidence allowing people to get away with such behaviour.

That all depends on your definition of sexual assualt and harrasment is. Is flirting awkwardly harrasment? Is being physically "over friendly" assualt? I once got called gropy, because i hugged two of my female friends for a picture.....The definition matters a lot.

I don't see a problem in dealing with people, who are being abusive or sexually exploitative. I see a problem in the overreaction, that comes when you fear, that you might be accused of it. That is what happens right now with a lot of companies. Just the fear of that an employee will be accused, rightfully or not, creates rules, that makes misunderstandings or just being odd, a cause for being fired.

[Kumorii]

Yeah, I get the vibe "Annie" was after something and she didn't get it on her own accord. So she's gonna blast Sacha now, and make a big ass deal of a guy being slightly inappropriate as her superior "gamer". Everyone is acting like Elon Musk groped his secretary or something. Maybe I just think an Officer/CEO of Method being equated to "this girl's boss" is a little silly and tongue in cheek. A bunch of gamers were on holiday, be real. Besides, when are people going to start accepting that anxiety is not an excuse to be a coward? It's like all cowards found a universal excuse to say I shouldn't have to *deal* with things since I have social anxiety. If someone says, "I don't handle rejection well" to you, man or woman, tell that asshole "I don't give a damn what you handle well, not my problem" and move on. But noooo, she has anxiety, she has to heal for 6 months before she can talk about this *extremely traumatic experience*.

It seems to me she was flirty and physical with the guy in person (with her hugs and attention) and the guy caught the wrong signal and started texting her when he was full of liquid courage. Which I get is cringe a little, but it shouldn't be something that his head gets put on a pike for. It is not a crime nor is it illegal to do what he did. The same "strength" she's invoking to roast this guy could have easily been used to just tell him she's not interested. Instead she perpetuates the behavior by playing coy with vague interest instead of being honest with the guy. Notice she only posts screenshots of things he said, and no screenshots of things she's claiming she said.

Annie if you're reading this, next time just say, "This is unprofessional. I would like you to stop this immediately." instead of trying to ruin someone's life.

As someone with anxiety I wouldn't say that it's how people anxiety tends to react. If you've noticed from all these "coming out" stories they tend to say it's a friend or similar who convinced them to come forward with it. People are getting pressured by others to do it. Being convinced by others something terrible actually happened when it in fact didn't, like in this Annie case.

People try to see malicious intent even if there is none, it's the current trend. If you don't see malicious intent you are somehow a bad person and you are virtuous for pointing it out and convincing others that's how it is.

Anything that can be explained by stupidity rather than malicious intent tend to be about stupidity. In this case both of them were somewhat stupid.

[Muxtar]

I'm a woman, I've offended women. As a woman, men have offended me, in a lot of ways... And?
You seem to have the opinion that all women behave and act in the same way, it screams like a certain type of person.

That aside, I'm willing to hear Josh's side of the story but unfortunately, he deleted everything.

I never stated ALL women and behave like that attention craving girls from twitter or other social media. Hell, I am married man myself, and my wife would NEVER do like these girls, she would said all she thinks of such morons just in their faces. She is quite fearful in rage trust me

I also want to hear his side of story, but it is what it is. It is easier to comply if you are white natural famous man, because you're nowadays half guilty by default just by being such a person.

[Flurryfang]

It's not because one member is a child predator, stop being disingenious. They're scum because they knew and still covered for him.

Also hitting on teenagers as an adult is disgusting, are you unironically trying to downplay this? Really says a lot about you dude.

Nobody have proof, that Method knew that Josh were an abuser and helping to hide him. Just because they did not fire him instantly, that anybody heard he might have been accused, does not make them bad or protecting sexual predators.

She was 16 m8, that is legal age in most countries in the world. And again, there is a big difference between a meme lord online saying shit to people in wierd chats, and then actually meeting them and abusing them IRL. Its not downplaying, its removing all the bullshit and looking at what really happen.

PS: and no need for personal attacks.

[BlimeyLimey]

smells like a whole lotta butthurt virgins in here who this has absolutely no impact on what-so-ever

keep staying mad about people being caught... yikes.

[Courierrawr]

She was 16 m8, that is legal age in most countries in the world. And again, there is a big difference between a meme lord online saying shit to people in wierd chats, and then actually meeting them and abusing them IRL. Its not downplaying, its removing all the bullshit and looking at what really happen.

"she was 16" And he was in his 20s dude. It's disgusting. Stop downplaying this shit. bUt He WaS jUsT mEmEiNg tHo!!111!

PS: and no need for personal attacks.

I have zero tolerance for pedophiles and pedophile defenders.

[rrayy]

Nope. If sex was uncosented = rape, there are physical marks inside. We had here in Ukraine the case of raping of young woman by the police asshole month ago, and medical expertise proved rape did occur. I wonder what can much better western medical system do in this case.

First of all, you can have marks inside with consentual sex as well. I guarantee you that the rape test was not the only thing the Ukrainian prescutors presented as evidence in that case. You cannot prove rape with a medical test because you cannot prove consent. You can only prove an act of sex took place between two people. You need to educate yourself on these matters.

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The 13 year old. Maybe, far to young and maybe was confused how to react.

The 16 year old? Dont kid yourself. She knew what was going on and could end it any time. Again, 16 and 21 year olds are not much different matured depending on the situation and both ( josh and the 16 year old ) were in a age were they kinda knew whats going on but not really

ANd you know that how? For your information, in many states in teh US, 17 is the age of consent and she would be considerd incapable of giving consent. You are not the arbiter of what a 16 year old knows or does not know.

[ArenaDk]

"she was 16" And he was in his 20s dude. It's disgusting. Stop downplaying this shit. bUt He WaS jUsT mEmEiNg tHo!!111!


I have zero tolerance for pedophiles and pedophile defenders.

You really must hate your grand parents then...... /s

Please focus on normal argumentation. Its fine that you dont like the age gap. But for many first world cultures , its nothing unusal and there is no need for insults and maligne claims

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First of all, you can have marks inside with consentual sex as well. I guarantee you that the rape test was not the only thing the Ukrainian prescutors presented as evidence in that case. You cannot prove rape with a medical test because you cannot prove consent. You can only prove an act of sex took place between two people. You need to educate yourself on these matters.

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ANd you know that how? For your information, in many states in teh US, 17 is the age of consent and she would be considerd incapable of giving consent. You are not the arbiter of what a 16 year old knows or does not know.

A 16 year old knows about this stuff, dont mark them as not knwoing naive children. No matter if they can give consent. ( are they even american?) , she could always block him instead of chatting with a person which was clearly wanting something

[Rune B]

This is objectively false.

We in our industry/business use screenshots as additional evidence alongside on-site investigations/audits.

I don't know what industry you work in, but screenshots aren't evidence unless they're verified by pulling the chat log from the server. Otherwise you're left with a reversal of burden of proof, in which case all photos of UFOs and the Loch Ness Monster etc. are true. It has to be verifiable and testable.

[Eldatur]

Why is it that it's always the WoW community and almost no other community that has these kinds of drama. After all this shit with Method and now Bay who I always thought was a creeper anyways now are outed I'm never touching any Blizzard game again due to this community.

[rrayy]

You really must hate your grand parents then...... /s

Please focus on normal argumentation. Its fine that you dont like the age gap. But for many first world cultures , its nothing unusal and there is no need for insults and maligne claims

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A 16 year old knows about this stuff, dont mark them as not knwoing naive children. No matter if they can give consent. ( are they even american?) , she could always block him instead of chatting with a person which was clearly wanting something

Again, you know that how? You are not a medical expert in psychology. You saying they do doesn't make that fact. Every child is different. You declaring they means nothing. There are age of consent laws for a reason. Your victim blaming and blind defense of a pedo tells me all I need to know about you.

[Odintdk]

Its easy in my opinion. Increase the punishment for wrong accuser and for people who are proofen guilty. But punish companys/ individuels who try to take justice in their own hands

While I agree to this as one of the possible solutions.. can you just imagine the kind of outrage that would take place at the mere suggestion of it being implemented? Whoever brings this up will be swarmed and labeled incel, then canceled too before he wakes up the next day.

[Sorshen]

Did what? Asked girl for her nudes online and then jerked off on them? Did he threaten or blackmail her? Did he do any physical actions on her?
Being moron IRL doesn't mean being criminal. People here forget this.

What the fuck is wrong with you? Underage girls. Multiple underage girls.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/42/contents

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/...d-sex-offences


It can mean 6 months to 2 years prison time for requesting sexual content from a minor alone.

[ArenaDk]

Again, you know that how? You are not a medical expert in psychology. You saying they do doesn't make that fact. Every child is different. You declaring they means nothing. There are age of consent laws for a reason. Your victim blaming and blind defense of a pedo tells me all I need to know about you.

Iam not a expert in psychology. But I studied medicine. Thank you very much.

Yes there are age of consent laws, please show me from which country she is so we can apply it. Else I will keep going by ours here, which is 14. So she is 2 years older.

Yes every child is different, which doesnt allow you to reduce them to useless, help,ess little beings. Have some respect for them. Many 16 year olds are hardworking member of society and probably more mature then you or me. But saying they cant press ignore button when they dont like a flirt? really?

edit : also blind defense ? I said they should castrate him for going after a 13 year old

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While I agree to this as one of the possible solutions.. can you just imagine the kind of outrage that would take place at the mere suggestion of it being implemented? Whoever brings this up will be swarmed and labeled incel, then canceled too before he wakes up the next day.

Simple answer, give the person a place to speak up and the people who disagree one too. Let them explain why:

Guilty people shouldnt be harder punished

Why wrong accusations shpuldnt be punished as hard

Why people defaming and jumping on unproofen evidence shouldnt be also punished.

There will be no answer , because the only negative is that people who witch hunt , cant do so any more without risk

[conceptKitty]

I never stated ALL women and behave like that attention craving girls from twitter or other social media. Hell, I am married man myself, and my wife would NEVER do like these girls, she would said all she thinks of such morons just in their faces. She is quite fearful in rage trust me

I also want to hear his side of story, but it is what it is. It is easier to comply if you are white natural famous man, because you're nowadays half guilty by default just by being such a person.

Do you think it's not a bit telling when Josh just left like he did?

[Biomega]

Why is it that it's always the WoW community and almost no other community that has these kinds of drama. After all this shit with Method and now Bay who I always thought was a creeper anyways now are outed I'm never touching any Blizzard game again due to this community.

1. Your information is very likely subject to selection biases; obviously you hear more in fields you're interested in because you frequent the places where that information is disseminated.
2. WoW is one of the oldest and largest single-game communities, so you see more total cases and they are more visible
3. WoW is very community-driven because it's a game with high degrees of fixed group play, and the more community is emphasized the more likely contact is to happen between the members of that community

I'm sure there's more reasons, too.

HOWEVER

This doesn't mean such things don't happen in other communities, gaming or otherwise. They do.

[rrayy]

Why is it that it's always the WoW community and almost no other community that has these kinds of drama. After all this shit with Method and now Bay who I always thought was a creeper anyways now are outed I'm never touching any Blizzard game again due to this community.

WoW has a very large community. But their are plent of other communities having issues, especially ones outside of gaming.