bubba Wallace noose was a garage door opener

[StillMcfuu]

So my previous position was:

1) Nascar was right to launch an investigation
2) Investigation found nothing to be concerned about
3) Mission Accomplished, everyone should move on with their life. There is real racism out there, and we should be glad that isn't it.

However, in light of the evidence released by NASCAR yesterday, I would like to state that I was wrong, and would like to amend my position.

1) NASCAR was right to launch and investigation
2) Investigation found something that is extremely disturbing, but untraceable
3) Yep, NASCAR still has a problem, and there is more work to be done here.

My previous position was largely based on the simple loop knot that it appeared to be. That seemed entirely reasonable for use as a garage door opener, and I can absolutely see how it was an innocent choice. Someone simply tied it as a convenient loop to close the door with your foot, or loop it over an object to secure the door.

This picture does not show that.

That is a goddamn hanging noose. It may have been their before Wallace occupied the garage, but it really strains the imagination to see anything innocent in that picture. I am sure it does function as a garage door opener, but it is completely unnecessary for that task, and the imagery is blatant. In light of that additional evidence, I change my position to "It is a damn shame they couldn't find who tied that".

It's a uni-knot. It's a fisherman's knot used to tie hooks.

I'm not going to say ridiculous things about turns on the knot vs tradition. Yes that knot could be used to hang someone, but popular culture would have most people believe that 13 turns on the knot makes it a noose, which was used but the 13 turns is based on superstition vs any practical application. The uni-knot is commonly made with around 6 loops and is used to connect the hook to the line.

Fishing is a far more popular past time than hanging, especially among Nascar pit crew.

[Thekri]

It's a uni-knot. It's a fisherman's knot used to tie hooks.

I'm not going to say ridiculous things about turns on the knot vs tradition. Yes that knot could be used to hang someone, but popular culture would have most people believe that 13 turns on the knot makes it a noose, which was used but the 13 turns is based on superstition vs any practical application. The uni-knot is commonly made with around 6 loops and is used to connect the hook to the line.

Fishing is a far more popular past time than hanging, especially among Nascar pit crew.

As I have stated before, I do not believe the act of tying a knot is inherently evil. However, I do think it a bit dishonest to pretend that is anything but a noose. The loop is not wrapped around a fishing hook and pulled tight, the end is deliberately left open and unfilled, as a hanging noose.

It is also not tied out of fishing line or bungee cord, it is tied out of what appears to be plain rope not any sort of modern nylon or cord. I am not familiar with NASCAR garages, but I know that type of rope is extremely rarely used in modern applications, because it frays, breaks, and leaves little fibers everywhere. It is however, stereo-typically the look of a hanging noose.

As I stated before in my previous position, I do understand the utility of a looped pulldown loop. However the complexity of that knot is far in excess of any reasonable amount of force needed to close a garage door. It is used on fishing lines because a very small and thin knot must handle the force of a far larger struggling fish, while nobody is reasonably going to need to pull a garage door handle so hard as to justify such a strong knot, which takes longer to tie. However, such a knot is necessary to deal with the shock of a human body hitting the end of a hanging noose.

And lastly the obvious visual. I mean come on. Even if this was made innocently, it looks like a hanging noose to literally everyone. I don't know if the intent was racist, because we don't know who tied it, but the appearance is obviously there. Maybe someone tied it because they thought it was funny, maybe someone was trying to be edgy, maybe it was some sort of in-joke with that crew. Or maybe they tied it to be racist, we don't know. But the imagery is obviously an extremely bad look, and hanging on the garage door of the only black driver in all of NASCAR, and on exactly 1 out of 1254 doors... yeah. Not a good look.

[Milchshake]

Nop, still a noose.

[Yuujin]

It's a uni-knot. It's a fisherman's knot used to tie hooks.

More of the usual suspects. Getting pretty sad at this point.

[StillMcfuu]

As I have stated before, I do not believe the act of tying a knot is inherently evil. However, I do think it a bit dishonest to pretend that is anything but a noose. The loop is not wrapped around a fishing hook and pulled tight, the end is deliberately left open and unfilled, as a hanging noose.

It is also not tied out of fishing line or bungee cord, it is tied out of what appears to be plain rope not any sort of modern nylon or cord. I am not familiar with NASCAR garages, but I know that type of rope is extremely rarely used in modern applications, because it frays, breaks, and leaves little fibers everywhere. It is however, stereo-typically the look of a hanging noose.

As I stated before in my previous position, I do understand the utility of a looped pulldown loop. However the complexity of that knot is far in excess of any reasonable amount of force needed to close a garage door. It is used on fishing lines because a very small and thin knot must handle the force of a far larger struggling fish, while nobody is reasonably going to need to pull a garage door handle so hard as to justify such a strong knot, which takes longer to tie. However, such a knot is necessary to deal with the shock of a human body hitting the end of a hanging noose.

And lastly the obvious visual. I mean come on. Even if this was made innocently, it looks like a hanging noose to literally everyone. I don't know if the intent was racist, because we don't know who tied it, but the appearance is obviously there. Maybe someone tied it because they thought it was funny, maybe someone was trying to be edgy, maybe it was some sort of in-joke with that crew. Or maybe they tied it to be racist, we don't know. But the imagery is obviously an extremely bad look, and hanging on the garage door of the only black driver in all of NASCAR, and on exactly 1 out of 1254 doors... yeah. Not a good look.

It's use being in bad taste, sure I can agree to that. But it had been hanging there since last year, and it's a common knot that would be known (not just by sight but how to tie it) by a lot of people. That knot in that application may have been chosen because they didn't want the end to close. Depending on type of rope and other factors, closing the loop tends to be difficult. It's what makes the knot an exceptional fishing knot, it's incredibly easy to tie and the inherit friction of the loops disperses forces more evenly than just a single bit of string through the eyelid.

If this were a 13 turn noose, I'd 100% say this is a little more fishy than what it appears.

But because it's a common knot, done text book on how you would tie that knot and that it had been there for months, long before anyone knew Wallace would be using that garage leads me to believe that the entire situation was blown out of proportion and that it's not really much of a "look" it's just an unfortunate coincidence.

Nascar should have kept this quiet until after an investigation was completed, at first glance it warranted looking into. But turning it into a circus, and then to have it blow up in their face and make them and the party that they were trying to "protect" (Wallace) look far worse off is a worse look.

[szechuan]

But because it's a common knot

The Hangmans Noose is not.

Which The FBI confirmed it was.

Nascar should have kept this quiet until after an investigation was completed, at first glance it warranted looking into.
But turning it into a circus, and then to have it blow up in their face and make them and the party that they were trying to "protect" (Wallace) look far worse off is a worse look.

Yet it seems like the only people getting angry are Racists.

[Endus]

It's a uni-knot. It's a fisherman's knot used to tie hooks.

I'm not going to say ridiculous things about turns on the knot vs tradition. Yes that knot could be used to hang someone, but popular culture would have most people believe that 13 turns on the knot makes it a noose, which was used but the 13 turns is based on superstition vs any practical application. The uni-knot is commonly made with around 6 loops and is used to connect the hook to the line.

Fishing is a far more popular past time than hanging, especially among Nascar pit crew.

The other knots, including the uni-knot you're talking about, are used entirely differently than a hangman's noose.

A hangman's noose's two key elements are the heavy "neck", which those other knots share, and the hanging loop, which those other knots do not. They're pulled tight. They're a complex hitch, not a loose bight. This makes them similar to a hangman's noose knot, but not the same.

The "13 loops" thing is also apocryphal nonsense.

[Egomaniac]

Not people.... 1 single person.

There were others before him. They moved on though.

[lockedout]

Are you aware if the person who did make it is a knitter or a trapper?

If you followed the conversation (which you didn’t) I was simply pointing out to endus who made the claim that a noose is only used for hanging, that it has other uses. Even if they knew exactly who tied it no crime was committed. No one knew a year ago who would be using that garage stall.

[Machismo]

If you followed the conversation (which you didn’t) I was simply pointing out to endus who made the claim that a noose is only used for hanging, that it has other uses. Even if they knew exactly who tied it no crime was committed. No one knew a year ago who would be using that garage stall.

So, you agree that it was a noose... great.

[lockedout]

So, you agree that it was a noose... great.

Sure what does that accomplish? It’s not illegal, it wasn’t targeting anyone. It was used to pull down a garage door.

[Machismo]

Sure what does that accomplish? It’s not illegal, it wasn’t targeting anyone. It was used to pull down a garage door.

I never said it was illegal. But, people who hang nooses seem to hold particular beliefs.


Quite peculiar, indeed.

[XangXu]

I never said it was illegal. But, people who hang nooses seem to hold particular beliefs.


Quite peculiar, indeed.

I think whoever tied it didn’t even think. No one set out to make this noose into a statement.

The frenzied dumb fuck memeing internet people did that.

[lockedout]

I never said it was illegal. But, people who hang nooses seem to hold particular beliefs.


Quite peculiar, indeed.

What that there garage doors need to close?
Can you prove malice?

[Machismo]

What that there garage doors need to close?
Can you prove malice?

Yep, and of all the garages... only one person used a noose. Imagine that.

[lockedout]

I think whoever tied it didn’t even think. No one set out to make this noose into a statement.

The frenzied dumb fuck memeing internet people did that.

Logical thinking will get you no where on this forum when there is outrage to be had.

[Machismo]

I think whoever tied it didn’t even think. No one set out to make this noose into a statement.

The frenzied dumb fuck memeing internet people did that.

Oh, I doubt that there was much malice behind it. Ignorance? Now that is far more likely.

Then again, there could have been. I know I wouldn't have been dumb enough to tie a noose.

[lockedout]

Yep, and of all the garages... only one person used a noose. Imagine that.

So that means what exactly?

To expand out of all the garages he was assigned that one by NASCAR not the person who tied it.

[Machismo]

So that means what exactly?

That some dipshit decided to hang a noose in a garage.

[Machismo]

And nobody in the time since it happened thought maybe it was a bad idea to have a noose just hanging around, no pun intended.

Well, in a community that is surrounded by Confederate Flags and racists, the appearance of a noose probably wouldn't raise much attention.