Apple Silicon - finally an alternative to x86 on desktop

[ldev]

first: i dont get why you rant that much around here. cheesus christ. something must really hurt you or whatever the fuck.

Or maybe, take off your tinfoil hat, or leave it, this might blow your mind - this is my thread and I'm addressing all comments. Most are poop like yours with huge levels of anti apple bias, so addressing poop biased comments doesn't make me a fanboy, it makes you look bad.

I mean at the end of the day migration to brand new CPU family on desktop is insanely huge, easily most important thing of last few years in tech. And IT enthusiasts can't get anything but excited. Now I understand this forum is filled with gamers, and while they discuss Intel and Nvidia and AMD, they are anything but IT enthusiasts - children or man children, who enjoy pcmasterrace trolling and care only about FPS in their games and from how afar can you see their shitty tasteless blinking leds in keyboards, pc cases and so on.

[Blackmist]

The iPad Pro is practically a computer anyway. It already has full keyboard support.

I suspect what we'll see here is a convergence of the two lines into one ecosystem. Macs are a tiny part of Apple now. They'll rather get rid of that and just have ARM Mac be an iPad with a mouse and keyboard.

[Mister K]

Your argument was that FC is not for pros. Not that it lacks collaboration tools. Which it does, absolutely.

"Final Cut is just not acceptable. If you are a one man band it won't matter" - so which the fuck is it? Not acceptable or "won't matter"?

"NLE really doesn't matter" - again, so for lone cutter, does NLE matter or not? You said when arguing against FC that it does and it's not for pros.

Learn to construct arguments.

"Resolve shits on Final Cut and so does Premiere (Adobe ecosystem is juicy)"
I know, right? For every Final Cut/Motion tutorial there's literally a thousand of Adobe Premiere/After Effects tutorials. For every FC effect/template there's literally thousands for Premiere/After Effects. Literally almost every video stock footage site throws in Premiere/AE templates into subscription. Skillshare, Lynda, Udemy and every other learning website has a shit ton of content for Adobe ecosystem and almost none for FC/Motion. Popularity and, it turn, getting help anywhere, is wayyyy in Adobe's favour.

And yet, despite all that, according to you, Final Cut is the tool for beginners and hobbyists, but NOT Adobe products. Like, whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa? xD For real, how the fuck did you came into this conclusion? I would never ever recommend Final Cut/Motion to a hobbyist, exactly because of that. Once you know how software like FC and Motion works and you don't need any help - only then you could chose these tools, mainly because they are fast, crash less and most importantly - costs way less money.

FC is not widely used in pro environment. It is used by YouTubers and people stepping into the industry with their little Macbooks / iMacs. Parasite is an exception (stubborn editors) and I am sure if you dig hard enough you will find more. THE INDUSTRY uses primarily what I listed previously. Yes you have a wildcard every so often (FCP7 is commonly used in Korea).

Again it is not acceptable in post houses and for one man bands that are doing their little weddings, basic edits, yes it does not matter on the NLE, both are true, both are valid. Cutting a draft does not matter as its cutting, I mean ever cut up a video? You will understand that NLE won't matter for that aspect. I know few people who use it and you can clearly tell the difference in their edits. The type that either chuck slomo 99% of times and call it cinematic or speed ramp the shit out their videos.

Premiere has plenty of other benefits outside of tutorials and collaboration and Adobe ecosystem is the major factor. The little playback/rendering of FC is not as important especially once your system is powerful enough that it won't matter. Also After Effects for 2D graphics (for instance Kurzgesagt, LineArt, WebArt) is miles better than FC/Resolve. That is just one example for specific use case, partly due to AI.

Again for one man bands it wont matter but why limit yourself due to your shitty bias? Learn, adapt, move and improve. It clearly seems you are bound to FC and fanboying hard. Industry professionals are moving away from FC and some even from Premiere over to Resolve. But whatever gets your work done

Also Puget > All primarily does Resolve/Premiere optimisations and that says everything

Working with people that refuse to learn a modern NLE is such a pain in the ass. Stubborn Final Cut 7 fanatics that refuse to learn Resolve, Premiere, or any moderately updated software makes jobs so much harder. Inevitably that kind of person is predisposed to not really be in the know with a lot of new techniques and standards.

PS: Used FCPX for a month because I had to on 2019 iMac and while I liked delivering the project due to speed, hated everything else on it. Fuck me what a nightmare of a shit show. Premiere has bugs, Resolve requires a strong machine and it's proxy workflow is meh BUT jeeeeees never touching FC ever again.

[ldev]

Is this your final confirmation that "FC for hobbyists not for pros" is complete bullcrap?

[Niwes]

Or maybe, take off your tinfoil hat, or leave it, this might blow your mind - this is my thread and I'm addressing all comments. Most are poop like yours with huge levels of anti apple bias, so addressing poop biased comments doesn't make me a fanboy, it makes you look bad.

I mean at the end of the day migration to brand new CPU family on desktop is insanely huge, easily most important thing of last few years in tech. And IT enthusiasts can't get anything but excited. Now I understand this forum is filled with gamers, and while they discuss Intel and Nvidia and AMD, they are anything but IT enthusiasts - children or man children, who enjoy pcmasterrace trolling and care only about FPS in their games and from how afar can you see their shitty tasteless blinking leds in keyboards, pc cases and so on.

hmm, i dont like that type of fps>all modding gaming stuff ppl too, you described in your second part. i for myself be definitely not one of them.

your first part: are you 12 years old or what ?

nonetheless, have a nice life.

[schwarzkopf]

It doesn't matter because I will never buy an Apple computer.

Well, for me it means never buying them in the future - being able to run OSX and Windows was a major selling point for Mac, that is gone.

Sadly for me - that also means abandoning the iOS platform and moving back to the inferior Android - because Apple still insists on Mac for iOS dev.

[Temp name]

The iPad Pro is practically a computer anyway. It already has full keyboard support.

Yeah, but they've had keyboard support for ages. They just got mouse support though.

[Blackmist]

Yeah, but they've had keyboard support for ages. They just got mouse support though.

It was the mouse support that makes me think the Mac line is nearly ready to be phased out. If you can make an iPad act like a laptop, you can replace a laptop.

[Temp name]

It was the mouse support that makes me think the Mac line is nearly ready to be phased out. If you can make an iPad act like a laptop, you can replace a laptop.

The primary problem comes in translating all the code and apps they have for x86 right now into ARM-compatible code. That's going to be a huge undertaking that even Microsoft failed at. Granted, Apple does do a better job on their OS than Microsoft, and care a lot more about the user experience, but it's not going to be easy, cheap, or fast.

[LeGin Tufnel]

As an end user (1 of the 4 industry-standard apps I'm obliged to use professionally is Mac OS only) who knows absolutely nothing about how they work, please shout at me if this is a stupid question but how will this affect software developers? Is this problematic?

The transition from 10.14 to 10.15 has been excruciating because of the 32 / 64 bit thing and has resulted in a situation where I can’t upgrade my hardware because the software I need to use wouldn’t work on it 9 months on. And I'm not sure I fancy another round of this. I’m sure there’s probably someway of downgrading but I don’t have the time or the patience, and the last time I tried that it went horribly wrong. If what you're arguing about has nothing to do this, please feel free to tell me to fuck off

I have a laptop with Bootcamp / Windows and losing that ability wouldn't be the end of the world. Is that the only foreseeable problem?

[Thunderball]

As an end user (1 of the 4 industry-standard apps I'm obliged to use professionally is Mac OS only) who knows absolutely nothing about how they work, please shout at me if this is a stupid question but how will this affect software developers? Is this problematic?

The transition from 10.14 to 10.15 has been excruciating because of the 32 / 64 bit thing and has resulted in a situation where I can’t upgrade my hardware because the software I need to use wouldn’t work on it 9 months on. And I'm not sure I fancy another round of this. I’m sure there’s probably someway of downgrading but I don’t have the time or the patience, and the last time I tried that it went horribly wrong. If what you're arguing about has nothing to do this, please feel free to tell me to fuck off

I have a laptop with Bootcamp / Windows and losing that ability wouldn't be the end of the world. Is that the only foreseeable problem?

Short answer: it is problematic. For the long answer read through the thread, there are a couple of qualified opinions in this thread already.

[LeGin Tufnel]

Short answer: it is problematic. For the long answer read through the thread, there are a couple of qualified opinions in this thread already.

OK, thanks.

I wouldn't pretend to understand the long answer, neither do I have any interest in doing so. As would, I hope, you'd admit if you asked me for a summary of in-depth, highly technical question about my profession of which you have zero knowledge.

All that concerns me is my ability to conduct my profession using the tools available and I've struggled in the last year because of Apple "complications".

So.

[Thunderball]

OK, thanks.

I wouldn't pretend to understand the long answer, neither do I have any interest in doing so. As would, I hope, you'd admit if you asked me for a summary of in-depth, highly technical question about my profession of which you have zero knowledge.

All that concerns me is my ability to conduct my profession using the tools available and I've struggled in the last year because of Apple "complications".

So.

I get that. However I'm not qualified to answer that specific question myself so I'm not going to try to.

[LeGin Tufnel]

I get that. However I'm not qualified to answer that specific question myself so I'm not going to try to.

Ok, sorry - my bad

[Stickiler]

All that concerns me is my ability to conduct my profession using the tools available and I've struggled in the last year because of Apple "complications".

The Short answer is: "It depends how complicated the software you use is"

The long answer:

Apple is developing an emulation layer to try and ease the transition, however there's a very large possibility that the emulation layer won't be able to handle anything overly complex without slowing your system to an absolute crawl. Apple has said that they're going to produce x86 Macs for a while, also to ease the transition, but unless the developer of your software releases an ARM version, there will come a day where you'll have to be running on years old hardware, just to make it work.

Given how you struggled with the 32-64bit transition(which is orders of magnitude less disruptive than an x86-ARM transition), you've got grim times coming.

[Neuroticaine]

Cool. "Let the Apple bashing begin." was more of a joke, but that's what soulless corporation like Microsoft does to you - makes you float too. Still have PTSD from working with MFC and WWF.

In what reality is Apple NOT a soulless corporation?

[ldev]

The Short answer is: "It depends how complicated the software you use is"

The long answer:

Apple is developing an emulation layer to try and ease the transition, however there's a very large possibility that the emulation layer won't be able to handle anything overly complex without slowing your system to an absolute crawl. Apple has said that they're going to produce x86 Macs for a while, also to ease the transition, but unless the developer of your software releases an ARM version, there will come a day where you'll have to be running on years old hardware, just to make it work.

Given how you struggled with the 32-64bit transition(which is orders of magnitude less disruptive than an x86-ARM transition), you've got grim times coming.

Is 27% performance penalty really "absolute crawl" on iPad Pro cpu from 2018?

In what reality is Apple NOT a soulless corporation?

Yes, every corporation and it's product is the same - no soul. Why are people having discussions about iOS v Android, Alfa Romeo vs Volkswagen, etc, is beyond me.

[Mister K]

Is this your final confirmation that "FC for hobbyists not for pros" is complete bullcrap?

Do you even read?

[LeGin Tufnel]

The Short answer is: "It depends how complicated the software you use is"

The long answer:

Apple is developing an emulation layer to try and ease the transition, however there's a very large possibility that the emulation layer won't be able to handle anything overly complex without slowing your system to an absolute crawl. Apple has said that they're going to produce x86 Macs for a while, also to ease the transition, but unless the developer of your software releases an ARM version, there will come a day where you'll have to be running on years old hardware, just to make it work.

Given how you struggled with the 32-64bit transition(which is orders of magnitude less disruptive than an x86-ARM transition), you've got grim times coming.

Ok, thanks for the reply. Will give this some thought.

[Stickiler]

Is 27% performance penalty really "absolute crawl" on iPad Pro cpu from 2018?

I'm going to need a source on that 27%, because there's no possible way that the performance penalty is the same hard number for every single app. Even 27% is too much, especially for workloads that push the specs to the absolute maximum.