Shadowlands - An Update on Pelagos' Pronouns

[deenman]

oh for christ sakes... can we have ANYTHING....ANY..FUCKING..THING.. without political correctness or "inclusiveness" rammed into it?

oh yes,respecting how people want to be adressed is SOOOOO RAMMING!!,it must rly suck being so hateful,anyways,in my country they/them has been a thing for hundrets of years,it has always been the norm in adressing people

[Krakan]

Bit of both on that last question. One can assume the player character has little conflict between internal and external expression (for whatever reason; the adventurer as a character is intentionally left an AFGNCAAP so you can impose your own backstory and persona as you see fit). For others, their idealized self manifests differently in the spirit world, like Pelagos or those who manifest in Ardenweald as animal spirits. This mostly serves to let the devs get more creative with Shadowlands's inhabitants, since the afterlives we visit (which aren't the sum total of all afterlives) do draw from all worlds and all points in history; having characters from foreign worlds/timelines manifest in more familiar forms saves on model development and helps keep each zone thematic.

I guess that makes sense... I don't know even with all the time travel nonsense I do hate when lore is rewritten for plot.

Still this is pretty minor and doesn't even stack up to the sky scrapper sword everyone including the devs forgot about...

[Orange Joe]

Because they're making a fuss about it instead of just doing it and not saying anything about it.

2 paragraphs is a fuss? Whats that say about how much you have posted about it?

- - - Updated - - -

They also teach there are 2 genders. Funny things those schools are.
Also I think you need to write in bold "irrational". That's the key word here. Also I don't care about definitions written by SJWs of the words they make up as they go along.

lol

Which school did you go to that doesn't know the difference between Gender and Sex?

[razorpax]

Who is Pelagos??

Unless the fact they wished for a penis is relevant idk who would care one way or another

[Chickat]

Oh I know this. I'm just here for the salt my dude.

Apologies then.

[Sangris]

2 paragraphs is a fuss? Whats that say about how much you have posted about it?

It's not about the length of it, and you know it. Aside from that, I wrote ONE sentence about it. Everything else was just responding to people who felt offended by me not celebrating how progressive they are (even when we all know Blizzard only "care" when it suits them).

[BrintoSFJ]

If you care about this, on either side of the coin, you're an idiot. It's a game, with make believe characters. Who gives a flying fuck what the character identifies as.

If the dragon identifies as a fairy toaster 9000 space goat, cool what ever. Doesn't affect me at all, just give me the damn quest so I can go kill murlocs.

The most reasonable comment of the thread.

[Orange Joe]

It's not about the length of it, and you know it. Aside from that, I wrote ONE sentence about it. Everything else was just responding to people who felt offended by me not celebrating how progressive they are (even when we all know Blizzard only "care" when it suits them).

I'm sorry I just don't see it meeting this definition.

a display of unnecessary or excessive excitement, activity, or interest.

You might think it was unnecessary. They and the people it was directed at would disagree.

[Th3Scourge]

"presented as a woman"



If she has a vag, SHES A WOMAN.



Seriously, they should have just not said anything and no one would have cared. Instead they had to send a giant virtue signal out of the Alphabet people

[Sangris]

I'm sorry I just don't see it meeting this definition.




You might think it was unnecessary. They and the people it was directed at would disagree.

Again, I don't care about them doing it. That's completely fine and if players had issues with it and they fixed it, great. My issue is instead of just silently changing it and going their merry way, they felt the urge to announce to the entire world what a great political thing they did. Players would have noticed anyway, given praise to Blizzard for listening to feedback and noone would have given a toss. That's how it always was.

But their constant "we care" speech while doing the opposite (let's be honest, the past 12 months have been anything but great PR for Blizzard), which shows that they don't care in the slightest, is just irritating.

As @Mokuna put it well in this thread:

I think you quite don't understand the issue here, for many years we had games where the characters are sexually ambiguous, gay, transgender, sometimes you don't even know,they worked and noone complained about it being propaganda or wrong apart from maybe some real homophobic people (not the ones people here cluelessly call homophobic) that was a part of their character, not an empty shell with TRANSGENDER written on top of it.

Having your gender/sexuality/skin color being your main defining point IS the problem, that's why the comments in here are so polarized, beetween people wrongly feeling this is helping a cause and people who see it as a manipulation, that's why people in black lives matters struggled to be taken seriously when they used "i'm black" as an argument, if you want to promote transgenders in your video game you make a great character that happens to be transgender, you don't make a character and light a giant panel over his head "HEY I'M TRANSGENDER", that's low effort and just shows you're doing it for easy PR.

[Khelek]

While I find the entire thing ridiculous, lets examine it from the point of view of said community and blizz.

Blizzard creates a character that can exhibit the characteristics of a trans person within their mythos to virtue signal (I will explain in a bit why that is the case). Using the concepts present in the Shadowlands, this person transitions from female to male. Blizz decides to use the pronouns they/them probably to make the writing easier and so they don't mess up. This is reasonable (within the context of the trans community) as many do use such different pronouns rather than the traditional gendered ones.

However, a segment of that community who transitions and does change their pronouns to suit their new gender (she/her --> he/him) complain when the character does not conform to their version of a trans person and in response blizz changes the pronouns. THIS is how we know blizz is virtue signalling. They created this character to try and appease a certain community and when a segment of that community complained they swiveled 180 degrees on a dime. This shows they put no real effort into creating this character and their story, since there are segments of the trans community that do use they/them and if blizz believed in the authenticity of the character they would have stuck to their original visions. They could simply say the character was written to reflect that segment of the trans community.

By changing the pronouns, blizz is denying the humanity and existence of trans people who choose not to use traditional gendered pronouns and are therefore discriminatory and bigoted.

You see how this works? You can never please everybody, so have faith in your writing/vision for the story and don't change it to try and appease the unappeasable. This just shows blizz writing is superficial and no one is trying to create interesting engaging characters. They are trying to appease the mob and check boxes.

This character could have been an interesting take on the trans community. They have the scenario to make it viable like in Left Hand of Darkness by Ursula K. Le Guin. Sadly, they blew that opportunity.

[Orange Joe]

Again, I don't care about them doing it. That's completely fine and if players had issues with it and they fixed it, great. My issue is instead of just silently changing it and going their merry way, they felt the urge to announce to the entire world what a great political thing they did. Players would have noticed anyway, given praise to Blizzard for listening to feedback and noone would have given a toss.

But their constant "we care" speech while doing the opposite (let's be honest, the last 12 months have been everything but great PR for Blizzard), which shows that they don't care in the slightest, is just irritating.

As @Mokuna put it well in this thread:

They explained why. And going by replies to this thread there is no doubt people would have bitched without context.

The fact that you and dude you quoted think that just mentioning something about a persons race/sexuality/(insert here) means it is now there defining trait say more about you than you think.

It's a no win for them...

[Hailic]

The real issue that Blizzard will not touch is the Hong Kong situation. Hong Kong lives matter!!!!

[Sangris]

They explained why. And going by replies to this thread there is no doubt people would have bitched without context.

The fact that you and dude you quoted think that just mentioning something about a persons race/sexuality/(insert here) means it is now there defining trait say more about you than you think.

It's a no win for them...

I never said it was their defining trait. I said they used this NPC for their own PR agenda. There's also a gay male Night Elf couple that's actually playing quite a significant role in Tyrande's arc in Ardenweald. Noone cares. Noone rages because of it. And their "explanation" is just used as an excuse why they felt they had to make a bluepost about it. They obviously wouldn't blatantly scream "LOOK WHAT AN AMAZING THING WE DID!"

And if you truly went by the replies in this thread, you'd see that people have issues with them doing this for PR and nothing else.

[Th3Scourge]

Or, they knew their toxic community would see the change and throw a shit fit (they even stated as much?), which seems they are doing anyway. Lose/lose lol

No one would have gave a fuck if they had just said I was a woman in life and in death I chose to be a man. Isn't that what the afterlife is meant to be about? Instead they had to bring critical theory poison into it

It's nothing more than a blatant virtue signal, because no one actually would have noticed.

[Orange Joe]

]I never said it was their defining trait. I said they used this NPC for their own PR agenda. [/B]There's also a gay male Night Elf couple that's actually playing quite a significant role in Tyrande's arc in Ardenweald. Noone cares. Noone rages because of it. And their "explanation" is just used as an excuse why they felt they had to make a bluepost about it. They obviously wouldn't blatantly scream "LOOK WHAT AN AMAZING THING WE DID!"

And if you truly went by the replies in this thread, you'd see that people have issues with them doing this for PR and nothing else.

Did you not read who you quoted as having it right?

Having your gender/sexuality/skin color being your main defining point IS the problem,

They are changing some text in the game... That is it. Changing from them/they to he/him. If this upsets you, YOU are the problem not blizzard....

[razorpax]

oh yes,respecting how people want to be adressed is SOOOOO RAMMING!!,it must rly suck being so hateful,anyways,in my country they/them has been a thing for hundrets of years,it has always been the norm in adressing people

I mean pelagos is an npc with no feelings

[Kathranis]

288 replies over Blizzard changing a few words used by an npc ghost. People's priorities are all messed up these days.

[Justpassing]

288 replies over Blizzard changing a few words used by an npc ghost. People's priorities are all messed up these days.

288 pages soon.

[Sangris]

Did you not read who you quoted as having it right?



They are changing some text in the game... That is it. Changing from them/they to he/him. If this upsets you, YOU are the problem not blizzard....

First off, quoting someone doesn't mean that you agree with every single word of it, just the gist of it.

Secondly, some characters in recent media DO exist for only that reason, which is actually an insult to LGBTQ people as it completely reduces them to their orientation and not themselves as people

And thirdly, did you not read what I have written like 15 times already? I DON'T CARE THAT THEY ARE CHANGING THE TEXT. I care that they are using the character (and, by extension, trans people) to do some PC PR bullshit.