[Spoilers] Night elves new capital

[GreenJesus]

Sweet. Another tree that Blizzard can use for a plot point to corrupt and shit on the night elves when they want a faction war expansion.

Pin this post: In 2-4 years Nordrassil will either get corrupted or burnt down.

[Beloren]

But part of the culmination of the Long Vigil is reuniting with the world, forming part of it once again as more than sentries to a foretold invasion, so it makes sense for them to have a capital city then, and try to have one again now. Even if it's for morale rather than the actual need of a centralized power infrastructure. They could go without a capital, but a capital makes sense in terms of re-establishing themselves as part of the world.

Yeh, i don't begrudge the night elves having a capital, I don't begrudge it being beautiful either - it just can't be Suramar.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Yeh, i don't begrudge the night elves having a capital, I don't begrudge it being beautiful either - it just can't be Suramar.

There's no reason for it to be Suramar or to be anything close to Suramar.

[ravenmoon]

There's no reason for it to be Suramar or to be anything close to Suramar.

That's just silly, whatever it ends up being, it has every right to be Suramar or look like Suramar.

Off course it is mainly horde fans that disagree, but I find it quite incredulous that fans would claim that night elves cant have a night elf city or similar style because it's on the horde, when the city in question is night elven racial city where most of the night elven playable group originate from.

Talk about stealing your identity...its like telling the high elves you can have any city you want, you just cant have Silvermoon or anything close to it, never mind that's where you came from and your race built it too.

Pff

[Verdugo]

Off course it is mainly horde fans that disagree,

No, its just you that agrees.

You and your second account you like to talk with.

Infracted.

[Tanaria]

It might have every right to be Suramar, but the brutal fact is - the night elves have got no hope in hell of getting Suramar.
The Nightborne, HMT and Blood Elves are just too strong of a defense.

[Alanar]

That's just silly, whatever it ends up being, it has every right to be Suramar or look like Suramar.

Talk about stealing your identity...

No it's not, it and stealing identity.. realy dude? what have you bee trying to do for the past months here?

- - - Updated - - -

No, its just you that agrees.

You and your second account you like to talk with.

what is hes second account;o?

[Verdugo]

what is hes second account;o?

I am sure you know, the other account that posts blocks of texts about night elves.

[Illusions]

Why is it there's always like, two-three MMO-Champion users who always scream the loudest (or longest) about arcane Elves, Highborne and whatnot as if they are an equally large side now?

The Highborne were welcomed back by Tyrande, and it wasn't as if suddenly there were Highborne everywhere using arcane flippantly. The distrust still remains after the Highborne got the whole world blown up - we're only now starting to see a few signs of trust reappearing, with Mordent (think it was him?) in Darkshore being one of the generals/people who defend the bases. The Highborne holding up the portals also did them a lot of good reputation wise.

But that's not enough to suddenly reject their past and go revert back 15k years and forget all they've done thus far. They're not going to build marble structures just because Highborne are back with them. They didn't back in Darnassus either.

They built marble structures because that was their core as well, not because Highborne - the temples in Darnassus and Val'sharah are a good example of that. I'd rather wager there may be fewer marble structures now because you cannot easily build it with the help of Druids (or wisps? Though I assume wisps can help with marble structure if we look at WC3 -> Altar of Heroes), if the capitol is going to have a Highborne faction, it's not going to be an equally sizable and important group to the Druids or Priestesses or any faction of Night Elves. Maybe at most there will be a tower/spire like in Feralas.

But please, for the love of Elune, stop hijacking every thread or spamming your own threads full of tangential headcanon and 'woe-is-me they forgot Highborne' type of posts. You are not any more right for posting more words, but perhaps more people are willing to prove you wrong if you'd write more concisely.

[Shakana]

Interesting. Thanks.

[Mic_128]

That's just silly, whatever it ends up being, it has every right to be Suramar or look like Suramar.

Off course it is mainly horde fans that disagree, but I find it quite incredulous that fans would claim that night elves cant have a night elf city or similar style because it's on the horde, when the city in question is night elven racial city where most of the night elven playable group originate from.

It's where they originated from, yes. But there's been 10,000 years of cultural change since then, specifically to move away from the over-the-top use of magic in their construction, as well as working with nature to construct, rather than clearing land to do so.

[pacotaco]

It would be odd for Tyrande and Malfie Boi to choose Nordrassil as a new capital. I was under the impression that Hyjal was a place of worship for nelfs, with the druidic Moonglade and Barrow Dens at ear's distance. Thematically, Dire Maul/Eldre'thalas would have been much more fitting imo.

I would move the NElf capital to the Wyrmscar Island (Bloodmyst Isle, Azuremyst Isles):
- Gameplaywise, it would revitalize that zone, and it could be a good excuse to finally integrate it into the world, instead of being in a different instance (the Outland one)
- Lorewise, it was a NElf & green dragon city (blessed by Ysera), and it's relatively close to Teldrassil and other NElf homelands. They can make the new story about the NElves restoring the zone and the sorroundings with the help of the green dragons and the Draenei.

To mirror that, I'd move the Forsaken to the Windrunner Village(Ghostlands, Quel'thalas):
- Gameplaywise, the same reason as above: integrate the zone into the world map instead of being on a different instance (the Outland one).
- Lorewise, it's next to Lordaeron, on plagued lands, on a kingdom traditionally allied with them, and they can make the new story about the Forsaken containing the Scource forces there so they don't reach Silvemoon.

[Mace]

Why is it there's always like, two-three MMO-Champion users who always scream the loudest (or longest) about arcane Elves, Highborne and whatnot as if they are an equally large side now?

Night elf fans wanting more of this or talking about it doesn't change that, nor does it mean they want that unless they have expressly stated that - which is their right if they want.

If they talk about something they like, , they can, if you read that to mean more than they are saying, that's on you. I have been accused of screaming loudly about that, in my other topic. I am talking about the presence and arcane nature of the night elf race to show it exists to those who deny it.

I am not screaming for Highborne as if they are an equally large side, and what you would probably find out is must discussions are about those that have made incorrect assumptions about night elves and the arcane - rather than arguing whether what one fan desires for the future should happen or not.

The Highborne were welcomed back by Tyrande, and it wasn't as if suddenly there were Highborne everywhere using arcane flippantly. The distrust still remains after the Highborne got the whole world blown up - we're only now starting to see a few signs of trust reappearing, with Mordent (think it was him?) in Darkshore being one of the generals/people who defend the bases. The Highborne holding up the portals also did them a lot of good reputation wise.

And? the Highborne are still there, whether everyone trust them or not, and they are doing their thing. They are still greatly talented, gifted and adept at magic, the arcane ability of the night elf race is still as strong now as it was then - and some people like the Highborne, so requesting customisations for them or more activity from them shouldn't surprise you . There are way smaller groups that get more screen time.

Requesting screen time also is not asking for night elves to return to pre-sundering habits of the Highborne.

And the current situation is more nuanced than you are accounting for. Because Darnassian night elves are learning under the Shen'dralar and are now Highborne, do you think they are mistrusted or distrusted? Those who faithfully respected the ban for 10k years even if they were Highborne before that? what about those new night elves born after the sundering, with great arcane gifts and talents that were wasted and are only now getting training. Not guilty of any of the atrocities or abuses of the Highborne - are they worthy of being distrusted even though they are Highborne now?

In fact their number will be great than the Shen'dralar who escaped - so please tell me how night elves who chose to overcome their hate, and accept the group of Highborne who proved themselves incorruptible would be in a perpetual state of distrust towards the Highborne they've accepted?


Surely the more logical conclusion would be that the only Highborne they would trust are those that now work and live amongst them, where their priestly and druidic principles of discipline and humility (priest) and balance and harmony (druid) that are stalwart tenets would definitely affect hem and continue to be adhered by the new generation of Highborne who develop their arcane abilities and Highborne tenets of progress and development.

But that's not enough to suddenly reject their past and go revert back 15k years and forget all they've done thus far. They're not going to build marble structures just because Highborne are back with them. They didn't back in Darnassus either.

And not a person I know is saying that night elves are accepting the bad portions of their past.


No one is saying night elves using their arcane ability is a return to pre-sundering levels of usage or abuse

But if you talk about accepting/rejection of past, you have to talk about what is accepted and what is rejected. And you have to understand why certain things are rejected and won't come back, but why other things from the past would, because they were never rejected. Cities and buildings are not what's rejected. Blood line hierarchy rule, preference, reckless abuse and addiction, hubris - those are rejected - beauty, advancement, development, nice buildings or clothes, great skill and mastery, great intelligence and study - none of these things are rejected.

Now during the Long vigil, not all of these are needed.. you didn't need cities during then because it was a different purpose. Furthermore the ban on arcane practice meant certain developments couldn't take place, and the lifting of it means some of those things can once more return and be developed -but that's lifestyle changes based on situation not rejection/acceptance.

They built marble structures because that was their core as well, not because Highborne - the temples in Darnassus and Val'sharah are a good example of that. I'd rather wager there may be fewer marble structures now because you cannot easily build it with the help of Druids (or wisps? Though I assume wisps can help with marble structure if we look at WC3 -> Altar of Heroes), if the capitol is going to have a Highborne faction, it's not going to be an equally sizable and important group to the Druids or Priestesses or any faction of Night Elves. Maybe at most there will be a tower/spire like in Feralas.

I'm not saying that marble structures are built because they are Highborne (though some fans think so), I constantly point out Darnassus as a prime example that it's a racial attribute. . Many of the old cities were built by Highborne and Ancient druids working together - it doesn't mean that the style is exclusive to Highborne, but what it means is that with the caste returned, just like they handle arcane affairs, they would likely handle building affairs.

And you are likely to see the level of complexity and beauty from the sundering era, in the new cities and urban centres they build. Not just wisps, but ancients, Ancients also wield arcane magic (you have arcane ancients - see Eldre'thalas - also proof that yes Highborne and nature wielders are not mutually exclusive - just that the night elves employ this a lot more than say the blood elves do - it's one of the ways their arcane and advanced societies differ, the night elves have a lot more nature in it, they did in pre-sundering times, and they would now. ] however having a lot more nature doesn't mean arcane usage is somehow less or weaker in night elves either (this is what some horde fans think, and usually where most of the discussions and arguments tend to erupt over i.e. me, my brothers, fellow night elf friends arguing against horde Belf fans who are convinced their elf group is the most powerful and magical)

But please, for the love of Elune, stop hijacking every thread or spamming your own threads full of tangential headcanon and 'woe-is-me they forgot Highborne' type of posts. You are not any more right for posting more words, but perhaps more people are willing to prove you wrong if you'd write more concisely.

Is this meant for me? If so why don't we head over to the thread I created for the discussion, and continue there, or private message me, I'd love to see what headcanon material you are referring to.
Night Elves, Magic & the Arcane - Common Misconceptions & Things You Didn't Consider

Secondly, if suggestion and desire is the headcanon you don't want a thread you didn't make to be "hijacked" over, then perhaps you should pay attention to the thread topic and nature of it, including the OP, it's a speculation thread - so people's desires, expectations, hopes, suggestions and thoughts - all of which are opinions (as that is what those words imply ) or in your terms "headcanon" is basically what this thread is about. If that annoys you, then why respond to a thread that's by default going to be based on that.

If you want a more factual discussion, head over to my topic. But I would ask you to refrain from slurring and insulting posters, people are quite free there to project into the future and post theories they have, and I want them to have the freedom to do so without being harassed and insulted.

.

[Hellspawn]

I would move the NElf capital to the Wyrmscar Island (Bloodmyst Isle, Azuremyst Isles):
- Gameplaywise, it would revitalize that zone, and it could be a good excuse to finally integrate it into the world, instead of being in a different instance (the Outland one)
- Lorewise, it was a NElf & green dragon city (blessed by Ysera), and it's relatively close to Teldrassil and other NElf homelands. They can make the new story about the NElves restoring the zone and the sorroundings with the help of the green dragons and the Draenei.

To mirror that, I'd move the Forsaken to the Windrunner Village(Ghostlands, Quel'thalas):
- Gameplaywise, the same reason as above: integrate the zone into the world map instead of being on a different instance (the Outland one).
- Lorewise, it's next to Lordaeron, on plagued lands, on a kingdom traditionally allied with them, and they can make the new story about the Forsaken containing the Scource forces there so they don't reach Silvemoon.

I'm very much against to move the night elfs of the mainland. Also if you look around in Hyjal, there are a lot of night elfs stone ruins so they clearly lived there at some point. Most worshipping is done on the shirnes which are not directly at Nordrassil. So its similar to Zuldazar where all the loa shrines are around the city. Also they got all of their nature allies there and from a player perspective it would be also more central point to the other Alliance cities we have/had on Kalimdor. Wyrmscar Island is probably the most boring choice near and on Kalimdor, it has nothing going for it and yields no interesting or thematic story development.

Same for the Windrunner Village. There is literally no reason to settle for the Forsaken there unless they suddenly feel nostalgic for the Windrunners, which I very much doubt. Making the Forsaken the meat shield for the blood elfs sounds unlikely, they probably have their own story going that has nothing to do with the blood elfs for the most part.

[Mace]

It's where they originated from, yes. But there's been 10,000 years of cultural change since then, specifically to move away from the over-the-top use of magic in their construction, as well as working with nature to construct, rather than clearing land to do so.

Night elves banned magical use altogether, they didn't go oh we're moving away from arcane magical use in our construction whether you consider it over the top or not (by the way over-the-top ifs your interpretation, the night elves viewed it as wondrous - see WC3 manual, see Chronicles account). All arcane magic was banned, not moved away from in the Long vigil group, and the city groups (i.e. Eldre'thalas and Suramar built nothing new, they stayed in already built cities) There was no "moved way from the so called "over-the-top use of magic" in their construction" - There are things the Long vigil moved away from and outright changed, there are things they completely banned like magic to prevent the return of the Legion, but now use again.


Not once was it ever stated, or implied or shown that arcane magic in their construction was "moved away from". there is going to be no arcane magic for construction when it is banned, but when it returns, there is no reason it isn't or shouldn't be used. Both ancients and Highborne they currently have can use arcane, magic and nature to build. Those pre-sundering cities, including Suramar and Zin'Azshari were built combining nature and arcane magic (wielded by Ancients and Highborne), I'm sure lots of arcane magic was used in their creation, nature too - I don't think it's the arcane magic that was over-the-top, not compared to the wonders they were doing, nor do I think that is what they had a problem with or viewed as bad or abusive - (iti s not this that calls the Legion, or leads to the character change or greed for power that leads to allying the Legion, nor do these wonders to any harm or wrong). I'll explain below. The architectural design might be viewed as over-the top or extravagant, but I don't think that was bad or viewed badly either. A druid might disagree ofc, but then for him nature is the extravagance he delights in, not the craftsmanship of a builder or potter or tailor and while he is fine with the simplicity of buildings and attire, others aren't - an architect or tailor is not going to build like druids build or design clothes like they do. If you think about it, you'd realise he shows as much love for grand beauty and extravagance as the non-druid (whether Highborne or craftsman or priest) does , it's just that his grand beauty is in nature, and guess what he iuses his magic to enahcne and develop it further into greater beauty - he does so in a way that's natural and not dismissive of the lifeforms, but he does that to astonishingly great length, just like the architect highborne or tailor craftsman night elf would do with buildings or clothes. The same elven love for beauty and grace, just for different objects of affection.


Things Moved Away from by Night Elves - An In-depth look
See Night Elves, Magic & the Arcane - Common Misconceptions & Things You Didn't Consider for detailed discussions:


I think 2 issues are conflated here. What exactly did the Darnassians move away from, and what has returned? Culture, society, these are generalised words to mean a host of different things, that change and morph to varying degrees based on events, especially major events, changes, attitudes, but lifestyle changes, behavioural ones some based on a true character reform but others forced by circumstances. we must go into a little more detail to determine what is happening with these peoples. So we can make more informed observations and predictions.

Reckless
The only thing I am certain night elves have moved away from is reckless and abusive use of magic - reckless implies taking irresponsible dangerous risks that aren't necessary but done out of your ambition for more power - - opening the portals for demons to flood your world is one such example. Abusive use of magic is a callous disregard for properly handling and using something - usually abuse is observed when the result of such use produces something detrimental, undesirably bad, dangerous or destructive. an example of abusive use was the Nightborne using the arcane for food, wasting a lot of magic you didn't need to use to make party poppers.

Abusive
Abusive lifestyle wasn't limited to magical use, many other abusive ways of living is observed in wealthy people who use their wealth frivolously and callously in the face of oppression, starvation and clear lack - this behaviour is labelled decadent, and it's an excess and opulence that is undesirable.

Excess
Notice that abundance, great wealth, lavish beauty are not considered the evils of ecess as such, only when the people using these do so in a detrimental way, un-necessarily criminally wasteful way or abuse oftheir authority - it's not having authority that's bad or having great authority it's when you abuse said authority to disadvantage, manipulate, cheat, steal from others. Use your magic constantly on whims that you could have done easily via other means - that can be considered abuse when magical use is precious and sacred, it is not abuse to use your magica skilfully to create a beautiful and intricate work of art - is beautiful artwork abuse? But if you employ your magic to make 40 palaces for yourself in every square and hten fill them with wealth - now that's abusive excess that is considered decadent and opulent.


Night elves creating beautiful forests and flower gardens or beautiful buildings and temples is not an abuse of magic Nor is having wealth and abundance - being callous with your magic, taking dangerous risks you don't need to in pursuit of power is - usually the motive and attitude are as much determinants, but the judge is really the result - if ingesting arcane magic was actually truly beneficial it would not be considered an abuse, but it wasn't, Using arcane magic at the expense of normal natural activity is an imbalance.

It's like eating food, eating food is actually good and beneficial, but abusing it is over eating, it gets you obese, unhealthy, if you do nothing but eat food, instead of exercising, and cultivating your mental and spiritual health in a balanced lifestyle you become unhealthy and as such you are abusing magic. Making delicious foods that look beautiful and yummy is not an abuse, over indulging in that by constantly eating the food is unhealthy and using it to impoverish others or destroy them..that's abusive.


Using your authority to force others to make your lavish banquets to indulge your vanity or status is abusive, making a lavish beautiful banquet is not, there are good occasions for that when it is warranted, but doing it all the time, is that really warranted?


The State of Affairs
You can clearly see that it's the abuse, addiction and recklessness that goes out, all the unfair attitudes and behaviours as well as structures (like blood line hierarchies) is what would have been moved away from intentionally. This is not ht same as banning the arcane which they did for a fixed purpose , as well as living in isolation, having no cities - these are things that were done for the long vigil, and such things necessitate a different lifestyle. when the vigil ends, then needs for cities return, there is no need to ban the arcane so it will return with it's conveniences and advantages. It is up to the night elves to stay way from the attitudes of excessive reckless abuse and addiction - and this doesn't just stand for arcane magic, it stands for all magic, any substance any attitude and behaviour including civil authority and power.

If abuse, arrogance and addiction limited to arcane over-indulgence? ofc not, there was no arcane when the night elves arrogantly grew Teldrassil to restore their immortality - but then some viewed that as arrogance others viewed it as something they deserved and within their right as part of their identity.

Moving away from the pre-sundering culture - doesn't mean moving away from building marble or beautiful structures.

Further, building with nature is not the only things night elves do, now or during the long vigil or during the pre-sundering era, they built with arcane magic, and this is not banned or looked down open - all reports is that they loved their wondrous cities and civilization.. those are not the things they hated. Highborne arrogance, addiction, and abusing their magical well.. you can see what was considered such when you read the War of the ancients - the night elves, even some Highborne are grumbling that the Queen is going too far with how their using the well, - they notice the bubbling of the waters increasing more and more furiously, and they think the y hare going to far.. they don't think this about their wonderful cities and civilization - that's not what they are referring to. We are given context.

[pacotaco]

I'm very much against to move the night elfs of the mainland. Also if you look around in Hyjal, there are a lot of night elfs stone ruins so they clearly lived there at some point. Most worshipping is done on the shirnes which are not directly at Nordrassil. So its similar to Zuldazar where all the loa shrines are around the city. Also they got all of their nature allies there and from a player perspective it would be also more central point to the other Alliance cities we have/had on Kalimdor. Wyrmscar Island is probably the most boring choice near and on Kalimdor, it has nothing going for it and yields no interesting or thematic story development.

Same for the Windrunner Village. There is literally no reason to settle for the Forsaken there unless they suddenly feel nostalgic for the Windrunners, which I very much doubt. Making the Forsaken the meat shield for the blood elfs sounds unlikely, they probably have their own story going that has nothing to do with the blood elfs for the most part.

The problem with doing Hyjal a new capital is that it's currently a neutral leveling hub. That creates a lot of technical and gameplay problems.
It's not like Zuldazar at all in the sense that it's an island, cut from the rest of the world map, and dessigned to be a Horde hub, with some minor side quest for the Alliance.

Meanwhile, what I propose has not this problem, because they're already Alliance and Horde starting zones, they're not yet integrated to the world (so they can make some changes when they do it to allow flying) and they're very underused.

About the Forsaken, the description text after Shadowlands changed to reflect that the new Forsaken don't look for vengeance as their only focus in undead, but they (un)live to protect the living.

[Hellspawn]

The problem with doing Hyjal a new capital is that it's currently a neutral leveling hub. That creates a lot of technical and gameplay problems.
It's not like Zuldazar at all in the sense that it's an island, cut from the rest of the world map, and dessigned to be a Horde hub, with some minor side quest for the Alliance.

Meanwhile, what I propose has not this problem, because they're already Alliance and Horde starting zones, they're not yet integrated to the world (so they can make some changes when they do it to allow flying) and they're very underused.

About the Forsaken, the description text after Shadowlands changed to reflect that the new Forsaken don't look for vengeance as their only focus in undead, but they (un)live to protect the living.

Who cares if its currently a neutral Zone currently its mostly like that because its a leveling Zone from Cataclysm and it is unchanged since then. You know, the currently pretty much hostile Tyrande, Malfurion and their army is already there, so lore wise it is not neutral anymore to begin with.

It also does not matter at all that there is already a start Zone on the Isle. First of the old content is in another phase and they would still have Teldrassil. And if they actually really revamp Azeroth they can restructure the entire thing anyways, that would be a different discussion, but in short, with level scaling they don't need specific Zones. Also they already got a new starting experience and I doubt they will go back to individual ones even if they do a revamp.
Phasing is no problem since Darkshore is already phased and Teldrassil too, so I don't see a problem to make a phase for a new main hub in Hyjal.
The new night elf capital can't be used for cataclysm leveling anyways, so this entire point is a no-starter

The text you referencing regarding the undead was changed, nothing about protecting the living in there anymore. Now it says more something about crafting their own future.

[Mic_128]

Not once was it ever stated, or implied or shown that arcane magic in their construction was "moved away from". there is going to be no arcane magic for construction when it is banned, but when it returns, there is no reason it isn't or shouldn't be used.

Aside from the fact that the Highborne that have rejoined Night Elven society are incredibly mistrusted, to the point the Wardens were trying to pick them off one-by-one. That and Tyrande's obvious distaste about the Nightborne's society. That's like always being against pink houses, finally make up with your brother that had a pink house, disowning your cousin for owning a pink house, telling them "Pink houses are bad and you're dumb for that" and then going and building a brand new pink house yourself.

Maybe if there was any sort of slow development of them coming around to the Highborne, of Night Elven society starting to return to the arcane - but that's not what's happened. It would be incredibly jarring and against every part of their characterisation over the last what, 15 years?

[Hellspawn]

Aside from the fact that the Highborne that have rejoined Night Elven society are incredibly mistrusted, to the point the Wardens were trying to pick them off one-by-one. That and Tyrande's obvious distaste about the Nightborne's society. That's like always being against pink houses, finally make up with your brother that had a pink house, disowning your cousin for owning a pink house, telling them "Pink houses are bad and you're dumb for that" and then going and building a brand new pink house yourself.

Maybe if there was any sort of slow development of them coming around to the Highborne, of Night Elven society starting to return to the arcane - but that's not what's happened. It would be incredibly jarring and against every part of their characterisation over the last what, 15 years?

Without the Highborn there would not have beens portal to flee from the burning Teldrassil. Also there is a small interaction between the Shen'dralar leader and Maiev in the Darkshore Warfront. It is clearly not hostile its more that Maiev is a maybe a bit annoyed that the Highborne overstates his importance in the attack.
The Shen'dralar also helped during Cataclysm to cleans Felwood. So personally I would say there are still differences, but that enables also storytelling and development.

[ravenmoon]

No it's not, it and stealing identity.. realy dude? what have you bee trying to do for the past months here?

It's not stealing when it is part of your identity and is from that part of it, that's still around too. Nightborne share Night elf things as a night elf sub-race, just like Highmountain share their cultural facets from the tauren, and Darkspears share what they have from the Zandalari, it's not unique to the Darkspear, it originates from the Zandalari and the Zandalari still have it.

Night elven Highborne development, or living in Suramar or a Suramar looking city is not stealing identity from Nightborne at all,. Now if Night elves were given Nightborne features not part of night elf lore, like those upturned ears or chrono magic mastery - then you could say that's stealing, because those are Nightborne developments not from the time as Kaldorei.

As you see, Nightborne have many many things that are night elven, should we accuse them of stealing them? then why does night elves having similar on their wing is now suddenly stealing - ? Is not you stating that the actual theft attempt ? Because you know Suramar and the arcane legacy there is night elven, but you are now of the position it's not night elven or shouldn't be there, that's stealing.

- - - Updated - - -

It's where they originated from, yes. But there's been 10,000 years of cultural change since then, specifically to move away from the over-the-top use of magic in their construction, as well as working with nature to construct, rather than clearing land to do so.

Are you saying that use of magic in their construction can't return because they moved away from it? Then why did moving out of isolation, building cities, using arcane magic, interacting with other races all occur? These are all things night elves moved away from whether in small or over the top measures.