Would removing the wow token be better for the health of the game?

[oplawlz]

While you're correct that it's not going to happen, i would be in favor of this change.
This was okay back when boosting was a niche thing, when only a handful of people on the server could even afford to pay a top end guild to drag them through a raid.

But now, it's a damn business, probably one that even has shady RMT side activities going on.

The argument "it's always been allowed" simply doesn't have the same pull when the game has changed this much on this front.

I would actually argue that it was okay until the token was added. As soon as an officially sanctioned real money value was attached to in game currency this should have been disallowed.

[Gaidax]

Then I'd just buy gold, like I did back in past.

No thanks, I'd rather have token so I can toss a hundred eurobucks at Blizz and have myself covered gold-wise for half a year for all the character upkeep and crap.

I don't have much time aside from 2 days per week for raiding nowadays, so I am happy I can just sell token and buy all the mats and shit I ever need from AH and some odd BoE and not bother with gathering crap or trying to make gold.

[Adamas102]

There is far more negattives than posittives. Lot of people what claims they play becouse of token mostly just lie in order to defend token existence. But if Blizzard would remove it they would complain, maybe like unsub for month or two and in moment anger will be gone they will sub again with real money. Nobady will quit their guild, friends and game they enyoj becouse they cant pay for it with gold. Its made up myth to justify token existence.

There might be some people like that, but speaking for myself (and I’m sure I’m not the only one) I would 100% quit the game if I couldn’t pay the sub with gold. No anger about it, I just don’t think WoW is worth a real money sub.

It’s impossible to say how many people would quit and how many would return, but there is a certainty that the WoW token increase the number of subs.

[Doffen]

There is far more negattives than posittives. Lot of people what claims they play becouse of token mostly just lie in order to defend token existence. But if Blizzard would remove it they would complain, maybe like unsub for month or two and in moment anger will be gone they will sub again with real money. Nobady will quit their guild, friends and game they enyoj becouse they cant pay for it with gold. Its made up myth to justify token existence.

I wouldn't have started WoW again even if it wasn't for the token. So how dare you try to undermine peoples opinions and how they want to finance their sub by saying they are lying just to justify its existence? Come on. As an example, I would not have played WoW at all the last three months because BfA is not worth the money. I rather buy another game instead(which I did seeing tokens are "free" for me but now that sub stop to prepatch, bye guildies) And I am far from being the only one. I gave a guildie of me gold to buy sub for a month once. He wouldn't have raided with us that month if it wasn't for that and for me it was just a few gold I really didn't need. WoW Token gives players options.

Btw, you are a person who really likes classic I've gathered. You know people play retail to get gold so they can pay for their sub so they can play classic right? People who had quit WoW but had enough gold to buy tokens to play classic. Its boosting subs for both version. How thats not a good thing? The positives outweight the negatives by quite a bit in that regard.

By all means, I wouldn't care if you just said that you think its not good for the game. But people are not lying just because they think differently than you. There are certainly some issues whether you buy gold from blizz or from a hacker/botter. But one is clearly better than the other.

[RemasteredClassic]

At this point wow needs to go f2p if it continues the way it has been going...or risk losing its entire remaining playerbase to nw.

Have you seen sir medieval’s latest video? Looks incredible and the likes and comments tell me this game will finally give us mmorpg fans what we have been asking from blizzard to no avail.

Wow’s Job is not to make players happy or have fun, but to legally steal their money.

[agentsi]

How does that work with personal loot and M+? Is it and all leather run? Do you just eat shit if you get unlucky?

Pretty much, usually though if its a funnel run you get 1-2 pieces plus the 475. I did it two weeks in a row, only 150k each week, and got REALLY lucky. All slots but 2 are 465/470/475.

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Guess you didn't go to the right sites lol

I've only ever used one site, because its the safest one out there. If there is a really cheap one, probably high risk of getting banned.

[Onikaroshi]

The difference here is, it was at least against the rules and Blizzard attempted to stop it. I know people that tried to buy gold in TBC and were banned, and that thought of losing your account was enough to stop most people doing it.

They must have been pretty stupid about it, blizzard barely ever bans for gold buying.

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I've only ever used one site, because its the safest one out there. If there is a really cheap one, probably high risk of getting banned.

My old site, that I never got banned for using, is about 14 bucks for 121k, which is what you get for 20 legally.

[h4rr0d]

The question I keep wondering about is, who the hell is buying all this crap with money? Who spends the equivalent of $40 to buy an offhand weapon with the right corruption?

I also wonder about how reliable a revenue stream that is. In game I used to go nuts farming for the best boes and darkmoon trinks etc. but I eventually stopped because I got good enough that they weren't important.

$40 is equivalent to an hour (or even less) of IRL work for quite a few people, mythic ilvl offhand is going to give their toon insane boost. Great stuff if they want to start running 15s with their fresh alt. And as a sidenote, these will save some time doing the daily chores thanks to the boost, so in case of people with billable hours, you can even talk about return on investment here.

Edit: For me personally, I'm getting paid in different currency than what I need in my country, so I have to exchange money as part of my revenue stream. I can have or not have $100 overnight based on stuff I have no control of, so spending half that to actually have some fun feels pretty justified.

[Tiwack]

Yes, the very existence of it is testament to their defeat in attempting to control their own games currency. Maybe in the future with the help of AI it'll be possible to remove the token while also punishing anyone attempting to sell boosts/gold ingame. Still probably years out and as such we're doomed to make due with it.

[agentsi]

They must have been pretty stupid about it, blizzard barely ever bans for gold buying.

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My old site, that I never got banned for using, is about 14 bucks for 121k, which is what you get for 20 legally.

It's roughly the same for me as well, but they started charging tax and fees, so its like $16-17.

[Witchblade77]

I think it would decrease it but I could be wrong. I know before the token while carries existed it was never close to the extent of their prevalence afterwards.

It tended to be reserved for high rollers and ah mongrels. I don't know if removing the token would change that now. A lot of players are sitting on hordes of gold from wod and a lesser extent mop when broken farming methods run rampant.

Eventually I think those reserves will be exhausted but I can't say if carries would vanish or simply become cheaper as a result.

the most carries I've ever bought was back in wrath. ok, it was gold DKP runs, but nonetheless, you PAID to participate and paid WELL. i used to participate in one every week, and there were people who paid obscene amounts of money for certain weapons, etc. that was long LONG before token. years before.

when you brought up WoD - THAT. THAT is where the real issues began. you could generate so much gold for so little effort back then... and i say that as someone who benefited greatly from garrisons. but as i said, the problem is NOT the token, token merely allowed for that gold to be shifted between players a lot more, a lot safer then gold selling sites. the problem was WoD's insanely easy generation of gold, followed by legions slightly harder but still considerable generation of gold, and that whole raid soloing for a good chunk as well, followed by BFA that has its own methods to generate gold through gaemplay maybe not with as little effort as before, but still.

[Onikaroshi]

the most carries I've ever bought was back in wrath. ok, it was gold DKP runs, but nonetheless, you PAID to participate and paid WELL. i used to participate in one every week, and there were people who paid obscene amounts of money for certain weapons, etc. that was long LONG before token. years before.

when you brought up WoD - THAT. THAT is where the real issues began. you could generate so much gold for so little effort back then... and i say that as someone who benefited greatly from garrisons. but as i said, the problem is NOT the token, token merely allowed for that gold to be shifted between players a lot more, a lot safer then gold selling sites. the problem was WoD's insanely easy generation of gold, followed by legions slightly harder but still considerable generation of gold, and that whole raid soloing for a good chunk as well, followed by BFA that has its own methods to generate gold through gaemplay maybe not with as little effort as before, but still.

Yea, and the tokens themselves aren't really harmful to the economy, at least not anywhere near as much as bots are. The tokens don't create gold (well, they may create a SMALL amount in certain circumstances but in the same vein they can also remove gold), but bots with hacked accounts selling chinese gold actually create raw gold a lot of the time farming vendor trash 24/7

[DemonDays]

The token put a real life money price tag on every item and most achievements in the game. Of course it is bad. Very, very bad.

Thread is over on the first page.

By every definition of the term - WoW is pay2win.

You can buy any prestigious achievement, power gain, mount or armour set in the game with real money. Straight into Blizzards pockets.

[Hablion]

With me the only reason I am able to play wow is because of the token. If it was to go away I would have to resort to seeing if any friends can gift game time for gold (which by tos would be wrong) if i wanted to continue my time playing. I love this game but for some money is tight and for me this game is the only form of entertainment I have. I can see why people are frustrated to some degree and my reason maybe selfish but that my personal take on it.

[Lefrog]

Thread is over on the first page.

By every definition of the term - WoW is pay2win.

You can buy any prestigious achievement, power gain, mount or armour set in the game with real money. Straight into Blizzards pockets.

I’ve never played a game that wasn’t by this definition, as I’ve sold entire accounts since accounts were a thing.

Half the definition of pay2win is you have the win at something. I’m ok with letting a random person win at having a mount or achievement. It doesn’t really impact what I am here for or want.

Buying OP corruption gear crossed that line. You could buy your way into a raid or pvp kill by being worse off then some peers with bad rng. I would argue though, that very few times in WoW history has gold ever given you a “real” edge against better players. The beauty of WoW is that for those few times where you can buy a kill, it will only ever be temporary as power increases fairly often. You can buy carries all you want, but that will never make a bad player good. That gear edge is often times negligible, and very temporary.

[Monster Hunter]

The token put a real life money price tag on every item and most achievements in the game. Of course it is bad. Very, very bad.

Bollocks, those things allready had real money price tags befor the token, all the token did was bring regulation to it under blizzards umbrella instead of being dictated by the Chinese gold Market.

People will and always will be willing to pay real money for gold, that won't change, the question is do you want that exchange rate set by blizz or a black market, and how OK are you with huge botting problems.

[DemonDays]

Bollocks, those things allready had real money price tags befor the token, all the token did was bring regulation to it under blizzards umbrella instead of being dictated by the Chinese gold Market.

People will and always will be willing to pay real money for gold, that won't change, the question is do you want that exchange rate set by blizz or a black market, and how OK are you with huge botting problems.

Before it was "illegal" and could easily lead to losing your entire 15 year old account.

Now it's totally legitimate. In-game automated shop for buying gold.

The game is pay2win LEGITIMATELY now.

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I’ve never played a game that wasn’t by this definition, as I’ve sold entire accounts since accounts were a thing.

Half the definition of pay2win is you have the win at something. I’m ok with letting a random person win at having a mount or achievement. It doesn’t really impact what I am here for or want.

Buying OP corruption gear crossed that line. You could buy your way into a raid or pvp kill by being worse off then some peers with bad rng. I would argue though, that very few times in WoW history has gold ever given you a “real” edge against better players. The beauty of WoW is that for those few times where you can buy a kill, it will only ever be temporary as power increases fairly often. You can buy carries all you want, but that will never make a bad player good. That gear edge is often times negligible, and very temporary.

Exactly. BoE Corruption gear just sealed the deal.

The way WoW is currently designed is that bad players can absolutely do good DPS with 70%+ of their damage coming from random sources.

[kaminaris]

Before it was "illegal" and could easily lead to losing your entire 15 year old account.

Now it's totally legitimate. In-game automated shop for buying gold.

The game is pay2win LEGITIMATELY now.

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Exactly. BoE Corruption gear just sealed the deal.

The way WoW is currently designed is that bad players can absolutely do good DPS with 70%+ of their damage coming from random sources.

Thats bullshit. Before blizzard implemented some security measures against RMT in last year you could safely buy gold from 3rd party websites. With no fucking risk whatsoever unless you were extremely dumb and admitted yourself.

I have couple of acquaintances that still buy gold from those and never got ban or anything.

My pre-pre-previous guild was doing RMT for like 3-4 expansions where milion of gold was actually a lot of money and nobody even got a warning or suspension.
Vanilla -> Wotlk was RMT paradise. Then it got a bit worse.

Also boe didn't change shit. Your relative power is what matters, relative power to max and you could always buy that.

And no, nobody can do 70% of their dps coming from random sources. Corruption is nothing more than a enchants to gear that gives equivalent of +50-200 ilvl.

[Alkizon]

It was... hmm... there it is.

[dacoolist]

Before it was "illegal" and could easily lead to losing your entire 15 year old account.

Now it's totally legitimate. In-game automated shop for buying gold.

The game is pay2win LEGITIMATELY now.

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Exactly. BoE Corruption gear just sealed the deal.

The way WoW is currently designed is that bad players can absolutely do good DPS with 70%+ of their damage coming from random sources.

The game was pay2win in vanilla - just because you didnt play back then doesn’t mean players werent selling runs for gold: which they have been since vanilla.

Sucks to find out the games been this way since the beginning - Don’t worry tho, keep on preaching lol