Why so much hate for Tinkerer?

[Irian]

MMO-C is not a good way to gauge popularity of an idea, this site is an echo chamber of hatred and negativity. There are some people who seriously never shut up about tinkers on this forum and this has created a negative attitude towards the idea as a whole here.

In truth, tinker is probably a pretty popular idea and would be well received if they did it. Just not gnome/goblin only for the love of god.

[EllieNora]

Short answer - Engineering exists.

Plus tinker here means "Going for a shit."

[Scrysis]

Except none of that would happen. A class' abilities don't effect what gets added to a profession.

100% would happen because in some cases, it already has. Metamorphosis originally belonged to Demo warlocks. They took it away and gave it to Demon hunters. Go back and look at engineering over the years. Exploding mechanical sheep, alarm bots, bombs, mechanical battle chickens and dragons. . . those sound like class abilities, but they're not. They're engineering trinkets and gizmos. In some cases, Blizzard revisits an idea from a previous expansion and updates it for engineering. So those things don't always stay in the expansion that they're introduced.

i'd gladly trade the engineering profession for an engineering themed class seeing as blizz doesn't seem to want the professions to matter.

Well, I've got news for you! Blizzard has heard yours and everyone else's complaint about professions, and they're doing a whole bunch with them come Shadowlands! As a matter of fact, they're literally core to your progression as you'll need profession-crafted components to make your legendaries. Rejoice!

[Lex Icon]

100% would happen because in some cases, it already has. Metamorphosis originally belonged to Demo warlocks. They took it away and gave it to Demon hunters. Go back and look at engineering over the years. Exploding mechanical sheep, alarm bots, bombs, mechanical battle chickens and dragons. . . those sound like class abilities, but they're not. They're engineering trinkets and gizmos. In some cases, Blizzard revisits an idea from a previous expansion and updates it for engineering. So those things don't always stay in the expansion that they're introduced.



Well, I've got news for you! Blizzard has heard yours and everyone else's complaint about professions, and they're doing a whole bunch with them come Shadowlands! As a matter of fact, they're literally core to your progression as you'll need profession-crafted components to make your legendaries. Rejoice!

well that's something i suppose.. but i feel i've heard that before so i guess wait and see?.

[Whitedragon]

It sounds ridiculous. The fantasy of all the classes make sense, except for tinkers, and if I’m being completely honest we need another caster class first. They’ve introduced 3 melee classes since WoW began, and I’d like them to introduce another magical caster class to balance it out. Every time someone brings up tinker all I see in my head is robots and guns. It’s a boring concept.

Boring? As apposed to what most seem to be hoping for in the necromancer? A dark/death welding class that is almost wholly covered by death knights and warlocks?
What will stand out more, a guy in a warbot mech using a flamethrower and rockets, Or another cloth equipped caster shooting Shadow bolt re skins while summoning Deathknight pets in a demonoloy off shot play style... It gets even worse when one considers that 2 out of the 3 classes that have been added are already heavy Dark/Edgy Antihero class fantasy archetypes. Can it be made? yes. is it also a way more thematically covered concept then inventor? Also yes.

If you are one of the few who is actually hoping for a caster class that isn't just cloth DK+, then I would agree that could work okay, and maybe they could indeed come up with something not currently mostly covered so far, but otherwise I have to disagree.

[Elim Garak]

What will stand out more, a guy in a warbot mech using a flamethrower and rockets,

I don't want that ever in a group environment. Big and noisy with VFX half the screen in size. Not to mention SEVERAL of them.

[Aggressive]

Boring? As apposed to what most seem to be hoping for in the necromancer? A dark/death welding class that is almost wholly covered by death knights and warlocks?
What will stand out more, a guy in a warbot mech using a flamethrower and rockets, Or another cloth equipped caster shooting Shadow bolt re skins while summoning Deathknight pets in a demonoloy off shot play style... It gets even worse when one considers that 2 out of the 3 classes that have been added are already heavy Dark/Edgy Antihero class fantasy archetypes. Can it be made? yes. is it also a way more thematically covered concept then inventor? Also yes.

If you are one of the few who is actually hoping for a caster class that isn't just cloth DK+, then I would agree that could work okay, and maybe they could indeed come up with something not currently mostly covered so far, but otherwise I have to disagree.

Whether we like it not, another class IS coming. I, too, want it to be a caster class. The last 3 classes introduced have ALL been melee. But for all those people bitching about how Blizzard should not introduce another class cause of balance, well cry more. This game will NEVER be balanced...EVER. So get use to it or find another game. Believe it or not their are some of us that would like to have another class introduced into this game. And it would be cool if it was a caster like Necromancer, Witch doctor, or sorcerer. Just not another fucking melee for the love of God

[Phaelia]

Boring? As apposed to what most seem to be hoping for in the necromancer? A dark/death welding class that is almost wholly covered by death knights and warlocks?
What will stand out more, a guy in a warbot mech using a flamethrower and rockets, Or another cloth equipped caster shooting Shadow bolt re skins while summoning Deathknight pets in a demonoloy off shot play style... It gets even worse when one considers that 2 out of the 3 classes that have been added are already heavy Dark/Edgy Antihero class fantasy archetypes. Can it be made? yes. is it also a way more thematically covered concept then inventor? Also yes.

If you are one of the few who is actually hoping for a caster class that isn't just cloth DK+, then I would agree that could work okay, and maybe they could indeed come up with something not currently mostly covered so far, but otherwise I have to disagree.

I never said anything about it being a necromancer, I just want another caster.

[Teriz]

100% would happen because in some cases, it already has. Metamorphosis originally belonged to Demo warlocks. They took it away and gave it to Demon hunters. Go back and look at engineering over the years. Exploding mechanical sheep, alarm bots, bombs, mechanical battle chickens and dragons. . . those sound like class abilities, but they're not. They're engineering trinkets and gizmos. In some cases, Blizzard revisits an idea from a previous expansion and updates it for engineering. So those things don't always stay in the expansion that they're introduced.

Uh, neither Warlocks or Demon Hunters are professions, they’re both classes. Engineering is a profession, so a Tinker class wouldn’t negatively effect it, much less steal abilities from it (since engineering has no abilities).

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I never said anything about it being a necromancer, I just want another caster.

Good luck finding a magic type that isn’t covered by an existing class.

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Short answer - Engineering exists.

Engineering isn’t a class, and it contains none of the Tinker hero’s abilities.

[Aucald]

This thread needs to settle itself - drop the name-calling and vitriol, and focus on the topic at hand without rancor.

[Nephys]

I really don't understand a community that hates variety so much. A technical based class with steampunk vibes is usually a staple in many fantasy games and its a clear missing component in WoW despite the myriad of technologies the world offers. Yet anytime someone suggests a desire for the class or even comes up with creative ways to implement it half the community it seems nearly has a stroke with the amount of rage they bring.
I mean in reality it doesn't have to be called tinkerer, but i do think the game would benefit from a class that embodies a mechanical steam punk type vibe.

I think that people like me hate the tinker class merely because of aestethics. That steampunk vibe can be interesting but the aestethics that we would get for tinkers would be awful, warcraft's style for mechas is so ugly. We got improvements with mechagon and mechagnomes, but it is still the same style, so unless they completely revamp the style I would vote against it. Something else that could solve this problem is make Tinkers from races other than gnomes and goblins, but that would take a lot of effort. I would actually like Nightborne Tinkers, or even Draenei, as I am sure others would as well.

[Capultro]

I wish they'd scrap Engineering as a profession since *so* many of its previously unique QoL features are now available w/o being an Engineer, and they could give the tools of it to a Tinker instead. Some of the still kinda important stuff like Hunter scopes would be made by another profession instead (maybe Blacksmith? Hell maybe even Enchanters could make the "enchant" and the scopes are a vendor item; you attach the enchant to the scope). Teleporter items would become a quest you can do to permanently unlock it (like Winterspring, Tanaris, etc).

I also think Tinker could dabble in old, scrapped, Alchemy recipes, like old regen pots and whatnot. It could get a healing spec that is essentially a mix of Engineer from TF2 with a mix of Alchemy stuff like throwing potions on the ground to cause AoE healing, throwing potions at people to heal them, and other science-y stuff that you could use to heal.

Tinker would be an awesome class. Tank, Healer, Ranged.

not mor tank,healer classes please.3 dps specs are very better....

[Ielenia]

Except I’m talking about Gameplay, not lore.

You're talking gameplay, and treating it as if it is lore. There has absolutely zero distinctions between the two in the lore.

[Capultro]

It's vapid, shallow and totally irrelevant but I hate the fucking word Tinker.

hate is nice,die tinkers!!!!!!wiuld be nice hve tinkers for killthem with our demon hunters

[Teriz]

You're talking gameplay, and treating it as if it is lore. There has absolutely zero distinctions between the two in the lore.

I’m talking about gameplay in the context that a profession doesn’t offer the same gameplay opportunities as a class. Thus saying that you can just roll engineering to experience gameplay similar to the Tinker hero from WC3 or like Mekkatorque in WoW is utter nonsense.

Also the notion that Professions are the same as classes in lore is also utter nonsense. I don’t see groups of Blacksmiths or herbalists running around punching monsters in the face.

[A Chozo]

Short answer - Engineering exists.

So did Demonology Warlocks, and that didn't stop Blizzard at all.

Y'all who think Tinkers wouldn't happen because of Engineering are sorely lacking on the creativity department. Tinkers could have three specs about Golemancy, Chemistry and Envisioning, being playable by several races like Gnomes, Undead, Mag'har Orcs and Lightforged Draenei. It won't be Engineering that will stop Blizzard should they ever desire to make playable Tinkers.

Gameplay is not lore.

The gameplay is the default lore until pointed out otherwise, varying per case. People like Gazlowe and Mekkatorque can be tinkers, so it's possible to make it a class.

[Teriz]

hate is nice,die tinkers!!!!!!wiuld be nice hve tinkers for killthem with our demon hunters

Yeah, have a 5v5 of Tinkers versus DHs.

Unfortunately the Tinkers would win because they would likely have a healing spec.

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The gameplay is the default lore until pointed out otherwise, varying per case.

It's amazing how certain people can't get that through their heads.

[A Chozo]

It's amazing how certain people can't get that through their heads.

I mean, if this were Overwatch, I would say to consider the game flat out non-canon, and the canon sources non-canon too. Question everything.

But in WoW? Stuff is canon until proven otherwise. Some people do have a hard time believing this because of headcanons tho, like the people who think that Undead Holy Priest isn't canon or similar shit.

[Ielenia]

Also the notion that Professions are the same as classes in lore is also utter nonsense. I don’t see groups of Blacksmiths or herbalists running around punching monsters in the face.

This is a blatant misrepresentation of the argument because "punching monsters in the face" is a meaningless arbitrary rule. You are not required to "punch monsters in the face" to be a priest. Or a paladin. Or a mage. Or a rogue. Etc, etc, etc.

On top of that, "blacksmiths" and "herbalists" have not been shown to basically be a synonym to any class concept, fan-made or otherwise, in the lore.

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The gameplay is the default lore until pointed out otherwise, varying per case.

Actually, it's the other way around. Gameplay is not lore, and it's just a window which allows us limited interaction with the world and its lore, and rarely reflects lore. I've made a list of things in which gameplay does not reflect lore just from things off the top of my head in another thread.

[A Chozo]

Actually, it's the other way around. Gameplay is not lore

Aye, fuck, the game is non-canon then

. . .

Things happening in the game are canon. We experience that canon through gameplay - its our lens, because it's still a game. Obviously it needs to be interpreted correctly, because the lens of the gameplay differ a little from the actual happenings. But what we see happen in the game? Canon until proven otherwise.