Mythic+ feedback, We must have new real changes...

[SecretAgent]

Hello
Very few changes or new things are coming to the shadowlands mythic+ system even though its one of the most played feature
So here is some things that have to change
1) Rework affixes into kiss-curse so they dont only slow the dungeon down, here is how to do it: all the affixes below retain the same effect in addition to
- Grevious: while above 90% hp, gain X primary stat, while below 90% you get increasingly damaged. This so players avoid taking avoidable dmg
- Sanguine: Standing in the pools causes it to shrink and deals increasing damage to you, when its totally shrinked you gain 5% damage increase for 15sec : this would allow you to remove some sanguine pools and gain minor dmg increase at the cost of increasing damage and make it bearable in dungoens like waycrest

- Raging: Same + When you reach 30% hp, you enrage dealing 25% more damage and taking 100% more damage except for tank

- Volcanic : same but you can now move mobs to volcanic, causing them to take damage. And volcanic will trigger one more time in the same location after 3sec. So people dont ignore it and giving time to move adds

- Quaking : same but if you do trigger the explosion near mobs they will take X dmg. This makes the party get near adds while quaking and making it a little bit harder for them to not hit each other!

- Explosive : same but if an explosive orb was able to finish its cast, it will deal dmg to the party and mobs too(not % dmg). Some groups might be able to survive 1 or more casts!

- Etc, all affixes can be reworked

2) New affixes :
- Eye of the jailor: Every 1min a mob will spawn and fixate on a target, that gains increasing movement speed and dmg. The mob must be killed asap. When it dies it will drop an orb that increases dmg/healing for the target that was fixated on by 10% for 10sec to offset the loss in dps due to kiting
- Force of winds: Every 1min all people will be pushed forward by 25 yards, This push might make you aggro mobs if you dont turn/position well
- Reaping etc
3) Remove fortified/Tyrannical
- Bosses feel like trash with fortified, and tyrannical is way too much hp, just remove both of this and increase both boss/trash hp and dmg equally.
4) Seasonal affixes : Replace it with lvl 10 affix, since some affixes like infested/beguiling ruin a season. Make it rotate weekly like the others. Create new affixes!

5) Let deaths matter more than time, currently 1 death removes 5sec. What if you increased time limit by 50% and made deaths remove like 20sec each ? Numbers can change

What are your thoughts... 4 years of the same system with little changes
Affixes are meant to change the way you approach the dungoen. And not just make it slow and the current ones became boring so new ones are needed or mythic+ is gonna slowly die
Yes we gonna get 8 new dungoens but we need some new affixes too or they gonna become boring fast
Very little attention is given to mythic+ ... and too much on covenants and torghast

[idunnowatdo]

I like your ideas. I don’t like force of wind. I don’t like the weekly 10+ weekly rotating affix. Needs to be somewhat static for season consistency. I do like kiss/curse. It allows at least 2 people who know exactly what to do to carry pugs and not make it painful

[SecretAgent]

I like your ideas. I don’t like force of wind. I don’t like the weekly 10+ weekly rotating affix. Needs to be somewhat static for season consistency. I do like kiss/curse. It allows at least 2 people who know exactly what to do to carry pugs and not make it painful

Force of winds would be easy and fun, ik some people will pull mobs through it but thats the point. you just gotta be cautious before it triggers so it dont push you forward to mobs you dont want to aggro, you can turn or move backward. You gotta be cautious too if yoy skipped a pack of mob and dont get pushed to it when you turn xD

[NineSpine]

It's a really, really bad system at a fundamental level, so there isn't much to change or fix that wouldn't be a different system entirely.

[Nevcairiel]

Your idea for grievous is hardly "kiss/curse", because the healer will always try to keep you without the debuff (and as such topped off), since it will really start hurting bad otherwise.
"kiss/curse" would be giving increased damage while the debuff is active, so that risky play is rewarded, not correct play.

Overall, I don't think such effects are necessary or would improve the play at all. There is already too much variance between weeks, and this would only make it worse. If anything, the seasonal affix, which is constant every week, should offer interesting options, as to not swing the difficulty per week even more. Its fine for difference between seasons.

I do agree that fortified/tyrannical need quite a revisit though.

[CalamityHeart]

The entire purpose of affixes is to slow down the dungeon. That's part of the challenge. I'm sure that what would essentially be putting forth the opportunity to make affixes less punishing would be a very welcome change... But I don't think it's a necessary one.

Something I do agree on is that Fortified/Tyrannical should be removed. Not because they're too punishing, but because they're very boring. What I'd like to see instead is dungeon-specific affixes to replace the tier 1 affixes.

The two dungeons in each zone would swap between two unique affixes that are particular to that zone. For example, Maldraxxus could have one affix called "Sloughed", in which a plagued-slime mob breaks away from bosses for every 20% of its health that's taken away. Dividing your attention between the boss and the slimes means that the boss will go down slower, but ignoring it and letting up to four slimes spawn will bring the boss down quicker, but put an increasingly large amount of pressure on the tank and healer due to the extra damage coming out from the slimes. The second affix could be called "Stitchbound", in which at the start of the dungeon, the tank is bound to one random other player in the group, and 15% of all damage the tank takes is also taken by that player. Every minute, the stitch leaves the player it was stuck to and jumps to a different player giving the healer more to pay attention to over the course of the dungeon. (These are probably not good ideas. But they just serve as an example.)

One week, Plaguefall would have Sloughed, and the Theatre of Pain would have Stitchbound, and the next week, they would swap and Plaguefall would have Stitchbound and the Theatre of Pain would have Sloughed instead. And similar pairs of swapping tier 1 affixes could be in place for the three other zones and their pairs of dungeons. And in Patch 9.1, maybe those zone-specific affixes would become unbound from their zones, so that then Spire has a chance to get Sloughed every week, and Plaguefall has a chance to roll an affix that used to be Ardenweald-exclusive or Bastion-exclusive. Each dungeon would still all share the same tier 2, 3, and seasonal affix.

[Adviceanon]

I really like your ideas. I love mechanics that can be used against enemies. I agree with you about tyrannical/fortified. Affixes should make the player excited, not bored. Environmental effects that help the player or hurt mobs requires more brainwork than just spamming buttons.

[LanToaster]

After the first sentence I thought:
Well, M+ is fine, dont fix a running system.

But your Ideas are actually nice. Hope they do it.

[SecretAgent]

Your idea for grievous is hardly "kiss/curse", because the healer will always try to keep you without the debuff (and as such topped off), since it will really start hurting bad otherwise.
"kiss/curse" would be giving increased damage while the debuff is active, so that risky play is rewarded, not correct play.

Overall, I don't think such effects are necessary or would improve the play at all. There is already too much variance between weeks, and this would only make it worse. If anything, the seasonal affix, which is constant every week, should offer interesting options, as to not swing the difficulty per week even more. Its fine for difference between seasons.

I do agree that fortified/tyrannical need quite a revisit though.

My grevious idea is not about kiss/curse only

Its about incentivizing dps to not get dmged by some avoidable mechanics to not lose the buff

[facefist]

I don't like your idea for raging that much. Would increase useless risk-taking too much imho, and would probably be extremely painful for the healer (especially in pugs) when people take damage on purpose to increase their output. Others sound quite fine actually.

Then again, I enjoy the current system as well. New dungeons keep me entertained for quite long period even with the old affixes.

[SecretAgent]

The entire purpose of affixes is to slow down the dungeon. That's part of the challenge. I'm sure that what would essentially be putting forth the opportunity to make affixes less punishing would be a very welcome change... But I don't think it's a necessary one.

Something I do agree on is that Fortified/Tyrannical should be removed. Not because they're too punishing, but because they're very boring. What I'd like to see instead is dungeon-specific affixes to replace the tier 1 affixes.

The two dungeons in each zone would swap between two unique affixes that are particular to that zone. For example, Maldraxxus could have one affix called "Sloughed", in which a plagued-slime mob breaks away from bosses for every 20% of its health that's taken away. Dividing your attention between the boss and the slimes means that the boss will go down slower, but ignoring it and letting up to four slimes spawn will bring the boss down quicker, but put an increasingly large amount of pressure on the tank and healer due to the extra damage coming out from the slimes. The second affix could be called "Stitchbound", in which at the start of the dungeon, the tank is bound to one random other player in the group, and 15% of all damage the tank takes is also taken by that player. Every minute, the stitch leaves the player it was stuck to and jumps to a different player giving the healer more to pay attention to over the course of the dungeon. (These are probably not good ideas. But they just serve as an example.)

One week, Plaguefall would have Sloughed, and the Theatre of Pain would have Stitchbound, and the next week, they would swap and Plaguefall would have Stitchbound and the Theatre of Pain would have Sloughed instead. And similar pairs of swapping tier 1 affixes could be in place for the three other zones and their pairs of dungeons. And in Patch 9.1, maybe those zone-specific affixes would become unbound from their zones, so that then Spire has a chance to get Sloughed every week, and Plaguefall has a chance to roll an affix that used to be Ardenweald-exclusive or Bastion-exclusive. Each dungeon would still all share the same tier 2, 3, and seasonal affix.

That would be too much work for them
And might see some unbalanced scenarios
They want affixes to be applicable to all dungoens

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I don't like your idea for raging that much. Would increase useless risk-taking too much imho, and would probably be extremely painful for the healer (especially in pugs) when people take damage on purpose to increase their output. Others sound quite fine actually.

Then again, I enjoy the current system as well. New dungeons keep me entertained for quite long period even with the old affixes.

I know that this will makes it harder for the healer, but this gives player some options whether to risk it or not
Numbers can be changed and it could be 50% hp enrage and increase dmg taken by 50% or something

Affixes that just slow down dungoens and no ability to play around them.are boring

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It's a really, really bad system at a fundamental level, so there isn't much to change or fix that wouldn't be a different system entirely.

Its not a bad system at all, and this is evident by its popularity. You might not like it but 90% of the players do like 1 mythic+ per week

[Puri]

I mean, perhaps it's so liked and played by so many because it's fine as it is now. Changes just for the sake of changes are usually bad.

That having said, I like your ideas.

[SecretAgent]

The entire purpose of affixes is to slow down the dungeon. That's part of the challenge. I'm sure that what would essentially be putting forth the opportunity to make affixes less punishing would be a very welcome change... But I don't think it's a necessary one.

Something I do agree on is that Fortified/Tyrannical should be removed. Not because they're too punishing, but because they're very boring. What I'd like to see instead is dungeon-specific affixes to replace the tier 1 affixes.

The two dungeons in each zone would swap between two unique affixes that are particular to that zone. For example, Maldraxxus could have one affix called "Sloughed", in which a plagued-slime mob breaks away from bosses for every 20% of its health that's taken away. Dividing your attention between the boss and the slimes means that the boss will go down slower, but ignoring it and letting up to four slimes spawn will bring the boss down quicker, but put an increasingly large amount of pressure on the tank and healer due to the extra damage coming out from the slimes. The second affix could be called "Stitchbound", in which at the start of the dungeon, the tank is bound to one random other player in the group, and 15% of all damage the tank takes is also taken by that player. Every minute, the stitch leaves the player it was stuck to and jumps to a different player giving the healer more to pay attention to over the course of the dungeon. (These are probably not good ideas. But they just serve as an example.)

One week, Plaguefall would have Sloughed, and the Theatre of Pain would have Stitchbound, and the next week, they would swap and Plaguefall would have Stitchbound and the Theatre of Pain would have Sloughed instead. And similar pairs of swapping tier 1 affixes could be in place for the three other zones and their pairs of dungeons. And in Patch 9.1, maybe those zone-specific affixes would become unbound from their zones, so that then Spire has a chance to get Sloughed every week, and Plaguefall has a chance to roll an affix that used to be Ardenweald-exclusive or Bastion-exclusive. Each dungeon would still all share the same tier 2, 3, and seasonal affix.

Affixes purpose should not be to slow down the dungoen, its to increase its difficulty not only by X dmg/hp increases but new mechanicß to play around

[NineSpine]

That would be too much work for them
And might see some unbalanced scenarios
They want affixes to be applicable to all dungoens

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I know that this will makes it harder for the healer, but this gives player some options whether to risk it or not
Numbers can be changed and it could be 50% hp enrage and increase dmg taken by 50% or something

Affixes that just slow down dungoens and no ability to play around them.are boring

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Its not a bad system at all, and this is evident by its popularity. You might not like it but 90% of the players do like 1 mythic+ per week

If Blizzard introduced a system to the game where you killed 100 raptors once a week for a guaranteed upgrade, 90% of players would do it. Would that make it fun and engaging content? Would you be saying "Everyone does it so it must be great!" Of course now.

Mythic+ is a good idea in a very general sense, but the implementation is clunky as hell, creates weirdly perverse incentives, and generates incredible amounts of toxic behavior. The primary problems are the key system and the time limits.

[Zka]

Most of current affixes put extra burden on the healer. Your ideas would make it even worse for the healer in many cases.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

I think the idea of using some of the negative Corruption effects as new M+ affixes would be pretty interesting. Not sure if they would be seasonal +10 or higher affixes or just new ones. Things like running from Thing From Beyond could be interesting.

[Tyris Flare]

Mostly we just need some new affixes that aren't horrible, and also we need the developers to commit to actually tuning dungeons and affixes appropriate so that there is no such thing as a "dead week" (for example, the coming Tyr/Bolster/Explosive week of awfulness).

Honestly part of the reason I am so skeptical of Covenants is because of how they have treated m+, the highest participation content with the least effort on their part. Two years into the expansion, dungeons and affixes still have massive disparities in difficulty, and the class meta remains very problematic.

[SecretAgent]

Plus i think they should increase time limit and make deaths matter more, let 1 death remove like 25sec but increase overall time too

[taishar68]

The changes I'd like to see are related more to balance and inclusion.

For balance, ensure that trash packs are positioned in a way that minimizes the (seemingly) overwhelming advantage that Door of Shadows has over the other covenant abilities for M+. Another option could be to make sure the amount of mobs needed to fill the bar makes too many skips impractical, which adds organic balance.

For inclusion, I'd like to see + keys, up to a limit, added to the LFG auto-queue. To be honest, it is the kind of thing that could swing badly, and there isn't anything inherently wrong with the current system, but here is how I would implement it:

You would queue for any M+ up to 9, with gear checks based on 1-3, 4-6, 7-9, where 1-3 has a minimum level, and so on.
You can only queue for dungeons at or below the highest key you have for the week, with 9 still being the max.
You can only queue for dungeons that you have at least completed on Heroic.

[SecretAgent]

Mostly we just need some new affixes that aren't horrible, and also we need the developers to commit to actually tuning dungeons and affixes appropriate so that there is no such thing as a "dead week" (for example, the coming Tyr/Bolster/Explosive week of awfulness).

Honestly part of the reason I am so skeptical of Covenants is because of how they have treated m+, the highest participation content with the least effort on their part. Two years into the expansion, dungeons and affixes still have massive disparities in difficulty, and the class meta remains very problematic.

Yes, Blizzard now is focusing too much on covenants and neglecting class design/PvP/mythic+ features of shadowlands
And we all know whatever they do will be unbalanced

They already know the problem and have the solution ready
They are just waiting for 9.1 to fix covenant issues so they can say "we listened to your feedback" and make that like a big feature of the patch lol even ion is saying that