Corruption - The worst system ever added to the game?

[Kehego]

Yeah, can you tell me? I hope it is what I think it is.

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Yeah you could buy them. After progress was done. Same with leggos. Just not on a rotation lmao. I bet you love everytime you get showered in avoidance and leech.

think of what classes use shields
and even if your luck was dogshit, you'd get far more honed minds/racing pulses/tentacles than avoidance. but eh.

[Doffen]

think of what classes use shields
and even if your luck was dogshit, you'd get far more honed minds/racing pulses/tentacles than avoidance. but eh.

Yeah, and? Elemental Shaman use it, prot warr and holy/prot paladin use it. Even that in itself isn't something to be implying anything about, tanks also do dps, while there are other corruptions that are better, IS wasn't bad for any of them in the start. And you can go on warcraftlogs, check off prenerf and elemental shamans. But that wasn't his point anyway, so not sure why you think you can be so smug when you didn't understand his point in the first place. The point was obviously that boe with corruption on it went for several million gold in the start. Which isn't something 99.99% of the player base can just buy. But for some reason you and your buddy over here think it was such a great addition to the corruption system.

Corruption is way better because you can buy bis it from AH for 3-4 million gold. You can't make this shit up. And to your last point(again), even if my luck was mediocre I could get more avoidance gear than the other thing you mentions. Not sure why you are even trying to argue against that. But eh indeed.

[deenman]

Popping into BFA once a week for dailies and coming across the PVP dailies is a fuckin disaster. I have no corruption gear and getting one shot by people who do is the worst design ever. I will NEVER play BFA content to get the gear they do and that's my punishment but the bad content, has created a bad system that gives me zero desire to try and even fix the problem because I shouldn't have to. Blizzard should.

huh?how is this a new concept?in tbc or wotlk if you were new or coming back and you didnt farm bg's to get resilence gear you would get eaten alive...and that gear took far more time and effort to get,as you needed to first farm honor for days,and then wait weeks until you got arena gear to really be competitive,corruption is leagues easier to get

[kaminaris]

Yeah you could buy them. After progress was done. Same with leggos. Just not on a rotation lmao. I bet you love everytime you get showered in avoidance and leech.

Nope you couldn't. Duplicates were useless.
And it's after progress vs after expansion is done for legiondaries.

[Kehego]

Yeah, and? Elemental Shaman use it, prot warr and holy/prot paladin use it. Even that in itself isn't something to be implying anything about, tanks also do dps, while there are other corruptions that are better, IS wasn't bad for any of them in the start. And you can go on warcraftlogs, check off prenerf and elemental shamans. But that wasn't his point anyway, so not sure why you think you can be so smug when you didn't understand his point in the first place. The point was obviously that boe with corruption on it went for several million gold in the start. Which isn't something 99.99% of the player base can just buy. But for some reason you and your buddy over here think it was such a great addition to the corruption system.

Corruption is way better because you can buy bis it from AH for 3-4 million gold. You can't make this shit up. And to your last point(again), even if my luck was mediocre I could get more avoidance gear than the other thing you mentions. Not sure why you are even trying to argue against that. But eh indeed.

Is *is* bad for tanks, everything else you said was just bellyaching.

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Nope you couldn't. Duplicates were useless.
And it's after progress vs after expansion is done for legiondaries.

I honestly love how people forget that you didn't even get the currency till what, early antorus?

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huh?how is this a new concept?in tbc or wotlk if you were new or coming back and you didnt farm bg's to get resilence gear you would get eaten alive...and that gear took far more time and effort to get,as you needed to first farm honor for days,and then wait weeks until you got arena gear to really be competitive,corruption is leagues easier to get

how dare you use your heinous logic

[goldlock]

Yep, that seems accurate, it's really hard for people to accept someone is better so people tend to blame it on corruptions.

And as you said, you got showered in corruptions vs having to farm all shit and useless content just to boost your BLP. Not even close to as bad as legiondaries were.

I mean when the corruption is doing more then any spell or ability the player uses it isn't hard

[kaminaris]

I mean when the corruption is doing more then any spell or ability the player uses it isn't hard

Absolutely irrelevant and it's not doing anything in my case by it's own.

[Kehego]

I mean when the corruption is doing more then any spell or ability the player uses it isn't hard

I mean the top parses are all from stat amp classes. Wrathion is a joke boss and one of the 2 bosses infinite stars is good on.

[Raelbo]

So yeah, just wanted to say that you are wrong that there is only 19 different corruptions you can get. They got ranks too. 19 unique ones, sure. But that won't help if you need three rank 1 to get the effect of a rank 3.

I am not wrong though. I said there are 19 different corruption effects, which there are. The point was to illustrate that the odds of getting a useful effect was a lot bigger than say, 1 in 52 (which seemed to be the implication you were trying to allude to)

If you mean what you are saying here, then you didn't play in 8.3, or you did not experience this.

I played. Given that my experience was very different to what people have described, it is my conclusion that the way some people perceive things affects the way their experience. So if those perceptions are skewed, it does a lot to explain the negative experience (eg feeling like you got screwed over horribly because you never got IS3 in the first week).

Early on the difference was greater than it is now. First of all you could be very lucky to get a rank 3 IS on a 475 item, while the other player got TA. But early on those did a bigger % of your damage because your character was lower in both ilvl and power than they are now in relative to player vs player. Not to mention the rng on those proc based corruptions as well. You could have your TA do 3% of your damage, while the other player got 20% of his Infinite Stars. Maybe it wasn't 30% then as in sheer numbers from your damage meters, though it was definitely like that from the first post-nerf on. But in terms of difference player vs player it was greater. So no, I am talking from experience and warcraftlogs.

Of course I have experience. As you yourself have aptly demonstrated, the odds of getting IS3 on a 475 item are very low. Yes it did happen, but nearly frequently enough that people who didn't get this needed to feel like they were screwed.

Also I have looked at warcraftlogs, and it doesn't tell the story you're telling unless you're very specifically cherry picking a handful of logs out of literally 100s of 1000s. Looking more holistically at the data, the problem really wasn't nearly as bad.

Just to say it, I got 1 rank IS on a 470 item on my main that I got in early May. Which I got traded from another raider... long after we had the raid on farm. I got a 450 IS from a HV in end of May. Unfortunately I had quit by then and only got it because a guildie asked if I could log in and boost him in there. You are highly exaggerating how easy it was to get BiS.

Uhhh no. I have never said it was easy to get BiS. I said it was easy to get relatively close (in terms of performance) to BiS. Which is what actually matters.

But again, I agree that need is not the same as want. But you could say that by any system, legendaries included. Which is what the discussion was in the first place.

The want in both cases was to get the best possible items for your spec. This was more likely to be achieved early in the legiondary system.
The need in both cases was to get a passable solution that would allow you to perform decently, while working towards your ideal solution. This was more likely to be achieved by the corruption system.

I would have to argue that, overall, the corruption system is better in this regard. The problem with the legiondary system was that you were statistically far more likely to be screwed over by not being able to get a legiondary that was at least reasonably decent, while a significant number of your peers had their BiS. In the corruption system, you're statistically likely to get to around 70-80% effectiveness relatively quickly, while the probability of your peers being BiS is very, very low.

That's not to say that I think the Legiondary system was bad, but it had less of an inherent "safety net" to protect you than the Corruption system has, and this was mostly due to not being able to get more than 4 legiondaries in the first two and a half months as well as a "putting all your eggs in one basket" type of design, where the corruption system literally showers you with chances so that, statistically, you're practically guaranteed to get enough useful stuff to make you viable.

My reasoning is based on logic and experience btw. There are numbers on warcraftlogs you could check. If you followed bloodmallet too you could see insane difference.

As I have already, I use both resources. I just think maybe I am better able to use them in a way that tells the real story.

I mean you keep harping on about IS as if it's the be all and end all of corruption. Sure, it's great on single target fights, but how often do we have genuine single target fights in the game? I think there's only one in Nya'lotha out of twelve. Not to mention all the trash.

Just because a handful of cherry-picked logs from warcraftlogs show that getting 30%+ of your damage from IS is possible, does not, in any way whatsoever, demonstrate that if I equip an item with IS3 in place of my current, then I'll suddenly see a flat 20% improvement. Some fights? Sure. Others not so much, and some will actually be worse.

I genuinely believe that most of the unhappiness with the corruption system boils down to players who had a skewed perception of how much of a difference getting their perfect corruptions would make to their ability to perform well. Meanwhile, if they'd just made the best with what they had, they would have been fine. And, honestly, I think the people who managed to perform the best this tier were not really those who got "lucky" with RNG (although a bit of luck does help, of course) so much as those who:
1) Put in effort and did a lot of content that drops high ilevel gear - thus maximising the number of corrupted items they got
2) Made smart choices with the corruptions that they did get and used the best combinations from what was available to them for each encounter

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Regardless even from a developers standpoint it was a bad system that was impossible to balance, blizzard devs themselves have conceded to this in interviews, horses mouth and all that friend.

Really?

How about posting a link showing where a representative of the devs said that?

Because the closest I could find was Ion saying something to the effect of corruption is now (not during progression) out of control. But that it's fine because it's the end of the expansion and is fun.

I haven't seen any admission that they think it was a "bad system". But hey, you're welcome to prove me wrong by providing a valid citation.

[Doffen]

Is *is* bad for tanks, everything else you said was just bellyaching.

Just calling you out for what you are. IS did 20-30% of their damage, even though TD do more. Then we got Elemental shamans. I guess that was the bellyaching. Awful arguments and you show you got no clue how things works in the game, which makes me wonder if you even played in 8.3?

I honestly love how people forget that you didn't even get the currency till what, early antorus?

He is quoting me, and I played in Legion so I actually know how it was. So why do you say that people forgot this, when players like me had all legendaries for our spec within 4 months? Love how you deflect everything, as usual.

how dare you use your heinous logic

Funny you would say that, when you could apply this to legendaries too. I mean, the amount of time you argue against yourself reminds me of another user here in this topic.

[Lei]

He is quoting me, and I played in Legion so I actually know how it was. So why do you say that people forgot this, when players like me had all legendaries for our spec within 4 months?

How much you had to farm for that? Because up until the end of NOVEMBER there was a legendary soft cap in place, and Ion stated himself (*) that if you had 4 leggos (for your CLASS, not even for your SPEC as you stated which is a much tighter criteria) you were super ultra lucky. Legion launched at the end of august. 4 months is december. Lego soft cap was removed at the very end of november. You were super lucky. The buyable legendaries came way too late but that doesn't mean players had all the best leggos (for their specs) by that, let alone 4 months in, for your spec.

(*) source https://www.wowhead.com/news=257898/...ur-legendaries
"Almost by definition, if you had 4 legendaries in, say, early October, you were super-lucky."
"What we genuinely did not anticipate was just how much some of the very most dedicated players would play, mainly in pursuit of Artifact Power. By mid-November, we started to hear questions about whether there was some sort of 4-legendary limit, and we realized that there existed a group of players that had done so much content that they actually had an expected legendary count of around 4."

[goldlock]

Absolutely irrelevant and it's not doing anything in my case by it's own.

I mean sure you can make the argument you have to hit the boss with abilities but I don't see it as a positive. As for stat boost corruptions its the same as putting enchantments on a monthly cooldown when they do the majority of your damage...

No one is really trying to argue it isnt a garbage system... I suppose you can make the argument it isn't the worst system but your never going to get to it being good.

[kaminaris]

I mean sure you can make the argument you have to hit the boss with abilities but I don't see it as a positive. As for stat boost corruptions its the same as putting enchantments on a monthly cooldown when they do the majority of your damage...

No one is really trying to argue it isnt a garbage system... I suppose you can make the argument it isn't the worst system but your never going to get to it being good.

no, its not doing majority of my damage. Idea was good, power was 20% too much.

[goldlock]

no, its not doing majority of my damage. Idea was good, power was 20% too much.

I think we talked about this before and your currently a BM hunter? If so I believe your right but you have to realize that out of the classes in the meta you are the exception not the rule.

Corruption does factor into the majority of your dmg for almost every other dps or at least the stat gain does.

[Bodakane]

The only problem I have with corruption is that it alters your look.

[Sunblaze]

I just dont understand why some people say that "it is fixed". How is it OK that you literally ahve to wait 3 weeks until you can get any upgrade for a character? I have 20k echoes banked and some pieces in my bag and literally havent touched my main for 3 weeks until tomorrow that ill have masterful 3 to buy.

Why is this better than, say, have everything on the vendor all the time, so i just buy things when i have my echoes, instead of making me wait arbitrarily?

[Doffen]

How much you had to farm for that? Because up until the end of NOVEMBER there was a legendary soft cap in place, and Ion stated himself (*) that if you had 4 leggos (for your CLASS, not even for your SPEC as you stated which is a much tighter criteria) you were super ultra lucky. Legion launched at the end of august. 4 months is december. Lego soft cap was removed at the very end of november. You were super lucky. The buyable legendaries came way too late but that doesn't mean players had all the best leggos (for their specs) by that, let alone 4 months in, for your spec.

(*) source https://www.wowhead.com/news=257898/...ur-legendaries
"Almost by definition, if you had 4 legendaries in, say, early October, you were super-lucky."
"What we genuinely did not anticipate was just how much some of the very most dedicated players would play, mainly in pursuit of Artifact Power. By mid-November, we started to hear questions about whether there was some sort of 4-legendary limit, and we realized that there existed a group of players that had done so much content that they actually had an expected legendary count of around 4."

I know all that, and like always as I said several times in this thread, it's from I got my new main in November 2016.

I also linked that link some pages ago. I did play legion a lot because I had so much fun then. That cap however was horrible and a big mistake from the devs.

It's on page 13 in this thread where I linked the link when the other poster claimed that came in 6 months into Legion. Only 3-4 months later than the truth.

[kaminaris]

I think we talked about this before and your currently a BM hunter? If so I believe your right but you have to realize that out of the classes in the meta you are the exception not the rule.

Corruption does factor into the majority of your dmg for almost every other dps or at least the stat gain does.

Oh boy, and this is why people should start learning simcraft before speaking utter nonsense

If I cleanse my entire gear i lose ~20% dps. That is not even close to "majority"



Even with cleansed weapon (that is technically built in corruption) its still 27%:



And no my class is not really exception.
From top parses of each dps class on mythic nzoth, stat amps are:
DK frost, DK unholy
Druid bala, Druid feral
Hunter BM, MM, SV
Mage arcane, fire, forst
Monk WW
Pala Ret
Priest shadow
Rogue assa, outlaw
Sham ele, enh
Warlock affli, demo, destro
Warrior arms

And extra effects specs are:
Rogue sub (twisted appendage)
DH Havoc

Half/half
Warrior fury

So overwhelming majority of DPS specs uses stat amps, stop spreading lies https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/ra...2344&class=DPS

[KOUNTERPARTS]

I would argue it's not the "worst" system ever but it did not really succeed in being a solution for Titanforging. Before adding in the Corruption vendor it was still RNG on RNG on RNG.


At least now at this point of the expansion, people should generally have a lot of Corruption Resistance and can play around with many different Corruptions if they choose. As it should be at the end of the expansion: all over the place.

[Zephire]

I love it. Had great fun with it and I'm sad it's going away. Might've been flawed both in how the actual corruption effect proced or was designed and how you obtained it. The system with a soft limit for how much corruption you could equip was very fun when you only had random pieces to chose from. When the vendors came everything just jumped to optimization which is also fun but rendered every choice but a few pointless for most classes.

I wish we see a new iteration of it in the future!