Sentenced to life imprisonment for trying to steal hedge clippers.

[Egomaniac]

How many crimes did he commit without getting caught?

According to the law?

Absolutely Zero.

Innocent until proven guilty.

It's really weird how you guys are still trying to justify locking a man up for his entire life over non-violent crimes.

Also, there's a false dichotomy between "coddling criminals" and "unduly harsh sentencing" some posters here are trying to force. Absolutely no one is saying that criminals should not be convicted and sentenced. What is being questioned is the idea of sending someone to prison for the rest of their life for attempting to steal lawn tools.

[Easo]

Silly Americans, just stop pretending that you prefer rehabilitation over punishment and we can move on.
It is clear that you have chosen and love to spend your taxes on keeping people locked up to punish them, as you are clearly ignoring the decades long experience that tough punishments do not deter the crime, ergo, punishing criminals is more important than preventing the crime in the first place.
P.S.
Should have gone straight to death penalty. /s
Oh, wait, even that would cost shitload to taxpayers because America has somehow made executions an expensive process.

[Santti]

Silly Americans, just stop pretending that you prefer rehabilitation over punishment and we can move on.
It is clear that you have chosen and love to spend your taxes on keeping people locked up to punish them, as you are clearly ignoring the decades long experience that tough punishments do not deter the crime, ergo, punishing criminals is more important than preventing the crime in the first place.
P.S.
Should have gone straight to death penalty. /s
Oh, wait, even that would cost shitload to taxpayers because America has somehow made executions an expensive process.

It would be even more costly, than to keep them locked up for life, yes. It's judicial process that makes it so costly, as you want to be sure you don't execute innocents.

Quick google suggests 18 times more costly to execute than lock up for life without parole.

https://deathpenalty.org/facts/5-myths-death-penalty/

[Egomaniac]

It would be even more costly, than to keep them locked up for life, yes. It's judicial process that makes it so costly, as you want to be sure you don't execute innocents.

Yeah, but the guys that argue for the death penalty also think that that it should be carried out immediately...skipping over the entire appeals process. They don't actually seem to care much about the chance they might be executing an innocent person.

[Santti]

Yeah, but the guys that argue for the death penalty also think that that it should be carried out immediately...skipping over the entire appeals process. They don't actually seem to care much about the chance they might be executing an innocent person.

Until you can reverse a death sentence, it's just abhorrent to even suggest something like that.

[Easo]

It would be even more costly, than to keep them locked up for life, yes. It's judicial process that makes it so costly, as you want to be sure you don't execute innocents.

Quick google suggests 18 times more costly to execute than lock up for life without parole.

https://deathpenalty.org/facts/5-myths-death-penalty/

Yeah, but the guys that argue for the death penalty also think that that it should be carried out immediately...skipping over the entire appeals process. They don't actually seem to care much about the chance they might be executing an innocent person.

I mostly meant it about the whole hooplah of injection drugs - having to source new ones, having shitty side effects from existing ones, lobbying, etc. I am aware that appeals process going for decades (at which point one has to wonder if there even is a point left to the executions. What is the "record" now, 36 years? xD) is the main cost reason.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Repeated criminal activity like stealing? Yeah probably best to stop stealing things. That said provided it's not a violent crime with no victims that would or could be hurt especially this sentence is absurd. The guy needs help

[RobertoCarlos]

Repeated criminal activity like stealing? Yeah probably best to stop stealing things. That said provided it's not a violent crime with no victims that would or could be hurt especially this sentence is absurd. The guy needs help

And what help do you give thieves exactly?

Give them free stuff so they don't need to steal?

Some people steal for fun/the rush. I doubt those shears were life and death for him. Probably did it because he was bored

[Doctor Amadeus]

And what help do you give thieves exactly?

Give them free stuff so they don't need to steal?

Some people steal for fun/the rush. I doubt those shears were life and death for him. Probably did it because he was bored

You could investigate why he is stealing, if it's a disorder you treat them to get them to stop. If they are stealing because they can and don't care well then you punish them accordingly, however steeling hedge clippers doesn't really seem like something diabolical.

[RobertoCarlos]

You could investigate why he is stealing, if it's a disorder you treat them to get them to stop. If they are stealing because they can and don't care well then you punish them accordingly, however steeling hedge clippers doesn't really seem like something diabolical.

Does not matter at all if its diabolical. What if those shears were a gift from a dead parent or loved one. He had no right to take them however minor it may appear.

What if the person he stole from suffers from mental illness and this was a huge deal to them and they are worried he'll be back to steal more.

Victim > offender

[Doctor Amadeus]

Does not matter at all if its diabolical. What if those shears were a gift from a dead parent or loved one. He had no right to take them however minor it may appear.

What if the person he stole from suffers from mental illness and this was a huge deal to them and they are worried he'll be back to steal more.

Victim > offender

It isn't a question of if he had the right to take them. Of course he didn't I am not condoning theft, I am however putting the issue in perspective, and that is if he has a condition he deserves help, if doesn't well then prison is the appropriate place for him to be.

[Hellobolis]

And what help do you give thieves exactly?

Give them free stuff so they don't need to steal?

Some people steal for fun/the rush. I doubt those shears were life and death for him. Probably did it because he was bored

you pay them. bread and games.

you pay them enough so they can survive and have some basic entertainment without having to resort to crimes, but not enough so that getting any job is always better. (ofc this requires a livable minimum wage to work, so you can pay below minimum wage but you still have the effect.)

sounds counter intuitive but it's a lot cheaper than all the tax money they will use up having runins with the police, being in prison, the damage from the crimes themselves, etc.

[Edge-]

Does not matter at all if its diabolical. What if those shears were a gift from a dead parent or loved one. He had no right to take them however minor it may appear.

What if the person he stole from suffers from mental illness and this was a huge deal to them and they are worried he'll be back to steal more.

Victim > offender

What if the person was married to the hedge trimmers? What if they had repeated sexual intercourse with them? What if they were the first pair ever created and worth millions?

I mean if we're making all kinds of wild hypotheticals, why not go all in?

[wunksta]

What if the person was married to the hedge trimmers? What if they had repeated sexual intercourse with them? What if they were the first pair ever created and worth millions?

I mean if we're making all kinds of wild hypotheticals, why not go all in?

What about all the hedge trimmers he didn't have a chance to steal?

[RobertoCarlos]

you pay them. bread and games.

you pay them enough so they can survive and have some basic entertainment without having to resort to crimes, but not enough so that getting any job is always better. (ofc this requires a livable minimum wage to work, so you can pay below minimum wage but you still have the effect.)

sounds counter intuitive but it's a lot cheaper than all the tax money they will use up having runins with the police, being in prison, the damage from the crimes themselves, etc.

Yeah and when bread and games isn't enough and they see thier nieghbour eating steak and driving a nice car they are gonna feel entitled to it.

Human nature always wants more. You give them bread they will steal meat. I dunno why you think freebies will suddenly make someone a good person. Ego rules all

- - - Updated - - -

What if the person was married to the hedge trimmers? What if they had repeated sexual intercourse with them? What if they were the first pair ever created and worth millions?

I mean if we're making all kinds of wild hypotheticals, why not go all in?

I dunno why you think theft is so funny. Its not

[Edge-]

I dunno why you think theft is so funny. Its not

I don't, I think your nonsense hypotheticals are funny.

This is a pair of hedge trimmers. A fucking pair of hedge trimmers, maybe $40 bucks, $150 if it was gas/electric. It absolutely does not warrant decades in prison, no matter what prior offenses he had, at the cost of over half a million dollars to taxpayers.

Period.

[RobertoCarlos]

I don't, I think your nonsense hypotheticals are funny.

This is a pair of hedge trimmers. A fucking pair of hedge trimmers, maybe $40 bucks. It absolutely does not warrant decades in prison, no matter what prior offenses he had, at the cost of over half a million dollars to taxpayers.

Period.

If they are so minor then that's a pretty dumb reason to steal them and use up a strike no? May as well be hung for a sheep not a lamb.

[Hellobolis]

Yeah and when bread and games isn't enough and they see thier nieghbour eating steak and driving a nice car they are gonna feel entitled to it.

Human nature always wants more. You give them bread they will steal meat. I dunno why you think freebies will suddenly make someone a good person. Ego rules all

doesn't have to work for every case imaginable to be financially worth it.

if it prevents even one shear given by a dead relative from being stolen, it's worth it amirite?

it's also specifically not about making people good people, it's about making people have enough to lose that they will think twice. criminal punishments don't work very well as a deterrent, losing your netflix account is something people can imagine and actually value.

[RobertoCarlos]

doesn't have to work for every case imaginable to be financially worth it.

if it prevents even one shear given by a dead relative from being stolen, it's worth it amirite?

it's also specifically not about making people good people, it's about making people have enough to lose that they will think twice. criminal punishments don't work very well as a deterrent, losing your netflix account is something people can imagine and actually value.

I like how you're all heart for the criminal but the gift from my dead grandmother is just a big joke. If it's no big deal he didn't have to steal it either.

You think someone addicted to crack looking to feed thier habit cares about thier net flix account?

[Edge-]

If they are so minor then that's a pretty dumb reason to steal them and use up a strike no? May as well be hung for a sheep not a lamb.

I mean, nobody is arguing that stealing them wasn't wrong or that it wasn't a dumb idea.

But that in no way, shape, or form justifies any policies or laws that would imprison someone for life for a minor offense, yet we have people happy that taxpayers in his state have paid over $500,000 to keep him locked up for decades over a pair of hedge trimmers.

- - - Updated - - -

I like how you're all heart for the criminal but the gift from my dead grandmother is just a big joke. If it's no big deal he didn't have to steal it either.

He didn't even succeed in stealing it, dude. Nobody is shitting on the victim here either, that's you projecting that so that you can justify your support for keeping the dude in jail for life.