Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[the game]

While this was directed at Theo, I would like to put my two cents in and say no. Because the countries in Europe are not immune to random deadly attacks on innocent citizens. So no matter where I lived, I would always want to have a means to defend myself successfully without relying on the government to do it, when they have shown repeatedly, they can't always.

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That's New York for you. No surprise there. I can understand why some people make their own ammo. But starting out now, might be hard to get the materials. But I do suggest you save your brass just in case you might want to some day.

agreed. Probably going to look into it.

[Stormdash]

Well, you could post a video of you shooting a gun.

To prove to someone who probably listens with rapt attention to guys like the leader of the NFAC when he talks about his "XR-15" being called a bullpup because of the vicious recoil? This is probably what you'd consider a firearms expert.

Or to give you a basis to falsely report me for threatening behavior?

Alternatively, you can do what you always wanted and come blow my brains out. I'll even give you my address.

Repulsive projection from a repulsive human being.

Or, if you don't feel comfortable doing that, you can just blow your own brains out.

Repulsive. Human being (alleged).

Cool link, bro.

When you have no answer for the degenerate scum in the video, why even comment on it?

Seems like you don't like these tactics because of their efficacy, rather than any sort of moral issue, as you lack any moral compass to make such judgments.

You should look at RCP average trends for a summary of the efficacy of these tactics. These tactics are primed to be a legendary own-goal. Turns out when the "language of the unheard" becomes viciously preying on innocent bystanders while calling them racist, they realize the reason you were previously unheard is because you aren't worth listening to.

So the founders opposed violent revolt, even though they themselves participated in one. Iiiiiiiinteresting...
[Infraction]

The violent revolt was to cast off a government and replace it. If you think that these guys are following the Founders justification, what you are saying is that they are declaring civil war. Guess what, that will get gun-owning Americans to show up. Fuck around and find out.

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It was not a about a King. It was about Taxes (which put in place to pay for the 7 years war which could be described as the first world war or global war as it was all around the globe). If you go that way, as soon as you exit the Imperial or Royal Palace, the King is not there and you can rebel.

If there's a great irony to where we started to where we are is that the government that the Revolution threw off had much less practical day to day power over their lives than the current incarnation of the federal government has today. George III had, on paper, near absolute power, but he neither had the ability to project that power into the homes of people in the colonies as a practical issue, he also didn't have nearly the ambition to wield it. If you'd asked him if he wanted input into every interaction between his subjects and their doctors or apothecaries, for instance, he'd have probably been horrified at the idea of wanting to bother with so much minutiae.

[Theodarzna]

If the USA would evolved to a more peaceful country with less crime rate (through better education, less inequality, etc...), would you oppose something that would restrict more the ownership of guns (like in most EU countries for instance)?

First, I think the choice of "evolved" is a weird one. Gives me a "Is this a game of Cid Meiers Civilization with a tech tree?" vibe to it.

Second, as I said previously; education is ill suited to solving the inequality problem because education is first and foremost a means by which social status is conferred. The very mechanics of education cannot be an equalizer because education is about sifting through students and placing them on a hierarchy of supposed talent. You cannot solve inequality by a machine that is designed to produce sort people into unequal statuses. The thinking about education as a solution to societies problems is the incorrect belief that education gives people what they deserve, but why is education the thing that determines if someone is worthy of a stable and dignified life?

Third, Less inequality comes about through massive transformations economically and empowering of working people. This means fundamentally solving the material immiseration of people. Something the EU for example has partially attempted with some of its Social Democracy, but left half done IMHO.

Finally, yeah, I'd oppose the restriction of firearms because at that point if crime and violence became less common, why deprive people of their possessions? What would be the point of that?

[Svifnymr]

The current ammo and gun shortage is getting crazy. i'm having a hard time even finding ammo online right now. Only one store around here has any real amounts of 9mm and 5.56 nato rounds. I've been looking for a Mossberg 930 spx and can't find that anywhere either. I was talking to a guy at the gun shop and he told me there's a ship in new york that's hauling guns. glocks and whatnot. But customs isn't letting it through.

Glock has a factory in Georgia, so probably not them, I imagine their shipments would come in via a Carolina or Florida port. Probably just more Century Arms stuff, if true.

That said, yeah, the current sellers market is still going strong. A co-worker that wanted to get an AR but kept delaying when it was $500, then $600, now they're $850 if you can find one.

[the game]

Glock has a factory in Georgia, so probably not them, I imagine their shipments would come in via a Carolina or Florida port. Probably just more Century Arms stuff, if true.

That said, yeah, the current sellers market is still going strong. A co-worker that wanted to get an AR but kept delaying when it was $500, then $600, now they're $850 if you can find one.

I mean I see ar rifles. The local rural king usually has one or two (floor models cause they can't keep them in very long). There's another place that's bigger that seems to have them in. but if you look at higher end defensive shotguns it's getting harder.

As for ammo I'm buying as much as i can find. I'm avoiding things with steel or aluminum casings but definitely buying whatever I can find. Thinking of picking stuff up for other calibers as well.

[Stormdash]

I mean I see ar rifles. The local rural king usually has one or two (floor models cause they can't keep them in very long). There's another place that's bigger that seems to have them in. but if you look at higher end defensive shotguns it's getting harder.

As for ammo I'm buying as much as i can find. I'm avoiding things with steel or aluminum casings but definitely buying whatever I can find. Thinking of picking stuff up for other calibers as well.

Y'know, sometimes I wonder if the SHTF/prepper have it right. They always say you want to think in terms of ammo availability in a real TEOTWAWKI scenario... but in practice that's what's getting bought up everywhere in the (obviously theoretical) build-up. I keep wondering if I should add a 5.7x28 or .357 sig or 22 TCM to the ongoing boat accident because that's the stuff you can find online lol

[the game]

Y'know, sometimes I wonder if the SHTF/prepper have it right. They always say you want to think in terms of ammo availability in a real TEOTWAWKI scenario... but in practice that's what's getting bought up everywhere in the (obviously theoretical) build-up. I keep wondering if I should add a 5.7x28 or .357 sig or 22 TCM to the ongoing boat accident because that's the stuff you can find online lol

agreed. Ever since covid hit and everyone started going bat shit crazy i decided to start stocking up on things as well. I pick up things like batteries, toilet paper, cordage, and food every time I go to the store. Need to start on medical supplies.

[Zython]

To prove to someone who probably listens with rapt attention to guys like the leader of the NFAC when he talks about his "XR-15" being called a bullpup because of the vicious recoil? This is probably what you'd consider a firearms expert.

I neither know who that is nor care.

Or to give you a basis to falsely report me for threatening behavior?


Repulsive projection from a repulsive human being.


Repulsive. Human being (alleged).

More SJW moral preening. Yawn.

When you have no answer for the degenerate scum in the video, why even comment on it?

It was a joke about how your link doesn't fucking work.

You should look at RCP average trends for a summary of the efficacy of these tactics. These tactics are primed to be a legendary own-goal. Turns out when the "language of the unheard" becomes viciously preying on innocent bystanders while calling them racist, they realize the reason you were previously unheard is because you aren't worth listening to.

For sure, man.

The violent revolt was to cast off a government and replace it. If you think that these guys are following the Founders justification, what you are saying is that they are declaring civil war. Guess what, that will get gun-owning Americans to show up. Fuck around and find out.

Which brings me to my original point. You won't do shit. You can't do shit. You're just LARPing.

[Theodarzna]

agreed. Ever since covid hit and everyone started going bat shit crazy i decided to start stocking up on things as well. I pick up things like batteries, toilet paper, cordage, and food every time I go to the store. Need to start on medical supplies.

Living in California I am I guess accustomed to shortages, when I visited Nevada a few months ago I was amazed by the comparison.

[Ghostpanther]

Another report about the increase in gun purchases....https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/...in-june-report

FBI background checks for gun purchases in New York in June more than doubled from a year ago, according to a new report.

Data shows the FBI processed 52,252 background checks for people seeking to buy firearms in the state in June -- a 121% increase from June 2019, the New York Post reported Saturday.

“When the original COVID scare started in the beginning of March and people thought they might get laid off, at that point we saw a huge surge," Cliff Pfleger, the owner of a Long Island gun shop, told the paper. "We sold out of almost everything we had in the store.”

And this part of the article.....seems like some are wanting to blame the increased shootings in NYC to the increase sales of guns...:P

The Big Apple saw 205 shootings in June, the bloodiest June in 24 years.

Researchers at the University of California, Davis estimated that an extra 2.1 million guns sold nationwide between March and May this year are linked to 776 gun-related injuries that would not have occurred without the sales spike.

“During the coronavirus pandemic, an acute increase in firearm access is associated with an increase in firearm violence,” the researchers wrote.

They are stating that most of the shootings in NYC was done by legal gun owners? I would have to see the proof on that. If it is true, may have been because of the unlawful actions of criminals trying to harm them.

I have checked the stats before and posted them on here and the majority of prisoners in prisons on gun related charges, did not commit the crime with a legally obtained firearm.

[Specialka]

Would have been interesting to see how those researchers link the two. But stop projecting your own biais in it: 'If it is true, may have been because of the unlawful actions of criminals trying to harm them.'. You have no proof or evidence about that, only your biais.

[Ghostpanther]

Would have been interesting to see how those researchers link the two. But stop projecting your own biais in it: 'If it is true, may have been because of the unlawful actions of criminals trying to harm them.'. You have no proof or evidence about that, only your biais.

It is a opinion. But considering who did the research, I think my opinion is pretty close to being the truth. You are free to disagree and link any info which points out my bias. Otherwise' it is only your own opinion that is being displayed.

It says they ," estimated that an extra 2.1 million guns sold nationwide between March and May this year are linked to 776 gun-related injuries that would not have occurred without the sales spike."

How do they know those two figures are linked? Appears they are only sharing a opinion. :P

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In relationship to the increased sales of guns, there is this effect also, which is making it very hard or a long time process if one wants to purchase a firearm....
....https://www.foxnews.com/politics/in-...m-no-easy-task

Someone trying to buy a gun in Seattle would be out of luck -- there's almost nowhere to get one. While Washington state has a preemption law regarding guns, meaning that only the state can make gun laws rather than localities, Seattle managed to find a loophole. In 2016 it instituted a steep tax on guns and ammunition sold in the city, which eventually chased out nearly all the gun stores.

"That's been a loser tax in the fact that all the gun shops except for one have left and the one that's remaining there, they have a second location down near Tacoma," Jane Milhans, a longtime gun-rights activist in Washington, told Fox News. "So they can send customers down there to pick up firearms and not have the tax."

And for those with the means to leave the city to get a gun, Milhans says the Washington state gun laws will force them to wait.

"Since July of 2019, if you want to purchase a pistol, for example, you have to get an enhanced background check," Milhans said. "So any first-time buyer who needs a firearm for personal protection is gonna have to buy a can of bear spray to hold them over until they get it."

But Seattle is far from the only place where increased crime, moves to defund the police and difficult processes to get a gun are intersecting.

So this type legislature, helps to encourage gun buyers to seek ways to buy their weapons outside of where they live.

[Eviscero]

They are stating that most of the shootings in NYC was done by legal gun owners? I would have to see the proof on that. If it is true, may have been because of the unlawful actions of criminals trying to harm them.

Lol you are so ignorant and biased. As if legal gun ownership is somehow correlated with being an upstanding person? Get the fuck out of here with that nonsense.

Legal gun ownership is correlated with lots of other things though:

- domestic homicides
https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0722085828.htm


- angry outbursts
https://www.oregonlive.com/today/201...anger%20issues.

- suicides
https://www.rand.org/research/gun-po...y-suicide.html

It's also NOT correlated with less crime overall
https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...vidence-shows/


Why are you so resistent to reality? Your bubble sucks and you know it.

[Ghostpanther]

Lol you are so ignorant and biased. As if legal gun ownership is somehow correlated with being an upstanding person? Get the fuck out of here with that nonsense.

Legal gun ownership is correlated with lots of other things though:

- domestic homicides
https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0722085828.htm


- angry outbursts
https://www.oregonlive.com/today/201...anger%20issues.

- suicides
https://www.rand.org/research/gun-po...y-suicide.html

It's also NOT correlated with less crime overall
https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...vidence-shows/


Why are you so resistent to reality? Your bubble sucks and you know it.

And why can you not disagree with out insults? I know the reason.

There are over 350 million firearms in the US. With tens of millions of owners of firearms. The numbers you post where firearms are misused, represents a very, very small percentage of those who are owned by responsible owners.

I am well aware of your statistics posted and those have been debated in this thread for years. They like to include suicides, yet ignore that Japan with it's much stricter gun laws, have a higher % rate of suicides than the US does.

There are min. of 40 million ( the number more than likely is much higher ) gun owners in the US. But for arguments sake, lets use the 40 million. And lets assume 400,000 cases of misuse of firearms happen on a yearly cycle ( it is more than likely not near that many ). Logic ( common sense ) tells us
that only represents 1% of the gun owners who misuse them. That means 99% have not been proven to have misused them.

Of course with a country like the US which grants it's citizens the Constitutional right to keep and carry firearms for self defense, you are going to have more misuse cases than countries which do not grant such right. Freedoms and Liberties have always came at a price.

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Another recent case of the Second Amendment right in action......https://www.foxnews.com/us/florida-h...truder-sheriff

A homeowner was “utilizing his Second Amendment right to protect himself and his family” when he shot dead a man who broke into his home with a gun, a Florida sheriff said.

The homeowner acted in self-defense when he killed Ronald Fleet, 55, in Land O’Lakes Saturday afternoon, Pasco County Sheriff Chris Nocco said.

“Any loss of life is tragic, but the victim was utilizing his Second Amendment right to protect himself and his family from the fear of Ronald, who was carrying a gun and kicking in the door,” Nocco said, according to Fox 13 Tampa. “I can’t imagine the fear they were going through.”

[Zan15]

And why can you not disagree with out insults? I know the reason.

There are over 350 million firearms in the US. With tens of millions of owners of firearms. The numbers you post where firearms are misused, represents a very, very small percentage of those who are owned by responsible owners.

Hey its only a small number of people dying...only a small number of people's lives ruined....its ok...as long as its not me....

I can see why you are such a hardened Trump supporter he uses the same logic for COVID.

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Another recent case of the Second Amendment right in action......https://www.foxnews.com/us/florida-h...truder-sheriff

A homeowner was “utilizing his Second Amendment right to protect himself and his family” when he shot dead a man who broke into his home with a gun, a Florida sheriff said.

The homeowner acted in self-defense when he killed Ronald Fleet, 55, in Land O’Lakes Saturday afternoon, Pasco County Sheriff Chris Nocco said.

“Any loss of life is tragic, but the victim was utilizing his Second Amendment right to protect himself and his family from the fear of Ronald, who was carrying a gun and kicking in the door,” Nocco said, according to Fox 13 Tampa. “I can’t imagine the fear they were going through.”

More Good Guys with a guns, utilizing their Second Amendment right to protect their homes.


https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2020...year-old-dead/

14-Year-Old Boy Dies After Accidental Shooting In Auburn.


https://www.fox13memphis.com/news/tr...FSNMBQZWD4ZCY/

One man is dead after a gun went off in the parking lot of a zoo in Kansas City, Missouri, police said.

https://www.newhavenindependent.org/...illed_in_hill/

Police Friday afternoon issued an update about the death of an 8-year-old boy in the Hill, confirming that they believe it resulted from an “accidental discharge” of a gun in the home.

https://www.tampabay.com/news/crime/...-deputies-say/

St. Pete man shoot, kills man while ‘playing defensive scenarios

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/...it-police-say/

Teen hospitalized after accidental shooting in Detroit, police say Adults were in the home when teen was shot


https://www.kiro7.com/news/trending/...IO3KWBYDRWAN4/

4-year-old boy dies in accidental shooting in Arkansas

https://www.wral.com/no-charges-to-b...ount/19221996/

Rocky Mount police said an 8-year-old was the victim of an accidental shooting Wednesday night.


https://www.ibtimes.com/2-year-old-a...itical-3025655

2-Year-Old Atlanta Toddler Shoots Himself In Head After Finding Loaded Gun At Home, Critical



Geeze, I did not even get past the first page of google news doing a 7 day search.
Well at least we had that one gun owner feel good story posted by Ghostpanther to cheer us up right?

[Specialka]

Hey its only a small number of people dying...only a small number of people's lives ruined....its ok...as long as its not me....

I can see why you are such a hardened Trump supporter he uses the same logic for COVID.

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More Good Guys with a guns, utilizing their Second Amendment right to protect their homes.


https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2020...year-old-dead/

14-Year-Old Boy Dies After Accidental Shooting In Auburn.


https://www.fox13memphis.com/news/tr...FSNMBQZWD4ZCY/

One man is dead after a gun went off in the parking lot of a zoo in Kansas City, Missouri, police said.

https://www.newhavenindependent.org/...illed_in_hill/

Police Friday afternoon issued an update about the death of an 8-year-old boy in the Hill, confirming that they believe it resulted from an “accidental discharge” of a gun in the home.

https://www.tampabay.com/news/crime/...-deputies-say/

St. Pete man shoot, kills man while ‘playing defensive scenarios

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/...it-police-say/

Teen hospitalized after accidental shooting in Detroit, police say Adults were in the home when teen was shot


https://www.kiro7.com/news/trending/...IO3KWBYDRWAN4/

4-year-old boy dies in accidental shooting in Arkansas

https://www.wral.com/no-charges-to-b...ount/19221996/

Rocky Mount police said an 8-year-old was the victim of an accidental shooting Wednesday night.


https://www.ibtimes.com/2-year-old-a...itical-3025655

2-Year-Old Atlanta Toddler Shoots Himself In Head After Finding Loaded Gun At Home, Critical



Geeze, I did not even get past the first page of google news doing a 7 day search.
Well at least we had that one gun owner feel good story posted by Ghostpanther to cheer us up right?

Why do you bother ? I commend your obstination, but he will just retort that those are only misuse cases. You know, they were not USING THEIR GLORIOUS 2A TO DEFEND THEIR LIFE !

[Zython]

And why can you not disagree with out insults? I know the reason.

There are over 350 million firearms in the US. With tens of millions of owners of firearms. The numbers you post where firearms are misused, represents a very, very small percentage of those who are owned by responsible owners.

Of course with a country like the US which grants it's citizens the Constitutional right to keep and carry firearms for self defense, you are going to have more misuse cases than countries which do not grant such right. Freedoms and Liberties have always came at a price.

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Another recent case of the Second Amendment right in action......https://www.foxnews.com/us/florida-h...truder-sheriff

A homeowner was “utilizing his Second Amendment right to protect himself and his family” when he shot dead a man who broke into his home with a gun, a Florida sheriff said.

The homeowner acted in self-defense when he killed Ronald Fleet, 55, in Land O’Lakes Saturday afternoon, Pasco County Sheriff Chris Nocco said.

“Any loss of life is tragic, but the victim was utilizing his Second Amendment right to protect himself and his family from the fear of Ronald, who was carrying a gun and kicking in the door,” Nocco said, according to Fox 13 Tampa. “I can’t imagine the fear they were going through.”

You know, it's ironic how you're claiming you all are "responsible gun owners" when you all spent the last week in this thread saying that the army should murder me for making fun of you.

[Ghostpanther]

You know, it's ironic how you're claiming you all are "responsible gun owners" when you all spent the last week in this thread saying that the army should murder me for making fun of you.

Link a post I made which said such nonsense. You won't because it does not exist.

Keep making such ridiculous comments and I will use the only other option I have on this forum. I desire discussions with reasonable adults.

[Zython]

Link a post I made which said such nonsense. You won't because it does not exist.

Keep making such ridiculous comments and I will use the only other option I have on this forum. I desire discussions with reasonable adults.

Given that I said "you all", a post by anyone in this thread is fair game.

Here you go.

[Zan15]

Why do you bother ? I commend your obstination, but he will just retort that those are only misuse cases. You know, they were not USING THEIR GLORIOUS 2A TO DEFEND THEIR LIFE !

He has me on ignore too but hey he wants to post the random rare cases where it's not clear anyone's lives would have been lost.... I will post the everyday deaths of having a gun to protect your home.

He has a strange way of celebrating a death when he is so pro life, but that is typical for 2a republicans