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  1. #201
    A prior armed robbery conviction gets factored in.

  2. #202
    I am Murloc! Noxx79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    ]
    No one is stopping you from subsidizing criminals. Just don't try to force others to do so.


    That seems to be the argument.. Which means throwing money at him doesn't accomplish anything except making the person doling out such money appear very foolish.
    By putting them in prison, you are subsidizing criminals. And since my taxes pay for the prison, I am being forced to subsidize criminals. Why do you want to force me to subsidize criminals?
    Throwing money at them doesn’t accomplish anything other than making the person doling out such money appear very foolish.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    A prior armed robbery conviction gets factored in.
    And you'll find nowhere where a prior armed robbery conviction, with no subsequent violent crimes, will justify life in prison for attempted theft of hedge trimmers worth <$100

  4. #204
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noxx79 View Post
    By putting them in prison, you are subsidizing criminals. And since my taxes pay for the prison, I am being forced to subsidize criminals. Why do you want to force me to subsidize criminals?
    Good point. It costs anywhere from 40-80 billion, not to mention the corporations that are profiting off their labor. The prison industrial complex is a big pie with a lot of fingers in it.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by Noxx79 View Post
    By putting them in prison, you are subsidizing criminals. And since my taxes pay for the prison, I am being forced to subsidize criminals. Why do you want to force me to subsidize criminals?
    Throwing money at them doesn’t accomplish anything other than making the person doling out such money appear very foolish.
    And you can petition to change that by putting such on a voting ballot.
    At which point you'd have to be very convincing for the voter to vote in favor of such a change.
    Do you imagine by any stretch that anyone here has been that convincing? Because I hear "armed robbery" as a prior conviction and that vote won't go your way.

  6. #206
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    And you can petition to change that by putting such on a voting ballot.
    At which point you'd have to be very convincing for the voter to vote in favor of such a change.
    Do you imagine by any stretch that anyone here has been that convincing? Because I hear "armed robbery" as a prior conviction and that vote won't go your way.
    The crime bill pushed by Clinton, Biden et al has been a huge disaster no matter how you slice it
    https://www.americanprogress.org/iss...rm-heres-stop/

  7. #207
    I like how 11 pages in and people are still trying to Strawman "we can't just let criminals go free" into it.

    No one is saying "Don't punish criminals"

    What we are talking about is keeping the punishment proportionate to the offense. No crime this man has ever committed justifies a life sentence.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    And you can petition to change that by putting such on a voting ballot.
    At which point you'd have to be very convincing for the voter to vote in favor of such a change.
    Do you imagine by any stretch that anyone here has been that convincing? Because I hear "armed robbery" as a prior conviction and that vote won't go your way.
    You hear "armed robbery" I hear "1987" and "prior conviction"... meaning he already served his sentence for that crime.
    Last edited by Egomaniac; 2020-08-11 at 07:42 PM.

  8. #208
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    It seems like as a culture, we are conditioned to dehumanize prisoners. Here's a good talk on it


    Also consider Danny Trejo, who was in and out of prison for 11 years due to multiple armed robberies and drug offenses. He was able to get help and became a better person for it.

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    And you'll find nowhere where a prior armed robbery conviction, with no subsequent violent crimes, will justify life in prison for attempted theft of hedge trimmers worth <$100
    my god you are dense

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by infinit View Post
    my god you are dense
    Ad hominem attacks just prove how weak your argument is.

  11. #211
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by infinit View Post
    my god you are dense
    Only the US and New Zealand have multiple strikes policies. Only the US and Australia have mandatory minimum sentencing for non-violent crimes. Only a handful of other countries have mandatory minimum sentencing but generally only for murder. Do you think the US needs these policies while other nations don't?

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    My focus was on the workers, doesn't US have enough homeless? Or do u need more to punish rich people that'll stay rich regardless?...

    This is as pointless as sanctions against rich powerful foreign leaders, when sanctions really hit the people instead while claiming to be on their side.

    One can't fix the world with lashing out...
    No, it isn't, stop lying you lier.

    If your focus was on workers you wouldn't;t be making disingenuous neo-liberal arguments that you can't punish the rich because it only hurts the workers. Do you know what else hurts the workers? The status quo or have you not noticed?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    Only the US and New Zealand have multiple strikes policies. Only the US and Australia have mandatory minimum sentencing for non-violent crimes. Only a handful of other countries have mandatory minimum sentencing but generally only for murder. Do you think the US needs these policies while other nations don't?
    It's also worth noting only one territory in Australia has mandatory minimum sentences and has a 300% higher indigenous incarceration rate than any other state.

    Which just goes to show they are both racist and don't work.
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    Ad hominem attacks just prove how weak your argument is.
    he knows full well it was not over clippers and the guy was a serious career criminal who should have been in prison in the first place over the robbery and burglary

  14. #214
    He's been in prison for 23 years.

    That's over twice as long as the combined sentence for all of his prior convictions.

    There are murderers and rapists serving less time than this petty criminal.

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    Only the US and New Zealand have multiple strikes policies. Only the US and Australia have mandatory minimum sentencing for non-violent crimes. Only a handful of other countries have mandatory minimum sentencing but generally only for murder. Do you think the US needs these policies while other nations don't?
    we have dangerous offender laws in canada (three strikes)
    guess who can get on that list.... armed robbers

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by infinit View Post
    he knows full well it was not over clippers and the guy was a serious career criminal who should have been in prison in the first place over the robbery and burglary
    He did go to prison for the armed robbery and burglary. He served his sentence.

    He's been in prison longer for the attempted theft of garden shears than all of his other convictions combined.

  17. #217
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by infinit View Post
    we have dangerous offender laws in canada (three strikes)
    guess who can get on that list.... armed robbers
    He already served 10 years for armed robbery. The debate is if he should receive a life sentence for petty theft. Would he receive life in prison in Canada for petty theft? My understanding is no, he would have to commit another violent crime to even qualify.

  18. #218
    Legendary! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saltysquidoon View Post
    No, it isn't, stop lying you lier.

    If your focus was on workers you wouldn't;t be making disingenuous neo-liberal arguments that you can't punish the rich because it only hurts the workers. Do you know what else hurts the workers? The status quo or have you not noticed?
    Dude, I'm an east european nationalist, don't call me neoliberal, i'm offended..
    You can punish the rich, all u want that caused the mess, but we are talking about not letting their companies sink along with all their workers.
    I couldn't give a rat's ass about some wall-street scumbags...

  19. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by infinit View Post
    we have dangerous offender laws in canada (three strikes)
    guess who can get on that list.... armed robbers
    And if he had committed armed robbery 3 times...then maybe you'd have an argument. You don't get on the dangerous offender list for stealing garden shears and forging checks.

    Also, most people on the "dangerous offender" list in Canada are on there because of sex crimes. This guy isn't a rapist. He isn't violent.

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    He already served 10 years for armed robbery. The debate is if he should receive a life sentence for petty theft. Would he receive life in prison in Canada for petty theft? My understanding is no, he would have to commit another violent crime to even qualify.
    he served time ( but not enough apparently ) as when got out he was caught with stolen items, robbed a house, forged a check, and stole some gardening tools.

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