“Subraces” available in Shadowlands

[FlubberPuddy]

it's comparable because Thalo'dan Privateers quests can only be done by Horde players! and Captain Thalo'thas Brightsun's quest was updated in Cata therefore we have that they are enemies of the alliance and friends of the horde in different expa.

the scale may be different but in essence it is the same case a group affiliated with the alliance and another group with the horde

If you believe this to be true then you'd be agreeing that Goblins are also a part of the Alliance and should be playable. That's what your logic is saying.

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The best thing Blizz could do would be to have the entire Silver Covenant join the Void Elves. That would put an end to any and all redundancy and confusion. And sand gnomes are just a hallucination, pretty sure.

There's never been confusion, only people who have wanted to minimize what the Silver Covenant are so that they could pretend High Elves don't exist on Alliance. Sounds very much like flat-earther logic imo.

[Rhlor]

If you believe this to be true then you'd be agreeing that Goblins are also a part of the Alliance and should be playable. That's what your logic is saying.

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There's never been confusion, only people who have wanted to minimize what the Silver Covenant are so that they could pretend High Elves don't exist on Alliance. Sounds very much like flat-earther logic imo.

I don't know of a goblin faction affiliated with the alliance but I would agree that green eyes will be added to the void elves because there is a group of blood elves affiliated with the void elves.

Thalo'dan Privateers exist as an organization.

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The best thing Blizz could do would be to have the entire Silver Covenant join the Void Elves. That would put an end to any and all redundancy and confusion. And sand gnomes are just a hallucination, pretty sure.

I am in favor of the silver covenant joining the void elves. I also want to see high elves npcs on silvermoon

[Alanar]

I also saw many alliance players trying to deny the blood elves blue eyes, it was a war between two very toxic groups! In my personal case I always thought that if they give high elves to the alliance they would have to give us something to the horde just as good as humans from Alterac

Oo oof.. well you are talking about 2 groups.., but honestly it was just the fancrazyness that made them grow into
this toxic grp where nothing but playable high elves was the goal.. anything that stands in our way...should be destroyed.

It was just 1 group.. vs any naysayer( which were mostly random posters who hop in and out.. but nothing organized.

So glad that shit is over.. so many people here have build a wall.. I mean reputation for themselves for being known in the high elf thread.

[Nuggsy]

Sin'dorei and Quel'dorei both fall under the High Elf umbrella despite what many here will argue. Sin'dorei changed their name to honor those lost. They didn't become a different race and while their magic source did change for a bit it didn't warp them enough to become a completely different elf like for instance Ren'dorei.

But all n' all, pretty good list.

[Mace]

Canonically, not all the high elves went the way of the blood elf. Otherwise, there would be no void elves, no high elves, no silver covenant, and Valeera Windrunner would have green eyes, not blue. You're only telling half the story. Leaving out vital content is very unbecoming.

Some people specialise in that, especially when it comes to elves, and they'll bite your head off and draw you into long winded pointless rabbit holes to push their very selectively presented palette. They are either time wasters or bossy unrelenting know it alls incapable of accepting anything they don't like or agree with. But it's a fantasy world that really encourages you to take only what you wanna believe and be creative with it, however they take it too far..

Just keep pointing out the other parts of the story they ignore, it's the best you can do, they may not listen, but at least other less familiar with it all, come away with a bit more informed opinion.

[Mehrunes]

Is this what has been going on in that High Elves thread for so long ? Retconing and headcanoning to make an elf lore that suits your opinions ?

Because I come from a place free from this echo chamber and High elves are just guys who never partake in mana tap and found other ways to resist the magic hunger. Since they did not agree with what their brothers and sisters who renamed themselves as "blood elves" were doing, they just chose to stay close from the Alliance. Them being not playable is not really proof they weren't indeed in the Alliance.

If we are to talk about lore, please don't indulge in the global headcanons of your communities.

The irony of your self-aggrandizing nonsense of a post is just sublime. https://wow.gamepedia.com/The_Warcra...of_the_Sunwell

I mean it's always fun when people start saying that all the Alliance High Elven groups aren't "technically" alliance. Sure they are faction tagged alliance and hostile to the Horde, but they are not really alliance. *eyeroll*

First of all, I said that "not all High Elven groups are Alliance" not that "all High Elven groups aren't technically Alliance". Which are two completely different statements. The fact that you have to twist what I said so severely to write your diatribe about what you find funny makes the validity of everything what followed disappear into a poof of smoke.

In the Shadow of the Sun makes it crystal clear that the folks at Quel'Lithien were on their own all that time since Lor'Themar exiled the malcontents ignoring the teachings of their sovereign. What piece of lore do you have showing them ever joining the Alliance? Oh, that's right, you don't have one and that's why you instead have to resort to harping about in-game faction tags, even though they are oftentimes used to merely portray a disposition rather than actual membership.

Wildhammers have been tagged Alliance since vanilla as well. Yet in Cataclysm Kurdan was uniting the Wildhammers under the Alliance banner. How could that be if they were totes legit already Alliance, hmm? Or, to fully drive the point home, Baine was recently tagged Alliance in one quest. Does it make him Alliance, jokes aside? Eyeroll when you actually have a something to stand on, otherwise it achieves the complete opposite result of what you intended.

That's not even the point tho. The facts are pretty simple; "High Elves" only exist in their own groups as either alliance members, or neutral ones. There's literally no organization of Horde High Elves by that name because they are called Blood Elves.

Of course there are individuals that cross these distinctions, but as much as there is no organization of High Elves on the Horde, there's no organization of Blood Elves on the alliance. But like, almost every race has neutral organizations that don't partake on the faction conflict.

Of course that's not the point. Because you don't actually have one here. The blue eyed Horde Thalassians in SL are most certainly not supposed to represent entire organizations, making what you said here completely irrelevant. And just because the remaining High Elf groups in general are Alliance that doesn't mean squat for the individuals.

Again, the Allerian Stronghold High Elves from Alliance Expedition already reached out to Quel'Thalas and tried reconciliation. All the way back in WotLK. The blue eyed Thalassians can be on the Horde, representing the individuals who decided to fully commit to that already tried reconciliation, while still identifying as High Elves. Just like Valeera is a Blood Elf despite having no ties to the Horde and being a sworn servant of House Wrynn.

[DatToffer]

The irony of your self-aggrandizing nonsense of a post is just sublime. https://wow.gamepedia.com/The_Warcra...of_the_Sunwell

I'm happy to say, I read your link and saw nothing wrong in what I said. I was really worried that some of my memories were wrong or worse, retconned.

[Mehrunes]

I'm happy to say, I read your link and saw nothing wrong in what I said. I was really worried that some of my memories were wrong or worse, retconned.

Uh-huh.

Prince Kael'thas returned home and rallied all the survivors he could find: approximately 90% of the surviving high elves. He declared that these survivors would now bear a new name--the blood elves--in honor of their fallen people. The blood elves no longer consider themselves high elves, and they have different priorities and behaviors than their high elf kindred.

In consequence, there are so few high elves left on Azeroth today that they cannot be considered a race in anything other than the biological sense. High elves do not gather in any significant numbers, nor do they act as a coordinated whole. They are a very small group of individuals scattered all over the world. As such, they do not have common opinions or goals. Indeed, modern high elves cannot even truly be said to have a culture--only a past filled with glory and regret.

This totally matches your point that the High Elves are "just guys who never partake in mana tap and found other ways to resist the magic hunger" rather than my argument that "The people that remained High Elves after Kael renamed the race are first and foremost the surviving High Elves that Kael could not reach and organize."

[DatToffer]

This totally matches your point that the High Elves are "just guys who never partake in mana tap and found other ways to resist the magic hunger" rather than my argument that "The people that remained High Elves after Kael renamed the race are first and foremost the surviving High Elves that Kael could not reach and organize."

Because we're both right on that matter maybe ?

"A crucial difference between high elves and blood elves is that no high elves have decided to feed their hunger for arcane magic by draining that magic from alternative sources (now that the Sunwell is useless)."

[Mehrunes]

Because we're both right on that matter maybe ?

"A crucial difference between high elves and blood elves is that no high elves have decided to feed their hunger for arcane magic by draining that magic from alternative sources (now that the Sunwell is useless)."

Which I can't recall denying. But as that quote explicitly states, the High Elf-Blood Elf split predates Kael leaving for Outland. I.e. it obviously also predates him sending Rommath back with the mana drain proclamation. So, pray tell, which part of what I said in my first post is "the global headcanon of my community" (whatever the hell that is even supposed to be), hmm?

[Maxilian]

Sand Gnome, the druidic and shamanistic reverse of the technological Gnomeregan gnome.
Can natively be Warrior, Druid, Rogue, Shaman, Hunter, and with Monk and Death Knight as learned/lore classes.

When it comes to skin and hair options, you can say we got them, we are missing the class selection and more armor that could "represent" their culture, though we have some with the Uldum items.

[DatToffer]

Which I can't recall denying. But as that quote explicitly states, the High Elf-Blood Elf split predates Kael leaving for Outland. I.e. it obviously also predates him sending Rommath back with the mana drain proclamation. So, pray tell, which part of what I said in my first post is "the global headcanon of my community" (whatever the hell that is even supposed to be), hmm?

Mostly the part about Alliance allegiance. Because you say "being a High Elf has squat to do with being Alliance.", and then you make a list of HE groups that are indeed Alliance inclined. But Alliance inclined is Alliance enough to be considered "Alliance" and I think we're just stuck with the difference between what Blizzard says and what they actually show (they say HE left the Alliance, but shows HE being allied to them). Like Wildhammers, they weren't part of the Alliance for a bit, but were tied closely enough with it that we could consider them Alliance. (Alliance as in not Horde and not neutral, I guess) Kul Tiras was pretty similar imo, they didn't join the Alliance per se, but were not isolated to the point they didn't accept visitors from this faction.

Maybe it has to do with military presence. You're not truly considered part of the Alliance until you decide to unite your forces to them.

Funny bits, you say that Silver Covenant doesn't count because they didn't exist until woltk, then you say HE can come back to Quel'thalas since woltk. It's like you just pick situations from time frames that suit you. But in that case, of course none of it will matter in SL, because HE will be able to chose between Horde or Alliance as they please.

[Mehrunes]

Mostly the part about Alliance allegiance. Because you say "being a High Elf has squat to do with being Alliance.", and then you make a list of HE groups that are indeed Alliance inclined. But Alliance inclined is Alliance enough to be considered "Alliance" and I think we're just stuck with the difference between what Blizzard says and what they actually show (they say HE left the Alliance, but shows HE being allied to them). Like Wildhammers, they weren't part of the Alliance for a bit, but were tied closely enough with it that we could consider them Alliance. (Alliance as in not Horde and not neutral, I guess) Kul Tiras was pretty similar imo, they didn't join the Alliance per se, but were not isolated to the point they didn't accept visitors from this faction.

Maybe it has to do with military presence. You're not truly considered part of the Alliance until you decide to unite your forces to them.

Funny bits, you say that Silver Covenant doesn't count because they didn't exist until woltk, then you say HE can come back to Quel'thalas since woltk. It's like you just pick situations from time frames that suit you. But in that case, of course none of it will matter in SL, because HE will be able to chose between Horde or Alliance as they please.

Right. Except not only were not all of the groups in that list Alliance, but as I explicitly stated, those that joined Alliance did so only after the split has happened (with me then pointing out when each group the groups that rejoined the Alliance did so), because at the time of the split Thalassians weren't in the Alliance to begin with. So please, do explain how being Alliance is so fundamental to their identity that they were already High Elves before they rejoined the Alliance?

So it's like you didn't even understand what I was saying and now you're throwing a fit because your misunderstanding of what I said somehow offended you. The best example being your utterly nonsensical last paragraph. Where did I say that the Silver Covenant "doesn't count", for example? And what does me pointing out the goddamn fact that Silver Covenant was created only in WotLK have to do with the other fact that a completely different group of High Elves tried to reconcile with the Blood Elves in WotLK?

[DatToffer]

So please, do explain how being Alliance is so fundamental to their identity that they were already High Elves before they rejoined the Alliance?

Welp, it's just the way they were shown in the game for all these years up until SL.

[Heartbreaker23]

If they're part of the alliance why haven't we seen them in 15 years? You would've thought that they would've helped out in any of all the wars

We see them all the time. Stop lying.

[qwerty123456]

Except being a High Elf has squat to do with being Alliance. The split happened after Quel'Thalas as a whole already withdrew from the Alliance and High Elves right now being affiliated with the Alliance (which they had to rejoin) is only incidental. Membership in the Alliance isn't even something that's a shared trait for each and every High Elf group.

The people that remained High Elves after Kael renamed the race are first and foremost the surviving High Elves that Kael could not reach and organize. That's all. Then a bunch of exiles at Quel'Lithien Lodge returned to the High Elf moniker and they never rejoined the Alliance. After the Third War (i.e. after the split) Quel'Danil Lodge allied with the Wildhammers (who themselves were at best Alliance in name only at the time) for the sake of survival. Silver Covenant didn't even exist until the start of Wrath and prior to that its would-be members were citizens of Dalaran, which at the time pretty much withdrew not just from the Alliance but from world affairs in general, hiding in a safety bubble. And the High Elves in Outland were stuck with the Alliance because they were part of Alleria's AWOL squad that joined the Alliance expedition on their own, completely unaware about the fate of their kingdom or that the split took place.

There's nothing preventing a High Elf from reuniting with Quel'Thalas. We've already seen some try to do so back in WotLK.




Most of the Thalassians that renamed High Elves are just people Kael couldn't organize. Because they weren't even in Quel'Thalas at the point. The only exiles that we know of were the lot at Quel'Lithien Lodge. And given how all of them sans one person turned into Wretched and got exterminated at behest of the one that did not share this fate, I'm not sure what lesson is there to be learned here for the Blood Elves.

First off there were actually a couple that survived Quel'Lithien Lodge. And given the fact that one even made it to Pandaria its possible many more had left.

Second the high elves of the alliance still refused to drain creatures which is why Lor'themar kicked out the other high elves. You really think he would have been open arms to them after he kicked out others for the same reason? Sure maybe now that they don't have to drain creatures to feed their addiction they might let high elves join them

And don't forget that Lor'themar felt sad after visiting(before they became wretched) and learning all the horrible shit that happened to the Quel'Lithien like the horde attacking and killing many of them. Why would he do the same thing knowing they either become Alliance or would suffer a horrible fate? Hell even many of his own people disagree with him which is why there are many blood elves that go to Telogrus Rift knowing full well research into the void leads to banishment.

[Ardenaso]

I'd love to have nu-Vrykul like a Thornspeaker for Kul Tirans

and I can't stress this enough: any blue eyed self-proclaimed High Elf prancing around Silvermoon deserves to get punched in the face and lynched in Murder Row for not taking up the name that honors their fallen brethren

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on the other hand, there's really nothing special on Alliance High Elves other than wearing blue and getting assimilated into human culture but nonetheless RP as much as you want; and I say this as a former hefa extremist

also, I'd love grey skinned former Blackrock on Orc

[Mace]

I'd love to have nu-Vrykul like a Thornspeaker for Kul Tirans

and I can't stress this enough: any blue eyed self-proclaimed High Elf prancing around Silvermoon deserves to get punched in the face and lynched in Murder Row for not taking up the name that honors their fallen brethren

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on the other hand, there's really nothing special on Alliance High Elves other than wearing blue and getting assimilated into human culture but nonetheless RP as much as you want; and I say this as a former hefa extremist

also, I'd love grey skinned former Blackrock on Orc

Hefa extremist? What's that.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

How many people in this forum say that silver covanent is an alliance organization when they are a faction of dalaran a neutral city? when you finish the quest the horde player is an honor member of the Thalo'dan Privateers. they are horde as silver covenant is alliance.

I think it's fair to acknowledge that both sides have high elves!

Yes, The Silver Covenant is a neutral faction, despite being alliance tagged and hostile to the Horde, despite Vereesa showing up even during Legion as an alliance Leader.

"The Silver Covenant is actually neutral" is perhaps the dumbest take people keep propagating and I loose immediate respect for anyone who brings it up.

The sheer delusion of comparing the SC to the Thalo'dan's Privateers is a new kind of crazy, so thanks for that. Like the audacity to thinks there's an equivalence between neutral pirates that request Horde help and a faction of elves that keeps showing up through multiple expansions to support the alliance is downright hilarious.

[Ardenaso]

Hefa extremist? What's that.

High Elves For the Alliance

but enough helf talk, this is sub-race topic

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even though it's not really a sub-race I'd love to have Dalarani customizations for Stormwindian and Forsaken like magical runic tattoos and long wizard beard