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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by PenguinChan View Post
    Remains to be seen, as the writers might pull a Kerrigan.
    I mean I am afraid they are that stupid these are blizzard writers. Attempted genocide is ok so long as you say sorry afterwards.

  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    It never made much sense anyway tbh
    Why has it never made much sense?

  3. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by RefinedMadness View Post
    WoW, Just WOW!
    How is this remotely a "WOW" situation? I get some find it interesting, but it is most certainly not a "WOW" thing.

    They revised something that was poorly written. BFD.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by unbound View Post
    How is this remotely a "WOW" situation? I get some find it interesting, but it is most certainly not a "WOW" thing.

    They revised something that was poorly written. BFD.
    How does the word "Bitch" make it poorly written?

  5. #165
    It was always a little weird tbh. The inflection didn't seem very casual. We also didn't see it done again. Was the swaering to keep the age rating up back then? It being removed now after so long is a little odd, but the new leveling revamp is a good a reason as any to go back and adjust it. But this also kind of brings up a question of if Sylvanas and Garrosh will interact in Shadowlands and if removing this was necessary to allow their relationship to be a bit different.

  6. #166
    People, as per usual for MMO-Champion, are completely missing the point here.

    Back when Cataclysm came out, Garrosh's "bitch" line was applauded on the forums because it signified a move towards a darker & grittier standard of storytelling. There are many examples of PG 18+ stuff in Cataclysm. After the kid-friendly fantasy of Vanilla, TBC and WotLK, maybe people were excited for this darker & grittier Warcraft.

    By removing this line, Blizzard is completely gutting Cataclysm's legacy and fully committing themselves to writing a story where instead of badasses like Garrosh, pre-MoP Thrall, Varian and Deathwing we have pacified SJW-approved characters like Anduin and Baine.

    Many of us are not happy about the direction the story is going in.

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by OrcsRLame View Post
    He was Orc Hitler, and you're gonna yikes over him calling a bitch a bitch? Christ.
    No, vulgar language like that is a rarity in blizzard games, thats why it was out of place, even when he said it it felt forced, like they added it in there to try and sound more impactful but instead you cringe at it.

  8. #168
    I get the outrage, but I subjectively like this change. The line felt out of place in WoW.

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathranis View Post
    I don't know, it always kind of felt out of place to me for the setting. I felt the same in TFT when Sylvanas told Arthas, "Give my regards to hell, you son of a bitch."
    In that usage of the word seems more understanding with what arthas did to Sylvanas.

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Why has it never made much sense?
    It was out of character, especially for an orc, to basically use a "human" insult. It would have made more sense if her insulted her in Orcish - it always seemed pretty random, as he never used that kind of language previously and never did again.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Wilfire View Post
    People, as per usual for MMO-Champion, are completely missing the point here.

    Back when Cataclysm came out, Garrosh's "bitch" line was applauded on the forums because it signified a move towards a darker & grittier standard of storytelling. There are many examples of PG 18+ stuff in Cataclysm. After the kid-friendly fantasy of Vanilla, TBC and WotLK, maybe people were excited for this darker & grittier Warcraft.

    By removing this line, Blizzard is completely gutting Cataclysm's legacy and fully committing themselves to writing a story where instead of badasses like Garrosh, pre-MoP Thrall, Varian and Deathwing we have pacified SJW-approved characters like Anduin and Baine.

    Many of us are not happy about the direction the story is going in.
    The absolute dramatics. Nobody really cares if a few of you "aren't happy", like you're some great connoisseurs of storytelling - if you're not happy then don't play/buy into it Cataclysm was the absolute worst, so there's not much to remove honestly.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by RefinedMadness View Post
    If the issue was Blizzard doing some sort of errata then many things could be changed to add some polish to decade old dialogues. The word seemed out place yet not at all out of character. The shock value of it made for a very memorable scene which leads me to believe it was deliberately added for emphasis. Besides, as others in the replies have pointed out, the word itself was said by the Sylvanas in WCIII so there is a precedent in older lore.
    Making something memorable and shocking and emphatic with profanity doesn't make it good. And the precedent being there doesn't necessarily make it okay. I'll admit, I know very little about WC3 and the general mood/tone/atmosphere of that game. For all I know about the RTS games, it could've very well been both in-character and tone-fitting for Sylvanas to call Arthas(?) a son of a bitch. But that doesn't change the fact that in Cataclysm, whether or not it was in-character, I don't believe it was tone-fitting. Not for WoW's general tone and way of having characters speak, and not for that scene in particular. I think we can agree to disagree on that.

    I don't know what Blizzard might be doing quietly to polish old dialogues. Sure, there's things here and there that could be changed. Maybe there's some things here and there that have been changed already and nobody notices. But of course people are going to notice when one of the bigger and more shocking and memorable stains gets suddenly cleaned up, nevermind how poorly it was done.

  12. #172
    "Bitch" always felt forced, he should've called her a more old-school term.

    But by all means, don't let that stop manchildren and anti-SWJs from making this into a big thing. They don't even understand the irony in their behaviour.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    It was out of character, especially for an orc, to basically use a "human" insult. It would have made more sense if her insulted her in Orcish - it always seemed pretty random, as he never used that kind of language previously and never did again.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The absolute dramatics. Nobody really cares if a few of you "aren't happy", like you're some great connoisseurs of storytelling - if you're not happy then don't play/buy into it Cataclysm was the absolute worst, so there's not much to remove honestly.
    Yeah shitting on old fans to appease Twitter SJWs who are only interested in the lore as far as it gives them characters to ship (Shaw / Flynn, Nathanos / Sylvanas, Lor'themar / Thalyssra) will surely go over well.

    Warcraft is about badass wars. Not sappy romances.

  14. #174
    You know what's really silly about this?

    Back when this line was uttered Sylvanas was pretty much the only female character who didn't act rashly or overly emotional like the old sexist trope of women in power implies. Compared to Jaina who was always displayed as a character who primarily made judgements based on her emotions, Sylvanas acted the way she did to secure the existence of the Forsaken people which made her appear as a level-headed albeit cold-hearted character and a competent leader.

    The word 'bitch' is used to draw a parallel between the recipient and a female dog that acts based on raw impulse/instinct in order to discredit and degrade them as overly emotional, unpredictable and aggressive. Furthermore it's usually used by men who see their male dominance threatened by women.

    The real joke is that while they can whitewash words like that from past dialogues, they actually turned Sylvanas into a 'bitch' according to the definition I gave above, since in recent lore it was revealed that she did everything she did out of a feeling of being wronged by the world i.e. she's a villain because she is an emotional woman.

    This is the irony of this entire discussion. They remove the language for being problematic/sexist but they push the character that was addressed by that language into the age-old sexist trope that is described by the word.

    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    It was out of character, especially for an orc, to basically use a "human" insult. It would have made more sense if her insulted her in Orcish - it always seemed pretty random, as he never used that kind of language previously and never did again.
    You do realize that the entire dialogue is in Orcish, right? You have to assume that he used the Orcish equivalent of the word as with every other word. This argument stems from a lack of understand about how fantasy languages work.

    Quote Originally Posted by Queen of Hamsters View Post
    "Bitch" always felt forced, he should've called her a more old-school term.
    I have yet to see a single actual argument for why the term is forced/unfitting/whatever. The term is pretty old-school and dates back to the 15th century (not that it should matter in any way).
    Last edited by Nerovar; 2020-08-27 at 01:30 PM.

  15. #175
    What they need to do is remove that entire zone, as well as the rest of the cata leveling experience. It's far past time for a revamp.
    change can't wait.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Neversage View Post
    I get the outrage, but I subjectively like this change. The line felt out of place in WoW.
    Why?

    It's literally a removal of one expletive word that didn't fit in the first place... how can anyone think any kind of outrage over this is justified
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cavox View Post
    I want Activision-Blizzard to burn, but for crimes against gaming, not because they got me too'd.

  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by united View Post
    What they need to do is remove that entire zone, as well as the rest of the cata leveling experience. It's far past time for a revamp.
    Agreed!

    And this time, they shouldn't tie the revamp so heavily into a specific expansion. Make it about local threats and stories.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Azerate View Post
    Why?

    It's literally a removal of one expletive word that didn't fit in the first place... how can anyone think any kind of outrage over this is justified
    - Cuz SjWs are infringing on muh rights to infantile content so I simply must bitch and whine to balance the universe!!!!!11

    Or something along those lines. There's not a whole lot of logic behind this kind of outrage, only emotions.

  18. #178
    you mean bitch? is that the new n-word in your community?
    None of us really changes over time. We only become more fully what we are.

  19. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by Wilfire View Post
    People, as per usual for MMO-Champion, are completely missing the point here.

    Back when Cataclysm came out, Garrosh's "bitch" line was applauded on the forums because it signified a move towards a darker & grittier standard of storytelling. There are many examples of PG 18+ stuff in Cataclysm. After the kid-friendly fantasy of Vanilla, TBC and WotLK, maybe people were excited for this darker & grittier Warcraft.

    By removing this line, Blizzard is completely gutting Cataclysm's legacy and fully committing themselves to writing a story where instead of badasses like Garrosh, pre-MoP Thrall, Varian and Deathwing we have pacified SJW-approved characters like Anduin and Baine.

    Many of us are not happy about the direction the story is going in.
    1) You're reading too much into it
    2) Who the fuck actually cares

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by Wilfire View Post
    Yeah shitting on old fans to appease Twitter SJWs who are only interested in the lore as far as it gives them characters to ship (Shaw / Flynn, Nathanos / Sylvanas, Lor'themar / Thalyssra) will surely go over well.

    Warcraft is about badass wars. Not sappy romances.
    Jesus christ, no one is shitting on you. The drama is real.
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