[Spoilers] Shadowlands: Afterlives Cinematic Discussion

[AwkwardSquirtle]

OK boys, tin-foil hat time.

"The Light has made a pact with the enemy of all."

"KILL HER KILL HER KILL HER SHE SERVES THE TRUE ENEMY."

"Light, save my soul."

"Not vengeance, Justice."

"So, the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived."

"She sensed a familiar presence. Recognized it. The taunting voice that had once held her in its grasp. Arthas? Arthas Menethil? Here?"

The Light is working with the Jailer, and through Uther's aid they gave him the anima he needed to begin his plan. Arthas was the only other soul Sylvanas saw in the Maw. Perhaps he was the only one who had been sent there in a long time. That anima boost was all he needed to claim a second soul. One who he could help him achieve his aims by returning to Azeroth.

[TheTaurenChieftain]

Trolls get Bwonland, which is... in freaking Ardenweald instead of somewhere else that's more shamanistic. Feels showhorned to me

(But hey, at least their afterlife is true/real! /s)

Really?? I didnt read too much into Shadowlands. But I think Necrolords would fit Bwonsamdi better than Aerdenwald. I don't think Aerdenwald really works that good with Bwonsamdi. Blizz writing often seems all over the place. Nothing seems to be really consistent.

It really feels like the shoehorned all the savage horde races to fit into the other covenants, which all fell "human, undead or elven" themed.

Nothing anchestral or maybe "zen" themed (for Pandarens). There are races and characters which perfectly fit into the theme of all the covenants and then there are characters which don't fit into most of the covenants at all.

I mean the Tauren talk with the ghosts of their anchestors all the time. How does this work with the whole Shadowland theme? Do shamanistic anchestral souls remain on Azeroth instead of going into the Shadowlands? But in the end I have the feeling Blizzard doesn't really care about Tauren lore at all. Tauren never really play an important role in the story (other than Baine).

[Timester]

Does anyone else find it interesting how Arthas' soul in the Shadowlands is never conscious, but a limp body? Really weird and I assume that will be a plot point.

We know that all souls are first sent to the Arbiter, so their fates can be decided. It is shown with Uther, he woke up already at Bastion.

Arthas was taken directly to the Maw.

[LemonDemonGirl]

Really?? I didnt read too much into Shadowlands. But I think Necrolords would fit Bwonsamdi better than Aerdenwald. I don't think Aerdenwald really works that good with Bwonsamdi. Blizz writing often seems all over the place. Nothing seems to be really consistent.

Well, the Necrolords seem to be war-like and deal with Necromancy, something Bwon boi hates. He's not a fighter either, he carries a staff around (for some damn reason) and uses magic. The only time I've seen him try and actually 'fight' per se is during Rastakhan's raid encounter (he runs around swiping people with his bony fingers), but other than that, nope. The Shadowlands are supposed to be infinite too, so where is the ancestral afterlife? It would be a 'Lore lol' for them to make one right?

It really feels like the shoehorned all the savage horde races to fit into the other covenants, which all fell "human, undead or elven" themed.

Nothing anchestral or maybe "zen" themed (for Pandarens). There are races and characters which perfectly fit into the theme of all the covenants and then there are characters which don't fit into most of the covenants at all.

I mean the Tauren talk with the ghosts of their anchestors all the time. How does this work with the whole Shadowland theme? Do shamanistic anchestral souls remain on Azeroth instead of going into the Shadowlands? But in the end I have the feeling Blizzard doesn't really care about Tauren lore at all. Tauren never really play an important role in the story (other than Baine).

A Zen 'knowledge' one would be perfect for Pandaren now that I think about it.


Poor Orcs and Tauren, Shamans are said to talk to their ancestors, and how can they if they're being brainwashed/tortured/reincarnated? Seems like a Plot hole to me

[bagina]

So... the way I see it it went somewhat like this:


-Early Shadowlands before the Jailer was the Jailer banished and the Maw "wasn't called the Maw", Eternal ones rule together in peace (?) ->
-???->
-the Jailer is banished and is butthurt about it ->
-the Jailer becomes the Jailer and the Maw becomes what it is today->
-the Jailer wants revenge->
-Natrezim are given the Lich King artefacts (possibly by the Jailer himself) ->
-The Frostmourne consumes its first soul - the beginning of troubles with the Death, dead rise and the balance is disturbed, (the Jailer grows in power?) ->
-the whole deal with Kyrian Uther->
-Arthas dies and Frostmourne is destroyed releasing the souls trapped in it (could mean something)->
-Sylvanas dies and forms an alliance with the Jailer->
-???
-Sylvanas and Jailer break the Arbiter (the machine of Death) for good/ souls go straight to the Maw(?)->
-BfA happens, Jailer grows in strength->
-Shadowlands trailer happens


I forgot where I was going with this lol.

[Dannihilate]

Really?? I didnt read too much into Shadowlands. But I think Necrolords would fit Bwonsamdi better than Aerdenwald. I don't think Aerdenwald really works that good with Bwonsamdi. Blizz writing often seems all over the place. Nothing seems to be really consistent.

It really feels like the shoehorned all the savage horde races to fit into the other covenants, which all fell "human, undead or elven" themed.

Nothing anchestral or maybe "zen" themed (for Pandarens). There are races and characters which perfectly fit into the theme of all the covenants and then there are characters which don't fit into most of the covenants at all.

I mean the Tauren talk with the ghosts of their anchestors all the time. How does this work with the whole Shadowland theme? Do shamanistic anchestral souls remain on Azeroth instead of going into the Shadowlands? But in the end I have the feeling Blizzard doesn't really care about Tauren lore at all. Tauren never really play an important role in the story (other than Baine).

It's likely because Bwon is a Loa, and most Loa are Wild Gods and Wild Gods go to Aerdenwald.

I completely agree that there doesn't seem to be a good "primal" afterlife that fits Shaman or Tauren, but then we haven't seen them all either. At this point in Shadowlands we're only seeing 5 of the realms of death, and there are countless realms mentioned in the beta.

[Selah]

Remember when the Naaru, beings of pure light, took the soul of a fallen crusader/paladin to the "afterlife" while leveling in Icecrown?

Uther being in the Shadowlands makes no sense. Actually, everything happening in the Shadowlands makes no sense right now. I mean, that's part of the intrigue of a new expansion but they're intentionally choosing someone who should be in the light's version of the afterlife.

[Qstall]

I like these shorts but I really don't care for any of the covenants or the characters shown here

I'll watch them anyway

Right? Bunch of never heard of angels, some archon. none of which we ever heard about

[formerShandalay]

There's a whole lot of hints that the Shadowlands don't care for either Void of Light -maybe because Void and Light created the physical universe- but it's clear that the Void wants to get a foothold, and the light itself is reaching Revendreth.

So are Light and Shadow trying to get a foothold there?

Has the Jailer picked a side? Does this all connect to Calia being reanimated by the Light? Is it relevant to her relationship to Arthas?

IS THE LIGHT ALLYING ITSELF WITH DEATH AND HAS BEEN USING THE MENETHILS AS PAWNS? First Arthas descent into madness, delivering him unto unddeath, and now Calia as their combined agent??

Well, there is a Naaru imprisoned in Revendreth. What if it's the same kind of 'imprisonment' that M'uru suffered? Like, getting yourself imprisoned to later be in the exact same place that you need to be in order to make people 'see the light' again? ^^

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Well, there is a Naaru imprisoned in Revendreth. What if it's the same kind of 'imprisonment' that M'uru suffered? Like, getting yourself imprisoned to later be in the exact same place that you need to be in order to make people 'see the light' again? ^^

They do like to trojan horse themselves into converting people

[Hugnomo]

OK boys, tin-foil hat time.

"The Light has made a pact with the enemy of all."

"KILL HER KILL HER KILL HER SHE SERVES THE TRUE ENEMY."

"Light, save my soul."

"Not vengeance, Justice."

"So, the Light's vaunted justice has finally arrived."

"She sensed a familiar presence. Recognized it. The taunting voice that had once held her in its grasp. Arthas? Arthas Menethil? Here?"

The Light is working with the Jailer, and through Uther's aid they gave him the anima he needed to begin his plan. Arthas was the only other soul Sylvanas saw in the Maw. Perhaps he was the only one who had been sent there in a long time. That anima boost was all he needed to claim a second soul. One who he could help him achieve his aims by returning to Azeroth.

Yes I think this makes sense. Uther may inadvertently have given the Maw the anima/soul it needed to grow/unravel its plan.

[Magnagarde]

I think that Uther throwing Arthas into the Maw is what broke the Shadowlands' mechanism. He would have been able to shed memories of his mortal life had he not ascended before Arthas was defeated atop of ICC; he ascended before he was ready and instead of allowing the Arbiter to decide Arthas' fate, Devos and Uther made the decision instead, leading to the disruption of the Shadowlands.

It would also explain/shed some sense into why Sylvanas went directly to the Jailer after she tossed herself off of Icecrown Citadel because her soul is the, chronologically, first soul whose departure for the Maw we have lore confirmation for. Seeing as she died shortly after Arthas was already dead, it makes sense that Arthas being thrown into the Maw is what broke the Shadowlands because she fell victim to the Jailer sometime soon after that.

[Trollokdamus]

So with this image
I strongly believe we will help Uther reclaim his other half of his soul. This could be the reason for the update to his tomb.

Interesting, so this is how Blizzard decided to address the Uther controversy. Still a retcon, but at least not a complete one as it seemed before. I still have questions though. Why exactly was his soul divided? And also, does every soul claimed by the Frostmourne get divided in the same way? If so, we may theoretically encounter the "good side" of Sylvanas who was never made a banshee and of Arthas himself.

[Syegfryed]

"i see only darkness"

"actually see two light angels"

smh

Well i didn't expect this to be that long, still think they are forcing the rule of cool way too much and it gets a bit cheesy not in the good way, not convinced with this uther soul division shenanigans, but i guess this show the division in bastion. Archon must be up in some shit, may end up being the real villain with the Janitor.

[tommyhil622]

So Uther's soul splintered. One went to the shadowlands the other part was in Frostmourne. When he returns to Azeroth (waiting for Arthas to die) Frostmourne is destroyed and it released the souls that were trapped there, shouldn't Uther be whole again? or is there two Uthers now?

- - - Updated - - -

"i see only darkness"

"actually see two light angels"

smh

Well i didn't expect this to be that long, still think they are forcing the rule of cool way too much and it gets a bit cheesy not in the good way, not convinced with this uther soul division shenanigans, but i guess this show the division in bastion. Archon must be up in some shit, may end up being the real villain with the Janitor.

If you look closely at his eyes, you see the maw.

[Trollokdamus]

is there two Uthers now?

Seems so. The "Frostmourne" Uther made an appearance in the Paladin Order Hall questline. This couldn't have been the "Bastion" Uther because he was already a kyrian at that point.

[gwahiir]

Uther's ghost in ICC after Arthas's death was compassionate and sad. What the hell is this retcon now? It feels completely wrong for Uther's character. I don't like it one bit.

Are you talking about the ghost appearing in the end cutscene? If so, that was not Uther, that was Terenas, Arthas's father.

[Elestia]

I guess the art style is going to be the same for the next four expansions as well. Impressive Blizz hasn't tried to revamp it yet.

That said, might have to sub to this shitshow if Arthas gets involved.

[Lahis]

Are you talking about the ghost appearing in the end cutscene? If so, that was not Uther, that was Terenas, Arthas's father.

Uther's ghost is seen in ICC entrance hall after Arthas'es defeat. You give one of the trinkets you get from Shadowmourne questline to him there.



Later, Paladins see his ghost again at his tomb when they are looking for clues to reclaim Ashbringer at the start of Legion.

[Deferionus]

illidan did bad things but he wanted to save the multiverse from the legion!

arthas did bad things because he was a power-hungry monster and wanted to enslave all azeroth like mindless zombies! deserves nothing but to suffer forever

I've read lore somewhere that the Lich King came to the conclusion the only way to repel the Burning Legion was to unite all of Azeroth against it, and the only way to do that was to make the entire planet undead under the Scourge's leadership structure.