Neuralink to Demonstrate AI/Brain Interface (Elon Musk)

[Fargus]

I'm not watching a youtube video - those are the most ridiculous sources of information, and the bane of scientific evidence. If you have what you claim, link it, and I'll take a look. Otherwise, don't be like those anti-science people, who ask us to prove their points. Be better than that, please.

How can you claim it's ridiculous without even watching it? This isn't some kind of spook we're talking about here. The dude's an actual, qualified professional. He's also debunked stuff like solar roads, etc. You're just ignoring it because it actually doesn't jive well with the Hyperloop nonsense, something you consistently defend even though there are actual engineering and economical problems associated with it. That's something the video I linked points out, if you bothered watching it actually explains why it's not viable (at least not in the vision that was originally planned). You can keep denying reality all you like - the science doesn't agree with the concept.

What you call the "Hyperloop" that is planned in some countries is a glorified metro that doesn't even promise the speeds and times the entire concept (or Musk actually) promised. Not to mention such ideas have been around well before Musk, so he can't exactly take credit for it.

This anti-intellectualism is staggering. Going to ignore evidence just because it happens to be on YouTube, despite being clear and scientifically accurate (as well as his other debunking videos)? How about something like Numberphile? Periodic Videos? You're as stubborn as a child - not unlike your avatar actually. Actually, it suits you because you sound like Trump here.

- - - Updated - - -

I expect people with degrees in science (& business) to be able to perform basic cost/benefit analyses and at least know about some basic principles in physics like thermodynamics.

I know you are a fan boy of his, so you will probably not be able to grasp this, but this guy has more than disqualified himself on multiple occasions.

Edit: Also not all uni programms are created equally, something everyone knows that has seen one from the inside.

It's quite hilarious how these Musk disciples flail around his every word whereas if they had a basic understanding of physics, they'd realise that the Hyperloop just isn't going to work.

Is physics actually taught in US schools these days?

[cubby]

How can you claim it's ridiculous without even watching it? This isn't some kind of spook we're talking about here. The dude's an actual, qualified professional. He's also debunked stuff like solar roads, etc. You're just ignoring it because it actually doesn't jive well with the Hyperloop nonsense, something you consistently defend even though there are actual engineering and economical problems associated with it. That's something the video I linked points out, if you bothered watching it actually explains why it's not viable (at least not in the vision that was originally planned). You can keep denying reality all you like - the science doesn't agree with the concept.

What you call the "Hyperloop" that is planned in some countries is a glorified metro that doesn't even promise the speeds and times the entire concept (or Musk actually) promised. Not to mention such ideas have been around well before Musk, so he can't exactly take credit for it.

This anti-intellectualism is staggering. Going to ignore evidence just because it happens to be on YouTube, despite being clear and scientifically accurate (as well as his other debunking videos)? How about something like Numberphile? Periodic Videos? You're as stubborn as a child - not unlike your avatar actually. Actually, it suits you because you sound like Trump here.

We aren't going to watch a 25 minute video because you can't find the guy's source material. I'm not ignoring the evidence, I'm just not taking some guy's word for it - I want to see his data. You've watched the video, just shoot us the links. The issue isn't anti-science or anti-intellectualism, it's that I don't need to waste my time to prove your point.

It is interesting that you spend all this time ridiculing and attacking me, instead of just finding this material his citing, isn't it?

It's quite hilarious how these Musk disciples flail around his every word whereas if they had a basic understanding of physics, they'd realise that the Hyperloop just isn't going to work.

Yep - figured you go here after your little rant above. Those people who can't put forth actual data usually run down the "fan boi" road, hoping with all their little immature hope that this will deflect the issue. Just adorable.

If you have information, please link it. If your source is so super cool awesome in his little video, then I'm sure the material he cites is available to link. Please don't make us do your work for you. That's what a Trumpkin does.

Is physics actually taught in US schools these days?

I heard Stanford has a pretty good program...you know, the doctoral program Musk got into...

[unbound]

Elon Musk's company, Neuralink, will demonstrate an AI/Brain interface brain chip on Friday.



Thoughts?

If they can read information from your brain, they can write information to your brain.

Regardless of what you think of Musk (and if you don't think very little of him, you need to become better informed about him), you don't want any company / person with that kind of access to you.

[PC2]

If they can read information from your brain, they can write information to your brain.

Only in the sense that they can deliver an electrical impulse into the implanted threads. Neuroscientists barely know anything about the brain so they can't meaningfully write information in a way that relates to a real world application.

[cubby]

If they can read information from your brain, they can write information to your brain.

Regardless of what you think of Musk (and if you don't think very little of him, you need to become better informed about him), you don't want any company / person with that kind of access to you.

I don't know enough about it, but I would imagine the goal is to make it a two-way process, so yeah, read and input. Not sure if that second part was aimed at me or everyone in general, but I agree that having that kind of power carries with it many problems. I would imagine, however, that if the result of this research was the development of a cure for Alzheimers, people might be ok with others having that kind of access to their brain.

[Die]

My first thought is people will use this instead of narcotics. Get a chip implanted that directly stimulates dopamine production and stay at an eternal high as long as you want. Cocaine, nicotine, alcohol, etc all become obsolete. Even coffee is phased out. Wake up in the morning, press a button, get a jolt of good feelings and get to work.

[PC2]

My first thought is people will use this instead of narcotics. Get a chip implanted that directly stimulates dopamine production and stay at an eternal high as long as you want. Cocaine, nicotine, alcohol, etc all become obsolete. Even coffee is phased out. Wake up in the morning, press a button, get a jolt of good feelings and get to work.

Except that can't work because your brain can't be tricked into feeling euphoria over the long-term. The feeling would become normalized and the person would have to turn off the brain device for some amount of time before the euphoria stimulator could have an effect again.

People shouldn't even want such a device in the first place because it's a bad idea to experience unearned euphoria.

[Howel]

Except that can't work because your brain can't be tricked into feeling euphoria over the long-term. The feeling would become normalized and the person would have to turn off the brain device for some amount of time before the euphoria stimulator could have an effect again.

People shouldn't even want such a device in the first place because it's a bad idea to experience unearned euphoria.

Even the notion of creating ANOTHER addictive entity, is so incredibly monumentally bad when we look at how much life is ruined and distraught by our current addictive substances and behaviours.

Which is why, yeah, unearned euphoria is one of the greatest hurdles of mankind's sanity and well being.

[Die]

Except that can't work because your brain can't be tricked into feeling euphoria over the long-term. The feeling would become normalized and the person would have to turn off the brain device for some amount of time before the euphoria stimulator could have an effect again.

People shouldn't even want such a device in the first place because it's a bad idea to experience unearned euphoria.

It may be a bad idea but it will become widespread guaranteed.

[cubby]

It may be a bad idea but it will become widespread guaranteed.

Agreed. There is no way this tech won't lead to that feature (amongst many others) and there is no way that feature won't be for sale. In fact, in a deep bit of irony, it might fund the continued development of the tech.

[Howel]

Agreed. There is no way this tech won't lead to that feature (amongst many others) and there is no way that feature won't be for sale. In fact, in a deep bit of irony, it might fund the continued development of the tech.

"We gotta sell crack cocain to further technology". Sorry, but it was too good, not to make a level of fun off

[Fargus]

We aren't going to watch a 25 minute video because you can't find the guy's source material. I'm not ignoring the evidence, I'm just not taking some guy's word for it - I want to see his data. You've watched the video, just shoot us the links. The issue isn't anti-science or anti-intellectualism, it's that I don't need to waste my time to prove your point.

It is interesting that you spend all this time ridiculing and attacking me, instead of just finding this material his citing, isn't it?




Yep - figured you go here after your little rant above. Those people who can't put forth actual data usually run down the "fan boi" road, hoping with all their little immature hope that this will deflect the issue. Just adorable.

If you have information, please link it. If your source is so super cool awesome in his little video, then I'm sure the material he cites is available to link. Please don't make us do your work for you. That's what a Trumpkin does.




I heard Stanford has a pretty good program...you know, the doctoral program Musk got into...

You don't speak for everyone here, couple of people called you out on your BS. Not sure what "links" you want but I think basic principles of thermodynamics doesn't need a 100 paper thesis, where an explanation from a qualified scientist will actually do. Maybe that's not good enough for you because you're too lazy to go through thunderf00t's calculations, or are afraid you can't refute them. Been several years pal, we've yet to get the Hyperloop Musk was sure of getting.

[cubby]

"We gotta sell crack cocain to further technology". Sorry, but it was too good, not to make a level of fun off

Lol, yeah. But seriously, how much funding for other drugs did Viagra create when it went to market?

- - - Updated - - -

You don't speak for everyone here, couple of people called you out on your BS. Not sure what "links" you want but I think basic principles of thermodynamics doesn't need a 100 paper thesis, where an explanation from a qualified scientist will actually do. Maybe that's not good enough for you because you're too lazy to go through thunderf00t's calculations, or are afraid you can't refute them. Been several years pal, we've yet to get the Hyperloop Musk was sure of getting.

We just want the data from the video you (and others before you) claim "proves" the Hyperloop won't work. I love that you think this is the first time weve seen this video linked as "evidence" that Musk's Hyperloop won't work. I will continue to ask, as I always do, show me the articles the guy in this video (or any other) cites or uses to "debunk" the Hyperloop. If it's something as simple as the laws of thermodynamics, then there should be a relatively "simple" article/publication to point at, showing the fundamental flaws of the Hyperloop. And all we've ever asked is to see those documents. Which you and your ilk never seem to have time to find. Weird, isn't it?

Meanwhile, you Musk hate-machines always pull this out, and die on this hill, because YOU and your ilk don't look at the sources of the videos you watch. What you fail to realize is that several dozen cities in multiple countries are working on their own Hyperloop projects - vis a vis Musk or Virgin or other companies. You and your ilk claim that one 'lil video "debunks the whole thing". Now, if that were the case, if that were actually true, why are so many cities and countries signing on for these programs? Do you think they all just ignore science and fall for the sales pitch? ALL of them?

What's really sad is that you, when challenged, launched into some diatribe about anti-intellectualism and how we're ignoring science. The sad irony is that you are your own worst demon, ignoring the science found on multiple fronts showing how this will come to fruition - and you're doing that by relying on one pathetic video.

Also, couple of articles for you to review, once you overcome your addition to youtube videos:

Physics World - I bet they know about the laws of thermodynamics!
Scientific America
University of California Berkeley
Oh no! India fell for the "scam" too!
Here is an article laying out the problems with Hyperloop, BUT NOT BECAUSE OF THE SCIENCE. I guess they missed your adorable little youtube video.

To quote one of the all time great lines from the MCU: I can do this all day.
(huge points if you can give me the next line, from the same character)

Let us know if you need more articles!

[Howel]

Lol, yeah. But seriously, how much funding for other drugs did Viagra create when it went to market?

I'd say Viagra is a tad less serious than hallucinogenics, just saying

[cubby]

I'd say Viagra is a tad less serious than hallucinogenics, just saying

I am not going to disagree with you there. I was pointing it out only for the analogous features of taking a pleasure based drug to market thereby creating a huge pool of R&D money.

But yeah - I would say it's an order of magnitude beyond Viagra.

[Howel]

I am not going to disagree with you there. I was pointing it out only for the analogous features of taking a pleasure based drug to market thereby creating a huge pool of R&D money.

But yeah - I would say it's an order of magnitude beyond Viagra.

Glad we can agree on that

[Fargus]

We just want the data from the video you (and others before you) claim "proves" the Hyperloop won't work. I love that you think this is the first time weve seen this video linked as "evidence" that Musk's Hyperloop won't work. I will continue to ask, as I always do, show me the articles the guy in this video (or any other) cites or uses to "debunk" the Hyperloop. If it's something as simple as the laws of thermodynamics, then there should be a relatively "simple" article/publication to point at, showing the fundamental flaws of the Hyperloop. And all we've ever asked is to see those documents. Which you and your ilk never seem to have time to find. Weird, isn't it?

The data is in his damn videos, he performs his own calculations, he actually shows where he gets his info from. You don't need some grandiose publication to point out fundamental flaws. It makes as much sense as making a publication to show why it isn't viable to build a tunnel to go to the core of the Earth.

What you fail to realize is that several dozen cities in multiple countries are working on their own Hyperloop projects - vis a vis Musk or Virgin or other companies. You and your ilk claim that one 'lil video "debunks the whole thing". Now, if that were the case, if that were actually true, why are so many cities and countries signing on for these programs? Do you think they all just ignore science and fall for the sales pitch? ALL of them?

Several dozen? Name them. Don't exaggerate for effect.

Is this even supposed to mean anything? Many jurisdictions waste money on projects that either don't come into fruition or are downscaled to such an extent that they're no where near their original schematics. These projects still not only haven't gotten off the ground, but those that did, are practically glorified metros. They're not reaching anywhere near the speeds Musk intended, nor did any of the prototypes or tests (which is demonstrated in thunderf00t's videos).

What's really sad is that you, when challenged, launched into some diatribe about anti-intellectualism and how we're ignoring science. The sad irony is that you are your own worst demon, ignoring the science found on multiple fronts showing how this will come to fruition - and you're doing that by relying on one pathetic video.

We? I'm only singling you out.

Fact of the matter is that having a physical object in a long vacuum tube at those kinds of speeds is dangerous. A real scientist explains why, and you're ignoring it because you can't be bothered watching a video.

Physics World - I bet they know about the laws of thermodynamics!
Scientific America
University of California Berkeley
Oh no! India fell for the "scam" too!
Here is an article laying out the problems with Hyperloop, BUT NOT BECAUSE OF THE SCIENCE. I guess they missed your adorable little youtube video.

Did you even read any of those links? At all? Or are you just blindly spamming links? The first one points out the engineering problems that thunderf00t was alluding to - you even have an expert from CERN quoted in that article regarding safety issues. As well as a control-systems engineer who rightly points out some of the technical problems. The second link essentially is a short blurb that describes what the Hyperloop is but doesn't go into the nitty-gritty of economical barriers or engineering problems. The third link is four years old and talks about the testing phase, as well as the student competition (which thunderf00t rightly calls out, as explained in that video). It even concedes that it's not a reality (and still isn't). Your Indian link shows a competition and building a prototype (one already exists in the US and has failed to reach the desired speeds and is currently rusting away in a desert) - approving a proposal isn't the same thing as building one for real. And as for your last article... that "adorable" video actually puts those problems those experts have quoted into the spotlight. You'd know that if you actually watched the damn video.

To quote one of the all time great lines from the MCU: I can do this all day.
(huge points if you can give me the next line, from the same character)

Let us know if you need more articles!

Sure, go and post more links showing why it's economically infeasible, and also from an engineering perspective, impractical. You're doing a good job backing up thunderf00t's video already, and showing precisely why Musk's original vision of the Hyperloop is pie-in-the-sky stuff.

[Kerplank]

Meanwhile, you Musk hate-machines always pull this out, and die on this hill, because YOU and your ilk don't look at the sources of the videos you watch. What you fail to realize is that several dozen cities in multiple countries are working on their own Hyperloop projects - vis a vis Musk or Virgin or other companies. You and your ilk claim that one 'lil video "debunks the whole thing". Now, if that were the case, if that were actually true, why are so many cities and countries signing on for these programs? Do you think they all just ignore science and fall for the sales pitch? ALL of them?

It's all PR wank as described here:

But nobody has ever built a fully working hyperloop, which, to make any use of its top speed, would need to be tens if not hundreds of kilometres in length. VHO’s prototype in Nevada is just 500 metres long. Its pod has not reached even half the target top speed – and it has never carried a single passenger. There are therefore no reliable cost estimates for what it would cost to build the roughly 370km Missouri route, let alone a clear idea of how much it would cost to operate.

Can you explain why any city would build a system like this when it has failed its testing parameters?

Here's a take from a civil engineer.

It is obvious you have no engineering experience or expertise, because only people who have no knowledge in this area would consider the Hyperloop as feasible.

[Masark]

we can only slow down the process and in some rare cases halt it.

We can't even do that. All the drugs based on the amyloid hypothesis have been resounding failures. Even in very early cases, they just plain don't work. They clear the plaques, but have no effect on the progression. They've giving it one last try to use the drugs preventatively in those genetically predisposed to alzhimers, but I doubt that's going to work, so it's almost certainly back to the drawing board.

[Monster Hunter]

We can't even do that. All the drugs based on the amyloid hypothesis have been resounding failures. Even in very early cases, they just plain don't work. They clear the plaques, but have no effect on the progression. They've giving it one last try to use the drugs preventatively in those genetically predisposed to alzhimers, but I doubt that's going to work, so it's almost certainly back to the drawing board.

Half the issue is we have so little understanding of both the condition and the organ its effecting.

It's 2020, we can map the brain, we can image the brain, we can see all the nurons fire and we know roughly what each bit does, hell we can even interface with it now aparantly but we still have very little understanding it's such a complicated organ, it is you, you are the firing of those specific neurons in those specific patterns, that specific data stored in those specific cells. You can lose an arm, a leg and eye, replace your heart, lungs liver and kindys. And your still you, but the brain.... That's You in the litteral sense, if that's damdged, if parts are lost in the case of alzhiemers, those cells dead. How really Is it even possible to fix that?