Shadowlands Beta - Upgrading PvP Gear with Honor

[quaizar]

Through wrath and cata I did a ton of bgs. I really enjoyed them because minus an op trinket or something everyone was in pvp gear. Since coming back to BFA I didn't do any bgs outside of farming honor for an essence. The main reason was because the gear you can obtain from it just wasn't worth it, and to be competitive you literally must have near bis this xpac. You're forced to raid to get the proper azerite and to get a trinket and in my case bis ring. Then you're forced to do m+ for most of your other items. I only wear like to PVP items, and those I had to wait for like 15 weeks to upgrade an older crappy item with a coin. Outside of playing with my friend of many years/expansions, rewards for pvp in BFA were next to zero.

I was super happy to see vendors returning, and then instantly bummed that at least in its current form they only have 3 iterations of stats which for rogue at least don't include the one I need most haste/vers. I don't expect to be able to have mythic raiding gear as a pvper, but I also don't expect to be farmed by someone just because they have mythic raiding gear. That really is the current state. Unless you're a glad, (which im 2200+) and are just that much better than everyone else, your ceiling is Sooooo much lower with how things currently are.

I would love to see a pvp stat return so that you'd reward people for pvp. Blizzards excuse is that they didn't want people to farm multiple sets of gear.... this is a joke. Currently I have a raiding set, a m+ set, and a pvp set.


The big changes that I'd like to see as someone who mainly does rated arena are as follows:

[Argorwal]

Honor gear is always looking cheap, if the stats are also bad (equivalent to LFR etc) then obviously people will just farm M+ to get pvp gear and get rolling. The question is why don't they simply accept that a lot of people for all kinds of reasons simply want to play BGs/arenas/RBGs. These people should have a way to be on the same level of progress according to the time effort and skill effort they put in game without having to depend on raids and M+.

This is a problem solved for raiders and M+ players they don't really have a reason to ever step foot in a battleground, so why should it be the other way around just for gear.

Considering random BGs are the PvP equivalent of LFR where you queue and have 3 decent players screaming to get the rest of their moronic team to do the right thing the item levels aren’t too far off.

I would skip the upgrade though and go straight to 190.

[ThatsOurEric]

If you are sitting there saying "omg, it's going to take so long to upgrade my honor gear" you don't deserve anything better. You are targeting honor gear and it really needs to be on the same level as heroic dungeon gear. That it's able to be upgraded to something like normal raid gear is a slap in the face to people who PvE. But it is and there's nothing that can be done about that. You guys need to learn to stay in your lane and let the better players have the better gear.

Found the elitist.

Could you sound any less pathetic? "Stay in your lane?" Are you serious?

Do us all a favor and stop playing the game. It could use a lot less of that
holier than thou garbage you're spewing. The complaints others have had
regarding this gear is very well justified.

[Nuciek]

There are two problems with honor gear right now:

1) Grind - it's just too much. I get it that we shouldn't get 190 gear for free but I think that gear itself (the 158 ilvl base items) should be quite cheap, cheaper than it is now, but upgrades should be quite expensive with cost increasing progressively. So we could get low ilvl gear pretty quickly, a full set in a day of playing BGs, but then we would actually have to decide if we really want to upgrade specific slot or not. In total it should cost less than it costs now to get and upgrade full set of gear. Normal dungeons drop 157, heroics drop 170 and you can easily gear up fresh character to a normal/hc dungeon level in a day.

2) Secondary stats - we're left at Blizzard mercy on what stat combination we get on our items, so plenty of specs will still be forced to grind PvE because there will be no PvP gear with their stats, and for those that don't know - secondary stats are REALLY important in PvP. They should either give us more gear choices or implement some kind of reforging system that would require honor to reforge item into stats of our choosing.

Now I know PvP Power/Resilience could potentialy fix those issues but it does create other problems and I feel like Blizzard is just stubborn because there are solutions to all of those problems, some of them posted by top players every expansion for years now.

[jazen]

'Elite' players really need to get over themselves. Casuals pay the bills at Blizz, and without them there'd be none of the higher end content. There's no reason gear for the more casual player has to be so much lower quality, as it's really the player that separates the two. Some difference, yes. Wide disparity, no.

[Frogguh]

Found the elitist.

Could you sound any less pathetic? "Stay in your lane?" Are you serious?

Do us all a favor and stop playing the game. It could use a lot less of that
holier than thou garbage you're spewing. The complaints others have had
regarding this gear is very well justified.

He's definitely a complete idiot, but also people in unrated pvp don't need the same gear ilvl as more difficult content. That higher gear should simply scale down to what is achievable in unrated pvp. If they want to use that epic loot, let it be in their own content.

[Themerlin]

Wandering Ancient better be the mount people are picking.

I want various re-coloring's of it once I hit Ardenweald

[ihate2beapessimist]

If haste/vers is so mandatory for PVPers why not just make all pvp gear haste/vers?

[tamarin]

No one is forcing you to do anything. Everything you do in wow is optional. You make the decision to do pve, not blizzard.

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I understand the whining. A bunch of bads that can't do high end content are complaining that they won't be able to grind out mythic level gear in a couple of weeks.

If you are sitting there saying "omg, it's going to take so long to upgrade my honor gear" you don't deserve anything better. You are targeting honor gear and it really needs to be on the same level as heroic dungeon gear.

What you PvE morons don't understand is that it doesnt matter in PvE if your gear is lagging behind everyone else because in PvE you can choose how strong your opponents are. Just pick a lower difficulty level and you're done.

In PvP, even in casual pvp, on the other hand, you don't get to choose the ilevel of your opponents. There is no drop-down menu to select "normal, heroic, mythic".

Therefore if you are lagging behind because you have more than 5 braincells and pve can't keep them all awake then you can't get an enjoyable casual pvp experience as you get overgeared by everyone else, who don't kill you because they know what they are doing but just because they have bigger numbers.

This is why PvP gear needs to be separate from pve. This is why you need pvp stats or a pvp ilevel. This is why removing these systems is an absolutely idiotic move, undoubtedly brought about by the drooling pve elitist idiot now helming this game.

[ThatsOurEric]

He's definitely a complete idiot, but also people in unrated pvp don't need the same gear ilvl as more difficult content. That higher gear should simply scale down to what is achievable in unrated pvp. If they want to use that epic loot, let it be in their own content.

I think that's a fair compromise.

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'Elite' players really need to get over themselves. Casuals pay the bills at Blizz, and without them there'd be none of the higher end content. There's no reason gear for the more casual player has to be so much lower quality, as it's really the player that separates the two. Some difference, yes. Wide disparity, no.

How dare you use logic to shush the 1% of WoW's playerbase who complain the loudest.

[tamarin]

people in unrated pvp don't need the same gear ilvl as more difficult content.

Again, they do because there is no restriction on the ilevel your opponents have, even in unrated pvp. This is not a difficult concept to grasp.

[bloodykiller86]

'Elite' players really need to get over themselves. Casuals pay the bills at Blizz, and without them there'd be none of the higher end content. There's no reason gear for the more casual player has to be so much lower quality, as it's really the player that separates the two. Some difference, yes. Wide disparity, no.

you get what you put into the game. if you have zero time you get zero gear. quit crying

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What you PvE morons don't understand is that it doesnt matter in PvE if your gear is lagging behind everyone else because in PvE you can choose how strong your opponents are. Just pick a lower difficulty level and you're done.

In PvP, even in casual pvp, on the other hand, you don't get to choose the ilevel of your opponents. There is no drop-down menu to select "normal, heroic, mythic".

Therefore if you are lagging behind because you have more than 5 braincells and pve can't keep them all awake then you can't get an enjoyable casual pvp experience as you get overgeared by everyone else, who don't kill you because they know what they are doing but just because they have bigger numbers.

This is why PvP gear needs to be separate from pve. This is why you need pvp stats or a pvp ilevel. This is why removing these systems is an absolutely idiotic move, undoubtedly brought about by the drooling pve elitist idiot now helming this game.

they already tried stat templates to fix that disparity....guess what it was a colossal fail. WoW PvP isnt meant to be a balanced game like League. Get gear and get better. thats how everything is in WoW. don't like it then play another game lol

[ashblond]

I still don't understand why Blizzard doesn't just merge PVP and PVE currency and vendor???

If there is no PVP specific stats (resilience, pvp power, etc..) on the PVP gear, and PVE/PVP use the same gear, why do we need separate currency and vendor for pvp????

Just remove justice/valor/honor/valor points, and make a single currency, like how titan residum works for azerite gear in BFA: Low ilevel gear (former justice/honor gear) cost less and high ilevel gear (former valor/conquest gear) cost more.

And make PVE and PVP activities reward the same currency at a fair rate. Players can get the same currency from dungeons/raids/BGs/arenas/world quests.

It is unbelievable that Blizzard still makes this outdated separation of PVE/PVP currency when they have been using the same gear for years!

[Pounced]

Through wrath and cata I did a ton of bgs. I really enjoyed them because minus an op trinket or something everyone was in pvp gear. Since coming back to BFA I didn't do any bgs outside of farming honor for an essence. The main reason was because the gear you can obtain from it just wasn't worth it, and to be competitive you literally must have near bis this xpac. You're forced to raid to get the proper azerite and to get a trinket and in my case bis ring. Then you're forced to do m+ for most of your other items. I only wear like to PVP items, and those I had to wait for like 15 weeks to upgrade an older crappy item with a coin. Outside of playing with my friend of many years/expansions, rewards for pvp in BFA were next to zero.

I was super happy to see vendors returning, and then instantly bummed that at least in its current form they only have 3 iterations of stats which for rogue at least don't include the one I need most haste/vers. I don't expect to be able to have mythic raiding gear as a pvper, but I also don't expect to be farmed by someone just because they have mythic raiding gear. That really is the current state. Unless you're a glad, (which im 2200+) and are just that much better than everyone else, your ceiling is Sooooo much lower with how things currently are.

I would love to see a pvp stat return so that you'd reward people for pvp. Blizzards excuse is that they didn't want people to farm multiple sets of gear.... this is a joke. Currently I have a raiding set, a m+ set, and a pvp set.


The big changes that I'd like to see as someone who mainly does rated arena are as follows:

True, I'm Multi R1 / Glad on hunter and this is a joke they implemented it like this. Just add resilience, or pvp power back to gear.

If you go and raid MYTHIC you have huge advantage over these current pvp item levels. And if you even TRY to gear starting from rank 1 and fight someone in full mythic gear in bgs/arena..... Good luck haha.

Mythic raiding shouldn't offer MORE powerful gear. Add a pvp stat that separates pvp gear from PVE.

[Recovery]

They should add a currency from m+ aswell that you could farm to upgrade m+ gear

Nah, M+ players should just be forced to do battlegrounds for their gear.... You know, the way pvp players were forced to get their gear from Mythic+ for the entirety of BFA.

[tamarin]

you get what you put into the game. if you have zero time you get zero gear. quit crying

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they already tried stat templates to fix that disparity....guess what it was a colossal fail. WoW PvP isnt meant to be a balanced game like League. Get gear and get better. thats how everything is in WoW. don't like it then play another game lol

You are completely wrong because there was pvp gear with pvp stats for nine years and it worked perfectly well. I mean this whole issue has been solved satisfactorily thirteen years ago, and the solution worked fine for 9 years before being summarily removed without explanation by PvE turbowanker Ion. There were a few flaws but they were nothing compared to the garbage we have now.

Gear is not the game, it's just an accessory to the game. The PvP game and the PvE game need different ones, as has been proved and thoroughly established from burning crusade to WoD.

The only thing that was "wrong" with it is that when PvEers crossed over to the pvp game, their shitty little dragon killer power fantasy was shattered when it turned out that they couldn't win simply by having overwhelming numbers.

[Kalach]

Sooo much crying and nagging...

So you wan to grind BG's and get Mythic raid equivalent gear?

It's like doing normal dungeons and expecting Mythic raid gear....

Regular BG's are equivalent to normal dungeons. You Grind away and upgrade to something equivalent to heroic dungeons, then to LFR and cap out at like normal or heroic raid. That's more than fair to someone who doesn't want to progress/casuals. Back when we had vendors, casuals or BG grinders didn't have the luxury of upgrading, so guess what... they did arenas!

It's meant as temporary gearing until you advance in Arena.

If you choose not to progress, or are a casual player, then it's as far as you'll go.

This game is based on rewarding those that put in the most effort.

There is nothing wrong with Honor gear not having the right secondary stats, it has always been the case when vendors were around. Now, if Conquest gear will not have the right secondary stats, that's a problem.

This is an excellent system, that in the beginning stages will drive people to do/experience as much content as possible to gear faster. Later, serious arena players can stick to solely arenas and have BIS gear, Raiders will stick to raids and have BIS gear, and BG grinders.... Well, they'll have Exactly what they deserve and cry that they are entitled to more.

[Recovery]

you get what you put into the game. if you have zero time you get zero gear. quit crying

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they already tried stat templates to fix that disparity....guess what it was a colossal fail. WoW PvP isnt meant to be a balanced game like League. Get gear and get better. thats how everything is in WoW. don't like it then play another game lol

Your whole comment is just... ew.

Trust us, if we could get blizz to completely separate pvp from pve, we would. We've begged for it for years.

There is a dedicated pvp server (the tournament realm) that could be used strictly for pvp and have its own set of balancing and gear. We've begged for them to implement that. They wont. PVE wold lose too many participants. There's a huge amount of players that wouldnt pve at all if they werent forced to. pretty sure thats the exact reason that blizz refuses to separate the 2 even though thats what pvp players want.

[jazen]

[QUOTE=bloodykiller86;52629492]you get what you put into the game. if you have zero time you get zero gear. quit crying

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I notice you don't refute my statement, just reply with the typical 'quit crying' tripe the self-called 'elite' players spew.

[TheFirstOnes]

Finally! Rewards for my hard earned PVP work...

If only Ret's were good for PVP