Are you tired of borrowed power?

[Swnem]

No. You can't keep adding things infinitely, nor can you have everything stay the same all the time. Abilities have always come and gone and i feel like this gives way more design space to look for cool things. If they actually manage to make some interesting "borrowed powers" they make em talents/legendaries/whatevers for the future. It feels like borrowed powers just became another meme for people to clutch on to cause it's not what we used to have.

edit: Saying it all gets trashed is just wrong. You clearly do not have any idea how many talents, baseline traits and abilities and conduits were "borrowed power" to begin with.

That is something false the dev team fed you with.
You can, in fact keep adding infinitly to a system.
Take the PvP talent system. They could keep adding more each expansion, but only let you choose 3. There are other systems too. For example the new skills can be upgrades of old skills with new or different side effects and/or animations.
Basically, there are ways.

It's more like, they want these systems cause they think they can sell expansions with them by making them a selling point.
I think this method won't work for much longer though.

[Ihazpaws]

Tired yes. I wish they would change the focus off from developing borrowed power abilities and instead focus on actual balance of classes + making more classes/specs.
Actually they should redo all classes and make every class have atleast 1 tank and healer option. That would help alot with the problem of having too many DD players. It would also be a good stepping stone for a full time DD to try tanking or healing and learn more about the process that happens in the group when doing pve. I'd love to have a mage tank or field medic warrior...

Borrowed powers take so much away from the actual class abilities. There is always tons of skills that cannot be used because they are tuned so badly. If they would be tuned correctly, then somekind borrowed power passive/active would be too good and make the skill OP. Also borrowed power like Corruptions are fun on the paper and when you actually can reach the BiS state having all needed corruptions to start destroying things but then you jump on alt and realize that you need to do that ridiculous farm again and can't enjoy other aspects of the game because without those corruptions, your character is a small useless pebble on the ground no one wants to invite and everyone will step on you.

[Yizu]

Am I the only one who wish we have new abilities, new rotation, mechanics every expansion? I get bored easily on a class, i almost always switch main every tier. To each their own I guess.

[Depakote]

No, I enjoy it. If abilities just piled up on us xpac after xpac then there'd be nothing interesting to look forward to in new expansions and our bars would just be a bloated mess.

Who's saying there has to be a new ability each expansion? What happened to the game relying on storytelling and fun rather than some borrowed power that'd just be gone next expansion?

[Tiev]

Borrowed power is fine unless it exists to patch an underlying problem with a class.

[Cthulhu fhtagn]

That is something false the dev team fed you with.
You can, in fact keep adding infinitly to a system.
Take the PvP talent system. They could keep adding more each expansion, but only let you choose 3. There are other systems too. For example the new skills can be upgrades of old skills with new or different side effects and/or animations.
Basically, there are ways.

It's more like, they want these systems cause they think they can sell expansions with them by making them a selling point.
I think this method won't work for much longer though.

No one has fed me anything. If you take a new talent in favor of an old one, wasnt the old talent then borrowed power? If it keeps existing you need to balance the game around more and more variables. In fact if you want to keep pvp talents from just last 2 expansions you would have no room to change the base class cause half of the talents would stop working. People loved tier sets, especially when they drastically changed gameplay of a class for one tier then you swapped to something else.

[jellmoo]

I don't really mind borrowed power per se. The two things I don't like are:

1) The less than natural way that the power/item is removed from the player at the end of the expansion. It feels gimmicky.

2) The fact that classes often feel incomplete when the power is removed. Many specs felt absolutely terrible after we lost the artifact weapon in Legion.

[Lucetia]

It seems that ever since Legion, BFA and now Shadowlands, we are getting some form of borrowed power that wont exist next xpac.
(Legendary Items/Artifact passives/actives)
(Azerite,Essences,corruption)
(Covenants, Soul Binds, Conduits)

Im honestly tired of this bullshit
Losing borrowed power is always a shitty feeling
Hopefully, they dial it back a bit next xpac

Except you forgot to mention talents, passives, abilities, bonuses, etc. "Borrowed" powers as you put it has been around ever since Classic wow in some shape or form.

[Nak88]

Of course we are, and we ain't coming back to Retail until they stop this idiotic trend.

[Overlordd]

You can make the argument that borrowed power has existed since Classic with the original Legendaries. I really don't think borrowed power systems are the issue. The issue is the way these systems are rolled out is typically less-than-ideal then iterated throughout an expansion so that they only ever feel legitimately balanced during the content drought leading into the next expansion.

Sulfuras was outranked by Ahn Qiraj and PvP weapons already. Maybe thunderfury is BiS till naxx but to compare borrowed power to legendaries in classic requires quite the bit of mental gymnastics

[Chonar]

No, not at all. I think this is a non-issue. The only thing that feels bad about it is feeling briefly de-powered at the very start of the expansion.

[Maxilian]

I liked Legion version of it, mostly because it have more meat and more reason to be.

But yeah, i kind of prefer that we get new skills and stuff that we won't lose just a couple a path later, cause when you're leveling or gearing and don't have all the things you need, the class feel incomplete.

[neik]

I heard that Path of Exile got some interesting and complex systems, perhaps merging some of their ideas might work for Blizzard. But I suspect it won't happen since wow is like a first person shooter without any ability to make any meaningful choices.

[Kaver]

It seems that ever since Legion, BFA and now Shadowlands, we are getting some form of borrowed power that wont exist next xpac.
(Legendary Items/Artifact passives/actives)
(Azerite,Essences,corruption)
(Covenants, Soul Binds, Conduits)

Im honestly tired of this bullshit
Losing borrowed power is always a shitty feeling
Hopefully, they dial it back a bit next xpac

Short answer: Yes

Long answer: Yeeeeeeeeees

[VinceVega]

I love it tbh.
Every expansion feels different. I don't want to play the exact same for years...
And they can't give us a new permanent ability every expansion. Would get needlesly bloated.

The systems give me a reason to log in more than just to do raids. Which aparantly is bad for some....

[RadmaKanow]

Personally I would like the story focus more about player, not everything around. With borrowed power you are almost meaningless addition - it doesn't matter who wields the power, only the fact that this power is wielded and can be used against BigEvil(tm). This way the whole concept of borrowed power stands against MMO principle - personal power increase.

But if we would increase in power so would our enemies, to the point of being ridiculously OP or we would fight Titans 1-on-1. So to avoid ascending to living gods status we get temporary buffs in the shape of borrowed power. Kinda working but overused theme makes it boring. Back then getting a legendary was a server wide thing. Now everyone has a small pile laying in the far corner of your bank.

[Garybear]

It seems that ever since Legion, BFA and now Shadowlands, we are getting some form of borrowed power that wont exist next xpac.
(Legendary Items/Artifact passives/actives)
(Azerite,Essences,corruption)
(Covenants, Soul Binds, Conduits)

Im honestly tired of this bullshit
Losing borrowed power is always a shitty feeling
Hopefully, they dial it back a bit next xpac

I agree. I feel like it breaks immersion of any sort of character progression.

[SirBeef]

Since it's always been in the game in the form of gear, specifically set bonus gear, no.

I understand the differences between tier gear and
expansion long power systems. But, toer was always a temporary means for raiders, often times changing how one plays the class.

[StillMcfuu]

So if you were say a feral druid you'd be happy if they invented some new combo point builder that had a shiny animation, then next animation removed shred and had the new one replace it in the rotation for the sake of not getting "stuck with the same buttons"?

No, and forgive me but I don't know enough about feral to speak on how the spec evolved.
Hypothetically, let's say they added a passive that gave 2combo points for shred when used from stealth or behind. 2 expansions on, they are looking to add a new passive, and the hypothetical passive is pretty popular, so they bake in the abilities of the hypothetical passive. Now Mangle, even though it's named the same, has learned some new tricks, its not the same old ability. And its talent row now has opened up more possibilities for the spec. Thats why adding and pruning is good.

With borrowed power, everything is stripped away, your character returns to a point before they started adventuring for that expansion, and it feels bad. Ultimately the world doesn't feel more dangerous, your character feels weaker.

[munkeyinorbit]

Yes I hate it with a passion. It's an easy way for devs to timegate shit and just pull onto a lever when they want us to move forward. Also a great way to force people to play more and stay subbed to farm power more.

It's a DISGUSTING feature.

What's more disgusting, the feature or the player that hates the feature but won't quit. Honestly if you don't like it then just quit. Unless your post is more about jumping on the bandwagon for fake outrage.