For a small moment I knew what it was like to be a demon hunter or rogue

[Narwhalosh Whalescream]

I miss metamorphosis.

[ydraw]

Mage also has spellsteal and frost nova/cone of cold for tank kiting on necrotic weeks. Dragon's breath if fire. And of course, sheep.

Warlocks have sacrolash, demonic gateway, battle res, soulstones etc

Whining is pretty annoying. Warlocks are more than fine in shadowlands, if nothing changes they'll be the best ranged DPS class in the game for both M+ and raids.

[Lucrece]

Warlocks have sacrolash, demonic gateway, battle res, soulstones etc

Whining is pretty annoying. Warlocks are more than fine in shadowlands, if nothing changes they'll be the best ranged DPS class in the game for both M+ and raids.

Was listing mage utility which they neglected to mention, not stating warlock had no competing utility. Stop projecting and get over that shitty grudge you keep holding from a few pages ago.

Warlock, mage, rogue, and warrior have always been in the top 5 historically throughout the game and it doesn't look like it will change. You can play any of them interchangeably in PvE and obtain similar results, but to pretend warlock stands alone atop the hill is also thoroughly dishonest.

[Danvash]

For what it's worth, the design going forward seems to be Cloak not removing any meaningful raid debuff.

They used cheat death to soak the giant tank meteors on Kil'jaeden, and immunities worked on the circles on Fallen Avatar that split the damage and didn't give a debuff. Rogues also did more damage than any warlocks on those fights.

Affliction was very powerful on Harjatan, Mistress Sass'zine and the Engine of Souls, and it was just okay on everything else. Tomb of Sargeras was after the single target nerfs were in, and most of the fights didn't favor Affliction's design at all.

[Delano]

Yes, and that was two expansions ago.

[ydraw]

Warlock, mage, rogue, and warrior have always been in the top 5 historically throughout the game and it doesn't look like it will change. You can play any of them interchangeably in PvE and obtain similar results, but to pretend warlock stands alone atop the hill is also thoroughly dishonest.

At the moment in Beta they absolutely do stand alone in terms of damage. And yet people in this thread are still whining.

[Gaidax]

And yet people in this thread are still whining.

Massive pikachuface here.

MMO-C forums and Warlock sub here are plagued by a few vengeful exes that literally haunt these forums for many years sprouting utter BS for sake of... I don't know what even...

Like that guy you quoted, I don't even understand what exactly he wants at this point after all these years of that nonsense posting. I guess it's just a habit or something at this point.

[Lucrece]

At the moment in Beta they absolutely do stand alone in terms of damage. And yet people in this thread are still whining.

Are you seriously telling people to not exaggerate while at the same time using pre-tuning beta status of a spec to determine their performance trajectory for an entire xpac?

And they most seriously are not even now. Subtlety is up there, as is frost mage. Arcane would have also been there if there hadn't been a tuning pass that will most likely happen to destro and affliction in the near future as well.

[Kaver]

A 2 minute immunity is infinitely more useful than anything Warlocks bring to a raid.

Remember Kil'Jaeden and Fallen Avatar where guilds stacked 5 + rogues?

What in the smoking hell are you on about?...

Remember G'huun where having 4 warlocks was mandatory?

Warlock utility + spread cleave is so much more useful in raids than Rogue utility. There have only been a few raid bosses where Rogue stacking was a thing. Warlocks are the king of raiding. Saying anything else is just an embarrassment.

[Gaidax]

Remember G'huun where having 4 warlocks was mandatory?

Well, to be fair that was a massive outlier, where Blizz went full pepega with it.

But other than that, indeed so, I find a Warlock player complaining about Rogue utility in raids to be hilarious.

[ydraw]

Are you seriously telling people to not exaggerate while at the same time using pre-tuning beta status of a spec to determine their performance trajectory for an entire xpac?

And they most seriously are not even now. Subtlety is up there, as is frost mage. Arcane would have also been there if there hadn't been a tuning pass that will most likely happen to destro and affliction in the near future as well.

No. Destro Warlock is the #1 dps spec in dungeons by an absolute mile.

Stop whining.

[Lucrece]

No. Destro Warlock is the #1 dps spec in dungeons by an absolute mile.

Stop whining.

Took me long enough to realize you're just discount Shandalar. Off to the ignore list you go with the other constantly banned loser.

[ydraw]

Took me long enough to realize you're just discount Shandalar. Off to the ignore list you go with the other constantly banned loser.

But if you ignore everyone, there won't be anyone left to hear you whine

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=898836316

Warlock has consistently been the best DPS class in the game's history

[Exodeus]

But if you ignore everyone, there won't be anyone left to hear you whine

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=898836316

Warlock has consistently been the best DPS class in the game's history

As it should be!

[Gaidax]

As it should be!

I think we're a tad too low there... Should be at least 10% over everyone else, clearly Warlock hate by Blizz is hamstringing our poor, overnerfed class.

[AwkwardSquirtle]

I think we're a tad too low there... Should be at least 10% over everyone else, clearly Warlock hate by Blizz is hamstringing our poor, overnerfed class.

Literally unplayable.

[JustaWarlock]

But if you ignore everyone, there won't be anyone left to hear you whine

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=898836316

Warlock has consistently been the best DPS class in the game's history

I mean, warlocks might be historically strong (except when we aren't until they fix us in a few patches), but what you linked is garbage if you read the notes(unless you are trying to support an agenda).

---

This data is taken directly from WarcraftLogs, using the data from the last 2 weeks of each stated content.
Data is taken at 75th percentile
The "Class Charts" take the strongest spec for that class at each date.

[8bithamster]

it was massively imbalanced. we knew that there' no way it would make it in that state to live. Our execute damage made warriors look like they were hitting with fuzzy mittens. Why are you surprised that this changed occurred?

Exactly.. but seeing this thread, this one change completely destroyed affli warlocks because they aren't easy mode top dps now. My theory, bunch of rerolled DH/Hunters who wanted another easy mode max dps realise that they actually have to work for it now.

[Kaver]

Exactly.. but seeing this thread, this one change completely destroyed affli warlocks because they aren't easy mode top dps now. My theory, bunch of rerolled DH/Hunters who wanted another easy mode max dps realise that they actually have to work for it now.

Are you saying that BM hunters have to work for max dps?

[Sharnie786]

Affliction has gone all of BFA with no AOE to speak of, while Rogues and DH have been able to faceroll massive numbers for the entirety of BFA. It would have been nice to feel like a real AOE class for once.

But you chose Affliction so you should feel how Affli feels. It's great at AoE damage but it's just slow. In raids Destro and Affli look great. I'd say play Destro to feel AoE burst in M+ etc.

I want to main Warlock because 2 of the 3 specs are fun and they're usually great DPS, alas I'm sticking to mage as 2nd main because we have no other mage abd 2 Warlocks already