Please remember all the times Blizzard were wrong - Launching WoW in Beta.

[Dracullus]

1. Garrison wasn't a problem for me, lack of content to do outside was (also later introduced gold mission, but it was just desperate act to keep subs).

2. Loved Legiondaries, it was great incentive to do many types of content, especially liked that in encourage you to do just emissary without need to grind all world quest. Only thing I would change is option to target next legenadary, I would prefer it over SL legendary system.

3. Sorry, I loved artifact system as well, especially during 7.0.

4. Yep, Azerite gear was shit for min-maxers and at best neutral for others. Only positive I see is first breach into post-titanforging world.

5. Again, loved Essences, it wasn't best system, but encouraged you to do different stuff like Legiondaries and that's big + for me. I wish I had more time to invest into rank 4 achiev + title, this will be veeeery rare in future expansions. And yeah, lack of catch up in early 8.3 was bad, no doubt about that.

6. Sadly corruption has lot more negatives than positivies as well, this changed my BfA (personal, I play Fury so class problems didn't affect me) score from 'good' (after 8.2) to 'mediocre' among WoW expansions.

Also I don't trust blindly Blizzard, but one thing I know - I had fun on launch with every expansion including WoD (bare technical difficulties); if some patch will be unfun for me (it's not only on Blizzard, sometimes we just burnout for few months), I'll just take break from WoW without creating drama. Am I doing something wrong?

[jazen]

If you're unhappy playing a game, it might be a good idea to stop playing.

[Very rare pepe]

If you are so tired of playing a game with 'beta' systems, how about you just don't?

Agreed, the only way to effect change in a company that is solely focused on money is to hit them in their wallets. If you want to see the game get better, quit. If it doesn't then you haven't wasted your time, if it does, yaaay!

[salate]

but artifacts were actually cool.
Garrisons were cut off, you couldnt take your favorite location to build it up, blizzard wanted to make it like “choose a zone and make the home” too bad they cut it in the end.

[Soluna]

Well, who says someone trusts blizz blindly? This forum is a pure antithesis to that, because most of the people here distrust blizz blindly.

But hey, what is your post about again? You don't even talk about a feature of the new expansion. I can assume you talk about the covenant system...but unlike the other features you talk about its in there since alpha and was highly discussed and improved by blizz and the community. We'll see if it found a golden spot, I hope so, but I'm worried, too.

Truth to be told, we've been in alpha/beta for so many months now, and there are still so many broken or horrible/unfun covenant abilities. Blizzard has fixed a bit of the covenant abilities, but has done jackshit for the most part. If they are going to implement all 48 abilities in total, they need to ensure that all 48 are balanced/fun.

[Ielenia]

I'm tired of still playing beta when Blizzard releases their new expansions. Blizzard keeps launching systems in a horrible state and then end up having spend a lot of time in order to "fix" it.

Please remember how bad these systems were when they launched and how wrong Blizzard were from the get go.

- Garrisons
- Legion Legendaries
- Artifacts
- Azerite gear
- Essences
- Corruption gear

Please think about how awful these systems were when they were launched. And how much time Blizzard had to use during the expansions to fix them. It amaze me how people can still have this blind trust in Blizzard that they will get things right. How can you trust that Blizzard will be able to fix things with balancing after you have experienced the corruption gear.

Blizzard have often been wrong. Blizzard don't deserve your blind trust.

Funny how you made that list of "examples when Blizzard was wrong from the get go" and yet fail to explain why the items in your list were a mistake in your view. Anyways, here's my view:

• Garrisons were good. The problem is that there was nothing else at all to do in the outside world.
• Legion legendaries were fine, for the most part. The only problem was how the "class-agnostic" legendaries were, for the most part, highly underwhelming.
• Artifacts were good. Each spec and class having a different "talent tree" was pretty good. And I didn't care one iota for the so-called "infinite grind".
• Azerite gear is a good system. As in, being able to pick-and-choose your "set" bonuses. The only hiccup is having been tied to the Heart of Azeroth progression. All slots should've been available from the start.
• Essences as a whole was... okay. What sucked about them is that the PvP essence was BiS for most specs for PvE.
• Corruption wasn't as bad as people made it out to be. Bad? Yes, but, again, not as bad as people made it to be. Sure, it sucked that someone way less geared might out-DPS you due to them having good corruptions, but for the most part, I liked the corruption system.

- - - Updated - - -

Those were literally the best iteration of daily quests we ever had.

I wouldn't call the daily quests in MoP as a mistake, but I wouldn't exactly call them "the best iteration ever", either, because I remember how it sucked having to grind and grind the other reputations just so I could unlock the Golden Lotus reputation to then grind and grind again.

[Drigs]

- Garrisons were fine
- Legendaries were fine, just obtaining them was annoying for the first patch
- Artifacts were fine
- Azerite gear was annoying until 8.1
- Essences were fine
- Corruption is the only example that's actually a bad system


Of course, the most obvious difference is blizzard are actively listening and changing stuff on the beta more than any other expansion - look at the pvp changes most recently as an example. It's clear they want to get this right, in the case of covenants - clearly they have the data and it obvious tells them most people are happy with how things are. Just because preach, asmongold and bellular make malding videos about covenants every other day doesn't mean they're right about them

- Garrisons were fine - Agreed, however they took over the actual game.
- Legendaries were fine, just obtaining them was annoying for the first patch - Getting locked from getting your BIS legendary because you got two crappy ones... hoping to randomly get a lego that your class needed to compete? you're wrong here
- Artifacts were fine - Artifacts were fine, Artifact power was garbage. If you did multiple roles you were screwed for a long time.
- Azerite gear was annoying until 8.1 - Azerite gear is still bad. Sure you can get them easier but the traits themselves aren't balanced at all and some specs (blood dk) have no good class traits
- Essences were fine - mostly fine, outside of blood of the enemy.
- Corruption is the only example that's actually a bad system - I think we all can agree corruption is awful

[Zentail]

I'm tired of still playing beta when Blizzard releases their new expansions. Blizzard keeps launching systems in a horrible state and then end up having spend a lot of time in order to "fix" it.

Please remember how bad these systems were when they launched and how wrong Blizzard were from the get go.

- Garrisons
- Legion Legendaries
- Artifacts
- Azerite gear
- Essences
- Corruption gear

Please think about how awful these systems were when they were launched. And how much time Blizzard had to use during the expansions to fix them. It amaze me how people can still have this blind trust in Blizzard that they will get things right. How can you trust that Blizzard will be able to fix things with balancing after you have experienced the corruption gear.

Blizzard have often been wrong. Blizzard don't deserve your blind trust.

Aside from Corruption gear, you just listed a bunch of reasons why I should trust Blizzard because I loved Garrisons, Legion Legendaries, Artifacts, Azerite Gear, and Essences. To each their own, I guess.

[3nfy]

If you've had this many problems with the game maybe you just don't like playing the game.

[VinceVega]

Here's the thing

If you are the top 1% and your covenant choice actually matters and is important to actually killing bosses (protip; if you're raiding heroic or doing 15s or lower, like 99% of players - you can pick what you like without fear you can't do what you want to do) - then by now surely you're used to these choices being made for you? You can't be at the very cutting edge and also expect to play exactly how you want - you have to make concessions. I don't know why we've decided it's such a huge issue in shadowlands.

If you are not raiding mythic, pick what you want and ignore everyone who gives you shit for it - they are wrong.

Heavens that again... if i can't play well and get an passive buff for 1% more dmg i make 1% more damage... why do people think performance of your abilities only matters for the (pulled from somewhere) 1%? That is not true and never will be.

[Kralljin]

If you are not raiding mythic, pick what you want and ignore everyone who gives you shit for it - they are wrong.

Imagine that some raiders below mythic also enjoy optimizing their character for a given situation.
But i guess those people are "wrong" as well.

The real irony of this whole debate is that those that keep repeating the "1%" line cannot grasp that some people enjoy optimizing for the sake of optimizing, not just because they *have* to do it.

[SkagenRora]

I'm tired of still playing beta when Blizzard releases their new expansions. Blizzard keeps launching systems in a horrible state and then end up having spend a lot of time in order to "fix" it.

Please remember how bad these systems were when they launched and how wrong Blizzard were from the get go.

- Garrisons
- Legion Legendaries
- Artifacts
- Azerite gear
- Essences
- Corruption gear

Please think about how awful these systems were when they were launched. And how much time Blizzard had to use during the expansions to fix them. It amaze me how people can still have this blind trust in Blizzard that they will get things right. How can you trust that Blizzard will be able to fix things with balancing after you have experienced the corruption gear.

Blizzard have often been wrong. Blizzard don't deserve your blind trust.

I just play and enjoy the game, No matter what they do, and if i don't enjoy it i just take a break from the game.

Stop overthinking things so much, You as players do not have to do any thing that you do not want to do, and if someone tries to "Force" you to do something.. Just tell them that you do not consider this a fun activity and won't do it.

[Kralljin]

The fact is if you aren't part of the 1% you can pick what you like without gimping yourself, contrary to what content creators and naysayers would have you believe

You pick the Covenant that isn't best for X, you gimped yourself for X.
Hmm, seems like i gimped myself.

There is a difference betwen having to do something and wanting to do something.

[Vampyrr]

Well I can just say.

If trust = no then leave = yes..

Please do shut up.. I love the game and yess I do think not everything if great but I loved this game for 15 years and ill love it another 15 if need to and thats all up to me and not you

I mean you dont get to tell others to shut up anymore than they get to tell you to shut up. There are issues and people are allowed to discuss it. I love Blizzard too doesnt mean I dont feel they are making another obvious mistake though.

[Cracked]

I'm excited for this not to happen so I can remind you

Well that would be a first. The day Blizzard launches an expansion with systems that are not deeply flawed and .. dare I say.. ENJOYABLE.. I'll stick a shoe in my mouth.

[Kralljin]

You've never been able to have the best choice in every situation. What are you complaining about?

Besides racials (which have been heavily neutered over the years, i might add), it was possible to optimize your character to the maximum in a given situation for the last ~10 years, minus Legion and BfA.

It seems you're just trying to build a strawman.

[Kyphael]

This picture sums it up pretty good.

This pretty much sums up Blizzard's process. Lol

[Leyre]

Those were literally the best iteration of daily quests we ever had.

Because blocking a set of dailies behind another faction dailies was such a SMART thing to do, right?

[Niwes]

in the end, nothing of all that was said here matters. the only thing that matters, is: which one pays and which one do not.

i am in beta. i play the game since 15 years. i see what OP and others see. since years. and i agree. but i still pay. what does this mean ? in the end: nothing. because, when you break it down rationally, there are only 2 types of factions:

- Blizzard as a company
- Player as a customer

The goal of Blizzard is, to make the most money, no matter what. The goal of the players is, to have most possible fun, with the product from Blizzard. Since above facts, are simply the truth, rationally there are 4 types of players/customers:

- the one that pays, because he likes for what he pays.
- the one that pay, even when he not much like it (any longer), but still pay (for other reasons).
- the one that not pay (stopped paying), because he not (no longer) likes for what he pays.
- the one that not pay, even when he would like, what he gets.

in the end, it only matters how many ppls are part of the first two or part if the second two.

since these are just facts, its simple as that.

[A Chozo]

lmao dude thinks people blindly trust blizzard

If someone buys a WoW expansion and happens to not have fun, it's on them. Everyone else know damn well what they are buying. This is WoW 9 - Shadowlands. Datamining is pried open like a garlic, just look at it and determine if it's fun or not. If they don't agree with your feedback, go play something else.