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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    So we agree and that is why I did not group them.
    You should group them. The core architecture is the same. Everything else has substantial differences with every generation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    AMD is maybe an American company but it is not supporting America Intel does and there is a premium on American made stuff. Unless your apple then there is a premium no matter where it is made.
    Intel is manufacturing in Indonesia/Malaysia, AMD on Taiwan. What's the difference? Both have nothing to do with America. Intel chips just cost more to make, that's it.

    [QUOTE=Kalika;52645437]AMD was winning their chips were better at all metrics and then they announced we are no longer going to compete we are going to make crappy cheap chips and dropped out.

    AMD hasnt made a competitive GPU since 280X. The point where they states that they're not going to try making a high end GPU was Polaris. That's a solid 5-6 years of making it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    When someone says they do not have a hard budget I assume a few hundred dollars is not a big deal but your right few hundred to me is not the same as a few hundred for you.
    Most people would still spend those few hundred on a GPU and would be right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    I am not sure they got the best product, though they have the best price. Like I said if your bleeding edge vs old tech and you’re not destroying your product must be inferior. Yes AMD have beat intel on the core count but when you compare core for core intel wins.
    The goal of the business is to make money. AMD came up with the architecture that allows them to make chips cheap and be competitive in performance, so yea, they have the best product because they hold 80% of the marketshare in DYI space.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    Much of computer metrics are measured in fractions of seconds so 15-18 second is an eternity.
    3 seconds is eternity? Ok. You're just digging a hole for yourself at this point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    I use an AMD video card, not because of cost but instead because I run macOS and macOS does not support Nvidia.
    Ok, so you dont have any connection to the market we're discussing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    I am not really a gamer and only play wow because of my wife.
    So why are you arguing with me exactly?
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    You should group them. The core architecture is the same. Everything else has substantial differences with every generation.
    Incorrect the core architecture, the microarchitecture, is vastly different the node processing is the same as Bordwell but that it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    Intel is manufacturing in Indonesia/Malaysia, AMD on Taiwan. What's the difference? Both have nothing to do with America. Intel chips just cost more to make, that's it.
    Once again wrong the wafer manufacturing happens in New Mexico, Arizona, Oregon, also in Ireland, and Israel with the bulk coming out of the US. Indonesia/Malaysia are just assembly plants i.e. low-tech jobs.

    AMD on the other hand is only headquarters here.


    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    AMD hasnt made a competitive GPU since 280X. The point where they states that they're not going to try making a high end GPU was Polaris. That's a solid 5-6 years of making it.
    Most people would still spend those few hundred on a GPU and would be right.
    I wasn’t talking about GPU I was talking about CPU the Athlon chip was smacking intel around then they decided to go fabless and fell of the grid for the past 10 years.


    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    The goal of the business is to make money. AMD came up with the architecture that allows them to make chips cheap and be competitive in performance, so yea, they have the best product because they hold 80% of the market share in DYI space.
    And the DYI space is 15% market share so not a big win there. AMD is just the name stamped on the chip TCSM is the architect in this deal. AMD is not beating Intel TCSM is beating intel.

    And the goal of tech companies is to be innovative then to make money.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    3 seconds is eternity? Ok. You're just digging a hole for yourself at this point.
    Ok, so you dont have any connection to the market we're discussing?
    In a world where every Microseconds counts yes 3 second is eternity. I have a connection to the wow market and that is what the OP was referring to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    So why are you arguing with me exactly?
    I only pointed out that found it funny that AMD was using bleeding edge tech and was not stomping the crap out of intel using old tech. You then decided to come at me with your propaganda about AMD.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    Incorrect the core architecture, the microarchitecture, is vastly different the node processing is the same as Bordwell but that it.
    So I guess the core architecture that's vastly difference is clocking and performing the same is supposed to work like that? Ok.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    Once again wrong the wafer manufacturing happens in New Mexico, Arizona, Oregon, also in Ireland, and Israel with the bulk coming out of the US. Indonesia/Malaysia are just assembly plants i.e. low-tech jobs.
    Ok I was wrong here. Still, noone is preventing Intel from manufacturing on TSMC aswell. Noone gives a shit where the CPUs are made.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    I wasn’t talking about GPU I was talking about CPU the Athlon chip was smacking intel around then they decided to go fabless and fell of the grid for the past 10 years.
    Getting rid of the fabs was a good move, considering their location. Not developing anything to compete with Core architecture was a big yikes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    And the DYI space is 15% market share so not a big win there. AMD is just the name stamped on the chip TCSM is the architect in this deal.
    TSMC is not designing chips, they're manufacturing. TSMC is also making chips for Intel, Apple and Nvidia, are you going to say TSMC is designing those too?

    DYI space is a smaller market but it's very good advertisement. Shares in the rest of the space will follow if Intel doesnt do anything about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    AMD is not beating Intel TCSM is beating intel.
    Suuuuure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    And the goal of tech companies is to be innovative then to make money.
    You cant innovate if you dont have money to invest into your R&D.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalika View Post
    I only pointed out that found it funny that AMD was using bleeding edge tech and was not stomping the crap out of intel using old tech. You then decided to come at me with your propaganda about AMD.
    I dont have any kind of soft spots for AMD. I'm just gonna lose all of my revenue if I'm going to tell my customers the truth, which is the fact that AMD is the way to go for a budget-concious PC buyer right now.
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  4. #24
    OP, can I ask how good your system runs WoW? Your type of specs interest me...The classic 2500k and a 680. Kinda interesting specs, just wondering how good it is.

    But please, dont buy anything now - Wait until December or so for ryzen 4000, or potential price cuts on ryzen 3000 + ofc new Nvidia GPU which will lower prices on older stuff, if you dont just buy a 3000 series GPU, maybe waiting until like...Spring? For the cheaper models like...who knows 3050ti

    Edit: Think Ryzen CPU's might come early october, and then retail sales maybe December. Again...AMD has been good for us; They do price cuts, or at least they have done before, maybe they might start getting a bit greedy now that Intel is not competition any longer...well, if you want high-end gaming all the FPS they are still the best.
    Last edited by Djuntas; 2020-09-15 at 08:32 PM.
    Youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/djuntas ARPG - RTS - MMO

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    So I guess the core architecture that's vastly difference is clocking and performing the same is supposed to work like that? Ok.
    It’s clear you do not get how CPU really function if you did you would understand that the Skylake was a line in the sand and Brodwell and everything before was on the other side of it. Skylake changed the way information was received, processed, qued, and sent back. Most of those changes were in the very cores themselves that you say are not any different. They also changed the way the cores and the IO connect to one another.


    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    TSMC is not designing chips, they're manufacturing. TSMC is also making chips for Intel, Apple and Nvidia, are you going to say TSMC is designing those too?
    Apple SOC and AMD CPU are nothing alike in any realm of reality. Apple is driving TSMC but TSMC foundation is controlling everything yes including Apple and Nvidia. They have not made a CPU yet for intel and if their manufacturing requires intel to completely redesign the chip then yes they will be controlling intel as well. However, if they manufacture intel chips the same way intel does then no. Hopefully, intel will get their shit together and not need to use TSMC to make their chips as a CPU from TSMC will be inferior.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    DYI space is a smaller market but it's very good advertisement. Shares in the rest of the space will follow if Intel doesn’t do anything about it.
    If you’re not a DIYer then you’re not looking at the DIY market and you’re not seeing the advertising.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    You cant innovate if you dont have money to invest into your R&D.

    I dont have any kind of soft spots for AMD. I'm just gonna lose all of my revenue if I'm going to tell my customers the truth, which is the fact that AMD is the way to go for a budget-concious PC buyer right now.
    Right and AMD throws money away left and right when they try to undercut the market.

    If they just instead created a CPU that was really on the level of Intel they would not need to be the cheaper CPU. As with anything when you are undercutting the market your producing an inferior product.

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