Shadowlands has major problems up ahead

[The Cheat]

Crunching hard? Where? As many people said, the major system of the expansion isn't working for several specs and we're not even speaking about balancing Covenant skills or conduits here. For several classes Covenant skills are fundamentally "broken" or just useless.

Yeah I mean I didn't say it's a good thing. Crunching is a plague in the gaming industry imposed by corps/publishers that control the money. ActiBlizz clearly wants SL released as soon as possible and that's why Blizzard the studio is probably having to crunch (and they still likely won't address every major issue resulting in at least a few gamebreaking bug hotfixes on launch week).

[NineSpine]

So they are going to punish casual players like me with prepatch and systemlands launch. AoE hard cap, nerf to legacy raid loot and gold, caking on layers of bloated rental systems. Not good. So who is the target audience for systemlands when they are clearly not targeting casual players like me or hardcore min/max players? EVen role players are upset with how covenant system is designed.

You aren't a casual.

[Yarathir]

The best thing about this stuff is the denial changing to realization once the expansion launches and people actually have to deal with it until at least the next content patch if not the entire rest of the expansion.

"Why didn't anybody tell me it was this bad!"

[Mafic]

You aren't a casual.

I have no legendary cloak and have done no visions or corruptions. I am very casual.

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The best thing about this stuff is the denial changing to realization once the expansion launches and people actually have to deal with it until at least the next content patch if not the entire rest of the expansion.

"Why didn't anybody tell me it was this bad!"

Remember BFA? I was telling people over the summer that warfronts were bad. There was even people defending how warfronts were time gated at launch. Like why? Warfronts were not anything special for them to be timegated.

[Toybox]

The best thing about this stuff is the denial changing to realization once the expansion launches and people actually have to deal with it until at least the next content patch if not the entire rest of the expansion.

"Why didn't anybody tell me it was this bad!"

No-one worth listening to will take pleasure in (maybe) being right about this sort of stuff though. It'll just be a shame

[NineSpine]

I have no legendary cloak and have done no visions or corruptions. I am very casual.

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Remember BFA? I was telling people over the summer that warfronts were bad. There was even people defending how warfronts were time gated at launch. Like why? Warfronts were not anything special for them to be timegated.

Casuals don't spend hours every day overanalyzing the game on forums.

[Yarathir]

No-one worth listening to will take pleasure in (maybe) being right about this sort of stuff though. It'll just be a shame

Why wouldn't one take pleasure in it? The contingent of bullheaded players who refuse to see the pattern deserve nothing better.

Fool me once, etc.

[NineSpine]

Why wouldn't one take pleasure in it? The contingent of bullheaded players who refuse to see the pattern deserve nothing better.

Fool me once, etc.

The pattern of what? People crying and whining about every single thing Blizzard ever does and then declaring victory the 10% of the time they are right?

If you say the world is ending every day, eventually you’ll be right, but that doesn’t make you a prophet.

[Yarathir]

The pattern of what? People crying and whining about every single thing Blizzard ever does and then declaring victory the 10% of the time they are right?

If you say the world is ending every day, eventually you’ll be right, but that doesn’t make you a prophet.

"10% of the time they are right."

Try the last two expansions. Feel free to enjoy your Azerite tra-- uhh, Essenc-- no.. Corruptions? Ah, no. Your Covenants. That's it.

[NineSpine]

"10% of the time they are right."

Try the last two expansions. Feel free to enjoy your Azerite tra-- uhh, Essenc-- no.. Corruptions? Ah, no. Your Covenants. That's it.

People said artifacts would be a disaster. They were fine. People said mythic+ would be a disaster and now it’s wildly popular. People said world quests would be a disaster. They’re fine.

BFA was certainly shit, but that doesn’t make the people who predict EVERY EXPANSION will be shit are some kind of geniuses.

[Nyel]

Remember BFA? I was telling people over the summer that warfronts were bad. There was even people defending how warfronts were time gated at launch. Like why? Warfronts were not anything special for them to be timegated.

We all did. The same with Azerite and class design. A lot of people agreed, but a lot of were in denial as well and just regurgitated the "it's alpha/beta/early launch" bs... same procedure as every (two) year(s).

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Casuals don't spend hours every day overanalyzing the game on forums.

Casual is a playstyle and doesn't reflect one's interest in a game.

[Toybox]

Why wouldn't one take pleasure in it? The contingent of bullheaded players who refuse to see the pattern deserve nothing better.

Fool me once, etc.

Because people worth listening to should want the game to be good, & those people tend not to be happy when something they predicted would be shit turns out shit. I took no pleasure in BfA ending up as crap as it did, & while I do predict issues in Shadowlands, I really, really hope I'm proven wrong on all of them.

[NineSpine]

We all did. The same with Azerite and class design. A lot of people agreed, but a lot of were in denial as well and just regurgitated the "it's alpha/beta/early launch" bs... same procedure as every (two) year(s).

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Casual is a playstyle and doesn't reflect one's interest in a game.

Casual
(1) : feeling or showing little concern : NONCHALANT
a casual approach to cooking
(2) : lacking a high degree of interest or devotion
casual sports fans
casual readers
(3) : done without serious intent or commitment

Someone who spends hours and hours and hours analyzing the game Is not casual.

[Toybox]

Casual
(1) : feeling or showing little concern : NONCHALANT
a casual approach to cooking
(2) : lacking a high degree of interest or devotion
casual sports fans
casual readers
(3) : done without serious intent or commitment

Someone who spends hours and hours and hours analyzing the game Is not casual.

There's no point debating the definition of casual within the WoW community as many people view it differently. I'd personally say that someone who raids 7 hours per week in a two day guild & then logs off is more casual than someone who plays 20 hours a week farming pets/mounts/transmog/WQs, but other people would vehemently argue the reverse is true.

[NineSpine]

There's no point debating the definition of casual within the WoW community as many people view it differently. I'd personally say that someone who raids 7 hours per week in a two day guild & then logs off is more casual than someone who plays 20 hours a week farming pets/mounts/transmog/WQs, but other people would vehemently argue the reverse is true.

The definition of casual is extremely clear. It’s not about time investment. It’s about how seriously you approach the game. You are certainly welcome to invent definitions, hell you can invent your own secret languages and communicate with your twin or imaginary friends in them if it tickles your fancy, but that’s not really the purpose of language.

[Mafic]

Casuals don't spend hours every day overanalyzing the game on forums.

My post count is lower than yours so by definition that makes me casual.

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We all did. The same with Azerite and class design. A lot of people agreed, but a lot of were in denial as well and just regurgitated the "it's alpha/beta/early launch" bs... same procedure as every (two) year(s).

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Casual is a playstyle and doesn't reflect one's interest in a game.

Yeppers.

I remember Azerite armor fiasco at launch...it seems a repeat is going to happen again.

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"10% of the time they are right."

Try the last two expansions. Feel free to enjoy your Azerite tra-- uhh, Essenc-- no.. Corruptions? Ah, no. Your Covenants. That's it.

The fear many have is that class power is going to be segregated to level cap again which defeats the entire point of the revamped leveling experience. People want to enjoy playing their classes from 1-50 and not feel punished because a class or spec is balanced around a rental convenant ability.

[Eapoe]

The definition of casual is extremely clear. It’s not about time investment. It’s about how seriously you approach the game. You are certainly welcome to invent definitions, hell you can invent your own secret languages and communicate with your twin or imaginary friends in them if it tickles your fancy, but that’s not really the purpose of language.

I’m pretty sure if I log in for 10 mins a day and do nothing but run from flight path to flight path but I take that as extremely serious because I do it at the same time every day that I would not be considered hard core.

[NineSpine]

I’m pretty sure if I log in for 10 mins a day and do nothing but run from flight path to flight path but I take that as extremely serious because I do it at the same time every day that I would not be considered hard core.

You think that this absurd example proves your point, but the fact that its the best you can do proves mine.

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My post count is lower than yours so by definition that makes me casual.

Im not the one pretending to be casual.

[Eapoe]

You think that this absurd example proves your point, but the fact that its the best you can do proves mine.

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Im not the one pretending to be casual.

No, it in fact does not. You stated “it doesn’t have to do with time invested but how serious you take it. That’s not true.
It actually encompasses both ideas. To state yours is the absolute truth just demonstrates ego and unwillingness to realize there is more to it than your narrow view.

[Mafic]

You think that this absurd example proves your point, but the fact that its the best you can do proves mine.

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Im not the one pretending to be casual.

Hey my gear level is lower than the average of most casual players for the final patch of BFA. You believe whatever you want.

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He gave pretty clear examples with the 4 skills and how 3 are either outright unsuable solo or at least annoying to use and one plays well and feels powerful. That is certainly something that casual players are interested in.

You would have a point if covenants would be some "A gives a bonus to crits and B gives a bonus to haste and according to some hidden formular crit is a few percent better for your class/spec" stuff. Casuals wouldn't probably not be interested in optimizing there.

But this seems to be pretty clear cut stuff that everybody will notice.

Yes.

So far Bone Spike is easy to use out in open world, dungeons and PVP. I can't say the same for the other three. I am not interested in downloading an addon to make Rogue kyrian echoing reprimand work.

Sepsis I guess can work in PVP situations if you need to vanish after 10 seconds but for solo? No way. Plus, a free vanish doesn't benefit Sub and Outlaw that much compared to Assassination. Sub has vanish and shadow dance charges so it is devalued as a covenant choice while Outlaw doesn't make use of free stealth openers.

Then you have venthyr slaughter which is just a fancy version of ambush/shadowtrike which doesn't feel different and then the venthyr vampiric effect that lasts 2 minutes while my wound poisons lasts for one hour. Constantly reapplying it every 2 minutes is very annoying.