What's the scolding horde players get at the start of the Ardenweald's covenant?

[zysis]

the horde did greater damage to the alliance than the scourge, the burning legion and N'zoth together. And not in a grey area, I am only talking about the times when they were clearly acting evil.

So... ignoring Lorderon, Stratholme and Scholomance are we? Good guy Alliance are we? Leave behind whole cities and forsake them?
Hey kettle, meet pot...

[Lorgar Aurelian]

So... ignoring Lorderon, Stratholme and Scholomance are we? Good guy Alliance are we? Leave behind whole cities and forsake them?
Hey kettle, meet pot...

Ignoring that non of that was actually done by the alliance even if you did count those the alliance would be way behind compared to the horde scourge or legion in terms of damage.

In the same vein of mass loss of life or damage to the world As I did earlier for the the other factions and let’s say we count per frostmourn arthas.

The alliance has,
Killed abunch of trolls while fighting zul’Jin.
Wiped out one tribe of cows.
Destroyed that other town (even though they let the civ’s go)
Purged stratholme.
And then??????

The alliance as a faction has caused very little destruction On the scale of the legion /scourge/horde sure there General warring but not much large scale destruction.

[Mardux]

Ignoring that non of that was actually done by the alliance even if you did count those the alliance would be way behind compared to the horde scourge or legion in terms of damage.

In the same vein of mass loss of life or damage to the world As I did earlier for the the other factions and let’s say we count per frostmourn arthas.

The alliance has,
Killed abunch of trolls while fighting zul’Jin.
Wiped out one tribe of cows.
Destroyed that other town (even though they let the civ’s go)
Purged stratholme.
And then??????

The alliance as a faction has caused very little destruction On the scale of the legion /scourge/horde sure there General warring but not much large scale destruction.

Yeah, because they dont target land. They target people.

[VladlTutushkin]

Yeah, because they dont target land. They target people.

Thats a pile of rubbish though. Alliance specifically chose NOT TO target people on several occasions. And “goblin ship” is mostly retconned anyway since devs couldnt justify why Gallywix was left in charge and just said that goblin starting chain is “only partially canon”. Like, not whole Bilgewater Cartel was on that ship, there were other ships escaping Kezan and so on.

[Not A Cat]

I hate how Horde PCs were forced to ride along this imo poorly written faction war. I prefer to play Horde, but I feel like they keep getting shafted by poor writing.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Yeah, because they dont target land. They target people.

I mean even by that metric they are way way behind the horde/scourge/legion as when they destroy land they tend to also destroy a crap ton of people where the alliance mostly just has general warring that every one else has as well.

[Feanoro]

I hate how Horde PCs were forced to ride along this imo poorly written faction war. I prefer to play Horde, but I feel like they keep getting shafted by poor writing.

Got news for you, both sides get shafted every time the writers think they can get the faction war right this time.

[bowlink]

Yes, I can see how that'd play out too, with the Horde directing them onto trains to take them to work camps with free showers.

You shouldn't said that. Mods don't know what Hyperboly is.

That said: given blizzard recent hiring practices and not vetting their freelance writers, ill enjoy shadowlands if i get to put sylvanas's head on a spike. If blizzard tries to use her as carrot on a stick this expansion so i hacve play the next to actually kill her i'm done.

[Nevad]

I mean even by that metric they are way way behind the horde/scourge/legion as when they destroy land they tend to also destroy a crap ton of people where the alliance mostly just has general warring that every one else has as well.

Kinda feel that throwing the Legion into the argument of damage skews the scale a bit seeing as they have apparently invaded and destroyed countless species and worlds.
Even if we are only talking Azeroth the sundering was caused by the first Legion invasion,the corruption of Medivh which leads to the invasion of Azeroth by the old Horde which was also a Legion plot and so was the creation of the Lich King. Then we have the third war where Legion forces laid waste to mount Hyjal costing the NEs their immortality.

I could go on but i think my point has hopefully come across.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Kinda feel that throwing the Legion into the argument of damage skews the scale a bit seeing as they have apparently invaded and destroyed countless species and worlds.
Even if we are only talking Azeroth the sundering was caused by the first Legion invasion,the corruption of Medivh which leads to the invasion of Azeroth by the old Horde which was also a Legion plot and so was the creation of the Lich King. Then we have the third war where Legion forces laid waste to mount Hyjal costing the NEs their immortality.

I could go on but i think my point has hopefully come across.

Ya the legion kinda make every thing else seem like nothing even just going off of Azeroth, but the original statement was that the horde had done more damage then the scourge legion and n’zoth so I went ahead and put them in any way.

[Eggroll]

Since they were losing the city Sylvanas decided to make sure the Alliance could not use it, solid tactical choice (the method might be debated though). But the capital of the Forsaken is still gone as well as the town Brill outside it. So saying the Forsaken didn't receive any consequences is a bit disingenuous. Btw why didn't the Alliance roll into the Forsaken starting area and burn that down? They already routed the horde from the area so should have been easy pickings.

Yeah it is, but by their own doing. If the Forsaken are such a bunch of brainless twats to worship a genocidal maniac - maybe be smarter next time around.

Appropriate consequences would have been if the forsaken had been eradicated. But alas they were not.

Now the 2nd most popular Alliance race (by a VERY large margin I might add) are without a capital. The Forsaken were only ever a niche race for the most edgelordy of Horde players. I'm sure we can find some sewers to house them.

- - - Updated - - -

So... ignoring Lorderon, Stratholme and Scholomance are we? Good guy Alliance are we? Leave behind whole cities and forsake them?
Hey kettle, meet pot...

I think what both of you are not taking in account is to divide between what happened before WoW even started and what actions the players experienced in real time.

I feel like it's a difference wether we are talking about some past actions players of both sides did not take part in - or if my player faction - night elves - are affected detrimental by the actions of Horde players - like Horde players - or the devs in that case - ridiculing the Burning of Teldrassil and what it meant to the night elf players.

[TirielWoW]

Yes, is such a big issue. I understand that many horde players are also annoyed by it, but fact is, that the horde did greater damage to the alliance than the scourge, the burning legion and N'zoth together. And not in a grey area, I am only talking about the times when they were clearly acting evil.

I think a lot of Horde players are annoyed by it because we weren't given the option to tell her to fuck off. Even NPCs who should have, by their own history, personalities, and prior behaviors, told her "no, get bent" just stood there and were like, "Okay I guess we burning this here tree." Like, for the tree thing to happen, Blizzard had to ignore its own storyline, and gave the players themselves 0 options to be true to their own characters (especially Tauren players). Sure, players had the option to turn against her later, but frankly, I think there are few players who would have chosen to stand with her after seeing men, women, and children burned alive because Sylvanas got insulted by a dying woman.

[Nevad]

Yeah it is, but by their own doing. If the Forsaken are such a bunch of brainless twats to worship a genocidal maniac - maybe be smarter next time around.

Appropriate consequences would have been if the forsaken had been eradicated. But alas they were not.

Now the 2nd most popular Alliance race (by a VERY large margin I might add) are without a capital. The Forsaken were only ever a niche race for the most edgelordy of Horde players. I'm sure we can find some sewers to house them.

- - - Updated - - -



I think what both of you are not taking in account is to divide between what happened before WoW even started and what actions the players experienced in real time.

I feel like it's a difference wether we are talking about some past actions players of both sides did not take part in - or if my player faction - night elves - are affected detrimental by the actions of Horde players - like Horde players - or the devs in that case - ridiculing the Burning of Teldrassil and what it meant to the night elf players.

Like NE's in their past worshipping a certain queen that just made a teeny tiny deal with a not so evil entity that just wants to cleanse existence of all life that caused just a little earthquake. No big deal. Note: no i do not like what Sylvanas has done or how Blizzard has written her. (Though my fire mage was all on board with the burning, she likes big flames).

Hoo boy genocide that's always a slippery slope what's next cleansing the entire world of everything you see as evil/bad? I'm sure the normal Forsaken citizens will see your point and take that decision with grace.

Just a nitpick the Forsaken are within ~1% of Orcs, Tauren and Trolls at least according to the metric i saw from 2019. The 1st being BE's by a mile (lord knows why). Also why would sewers be some kind of an insult? Have you seen the Rogue order hall in Dalaran? That place, in my personal opinion, is awesome.
You can still visit Darnassus you know, its not gone so going with the player argument seems like you are letting emotions getting to involved in the game. Had you come with an in-universe argument i could see where the apparent anger would come from. Also why would the amount of players matter when it comes to storytelling? That would mean nothing bad can happen to the top races of both factions.

If the burning of Teldrassil affected you that much you might need to take a step back from the game for a bit. But hey that's just my personal opinion, you do you!

[Selennah]

I just watched Nobbel's video on how to pick a covenant based on story, and he mentioned that horde players get a major scolding if they choose the Ardenweald covenant.

What is said and implied? I've tried to google for it but I get nothing.

I'm horde and play beta, and I don't see the theater as a scolding. In fact they also talk about how we, maw walkers (that's our nickname in shadowlands, , helped to heal azeroth and killed n'zoth. And the audicence aplaud us at the end ^^

[Feanoro]

Like NE's in their past worshipping a certain queen that just made a teeny tiny deal with a not so evil entity that just wants to cleanse existence of all life that caused just a little earthquake. No big deal.

The Night Elves in question were referred to as the Highborne, today called Blood Elves. The current Night Elves were more the Average Joes, kept in the dark about what their "betters" were doing.

[Varodoc]

You shouldn't said that. Mods don't know what Hyperboly is.

That said: given blizzard recent hiring practices and not vetting their freelance writers, ill enjoy shadowlands if i get to put sylvanas's head on a spike. If blizzard tries to use her as carrot on a stick this expansion so i hacve play the next to actually kill her i'm done.

Mods know what hyperbole is only when it's Horde fanboys making it. Like when Horde fanboys say trash like "Sylvanas did nothing wrong, elven barbecues are the best" or "Alleria/Jaina should be put in jail and R by 40 orcs" (I'll let you figure out what the R word is, and yes I have seen Horde fanboys say this horrible stuff).

[Ardenaso]

Yes, I can see how that'd play out too, with the Horde hauling them off from ships to take them to gladiator arena and target practice with probably no showers.

well this one happened

[Feanoro]

well this one happened

Quiet, the Garrosh fans will come to deny everything!

[bowlink]

Mods know what hyperbole is only when it's Horde fanboys making it. Like when Horde fanboys say trash like "Sylvanas did nothing wrong, elven barbecues are the best" or "Alleria/Jaina should be put in jail and R by 40 orcs" (I'll let you figure out what the R word is, and yes I have seen Horde fanboys say this horrible stuff).

nothing to figure out loud and clear. and yes your right some people get away with everything on this forum while others get the banner hammer. ill let you figure which is which.

[Nevad]

The Night Elves in question were referred to as the Highborne, today called Blood Elves. The current Night Elves were more the Average Joes, kept in the dark about what their "betters" were doing.

My point to the original poster was that felling judgement on an entire race/faction for the actions of their upper crust is not exactly PC. Else the NE's and by extension BE's, i guess, would be in a world of trouble.