Covenants won‘t be working outside Shadowlands

[Lucetia]

Ehm what? I make the choice of what Covenenant to take depedning on which is more useful in Arena. So you're saying PvP'ers should not be able to use the "New thing" of the expansion?

I'm saying that if they disabled it in PvP it would alleviate a ton of headaches. Every patch/expansion when new things like this are introduced it causes massive headaches and tons of complaints of posts saying "OMG Blizzard this is ability is OP and makes X class faceroll. Glad you let any noob just hit Y rating. Such a joke." until they eventually nerf it to the ground.

[Spazzix]

It's almost like it's not about the damage but about the fun of playing your class.

Have you tried playing it in current content? If not, you're in for a real treat...

Is this genuinely just complaining about having to use the sparkly animations from core abilities instead of the sparkly animations from a covenant ability in old content? You say fun of playing your class, but when I hear "playing your class" I think of ability interactions, decisions, procs, talent choices, gear selection, and strategy. I don't think, "When I walk up to the Lich King and kill him for my weekly shot at Invincible, should I auto attack him and then loot? or should I Tiger Palm him and then loot? OR should I use my sweet ass covenant ability and then loot?"

[keldarepewpew]

Have you tried playing it in current content? If not, you're in for a real treat...

Is this genuinely just complaining about having to use the sparkly animations from core abilities instead of the sparkly animations from a covenant ability in old content? You say fun of playing your class, but when I hear "playing your class" I think of ability interactions, decisions, procs, talent choices, gear selection, and strategy. I don't think, "When I walk up to the Lich King and kill him for my weekly shot at Invincible, should I auto attack him and then loot? or should I Tiger Palm him and then loot? OR should I use my sweet ass covenant ability and then loot?"

i dont get these people in old content you press fan of knives and the entire raid dies lol.

[Sorshen]

I'm saying that if they disabled it in PvP it would alleviate a ton of headaches. Every patch/expansion when new things like this are introduced it causes massive headaches and tons of complaints of posts saying "OMG Blizzard this is ability is OP and makes X class faceroll. Glad you let any noob just hit Y rating. Such a joke." until they eventually nerf it to the ground.

That's clearly not going to happen tho. They marketed Covenants as a core choice like picking your class. Ion's own words.
You can't just abandon class design halfway thu beta and then focus/double down on Covenants just to restrict them when you're running out of time.

[LazuOG]

I don't actually have useful input, I just though it would be fun to jump in and cry about having to use my core abilities to one shot things in old content instead of using my covenant ability to one shot things in old content...
...

But in all seriousness the point is, Blizzard had to put in EXTRA work to disable them, so unless "disable covenants outside of Shadowlands" came up on the "Wheel of Tasks to Waste Time Since We Have Nothing Else to Work on for Shadowlands" that they spin every Wednesday, they have their reasons (maybe to stop the possibility of "Rexxtroy" situations with weird covenant ability interactions in the old world?)

It's old content, you don't need your covenant ability.

Let me understand this.This gameplay defining sub class that our entire kit has been designed around this expansion is not something we should have when playing the game ? Some classes play very poorly without the stat and ability bonuses from the covenants. Also, it doesnt even make sense lore wise to even leave the Shadowlands. How can people be cool with this convoluted move that makes no sense from either perspective?

Also, who are you to tell people what they do and don't need ? That patronizing and irrelevant narrative has no place in discussions about topics like this. I dont need anything but auto attacks to clear old raids, so I should not be outraged if they take away everything else, right ? Because I don't need it ?

What I absolutely need at minimum should never be the question anyway. This is a game. What I and other players WANT is whats keeps us playing. We paid for these damn features only for them to be locked behind a zone? It doesnt seem to be enough to arbitrarily lock people into power systems, no, we also need to be held hostage inside 20% of the games available world in order to use content we paid for. Great reasoning there.

[keldarepewpew]

Let me understand this.This gameplay defining sub class that our entire kit has been designed around this expansion is not something we should have when playing the game ? Some classes play very poorly without the stat and ability bonuses from the covenants. Also, it doesnt even make sense lore wise to even leave the Shadowlands. How can people be cool with this convoluted move that makes no sense from either perspective?

Also, who are you to tell people what they do and don't need ? That patronizing and irrelevant narrative has no place in discussions about topics like this. I dont need anything but auto attacks to clear old raids, so I should not be outraged if they take away everything else, right ? Because I don't need it ?

What I absolutely need at minimum should never be the question anyway. This is a game. What I and other players WANT is whats keeps us playing. We paid for these damn features only for them to be locked behind a zone? It doesnt seem to be enough to arbitrarily lock people into power systems, no, we also need to be held hostage inside 20% of the games available world in order to use content we paid for. Great reasoning there.

in old content you press 1 aoe spell and everything in sight is dead, if it saves them dev time by simply disabling them instead of trying to make them work retroactivly in that content i really dont see how anyone can be against that. OLD content has 0 meaning in retail wow everyone insta dies i could spam fan of knives and everything insta dies.

[Lucetia]

That's clearly not going to happen tho. They marketed Covenants as a core choice like picking your class. Ion's own words.
You can't just abandon class design halfway thu beta and then focus/double down on Covenants just to restrict them when you're running your of time.

Ok, people are reading way too much into it. I never said they will or anything, just that they should in order to balance things easier and cause less issues over time. Clearly they aren't going to do it so most of you can stop getting your feathers ruffled. It's funny how majority of the people claim PvP should be about skill so when it is mentioned to balance abilities so everyone has the same then it's "PvP should be able to get other abilities too that can break things". So should PvP be about player skill or should it be about what abilities/op abilities you can have? Simply because we know anyone who will PvP will grab whatever ability is OP for that week just like they did with corruptions where possible.

[Lochton]

Always thought that they would announce this. Makes easier to balance things outside of Shadowlands.

[Harbour]

Oh, white knighters, but Papa Ion said: "We dont want player to look at Paladin who specced Venthyr and think "This is Paladin". We want player to look at Paladin who specced Venthyr and think "This is Venthyr Paladin".


Apparently, this is not the case anymore. They want player to look at Paladin who specced Venthyr and think "This is Venthyr Paladin... unless he stays in the newest zone. Then he is just a Paladin again".

[Wuusah]

Have you tried playing it in current content? If not, you're in for a real treat...

Is this genuinely just complaining about having to use the sparkly animations from core abilities instead of the sparkly animations from a covenant ability in old content? You say fun of playing your class, but when I hear "playing your class" I think of ability interactions, decisions, procs, talent choices, gear selection, and strategy. I don't think, "When I walk up to the Lich King and kill him for my weekly shot at Invincible, should I auto attack him and then loot? or should I Tiger Palm him and then loot? OR should I use my sweet ass covenant ability and then loot?"

It's complaining about not getting your full toolkit, especially the mobility skills that some covenants might give you. Imagine if you played Warrior and the game doesn't let you use heroic leap in content where you didn't have heroic leap yet. Mobility makes old content 100000x more fun to go through.

It shouldn't be that hard to understand this concept that it's less fun if you don't get to use your full toolkit.

And it's not just about old raids. What if someone wants to raid the other faction? What about world pvp? It's just not fun to have skills that you are used to, to be grayed out because of arbitrary reasons. I really don't understand how people can defend this.

[keldarepewpew]

If you are actively doing old content with max level chars and pretending you are actually playing the game and need a functional class i really dont know what the fuck you are doing.

[Harbour]

If you are actively doing old content with max level chars and pretending you are actually playing the game and need a functional class i really dont know what the fuck you are doing.

Are you implying that its okay for a class to be shit ouside expansion content?

[Kaver]

“It’s a RPG”. Of course covenant abilities shouldn’t work outside the realm of the Shadowlands when they are tied directly to that world

I bet all the “casuals” who are lecturing min-max’ers about “meaningful choices” and “essential restrictions of RPGs” will hate this change even though it completely fits with their own arguments about RPG elements. I love it!

[Harbour]

Why would the Covenant spells/abilities and Soulbinds work outside of the Shadowlands? This decision makes perfect sense to me. Why would you expect any different?

Most BGs and Arenas are located outside Shadolands. Covenant abilities shouldnt work there as well. They do. This common "lore" excuse is invalid.

[Ronald The Mcdonald]

“It’s a RPG”. Of course covenant abilities shouldn’t work outside the realm of the Shadowlands when they are tied directly to that world

I bet all the “casuals” who are lecturing min-max’ers about “meaningful choices” and “essential restrictions of RPGs” will hate this change even though it completely fits with their own arguments about RPG elements. I love it!

You're speaking from a STORY standpoint. From a gameplay standpoint it makes no sense. Especially when we have clear examples of Blizzard giving us borrowed power and have us use it anywhere while said borrow power is current and relevant.

[Harbour]

“It’s a RPG”. Of course covenant abilities shouldn’t work outside the realm of the Shadowlands when they are tied directly to that world

I bet all the “casuals” who are lecturing min-max’ers about “meaningful choices” and “essential restrictions of RPGs” will hate this change even though it completely fits with their own arguments about RPG elements. I love it!

Most BGs and Arenas are located outside Shadolands. Covenant abilities shouldnt work there as well. They do. This common "lore" excuse is invalid.
Its as if people who constantly sheeping behind every Blizzard decison has zero analytical abilities in their heads whatsoever. Big sad.

[Nightstalker]

It's old content, you don't need your covenant ability.

It's old content, you don't need anything but auto-attack afk. Just deactivate the entire spellbook for old content.
It's a damage/performance increase. You will always want to be at 100% of your capabilities.

[Baneto]

To quote Blizzard:
The Maw
The Maw is intended to be the desolate and brutal domain of the Jailer, and not a place any soul in the Warcraft cosmos ever hopes to visit. But this is, after all, a video game, and telling that story can’t come at the expense of creating a fun environment for adventurers




Blizzard is a meme at this point...

Rofl, love the meme its very accurate.

Im curious whats the next attraction on the Blizzard Circus will be now.

[keldarepewpew]

Are you implying that its okay for a class to be shit ouside expansion content?

I have tested beta enough to know covenant abilities are simply something you press on CD with minimal thought/impact if you think having this ability will make or break your class you are so far from the thruth. BOY are you in for a surprise .

[erifwodahs]

Actually, the KotEB have established portals and this time they are canon, since Taelia's and Calia's presence in the shadowlands/oribos is explained that way. So this time the whole tourism angle is part of the plot, not just for us either.

Time runs differently in shadowlands than the rest of the world too. Also every mage will be able to do portals to shadowlands so everyone and their grandma will be able to come there. It's not supposed to be a tourism point.

- - - Updated - - -

I have tested beta enough to know covenant abilities are simply something you press on CD with minimal thought/impact if you think having this ability will make or break your class you are so far from the thruth.

You have not tested it enough then. Some spells do flat out 30-40% dmg for that class. Imagine being a class with covenant ability dueling in Durotar vs someone whos covenant ability is only 10% of their output.