Covenants won‘t be working outside Shadowlands

[Toybox]

Applying the same logic then BFA content shouldnt work outside of BFA content, because you know reasons.

Thematically, Azerite powers should work where there's azerite, which rules out Outlands/Draenor but nowhere else as far as I'm aware. Since our covenant powers are directly tied to power sources within the Shadowlands, it does make sense for them to not work outside of that.

It'll be fine either way. It's not like you need your covenant ability to go do transmog runs or anything.

[arkanon]

Dont hate on me here, im very busy and havnt done any digging, but what exactly is the issue here? Im probably missing something really obvious, by who cares if your fancy SL stuff doesnt work when doing outdated, trivial content? Why would you want / need it to?

[Moggie]

I'm trying to find the source of it, but I'm 99% sure that's exactly how it's going to work. I remember them posting that Azerite essences will only work in BfA related zones going forward.

Correct. The gear has a message about not having any abundance of Azeroth in the world or some such like that so it’s disabled.

[Baneto]

Thematically, Azerite powers should work where there's azerite, which rules out Outlands/Draenor but nowhere else as far as I'm aware. Since our covenant powers are directly tied to power sources within the Shadowlands, it does make sense for them to not work outside of that.

It'll be fine either way. It's not like you need your covenant ability to go do transmog runs or anything.

Yeah, its not like we _need_ it but come on, how would people react to not being able to use the legion artifact in old content.
Or getting the "that ability is only usable in kul'tiras/zandalar" while trying to use your neck-essences in WoD/other content.

[Lahis]

Borrowed power can never be used beyond the expansion it was made for. This ain't any different.

[Kaneiac]

Shadowlands abilities not working outside the Shadowlands makes sense to me.

But they work inside battleground and arenas. This has been discussed 60000 times. Those battlegrounds take place in Outland, Azeroth, Pandaria, all the fuck over the place.

Lore is not a good reason for this

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Borrowed power can never be used beyond the expansion it was made for. This ain't any different.

I'm pretty sure I could use my artifact weapons and traits, and the Heart of Azeroth, in every instance or zone no matter where I was. My Doomhammer didn't turn off when I zoned into Firelands.

[Lahis]

I'm pretty sure I could use my artifact weapons and traits, and the Heart of Azeroth, in every instance or zone no matter where I was. My Doomhammer didn't turn off when I zoned into Firelands.

It didn't matter in Firelands during Legion and won't in Firelands during Shadowlands. You oneshot everything even without weapon in hand.

[Harbour]

Borrowed power can never be used beyond the expansion it was made for. This ain't any different.

This never was the case in Legion and BFA, expansions with borrowed powers.

What Blizzard do with Covenants is essentially WoD Outposts you build during questing and then choose one out of two abilities you can use in this location once in a while.

But that were outposts, and Covenants are the main feature everything revolves around.

[arkanon]

It didn't matter in Firelands during Legion and won't in Firelands during Shadowlands. You oneshot everything even without weapon in hand.

This is what im confused about, and i honestly feel like im missing something that is obvious to others - who cares if certain thigns dont work in a zone where literally everything is be one shot, and bosses only take a few hits even on mythic. I was farming some stuff from WoD on mythic, and had no luck on my 120 lock, so i swapped to my 110 lock that i havnt touched in a few years, and still cleared everything i needed to without hesitation - there was really no meaningful difference at all - bosses took 4 hits to die instead of 3 - woop-de-fucking-do. Again, if someone can point out something i havnt thought of, go for it, but i just dont see an issue at all here.

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This never was the case in Legion and BFA, expansions with borrowed powers.

What Blizzard do with Covenants is essentially WoD Outposts you build during questing and then choose one out of two abilities you can use in this location once in a while.

But that were outposts, and Covenants are the main feature everything revolves around.

This is a reality, yeah, but what is the ACTUAL issue here? What is the concern?

[Jester Joe]

This is what im confused about, and i honestly feel like im missing something that is obvious to others - who cares if certain thigns dont work in a zone where literally everything is be one shot, and bosses only take a few hits even on mythic. I was farming some stuff from WoD on mythic, and had no luck on my 120 lock, so i swapped to my 110 lock that i havnt touched in a few years, and still cleared everything i needed to without hesitation - there was really no meaningful difference at all - bosses took 4 hits to die instead of 3 - woop-de-fucking-do. Again, if someone can point out something i havnt thought of, go for it, but i just dont see an issue at all here.

The only real reason to care is stuff like the Night Fae covenant Soulshift ability being a lot of mobility, so it would be great to use to run old stuff.

But really, not having it isn't any different than running old content now.

[Kaneiac]

It didn't matter in Firelands during Legion and won't in Firelands during Shadowlands. You oneshot everything even without weapon in hand.

Things like Night Fae have a ton of extra mobility that makes it easier, is all.

It's not that I need it, it's that the logic of it makes zero sense. What is it hurting by letting you use it? It feels like an odd change literally nobody asked for.

[Aresk]

My garrison abilities aren't working outside of Draenor. It's almost like the garrison support only exists in the area where the garrison is. This seems like a perfectly reasonable situation, and it beats the Legion treatment where artifact abilities are just removed at the end of the expansion (though admittedly the stuff in Legion was pretty annoying to unlock to begin with).

[arkanon]

The only real reason to care is stuff like the Night Fae covenant Soulshift ability being a lot of mobility, so it would be great to use to run old stuff.

But really, not having it isn't any different than running old content now.

Good point, i hadnt thought of those. To be fair though, we have never had those in the past, so its not like we are LOSING anything when running old content, we just dont gain as much as we do in SL, which tbh, im totally fine with.

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Things like Night Fae have a ton of extra mobility that makes it easier, is all.

It's not that I need it, it's that the logic of it makes zero sense. What is it hurting by letting you use it? It feels like an odd change literally nobody asked for.

How is it hurting you by NOT letting you use it? You have never had it in the last 15 years, so nothing has changed. As others have mentioned, this isnt actually that new - various abilities are tied to zones or expansions, or particular types of content - i cant use my pvp abilities when running old raids, why isnt there equal uproar about that?>

[Kaneiac]

How is it hurting you by NOT letting you use it? You have never had it in the last 15 years, so nothing has changed.

That logic falls apart if you look at the game historically though. What if when Mists of Pandaria released, any class abilities or talents you learned from 85 to 90 werent able to be used pre-mop content? That's sort of what is happening here. You didn't have those abilities yet, so what's it matter?

It's just an odd decision is all. It ultimately is meaningless but I'm curious to hear what warranted this.

Another layer - will conduits work outside of the Shadowlands? If they do, then why don't abilities? It's just weird.

The lore doesn't hold up and feels patchwork when you can use these abilities in battlegrounds and arenas.

It also will end up making soloing BFA content considerably more challenging considering how important covenants are to player power.

[CalamityHeart]

I can't really wrap my head around why they'd do something like this, either.

I mean, on the one hand, ultimately, I can't see it really mattering either way. At least not to me. Old content is old content, and once I'm properly suited up, I'll be breezing through it regardless of whether or not I have access to my Covenant abilities. I'll probably get used to having that dead button pretty quickly.

But then on the other hand, I can't really see a point in it to start with... Lore just doesn't cut it as an excuse here. It just seems like a hard -1 to quality of life and not too much more to reasonably add.

[Musta]

If i werent so hooked by the lore at this point, i would have already quit. Jesus

[arkanon]

That logic falls apart if you look at the game historically though. What if when Mists of Pandaria released, any class abilities or talents you learned from 85 to 90 werent able to be used pre-mop content? That's sort of what is happening here.

Nah, its your logic that falls apart. All the new talents and changes CAN be used in old content. You are comparing apples and oranges.

Again, can you use your pvp talents in old raids? This isnt new.

[Grimbold21]

Well, I'm split in this. If they're not meant to work outside SLs then they shouldn't work in PvP.

What does that leave? Any world or raid content that is outside SL.

I was gonna argue that this means they need to stop class tuning around their new systems, but with this restriction they can keep up their nonsense of conflating the two.

[Lahis]

This never was the case in Legion and BFA, expansions with borrowed powers.

What Blizzard do with Covenants is essentially WoD Outposts you build during questing and then choose one out of two abilities you can use in this location once in a while.

But that were outposts, and Covenants are the main feature everything revolves around.

And Covenants do work everywhere where they are relevant: lvl 60 content.

You will oneshot all old content regardless. You don't need covenant spell to do that.

[Kaneiac]

Nah, its your logic that falls apart. All the new talents and changes CAN be used in old content. You are comparing apples and oranges.

Again, can you use your pvp talents in old raids? This isnt new.

Remind me when PvP talents were designed to be core parts of your class in all walks of the game. They never were. They're explicitly designed for PvP. Covenant abilities impact the balancing of the rest of your class for every single bit of content. So did artifacts, HoA, Azerite armor, etc.

You can find examples for both sides. Why does the Heart of Azeroth work in old content? Why don't covenants? Why did artifacts? There's no rhyme or reason to any of this.

Also, conduits and soulbinds still work in old content, I just tested it. Why don't abilities? The logic here meets absolutely zero reasonable metrics.