SPOILERS: Shadowlands Lore Thread

[InfiniteCharger]

Here's how I see it. The Lore is just used as a way for us Players to be given excuses to fight these cosmic power houses, and so on. Simple.

Lore is history within a game or franchise that establishes the mechanics of the world and universe plus why there is conflict and tension.
It works great when you don't know any better, aka when the game is new. But after 15 years things are different and players know better.

[UndedoKoleda]

He's not regional at all. He's a clear Cosmic threat. He's only not on the radar cause he and the Dreadlords made it so that everyone would focus on the Void threat, while the Jailer would go on scheming. It's the perfect plot.

This is the scan where it states that the Jailer is "an evil older than reality itself".

So it is just a quote from Bolvar "The Useless" Fordragon. How am I not surprised. That guy would tell just about anything to wash-out the shame of being bitch-slapped by Sylvanas "I made a hobby out of losing and dying" Windrunner.

"Yeah she beat me, but, but... She was empowered! Ohhh and the dude who is empowering her is like suuuuper strong! Trust me he is the real deal!"

He couldn't know how old or powerful the Jailer is. It's a guess work. It's Rhonin all over again.

Ill tell you why is the Jailer a regional threat and nothing more- because at the end of the expansion we are going to kick his face in. Something that we could never even dream to do to Sargeras or the Void Lords, for instance.


And the thing about Titan++ level- we don't know what level the Pantheon was. Ion also said that the Eternal Ones (Winter Queen, Sire Denathrius, etc) are on Titan level and I can bet you none of them is at the power level of the Pantheon. Not even close.

[darkoms]

Why are you tired of something Ion literally stated in his own words?

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...-s-power-level

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...-s-power-level

Honestly, it's almost the opposite of a challenge (having the identity of the final boss public at the start). It's almost an easier way to tell a story and set up an expansion with a very clear theme, harkening back to the Wrath or Cataclysm/Deathwing days. We didn't openly talk about the end boss for some recent expansions because it wouldn't have made sense at the time, or it would have given away story spoilers and twists. For example, in Warlords of Draenor, if you were told you'd fight Archimonde at the end, it would have been a head-scratcher. But here, there is a major titan plus plus level antagonist that we are facing, and there are major steps in our journey to undercover the nature of the jailer's plan and put together the forces to have a chance against him. That story will wend its way through all of Shadowlands and our content updates, until we ultimately do get a chance to face the Jailer.

https://www.wowhead.com/news=316804/...of-shadowlands

[darkoms]

https://www.wowhead.com/news=316804/...of-shadowlands

That's it. Wowhead said so. The source I gave says differently.
https://www.windowscentral.com/world...on-hazzikostas

[TheFirstOnes]

So it is just a quote from Bolvar "The Useless" Fordragon. How am I not surprised. That guy would tell just about anything to wash-out the shame of being bitch-slapped by Sylvanas "I made a hobby out of losing and dying" Windrunner.

"Yeah she beat me, but, but... She was empowered! Ohhh and the dude who is empowering her is like suuuuper strong! Trust me he is the real deal!"

He couldn't know how old or powerful the Jailer is. It's a guess work. It's Rhonin all over again.

Ill tell you why is the Jailer a regional threat and nothing more- because at the end of the expansion we are going to kick his face in. Something that we could never even dream to do to Sargeras or the Void Lords, for instance.


And the thing about Titan++ level- we don't know what level the Pantheon was. Ion also said that the Eternal Ones (Winter Queen, Sire Denathrius, etc) are on Titan level and I can bet you none of them is at the power level of the Pantheon. Not even close.

The Pantheon are Titan level, because it's made up of regular Titans. Not really hard to understand.

"So it is just a quote from Bolvar "The Useless" Fordragon. How am I not surprised. That guy would tell just about anything to wash-out the shame of being bitch-slapped by Sylvanas "I made a hobby out of losing and dying" Windrunner.

"Yeah she beat me, but, but... She was empowered! Ohhh and the dude who is empowering her is like suuuuper strong! Trust me he is the real deal!"" Even though Sylvanas is on the Jailer's side, and Bolvar legit knows about the Jailer and who he is. Once again, nothing really "guess worthy" there. Unlike Bolvar, Rhonin had NO way of understanding Sargeras' or the Old Gods' true power.

"Ill tell you why is the Jailer a regional threat and nothing more- because at the end of the expansion we are going to kick his face in. Something that we could never even dream to do to Sargeras or the Void Lords, for instance." Even though we aided in the imprisonment of Sargeras (We were weaker than we currently are in SL, btw), and the Void Lords are the next logical threat after the Jailer, meaning we're going to kick their faces in as well.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

That's it. Wowhead said so. The source I gave says differently.
https://www.windowscentral.com/world...on-hazzikostas

Okay? Are you trying to imply Wowhead is lying?

[TheFirstOnes]

That's it. Wowhead said so. The source I gave says differently.
https://www.windowscentral.com/world...on-hazzikostas

They both imply that the threat is beyond Titan level, tbh, as the question afterwards states that, from Legion to beyond, most of the actual threats kinda need to be "Titan Level". In which Denathrius is Titan Level, same with N'Zoth apparently (As stated within the very source you gave lol). And it's just going to go from there. Doesn't help that Steve also implied that the Jailer's the most dangerous being ever atm.

- - - Updated - - -

"We fought the Titan Argus, we have just defeated the Old God N'Zoth. First off, villains, in order to be credible adversaries at this point, needs to be at least at Titan power level, and that's kind of a big deal." We've been Titan level since 7.3. RiP lol

[bagina]

So do we know what the Jailer has done that makes him Satan and the evilest thing in the multiverse? They keep saying how evil he is but what does that mean really.

[TheFirstOnes]

So do we know what the Jailer has done that makes him Satan and the evilest thing in the multiverse? They keep saying how evil he is but what does that mean really.

https://shadowlands.wowhead.com/item...ration-preface I would suggest reading this little thing...

- - - Updated - - -

The WoW Shadowlands official site also talks about it, kinda. "Now you must investigate a conspiracy to unmake the cosmos" This was a VERY overlooked detail from the Shadowlands Site not even I thought about.

These are probably the First Ones right now.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

So do we know what the Jailer has done that makes him Satan and the evilest thing in the multiverse? They keep saying how evil he is but what does that mean really.

Nah, all we know is that he "betrayed" his brethren (the Eternal Ones) and they locked him up. We might learn more if we find the Primus, who I don't believe is the Runecarver.

[darkoms]

Okay? Are you trying to imply Wowhead is lying?

I want to say that the WoWhead recounted the information incorrectly.

[Houle]

the thing with the jailer powerlevel for me is,blizz always says such things to hype new villains up
when they first revealed g'huun, they said that "the titans were experimenting on the old gods, but accidently created something much worse. a blood god".
fast forward a few months, and it was suddenly stated that g'huun is far weaker than normal old gods.

same thing will happen with the jailer. well destroy his ass at the end of the addon. we couldnt do that with sargeras. if blizz thought sargeras was a villain we could face, he wouldve been the final boss instead of argus. only reason argus exists is bc sargeras is wayyyyy to powerful for us to fight directly, so they needed an endboss

[darkoms]

They both imply that the threat is beyond Titan level, tbh, as the question afterwards states that, from Legion to beyond, most of the actual threats kinda need to be "Titan Level". In which Denathrius is Titan Level, same with N'Zoth apparently (As stated within the very source you gave lol). And it's just going to go from there. Doesn't help that Steve also implied that the Jailer's the most dangerous being ever atm.

- - - Updated - - -

"We fought the Titan Argus, we have just defeated the Old God N'Zoth. First off, villains, in order to be credible adversaries at this point, needs to be at least at Titan power level, and that's kind of a big deal." We've been Titan level since 7.3. RiP lol

We fought Nzoth, and he was not on Titan's level. He was a Titan-level threat because he could corrupt Azeroth and make a Void Titan. The Jailer wants to kill the world soul of Azeroth, so he's a Titan-level threat to some extent.

We weren't a Titan level in 7.3. We couldn't even defeat Argus (who wasn't even a full-fledged Titan, otherwise he would be the size of a planet) without the help of the Titan avatars. If we were Titan level 7.3, we wouldn't need the Forge power to fight N'zoth. And we will fight Denatrius after his resurrection. He will be killed at some point in time during the quest chain in Revendreth and will be resurrected in the raid.

- - - Updated - - -

the thing with the jailer powerlevel for me is,blizz always says such things to hype new villains up
when they first revealed g'huun, they said that "the titans were experimenting on the old gods, but accidently created something much worse. a blood god".
fast forward a few months, and it was suddenly stated that g'huun is far weaker than normal old gods.

same thing will happen with the jailer. well destroy his ass at the end of the addon. we couldnt do that with sargeras. if blizz thought sargeras was a villain we could face, he wouldve been the final boss instead of argus. only reason argus exists is bc sargeras is wayyyyy to powerful for us to fight directly, so they needed an endboss

https://sagamer.co.za/2020/08/20/a-d...f-hibernation/
''So the winter queen we wanted something that stood above the night fae and felt somewhat different than they were. And of course, she’s similar to other creatures like her that we’ve had in the past. You know, she’s not a Titan, but she’s something kind of right below that. She’s an ultra-powerful creature here and part of this pantheon in a similar way that the Titan Watchers and Keepers we’ve seen in the past were part of the pantheon of law and order. These are the pantheon of death. So, that was sort of a starting point is that she’s a creature above and beyond the night fae themselves. She’s part of a greater order.''

''You know, she’s not a Titan, but she’s something kind of right below that.''
Titans>Eternals

Although before that they said that the Pantheon of Death is Titan level
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/674667962?t=00h57m18s

[Varodoc]

It's obvious that the Jailer is just a filler villain for the Void Lords. Shadowlands is WoD 2.0 in the sense that it merely serves as a stepping stone for 10.0, which will be about the Void and Light and will be the most climactic expansion yet. It is therefore not a surprise that patch 10.0 would be the most climactic expansion, as befits such a milestone for this game.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

That's it. Wowhead said so. The source I gave says differently.
https://www.windowscentral.com/world...on-hazzikostas

You do realize it was a "group interview" right? It wasn't that Wowhead took the info from windowscentral, they had their own interview with Ion.

[TheFirstOnes]

"We weren't a Titan level in 7.3. We couldn't even defeat Argus (who wasn't even a full-fledged Titan, otherwise he would be the size of a planet) without the help of the Titan avatars. If we were Titan level 7.3, we wouldn't need the Forge power to fight N'zoth. And we will fight Denatrius after his resurrection. He will be killed at some point in time during the quest chain in Revendreth and will be resurrected in the raid" We couldn't defeat Argus cause he was empowered by Death Magics, as well as Sargeras' own Magics. Prior to that, we made him kneel without any Titan strength amps (Which we got later on, after Argus' amps when Khaz'goroth Titanforged us).

Also, N'zoth was heavily empowered when we fought him. Him being considered "the weakest" was a baseless assumption Azshara expressed, cause all she saw was the power of N'Zoth beforehand. She also thought that Xal'atath could end N'Zoth, which was a literal fucking lie.

"And we will fight Denatrius after his resurrection. He will be killed at some point in time during the quest chain in Revendreth and will be resurrected in the raid." Ok? He'll just get empowered by Zovaal then, which will make him beyond Titan level.

- - - Updated - - -

We fought Nzoth, and he was not on Titan's level. He was a Titan-level threat because he could corrupt Azeroth and make a Void Titan. The Jailer wants to kill the world soul of Azeroth, so he's a Titan-level threat to some extent.

We weren't a Titan level in 7.3. We couldn't even defeat Argus (who wasn't even a full-fledged Titan, otherwise he would be the size of a planet) without the help of the Titan avatars. If we were Titan level 7.3, we wouldn't need the Forge power to fight N'zoth. And we will fight Denatrius after his resurrection. He will be killed at some point in time during the quest chain in Revendreth and will be resurrected in the raid.

- - - Updated - - -



https://sagamer.co.za/2020/08/20/a-d...f-hibernation/
''So the winter queen we wanted something that stood above the night fae and felt somewhat different than they were. And of course, she’s similar to other creatures like her that we’ve had in the past. You know, she’s not a Titan, but she’s something kind of right below that. She’s an ultra-powerful creature here and part of this pantheon in a similar way that the Titan Watchers and Keepers we’ve seen in the past were part of the pantheon of law and order. These are the pantheon of death. So, that was sort of a starting point is that she’s a creature above and beyond the night fae themselves. She’s part of a greater order.''

''You know, she’s not a Titan, but she’s something kind of right below that.''
Titans>Eternals

Although before that they said that the Pantheon of Death is Titan level
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/674667962?t=00h57m18s

Except other Interviews suggest that the Eternal Ones are on par with the Titans.

[darkoms]

You do realize it was a "group interview" right? It wasn't that Wowhead took the info from windowscentral, they had their own interview with Ion.

And the representatives of Winows Central were also there ;/
''In an age where digital shows and events are becoming ever more commonplace, we were among a few lucky guests at Blizzard's recent virtual World of Warcraft: Shadowlands summit.''

[TheFirstOnes]

"She’s an ultra-powerful creature here and part of this pantheon in a similar way that the Titan Watchers and Keepers we’ve seen in the past were part of the pantheon of law and order." I will admit that this is a very self contradictory statement, as the Keepers and Watchers aren't at all part of the Pantheon at all. They were creations of them, in a similar way the Night Fae, or the Ascended are creations of Pantheon of Death members such as the Winter Queen, and the Archon.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

And the representatives of Winows Central were also there ;/
''In an age where digital shows and events are becoming ever more commonplace, we were among a few lucky guests at Blizzard's recent virtual World of Warcraft: Shadowlands summit.''

I don't see the point you're trying to make.