One good thing to come from 2020

[PC2]

In reality you only need to keep essential services and agriculture running.

That's insane! To prosper we need a highly diversified economy with large production in many fields.

No one would die if we had less cars, smartphones and other bullshit luxury good.

Not true, I would die on the inside without my stuff, my car, my smartphone, etc.

2020 is proof that humans don't need non-stop economic growth to keep going.

You're either growing or dying. A country that takes a non-growth strategy isn't doing anything except sidelining themselves relative to the countries that do want to grow in size. Political parties largely can't adopt that strategy because it would inevitably lead to discontent as the local economy stagnates while the rest of the world grows.

Are you one those people with a paleo-philosophy? It seems like you're trying to take us back to the Stone Age.

[Shadowferal]

It doesn't matter what they are currently doing. The important thing is that you can mostly shut down the economy and life will go on just fine. Harsh climate regulation, free universal healthcare, any project that universally improves the quality of life for everyone can be done..

No.
You really are fairly ignorant of US economy. One of the reasons why no state has issued anymore state-wide lockdowns is because they are all nearly broke. To continue with such measures would have state government run services...infrastructure shut down. And that would only make things worse.

[Katchii]

We have collectively proven that we are resilient and that we can in fact take economic losses and have life go on.

Once we beat COVID, I fully expect mounting pressure on the world's governments to regulate all kinds of pollution and even forcefully close down the biggest polluters if they don't comply with the regulations. If business can survive being shutdown for months, it can survive taking a 10% cut into its profits margins to comply with environmental regulations.

The whole global warming debacle can be solved in 2021.

This is still yet to be determined. COVID isn't over yet, shut down isn't over and there are already "businesses" that aren't coming back from this.

If what you're referring to is the fact that "life goes on" well yeah... nothing is ever going to stop that. We will HAVE to get by.

Whether we actually ever truly recover from this, though, we don't know yet.

[Monster Hunter]

We have collectively proven that we are resilient and that we can in fact take economic losses and have life go on.

Once we beat COVID, I fully expect mounting pressure on the world's governments to regulate all kinds of pollution and even forcefully close down the biggest polluters if they don't comply with the regulations. If business can survive being shutdown for months, it can survive taking a 10% cut into its profits margins to comply with environmental regulations.

The whole global warming debacle can be solved in 2021.

to late to solve global warming now.

[Edge-]

The important thing is that you can mostly shut down the economy and life will go on just fine.

I'm sure there are millions upon millions of Americans, and millions more in other countries, that would strongly disagree with you on this. Just because your life hasn't been directly impacted doesn't mean millions of others haven't been. And I'm talking about purely economically here.

Harsh climate regulation, free universal healthcare, any project that universally improves the quality of life for everyone can be done.

But won't be, because climate change isn't the kind of obvious and imminent threat that global warming is to a lot of folks, and a great many straight up don't believe in it at all and elect politicians who don't believe in it either. Same goes for universal health care, at least in the US, and climate regulations. Again, literally the current political party in power in the US largely doesn't believe that we need to do anything serious about it.

The only reason they don't seem feasible on paper is because the governments and the big business are terrified of taking minor economic losses. In reality you only need to keep essential services and agriculture running. No one would die if we had less cars, smartphones and other bullshit luxury good.

Good lord I don't even know where to begin...but do you really think it's just as easy as that? It's that simple yet it's eluded nations world-wide for decades?

2020 is proof that humans don't need non-stop economic growth to keep going.

I agree to a point. But you'll find few, especially those in positions of power within businesses or the politicians they're funding, who would support such an assertion.

Now that we know, it is the time to mount massive pressure on governments to cut the bullshit and solve those issues.

Again, we don't "know". Look at half the US which has been trying to stay open in direct contradiction to medical/scientific advise, because they're more concerned about the economy than about saving lives.

Way more progress would be done to tackle climate change if it were measured in daily human lives lost to pollution instead of using abstract metrics.

Because direct metrics for something like climate changes are nigh impossible to calculate. And we already have some of this data, it's both neither as sensational as the covid data while also being far more "controversial". Just as we're seeing people reject covid death numbers in the US and claim that only 5-6% of people who died actually died of the virus and everyone else died of other causes, these numbers are already heavily contested by anti-climate change crusaders.

Again, noble idea. Not remotely practical.

[Wendigoman]

Well, I had much more time to relax at home to stop wasting my time. I had much more time just to sit at home in silence to understand better what I want from life and I had a very good conversation with my heart. After quarantine I became another person, now I understand myself much better. A small pause made me feel alive again.

[Adam Jensen]

Nope. And 2020 will be like every other year. Some good and bad things. Depends on who you ask. And humans have endured much, much worse pandemics than Covid-19. A lot worse.

Sure. The 1918 Flu pandemic was much worse.

Doesn't mean COVID19 wasn't a problem though.

- - - Updated - - -

to late to solve global warming now.

Too late, but immediate action might help us keep it at a 1.5-2 degree average temperature increase. We're past stopping it, but we can still mitigate it.

- - - Updated - - -

The globe will be warming up slightly for decades to come regardless of what is done in 2021, so get used to it during your lifetime. It's not the end of the world or anything.

You say that while thousands of arable land are becoming less and less arable. What happens when millions are forced to leave due to crop failures or miserable heatwaves? What happens if we don't do enough and literal wars break out over sources of fresh water, or oil or natural gas? What happens when the food chain collapses? Bees go extinct?

We have time now to stop or at least mitigate all of these future nightmare scenarios. But that time is running out.

[PC2]

climate change if it were measured in daily human lives lost

Because direct metrics for something like climate changes are nigh impossible to calculate.

Yes you can't reliably calculate that because causality is a tangled mess but more importantly you can't reliably predict future consequences because that largely depends on human choices, how well society adapts to environmental influences, and the growth of scientific knowledge and technology. While you can make calculations that tell you about the future climate what you can't do is make calculations that tell you the future state of humans and mankind. That is also precisely the reason for why things such as game theory simulations have and will always be failures. It's not a case where making those calculations is "difficult" or "expensive" it's that the idea doesn't make any sense in principle.

You say that while thousands of arable land are becoming less and less arable. What happens when millions are forced to leave due to crop failures or miserable heatwaves? What happens if we don't do enough and literal wars break out over sources of fresh water, or oil or natural gas? What happens when the food chain collapses? Bees go extinct?

We have time now to stop or at least mitigate all of these future nightmare scenarios. But that time is running out.

You're trying to imply that Earth will become less hospitable for humans, that's pure speculation. Anyone can speculate and my guess is that Earth will become more hospitable for more people, especially as Third World countries continue developing and lift millions out of poverty.

[Adam Jensen]

You're trying to imply that Earth will become less hospitable for humans, that's pure speculation. Anyone can speculate and my guess is that Earth will become more hospitable for more people, especially as Third World countries continue developing and lift millions out of poverty.

Not if those third world countries, especially the ones in equatorial or warmer regions become arid and dry due to climate change.

And yes, it is speculation. That's the point, to keep those scenarios as speculation and not reality.

[GreenJesus]

How can the OP be THIS out of touch? I'm flabbergasted. "We are resilient and can take economic losses." Can we? Can the thousands of business owners that went bankrupt agree to that? What about the millions that lost their jobs? Not to mention the lingering effects from Daddy Powell printing/borrowing trillions of dollars to keep the economy somewhat "stable". State and local governments will need to drastically reduce budgets or take on loans to offset the reduced income they are receiving as well.

We will be paying for this in interest for years to come.

[Wilfire]

How can the OP be THIS out of touch? I'm flabbergasted. "We are resilient and can take economic losses." Can we? Can the thousands of business owners that went bankrupt agree to that? What about the millions that lost their jobs? Not to mention the lingering effects from Daddy Powell printing/borrowing trillions of dollars to keep the economy somewhat "stable". State and local governments will need to drastically reduce budgets or take on loans to offset the reduced income they are receiving as well.

We will be paying for this in interest for years to come.

Yeah, that's on society. If society can keep running with all of those businesses and jobs gone it just means that they weren't as essential as people thought. UBI and get rid of this idiotic notion that we need to work ourselves to death.

[Edge-]

If society can keep running with all of those businesses and jobs gone it just means that they weren't as essential as people thought.

Nobody thought a job like pet groomer was "essential" to begin with. Our whole economic system is built on non-essential services. Not to mention a lot of those people who lost their non-essential jobs are struggling hard.

UBI and get rid of this idiotic notion that we need to work ourselves to death.

Would require massive global economic restructuring that doesn't seem any more likely today than it was last year. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for this. But this is, again, ludicrously wishful thinking that's not backed up by any real world evidence.

[PC2]

Not if those third world countries, especially the ones in equatorial or warmer regions become arid and dry due to climate change.

And yes, it is speculation. That's the point, to keep those scenarios as speculation and not reality.

Okay but we can't keep global warming from being speculative because even if we implemented extreme environmental policies there would still be warming for many decades regardless.

If you're worried about potentially dry and arid regions then the solution is to improve our methods of food production as well as energy/desalination technology. If dry and arid regions don't have the water needed for industry then they may have to specialize in non-water based industries so that they can trade and buy the necessary goods from other regions.

[Cruor]

The only right answer is working from home... which doesn’t mean shit for a large portion of US... it’s like Trump supporters live in another reality... 215000 dead, with numbers expected to climb through the winter, with US government continued to have no plan, but to threaten China... the outlook for 2021, outside of those who think 2020 is just another year (wtf @Ghostpanther), is pretty grim...

- - - Updated - - -



This is Trump’s problem... they want us to look around and think this is just another year... nothing is wrong... 4 more years of what you see in America right now...

- - - Updated - - -



Don’t say that around Sarah Palin supporters... they might say yes and then spam you asking where to send the money, even after you tell them it’s a joke...

(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravina_Island_Bridge)

- - - Updated - - -

Here is a prediction, if Trump wins, as I expect (fuck polls)... what you see now, is what you get for 4 more years. Every problem US will face, will be called a hoax and blamed on Trump’s opponent. Trump will continue to lie to the American people, in the name of protecting them, but just making him self rich. Every issue facing Americans will continue to get worse, as Trump points at Wallstreet and corporate profits, to claim it’s all lies made up by his opponents. Until a vaccine, Trump will continue to push dangerous superstitions as a cure to covid and demand people flaunt their state regulations. 100s of thousands of Americans will die, with travel from US being restricted for years.

215000 old fat and weak people. People in good health have the sniffles or a sore throat for 2 days. COVID is so overblown its not funny. The part I do agree with is Trump will win again and we have 4 more years if awesome. 4 more years of lower taxes gun rights and funny youtube videos of left wing people raging and crying.

[Edge-]

215000 old fat and weak people.

Older, yes (more "middle aged"), but obesity only factors into 7K cases - https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/c...ekly/index.htm

People in good health have the sniffles or a sore throat for 2 days.

Some do. And many have more serious cases.

COVID is so overblown its not funny.

It's not. 220K Americans have died. Peoples parents. Their grandparents. Their great grandparents. Their brothers. Their sisters. Their wives. Their husbands. Their friends. You just don't care because apparently you appear to lack basic human empathy. It's not as cool and edgy as you think it is.

Stop spreading misinformation.

[Felya]

215000 old fat and weak people. People in good health have the sniffles or a sore throat for 2 days. COVID is so overblown its not funny. The part I do agree with is Trump will win again and we have 4 more years if awesome. 4 more years of lower taxes gun rights and funny youtube videos of left wing people raging and crying.

Take note... 215000 dead is overblown, because of funny YouTube videos. Sorry, some people think there is more to live than YouTube videos...

This is what Trump does to people... you all know what I mean... That one family member... that one coworker... that’s what Trump wants America to be...

- - - Updated - - -

Nope. And 2020 will be like every other year.

Unbelievable... I know I responded to this before, but someone quoting me reminded me... unbelievable...

[Frolk]

Cyberpunk 2077

[Felya]

Cyberpunk 2077

It’s not going to live up to the hype... no game can...

I am psyched for Godfall...

[Ghostpanther]

Sure. The 1918 Flu pandemic was much worse.

Doesn't mean COVID19 wasn't a problem though.

- - - Updated - - -


- - - Updated - - -

Sure it has been a problem and I take it very seriously. I wear a mask when I go to town and I have maybe been in a shopping building 3 times since March. But we also need to keep things in perspective. And the large majority of those dying from it, are those who already have some serous health issues. We should also take obesity, smoking and diabetes serous.

[Shadowferal]

Yeah, as much as I tend to shrug off flu concerns I do follow the rules.

And I'm near certain it's too late about climate change. Record temps in the middle east of 125 degrees this year. Even without humidity that's has to be unbearable. I'm glad the deniers are young enough...they'll be the ones trying to reassure themselves that hypercanes are nothing to worry about.