Would Sylvanas have beaten Arthas as easily?

[Terongor]

Who are they? Did I give you a quote? And mb explain to me the difference in raising a goblin's corpse by Kras and a necromancer?

LOL what? https://wow.gamepedia.com/Shadow_Bolt
So you deny that the Warlocks use the Void? This is some completely new level of crap.

Are the Titans not divine beings? It also does not matter in this dispute, because I was only referring to the strength of the titans, not their essence.

You indicated that Xavius ​​was only able to corrupt the Tear of Elune because he possesses the power of the Nightmare and that the Tear is therefore vulnerable to the Nightmare. Therefore, you prove that the Tear is an artifact of Life.

Greater good? She did not kill Arthas when he first invaded Celtalas because she believed that for such a murder she would not be sung and praised for her military genius. And she didn't care about the lives of her people. She considered them just things. Her things. With her arrows in a quiver.

Blizzard also argued that Teldrassil is not so simple and that it makes no sense for Sylvanas to burn it. I'm tired of believing Blizzard's words about Sylvanas.

And Khadgar, Illidan and Velen only held back the demons in the battle with KJ (well, except for the phase with Illidan's vision). Um, what? Ragnaros is stronger than AlAkir.

How did you define it? On Draenor, the counterparts of the wild gods were born of the Spirit, like the various treants. Once again, what? Is the spirit an elementary force that must be destroyed? What are you talking about? Ah, that is, this is an artistic choice. So you tell me how the Emerald Dream of the planetary level can be analogous to the Shadowlands of the multiverse level or not? I've been asking you about this for 5 pages now and you just ignore this question.

So where did you get the idea that Mannoroth fights endlessly? And that he is at war with someone strong?

Sorry I misspoke I meant he.

Its shadow not void with that logic everything in wow with having name shadow would mean its void stuff like shadowlands.

The twitter answer which I sent you said that titan are not "divine beings" and thats the essential difference according to blizz between gods and titans.

Not really as we have seen much more powerful artifacts being corrupted by weaker beings but it made it alot easier for xavius for using nightmare.

One thing when people sing about some actions glory is because they were done honorably and sneak attack is considered always dishonorable.

Well its their game what they sayg goes.

They still were physically present and I'm not saying they were in the actual fight as we don't know yet. Al'akir is stronger than the lietanent of ragnaros for sure.

Only real counterparts were the 3 great birds of spires of arrak and sporemounds who devoured the life spirits and gaining power from it meaning even they consumed it like world souls meaning by your logic titans are creature of spirits. making spirit as large as other elements on azeroth makes no sense and placing azeroth as reality could just be artistic choice as its the main world we play in.

It neccecary doesn't need to stronger than him around same level would be enough and then just keeping fighting and training keeping your skills in their level.

[darkoms]

Sorry I misspoke I meant he.

Its shadow not void with that logic everything in wow with having name shadow would mean its void stuff like shadowlands.

The twitter answer which I sent you said that titan are not "divine beings" and thats the essential difference according to blizz between gods and titans.

Not really as we have seen much more powerful artifacts being corrupted by weaker beings but it made it alot easier for xavius for using nightmare.

One thing when people sing about some actions glory is because they were done honorably and sneak attack is considered always dishonorable.

Well its their game what they sayg goes.

They still were physically present and I'm not saying they were in the actual fight as we don't know yet. Al'akir is stronger than the lietanent of ragnaros for sure.

Only real counterparts were the 3 great birds of spires of arrak and sporemounds who devoured the life spirits and gaining power from it meaning even they consumed it like world souls meaning by your logic titans are creature of spirits. making spirit as large as other elements on azeroth makes no sense and placing azeroth as reality could just be artistic choice as its the main world we play in.

It neccecary doesn't need to stronger than him around same level would be enough and then just keeping fighting and training keeping your skills in their level.

Again, I didn’t give you a quote and I don’t think it’s very important what word was there. Krasus lifted the goblin's corpse. By the power of life.

But the shadowbolt has a purple projectile color, right? Just like the Void. And the person above has already pointed out to you that they are really using the Void.

Though Chris Metzen said the titans were godlike [32] and the Warcraft Encyclopedia states titans are not gods, [33] [34] the Ultimate Visual Guide, [6] the Sunwell Trilogy, [35] the Magazine, [2] and Loreology [36] have stated that they are "metallic-skinned gods" as described in [Mythology of the Titans]. The Senior Historian later clarified that by "gods" he meant "perfect specimen rather than an actual divine being". [3]
Reconciling the various sources, Chronicle Volume 1 described them as godlike beings. [4]
So what prevents me from also referring to perfect specimen when I call them gods?

Sorry what? What powerful artifacts have been destroyed by weaker creatures? Dragon Soul? Rhonin destroyed it only with the scales of Deathwing, he could not do anything with his own power. I don't understand what you are trying to prove? That Elune's Tear is an artifact of Life and therefore vulnerable to the Nightmare or what? Because before you tried to prove exactly that.

That's it. Sylvanas is far more concerned that she will not be praised for her victory than that she can end the invasion of Celthalas quickly and easily. And she does not care how much her subordinates must die for this.

Yes, but in the end it turned out that they lied and everything is really that simple. Sylvanas burned Teldrassil. The current Sylvna is just Guldan 2.0 with the Jailer instead of Sargeras.

It would be strange for them not to participate in a real battle, and then stand over KJ's body. Also, I don’t believe the players could beat KJ without help. Fair enough, but I meant that Malorne just killed him with one hit right after he was resurrected. There was no fight, no fight, Malorne just hit him and that was it.

Again, I didn't understand anything. Yes, and they came from the spirit. While the primal gods of Draenor, including Anzu, Sethe, and Rukhmar, were born from a large amount of spirit as opposed to the coalesced power of the Well of Eternity, [33] they have similarities with Wild Gods such as massive size, age , speech, and even Rukhmar creating the arakkoa like some Wild Gods made races of their own. However, Matt Burns was hesitant to call them Wild Gods, as the term has direct ties to the keepers on Azeroth, but does think they're part of a greater set of similar creatures. [34] [35]
They appeared in different ways, but they are all part of a set of creatures. Like doomguards and pit lords, they are different creatures, but they are all demons. I mean, it makes sense that when Azeroth was wounded, the spirit she absorbed was released. Because the wild gods are creatures of Life, they could not appear only because of the energy of the Source of Eternity, because the Source of Eternity is arcane. Yes, and this is the only world that has the Emerald Dream.

I really don't think Mannoroth is training. I think he considers himself above that. He can fight, of course, but he hardly often meets worthy enemies.

[Terongor]

Again, I didn’t give you a quote and I don’t think it’s very important what word was there. Krasus lifted the goblin's corpse. By the power of life.

But the shadowbolt has a purple projectile color, right? Just like the Void. And the person above has already pointed out to you that they are really using the Void.

Though Chris Metzen said the titans were godlike [32] and the Warcraft Encyclopedia states titans are not gods, [33] [34] the Ultimate Visual Guide, [6] the Sunwell Trilogy, [35] the Magazine, [2] and Loreology [36] have stated that they are "metallic-skinned gods" as described in [Mythology of the Titans]. The Senior Historian later clarified that by "gods" he meant "perfect specimen rather than an actual divine being". [3]
Reconciling the various sources, Chronicle Volume 1 described them as godlike beings. [4]
So what prevents me from also referring to perfect specimen when I call them gods?

Sorry what? What powerful artifacts have been destroyed by weaker creatures? Dragon Soul? Rhonin destroyed it only with the scales of Deathwing, he could not do anything with his own power. I don't understand what you are trying to prove? That Elune's Tear is an artifact of Life and therefore vulnerable to the Nightmare or what? Because before you tried to prove exactly that.

That's it. Sylvanas is far more concerned that she will not be praised for her victory than that she can end the invasion of Celthalas quickly and easily. And she does not care how much her subordinates must die for this.

Yes, but in the end it turned out that they lied and everything is really that simple. Sylvanas burned Teldrassil. The current Sylvna is just Guldan 2.0 with the Jailer instead of Sargeras.

It would be strange for them not to participate in a real battle, and then stand over KJ's body. Also, I don’t believe the players could beat KJ without help. Fair enough, but I meant that Malorne just killed him with one hit right after he was resurrected. There was no fight, no fight, Malorne just hit him and that was it.

Again, I didn't understand anything. Yes, and they came from the spirit. While the primal gods of Draenor, including Anzu, Sethe, and Rukhmar, were born from a large amount of spirit as opposed to the coalesced power of the Well of Eternity, [33] they have similarities with Wild Gods such as massive size, age , speech, and even Rukhmar creating the arakkoa like some Wild Gods made races of their own. However, Matt Burns was hesitant to call them Wild Gods, as the term has direct ties to the keepers on Azeroth, but does think they're part of a greater set of similar creatures. [34] [35]
They appeared in different ways, but they are all part of a set of creatures. Like doomguards and pit lords, they are different creatures, but they are all demons. I mean, it makes sense that when Azeroth was wounded, the spirit she absorbed was released. Because the wild gods are creatures of Life, they could not appear only because of the energy of the Source of Eternity, because the Source of Eternity is arcane. Yes, and this is the only world that has the Emerald Dream.

I really don't think Mannoroth is training. I think he considers himself above that. He can fight, of course, but he hardly often meets worthy enemies.

It is as ressurection is completely different than reanimation and it was never descriped when undeads were made in any distance that they were ressurected.

Metamorphosis of warlocks were Black and purple too which turned them into a demon is with power of fel.

As calling them gods imblies they are divine beings which they are not.

Azshara shattered one of the pillars of creation is a case were a weaker being destroyes more powerful artifact or a object.

Soldiers are meant to die in war thats their job... whats your point?

Not neccecary as if blizz for example makes it Sylvanas who beats the jailer and she self sacrifices hetkellä to take his place.

Until blizz gives us more we really can't say for sure and malorne was imblied to strongest of wild gods there has instances were oneshots have happened though was he prepared for malorne?

No? It was never said Those three came from spirit give a line which says they did. Life is differant than spirit wild gods appeared from life yeah but spirits is the fifth element and Azeroth didn't absorb it Azeroth consumed it.

Like you said before how can you prove he meets them rarely you are just making an expection here.

[Darth-Piekus]

According to the short story We Ride Forth Bolvar used a fraction of the real power of the Helm and aparently the Lich King can steal the Will of any undead anytime he wanted. If a powerful being like Mograine had his will instantly stolen at that small moment how come he didn't do the same on Sylvannas? Does the Jailer have some kind of protection around her?

Also considering Arthas had Frostmourne and used the Full power of the Helm I think he could have won the battle.

[Feanoro]

According to the short story We Ride Forth Bolvar used a fraction of the real power of the Helm and aparently the Lich King can steal the Will of any undead anytime he wanted. If a powerful being like Mograine had his will instantly stolen at that small moment how come he didn't do the same on Sylvannas? Does the Jailer have some kind of protection around her?

Also considering Arthas had Frostmourne and used the Full power of the Helm I think he could have won the battle.

There you go again, thinking it through instead of mindlessly saying "Duuuuuuuuuuuuuude, coooooooooooooooool" like the writers intend!

[Aucald]

According to the short story We Ride Forth Bolvar used a fraction of the real power of the Helm and aparently the Lich King can steal the Will of any undead anytime he wanted. If a powerful being like Mograine had his will instantly stolen at that small moment how come he didn't do the same on Sylvannas? Does the Jailer have some kind of protection around her?

Also considering Arthas had Frostmourne and used the Full power of the Helm I think he could have won the battle.

The Death Knights and Horsemen are still fundamentally connected to the Lich King as well as the Scourge's hive-mind (as shown by their ability to commune with Bolvar and send mental commands to the undead in Acherus), whereas Sylvanas and the Forsaken are not.

[darkoms]

It is as ressurection is completely different than reanimation and it was never descriped when undeads were made in any distance that they were ressurected.

Metamorphosis of warlocks were Black and purple too which turned them into a demon is with power of fel.

As calling them gods imblies they are divine beings which they are not.

Azshara shattered one of the pillars of creation is a case were a weaker being destroyes more powerful artifact or a object.

Soldiers are meant to die in war thats their job... whats your point?

Not neccecary as if blizz for example makes it Sylvanas who beats the jailer and she self sacrifices hetkellä to take his place.

Until blizz gives us more we really can't say for sure and malorne was imblied to strongest of wild gods there has instances were oneshots have happened though was he prepared for malorne?

No? It was never said Those three came from spirit give a line which says they did. Life is differant than spirit wild gods appeared from life yeah but spirits is the fifth element and Azeroth didn't absorb it Azeroth consumed it.

Like you said before how can you prove he meets them rarely you are just making an expection here.

I have no idea why you are writing all this nonsense. Krasus lifted the goblin's corpse. By the Power of Life.

Are you really going to argue with the Warlocks using the Void? You've already been given a quote.

You did not answer me. The Senior Historian later clarified that by "gods" he meant "perfect specimen rather than an actual divine being". [3]
So what prevents me from also referring to perfect specimen when I call them gods?

So how did you determine that Azshara is a weaker creature? Blizzard said that?

Yes, and? Does that mean it's okay that Sylvanas doesn't even consider them living beings? Only for the arrows in the quiver? Well, then it's okay that she was sent to the Maw.

Hetkella? What? Yes, yes, how many of these theories about the savior of the universe have I seen.

And you keep writing nonsense because you don't know what to say. Cool.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Wor...l?id=106974#24
You haven't even read Chronicle 2? Yes, and what prevented this energy of the Spirit from being freed when injured?

And you can't prove anything at all, but the Chronicles say he didn't expect the blow.

[Terongor]

I have no idea why you are writing all this nonsense. Krasus lifted the goblin's corpse. By the Power of Life.

Are you really going to argue with the Warlocks using the Void? You've already been given a quote.

You did not answer me. The Senior Historian later clarified that by "gods" he meant "perfect specimen rather than an actual divine being". [3]
So what prevents me from also referring to perfect specimen when I call them gods?

So how did you determine that Azshara is a weaker creature? Blizzard said that?

Yes, and? Does that mean it's okay that Sylvanas doesn't even consider them living beings? Only for the arrows in the quiver? Well, then it's okay that she was sent to the Maw.

Hetkella? What? Yes, yes, how many of these theories about the savior of the universe have I seen.

And you keep writing nonsense because you don't know what to say. Cool.

https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Wor...l?id=106974#24
You haven't even read Chronicle 2? Yes, and what prevented this energy of the Spirit from being freed when injured?

And you can't prove anything at all, but the Chronicles say he didn't expect the blow.

Again lifted it really bothers me what word are you meaning this time?

They "peer into the void" not dabble in it and thats a descriprio and peering into void is frase in english which means searching into unknown.

Now you are twisting what he said... He commented that what he meant when titans first it was in a ingame book based on ingame characters knowledge and it was said in his books titans were god and by gods he meant perfect beings not divine beings and him bringing the side point up of that he didn't mean "actual divine beings" refers that he seed them as gods but by definition they aren't.

Azshara couldn't do what tidestone did in Manhattan for example and he we see in her warbringers how he fails against similiar amounts of water.

Many real world general consider the soldiers just game piece in a board does that make them a bad person? US general who fought against nazis and vietcon considered troops just pawns meaning the game piece in chess.

Well again its likely as blizzs keeps defending her.

(Autocorrect herself to that)You linked me the whole book give the page and the line or something which you are basing this on.
Do you know what consumed means?
Its being used in pasttence here its likely used up already and we no prove of it being spilled out though its a possibility yeah.

Neither can you as I gave real world examples here were person of lesser experience in actual battlefields or combat experience who act usually by reflexes and don't expect the attacks by their experience has given them the rexlexes and your are saying because you don't want admit it that its wrong.

[Jastall]

According to the short story We Ride Forth Bolvar used a fraction of the real power of the Helm and aparently the Lich King can steal the Will of any undead anytime he wanted. If a powerful being like Mograine had his will instantly stolen at that small moment how come he didn't do the same on Sylvannas? Does the Jailer have some kind of protection around her?

Also considering Arthas had Frostmourne and used the Full power of the Helm I think he could have won the battle.

That's easily explained admittedly, the Forsaken broke free from the Lich King's control in a way that the Horsemen never did. Exactly how is still kind of nebulous in the lore; Illidan's ritual weakened the Lich King enough so that his hold on his forces slipped, fine, but nothing of the sort happened (that we know of) when the Frozen Throne itself was stormed and the LK toppled. As well, following the Dark Mirror story, Sylvanas could just walk up to any Scourge and break the mind control with her plot-contextual magic scream at any time. So it seems the link is as strong as the plot needs it to be.

The better question is why Arthas didn't re-dominate the Ebon Blade the second they left holy ground if he could do it this entire time. Or at least when they marched on Icecrown itself.

[Super Dickmann]

The better question is why Arthas didn't re-dominate the Ebon Blade the second they left holy ground if he could do it this entire time. Or at least when they marched on Icecrown itself.

Not really all that hard to explain, in the sense that all of the Horsemen were raised by Bolvar and so were bound to him. Darion originally wasn't and he questioned Bolvar, but when he died at Light's Hope and got raised he was connected to Bolvar in the process and so was under his power.

[Jastall]

Not really all that hard to explain, in the sense that all of the Horsemen were raised by Bolvar and so were bound to him. Darion originally wasn't and he questioned Bolvar, but when he died at Light's Hope and got raised he was connected to Bolvar in the process and so was under his power.

The Deathlord raised the Horsemen, not Bolvar directly. Even if the PC is a non-entity for story purposes, Bolvar was frozen in an ice cube during Legion and so the Four were raised by agents of his, not by him, exactly how Arthas's DKs were. My question is why Bolvar keeps such a strong Presence in their minds even if he's a pretty hands-off Lich King all things considered, but Arthas couldn't reassert himself on even the nameless NPC DKs once they left Light's Hope. Darian handwaves it as righteous anger but it seems a pretty weak explanation to me when Arthas tapped into the Helm's powers more than Bolvar ever did.

As I said, it seems like the link between the LK and the Scourge as is strong as the plot allows it.

[Super Dickmann]

The Deathlord raised the Horsemen, not Bolvar directly. Even if the PC is a non-entity for story purposes, Bolvar was frozen in an ice cube during Legion and so the Four were raised by agents of his, not by him, exactly how Arthas's DKs were. My question is why Bolvar keeps such a strong Presence in their minds even if he's a pretty hands-off Lich King all things considered, but Arthas couldn't reassert himself on even the nameless NPC DKs once they left Light's Hope. Darian handwaves it as righteous anger but it seems a pretty weak explanation to me when Arthas tapped into the Helm's powers more than Bolvar ever did.

As I said, it seems like the link between the LK and the Scourge as is strong as the plot allows it.

The PC either doesn't exist (if we go by the stories and thank fuck for that) or is doing so using either Bolvar's power or at least his mark, which he gives you at the start of the Order Hall campaign. In any case he's directly involved in both their gathering and raising and the Light's Hope thing is only really done to get Darion killed and affirm his loyalty. There's some plot convenience to it, but not much as far as WoW writing goes.

As for the second part, what I'd prefer is that it's just a matter of where it happened, i.e Light's Hope, even Darion chalks up his freedom mostly to that. What I suspect they'll do if they address it at all is that it was Arthas's spirit rebelling against the Jailor and he was actually a good boy who didn't want to reassert control.

[darkoms]

Again lifted it really bothers me what word are you meaning this time?

They "peer into the void" not dabble in it and thats a descriprio and peering into void is frase in english which means searching into unknown.

Now you are twisting what he said... He commented that what he meant when titans first it was in a ingame book based on ingame characters knowledge and it was said in his books titans were god and by gods he meant perfect beings not divine beings and him bringing the side point up of that he didn't mean "actual divine beings" refers that he seed them as gods but by definition they aren't.

Azshara couldn't do what tidestone did in Manhattan for example and he we see in her warbringers how he fails against similiar amounts of water.

Many real world general consider the soldiers just game piece in a board does that make them a bad person? US general who fought against nazis and vietcon considered troops just pawns meaning the game piece in chess.

Well again its likely as blizzs keeps defending her.

(Autocorrect herself to that)You linked me the whole book give the page and the line or something which you are basing this on.
Do you know what consumed means?
Its being used in pasttence here its likely used up already and we no prove of it being spilled out though its a possibility yeah.

Neither can you as I gave real world examples here were person of lesser experience in actual battlefields or combat experience who act usually by reflexes and don't expect the attacks by their experience has given them the rexlexes and your are saying because you don't want admit it that its wrong.

Again, sorry, this is a translator. I mean he raise corpse.

Again. Will you give me proof that a creature of the Void can be subdued by the Fel? Or that warlocks don't use the Void?
Warlocks peer into the Void without hesitation, leveraging the chaos they glimpse within to devastating ends in battle — their greatest abilities are fueled by the souls they’ve harvested from their victims. They exploit powerful Shadow magic to manipulate and degrade the minds and bodies of their enemies.
Note that the Void is capitalized here. And then it says that they use Shadow magic.

So the developer himself meant something, didn't he? As I said, you find fault with words because you are offended that you lost the argument.

What? Manhattan? Oh yes, because in the heralds of war there was ordinary water, not the waters of the Well of Eternity. Also, I didn't understand how you determined whether the Tidestone can do such cool things in the hands of non-Azshara.

Yes, it does. Suvorov, a Russian general, considered it a huge failure if more soldiers' blood was shed than necessary.

And yet, in the game, they present it to the exact opposite of how they describe it.

Can't you read one page or what? Do you not understand that you need to read exactly the chapter about the Gods of Arakk or what? Should I quote to you myself or what? I cannot copy + paste from this page, and I am too lazy to rewrite manually.
As I said, this is an ASSUMPTION, but it is strange that the Wild Gods appeared exactly in the places where the water of the Well of Eternity was poured. They are beings of Life, not arcane, so apparently the Spirit was in the Source of Eternity.

Magtheridon quickly became lazy and, apparently, lost his skills. As I said, Mannoroth was not expecting an attack. You are simply overestimating his reflexes.

[LedZeppelin]

Didnt he already beat her once? How would she deal with infest?

[Terongor]

Again, sorry, this is a translator. I mean he raise corpse.

Again. Will you give me proof that a creature of the Void can be subdued by the Fel? Or that warlocks don't use the Void?
Warlocks peer into the Void without hesitation, leveraging the chaos they glimpse within to devastating ends in battle — their greatest abilities are fueled by the souls they’ve harvested from their victims. They exploit powerful Shadow magic to manipulate and degrade the minds and bodies of their enemies.
Note that the Void is capitalized here. And then it says that they use Shadow magic.

So the developer himself meant something, didn't he? As I said, you find fault with words because you are offended that you lost the argument.

What? Manhattan? Oh yes, because in the heralds of war there was ordinary water, not the waters of the Well of Eternity. Also, I didn't understand how you determined whether the Tidestone can do such cool things in the hands of non-Azshara.

Yes, it does. Suvorov, a Russian general, considered it a huge failure if more soldiers' blood was shed than necessary.

And yet, in the game, they present it to the exact opposite of how they describe it.

Can't you read one page or what? Do you not understand that you need to read exactly the chapter about the Gods of Arakk or what? Should I quote to you myself or what? I cannot copy + paste from this page, and I am too lazy to rewrite manually.
As I said, this is an ASSUMPTION, but it is strange that the Wild Gods appeared exactly in the places where the water of the Well of Eternity was poured. They are beings of Life, not arcane, so apparently the Spirit was in the Source of Eternity.

Magtheridon quickly became lazy and, apparently, lost his skills. As I said, Mannoroth was not expecting an attack. You are simply overestimating his reflexes.

So but how does raised and ressurected translated as same?

Summon demon spells summons voidwalker which is a void creature and spell called summon demon summons a void creature makes it more towards fel.
Shadow magic is used by necromancer aswell and they used death meaning by your logic death magic users use void aswell and peer into void doesn't really mean that they use it if they mean the force could aswell be exploring it.

He wasn't a developer nor in a high enough position then to say metzen is wrong and in english god is defined as a divine being and he brought it up meaning he himself considers its still gods definition but he clarified that he meant god then as "perfect specimen" not a "divine being"

wrote it on phone autocorrect.Yeah the waters which drowned them was ordinary water by it wasn't all of azeroths seas by know would be same water as original sunwell.

and stalin made an order against nazis which they shot anyone who tried to retreat and we have many generals view on this and if we go by war waged in mediaval times average soldiers who were drafted serfs were considered as nothing sacrificiable.

and now we have this https://www.gamerbraves.com/world-of...nd-john-hight/

“We wanted to have some controversy, and we wanted people to misunderstand her, because she has deeper motivations."
“We’ve now got to go in and be part of fixing the Shadowlands, and along the way will finally understand why she did what she did. And I’ll leave it to you to be the judges, on whether you believe her, her motivations to be good or evil, or in the best interests of Azeroth” which implies blizzard is still on the same track.

When people are debating and using books as source they need to give the other person page and the which line its on the page atleast.

Quickly? Beyond the dark portal happened in years 8-9 while TFT happened in the year 22 and it was briefly mention how maghtheridon conquered it implying it was fast around 10 years of no opposition is fast? Seeing that reflexes can explain and keep the cutscene and the chronicles 3 both canon its most likely and it wouldn't be out of place.

[Shedaar]

Yes, she would demolish his toxic masculinity

+10, chuckled so hard xD

[Oneirophobia]

Well, it turns out Arthas got a lot of power from the jailor via Frostmourne. I don't think Sylvanas and Arthas would end up fighting at all, as it appears they may have been on the same side (although Sylvanas wasn't until after Arthas was gone).

I imagine if Arthas was getting his power from the Jailor's Frostmourne and Sylvanas was getting her's from a now freed Jailor directly that it is likely Arthas would lose.

Think of Arthas (or rather, Frostmourne) as Jailor's escape attempt #1, and Sylvanas is attempt #2. I guess Jailor learned from his mistakes that maybe it's better to have a puppet who isn't universally reviled right from the get go, and to have your puppet work in secret until it's too late to be stopped.

I think a lot of people in this thread are trying to bend this into "there's no way this whaman could best my favourite boi, this must be a political move by blizz to address toxic masculinity" as if a woman in a video game being an unrepentant genocidal maniac who feasts upon souls for power and is trying to cause the end of all life is a good look for females or something. Don't really get that but alright.

[Kharadin]

Pumped up on on death steroids, would she have had just as easy of a time against Arthas as she did with Bolvar and just played around with him? What do you think?

I feel like the combination of Frostmourne and greater experience/familiarity with his power means Arthas would definitely have put up more of a fight than Bolvar, though I can't say anything as to whether he'd have won or not, or even just have kept her hands off the helm.

Although I feel like that's the obvious response - isn't Frostmourne a much larger portion of Arthas's power than say, the helm or the armour? I'd certainly expect that Arthas before we killed him would have absolutely wiped the floor with Bolvar as he was before Sylvie slapped him around. What'd Bolvar really get out of being burned alive and then sat on a throne, keeping the scourge in check while AFK for a couple years?

[Drunkenvalley]

Frankly they've gone to great efforts to emphasize the gulf between Arthas and Bolvar. It isn't even clear if Sylvanas would've normally been capable of even reaching the throne under his rule. He was very heavily invested in great armies of the undead, after already inheriting the aftermath of the Third War. Unlike Bolvar, he was very willing to expand his power and his grip over it, and was deeply connected to it.

The Four Horsemen might've had a chance against Bolvar, or even against Sylvanas after donning the crown. At least that's what Bolvar and the Horsemen believed.

[darkoms]

So but how does raised and ressurected translated as same?

Summon demon spells summons voidwalker which is a void creature and spell called summon demon summons a void creature makes it more towards fel.
Shadow magic is used by necromancer aswell and they used death meaning by your logic death magic users use void aswell and peer into void doesn't really mean that they use it if they mean the force could aswell be exploring it.

He wasn't a developer nor in a high enough position then to say metzen is wrong and in english god is defined as a divine being and he brought it up meaning he himself considers its still gods definition but he clarified that he meant god then as "perfect specimen" not a "divine being"

wrote it on phone autocorrect.Yeah the waters which drowned them was ordinary water by it wasn't all of azeroths seas by know would be same water as original sunwell.

and stalin made an order against nazis which they shot anyone who tried to retreat and we have many generals view on this and if we go by war waged in mediaval times average soldiers who were drafted serfs were considered as nothing sacrificiable.

and now we have this https://www.gamerbraves.com/world-of...nd-john-hight/

“We wanted to have some controversy, and we wanted people to misunderstand her, because she has deeper motivations."
“We’ve now got to go in and be part of fixing the Shadowlands, and along the way will finally understand why she did what she did. And I’ll leave it to you to be the judges, on whether you believe her, her motivations to be good or evil, or in the best interests of Azeroth” which implies blizzard is still on the same track.

When people are debating and using books as source they need to give the other person page and the which line its on the page atleast.

Quickly? Beyond the dark portal happened in years 8-9 while TFT happened in the year 22 and it was briefly mention how maghtheridon conquered it implying it was fast around 10 years of no opposition is fast? Seeing that reflexes can explain and keep the cutscene and the chronicles 3 both canon its most likely and it wouldn't be out of place.

What's the difference? In any case, I gave you an example of raising undead by the power of Life.

And voidwalkers are also considered demons in the game, but as we know these are game mechs and they are not demons, but creatures of void. Tell me, if the Fel can summon and subjugate a Voidwalker, can you summon a light elemental the same way? Trent? Anyone from the shadow lands? Necromancers use Death. That is, they are all peering? And do nothing?

He was a senior historian, but yes, let's say he doesn't know lore. He also did not say that Metzen was wrong, he just explained what was meant by the gods. I still see no reason why I cannot call them gods due to their immense power.

How could this be ordinary water if it was the water of the Well of Eternity? The palace was in the epicenter of the explosion, what do you think happened to the water from the Well? I do not understand anything. What are the waters of all of Azeroth? What does Sunwell have to do with it?

Stalin was a HORRIBLE general. He was successful in pushing the war back by two years, but he was a disgusting strategist in himself, not to mention the fact that in the 1930s he shot many officers and generals. The war began horribly not only because the Soviet Union's technology was outdated and so on, but also because Stalin tried too much to command on his own. As soon as Zhukov and Rokossovsky began to command, the Soviet Union was able to provide normal resistance and launch a counteroffensive. But then again, I don’t know why you’re telling all this. We judge by the realities of our time, right? And we can confidently say that Sylvanas is heartless and cruel. Although, maybe I'm wrong, because after the first death, she got to some good place before Arthas burst her out, right? So she only deserved Hell after acting as an undead?

Or Blizzard just throws dust in your eyes, as was the case with Teldrassil, when it was obvious to all reasonable people that Sylvanas did it, but we were assured that it was not her.

So you started to assert that there are such words, although I did not give you anything. Could you please ask for this quote first? Although, in any case, I'm too lazy, and I don't see the difference between these words in this context.

How long do you think Mannoroth hadn't fought before meeting Grommash?) As I said, Mannoroth DIDN'T EXPECT the strike. I don't know why you are arguing with me and with the Chronicles.