New YouTube ToS.

[kamuimac]

A couple of days ago, YouTube updated their ToS, and it's apparently got some people mad.

https://variety.com/2020/digital/new...ng-1234834816/

hm there are adds on youtube ?

people still dont know how to use addblock in 2020 ?

[Frolk]

Billion dollar company wants to squeeze out a few more cent from each creator while not paying them anything.

Im TRUELY shocked that a greedy company like YT would be acting like a greedy billion dollar company.

Fuck YT, support the smaller sites whenever u can.

[Dezerte]

Seems hypocritical.

[Zuben]

I guess this means they wont backpedal on those awful mid-video ads.

[Graeham]

The only reason YouTube gets away with this is because there's no real alternative.

We need Apple or Microsoft to make a competitor to YouTube.

Unfortunately any viable alternative is likely to be bought out in due time and given the same treatment.

[Fencers]

Man, I have not even seen commercials in YEARS on Youtube. I have the adblocker installed from, I dunno, a decade at least. That prevented every commercial and AD on Youtube and most other places flawlessly.

It was only when I got Youtube Premium, that I discovered there were commercials on Youtube. I legitimately thought people only made money on Youtube from mention their sponsor in the video or from donations. I had no idea there was like an Allstate commercial airing before, Pasta Grannies or Vsauce videos.

[Rennadrel]

I mean, I thought the reason for demonetization was because advertisers didn't want to be associated with such content, by having their ads played within/around it.

I don't really have an issue with the idea that Youtube's gonna stick advertising on there and not pay creators; if it's in the TOS, you knew this was how it would work, and you could just . . . not post your content for them to profit off of. Or focus on Patreon as your financial backing. Or use Youtube as essentially "teasers" for your real content, hosted somewhere that monetizes you more advantageously. Creators have options, they're not being forced into giving up their content for free, here.

I just find it weirdly inconsistent with Youtube's original argument for demonetization.

The problem is that there is no reliable YouTube alternatives right now. Those that exist are notorious for having technical failures and outages because who knew that running server farms to host video content was expensive upkeep? Google has more than enough money to keep YouTube operational most other startups don't last long enough because they have no ad revenue generation to keep growing their servers.

The most prominent one that I know of is Bitchute and even they are getting screwed over. Twitter has blacklisted links to videos on that website, just because Bitchute has a different set of rules as far as what kind of content is allowed and how their rules are structured. Twitch is effectively useless if you are a creator who isn't a gamer because you'd likely just get DMCA'd into oblivion for whatever reason (and even video game streamers on Twitch are getting shafted by DMCA abuse) or banned because their rules are absolutely asinine. So unless someone can throw a huge pile of cash at Bitchute to improve their service, you are going to be hard pressed for content creators to be able to find places that give them as much exposure as YouTube does while also paying them for the revenue they generate as creators.

[Endus]

The problem is that there is no reliable YouTube alternatives right now. Those that exist are notorious for having technical failures and outages because who knew that running server farms to host video content was expensive upkeep? Google has more than enough money to keep YouTube operational most other startups don't last long enough because they have no ad revenue generation to keep growing their servers.

The most prominent one that I know of is Bitchute and even they are getting screwed over. Twitter has blacklisted links to videos on that website, just because Bitchute has a different set of rules as far as what kind of content is allowed and how their rules are structured. Twitch is effectively useless if you are a creator who isn't a gamer because you'd likely just get DMCA'd into oblivion for whatever reason (and even video game streamers on Twitch are getting shafted by DMCA abuse) or banned because their rules are absolutely asinine. So unless someone can throw a huge pile of cash at Bitchute to improve their service, you are going to be hard pressed for content creators to be able to find places that give them as much exposure as YouTube does while also paying them for the revenue they generate as creators.

That's why I suggested creators find other ways to monetize. Patreon in particular seems like a successful avenue for many. If you consider Youtube revenue a "nice bonus" but not your core income stream, being demonetized there is an irk, not a financial disaster.

Ideally, I'd like to see a complete reformation of the entire economic system, to create a society where corporate entities work for and with their own staff in pursuit of the interests of their consumers, as much or even a little more than their own profit margins. Which, yes, is a socialist model, before anyone says it; I'm hardly hiding my socialist views here. Short of that, there aren't a lot of ways to expect a predatory capitalist system to not act in its own predatory self-interest. Expecting Youtube to act for creators rather than shareholders is kind of like expecting a wolf to help a deer dig through the snow to get at some bark to eat, rather than just eating the deer; it's not what they're about, at any level. Which isn't me saying "wolves eating deer is great for the deer", it's me saying "it's a fuckin' wolf, doing wolf things; what did you expect?"

Not paying content creators is akin to the practice of unpaid internships. If people didn't accept the deal in exchange for what they saw as exposure worth the tradeoff, the practice wouldn't exist. That it's a shitty deal is why I oppose the economic model that supports it, rather than focusing on the specifics of any one as if they're not a symptom of a greater issue.

The lack of an alternative, similarly, is just a market response. In particular, Youtube has a primary role in their market not because of any control of supply or dastardly market manipulations, but for a much simpler reason. Customers prefer Youtube to its competitors. That'll continue until there's a competitor that's better than Youtube. That's not Youtube's fault, really.

Blaming a wolf for being a wolf isn't really a good argument. Maybe build an economy that isn't run by and with the intent of supporting wolves, exclusively.

[Fencers]

The problem is that there is no reliable YouTube alternatives right now. Those that exist are notorious for having technical failures and outages because who knew that running server farms to host video content was expensive upkeep? Google has more than enough money to keep YouTube operational most other startups don't last long enough because they have no ad revenue generation to keep growing their servers.

The most prominent one that I know of is Bitchute and even they are getting screwed over. Twitter has blacklisted links to videos on that website, just because Bitchute has a different set of rules as far as what kind of content is allowed and how their rules are structured. Twitch is effectively useless if you are a creator who isn't a gamer because you'd likely just get DMCA'd into oblivion for whatever reason (and even video game streamers on Twitch are getting shafted by DMCA abuse) or banned because their rules are absolutely asinine. So unless someone can throw a huge pile of cash at Bitchute to improve their service, you are going to be hard pressed for content creators to be able to find places that give them as much exposure as YouTube does while also paying them for the revenue they generate as creators.

Never heard of this site till reading your post. And well Twitter and other legitimate outlets ought to ostracize this type of site.

I went to the website and on the front page the top 8 videos were:

1. PROOF: Bernie Sanders & AOC caught sabotaging the Election
2. The Jewish Subtext to COVID and the US Election Fraud
3. SJW triggered by Space Buns
4. Extreme Lockdown Destroying Manitoba
5. Americans OPENLY DEFY COVID lockdown to celebrate Thanksgiving, Democrat Hypocrisy Sparks Defiance
6. Your Body, Your Choice, The Beginning of Vaccination
7. Explaining Black Crime and Violence on Buses is Exhausting
8. NINTENDO BANS POLITICS

White men hosted seven out of eight videos, a white woman hosted one video.

Yea, the money for Bit Chute is sure to be rolling in any day now.

[Very Tired]

The best thing anyone could really do is spread awareness of ad blocks. Takes less than a minute to install and saves hours upon hours of your time by not viewing or seeing ads. Honestly don't know why ad block isn't more of a thing. YouTube ads should really be falling in the same category as lottery tickets, MLM products, spam email, and televangelists seeing as they are just taxes for the stupid.

[select1a]

Never heard of this site till reading your post. And well Twitter and other legitimate outlets ought to ostracize this type of site.

I went to the website and on the front page the top 8 videos were:

1. PROOF: Bernie Sanders & AOC caught sabotaging the Election
2. The Jewish Subtext to COVID and the US Election Fraud
3. SJW triggered by Space Buns
4. Extreme Lockdown Destroying Manitoba
5. Americans OPENLY DEFY COVID lockdown to celebrate Thanksgiving, Democrat Hypocrisy Sparks Defiance
6. Your Body, Your Choice, The Beginning of Vaccination
7. Explaining Black Crime and Violence on Buses is Exhausting
8. NINTENDO BANS POLITICS

White men hosted seven out of eight videos, a white woman hosted one video.

Yea, the money for Bit Chute is sure to be rolling in any day now.

Youtuber Folding ideas had a great video on this, it was done years ago but it explains every youtube alternative ever. Every youtube alternative immediately gets exploited by people who were kicked off youtube. Some people are kicked off youtube for no good reason but many are not, and when they flock to the new site they immediately make it toxic. The new site is left with the option to censor all the toxicity, leaving a site with no traffic that resembles youtube, or accept the toxicity and alienate everyone who doesn't want to buy diet pills and loves the alt.right. Then they get wiped out by insane storage costs.

I suspect you could create a viable alternative to youtube by having a very narrow field of accepted content and deleting everything with less than a thousand views to cut down on storage. But I don't have a million dollars handy so I can't prove that.

- - - Updated - - -

The best thing anyone could really do is spread awareness of ad blocks. Takes less than a minute to install and saves hours upon hours of your time by not viewing or seeing ads. Honestly don't know why ad block isn't more of a thing.

Because most people understand that content creators have to be supported in some way, and don't want to come across as freeloaders.

[minteK917]

Even if you managed to make a non dogshit youtube alternative thats not flooded by alt right... guess who controls the search engine for people to find your website.

[Rennadrel]

Never heard of this site till reading your post. And well Twitter and other legitimate outlets ought to ostracize this type of site.

I went to the website and on the front page the top 8 videos were:

1. PROOF: Bernie Sanders & AOC caught sabotaging the Election
2. The Jewish Subtext to COVID and the US Election Fraud
3. SJW triggered by Space Buns
4. Extreme Lockdown Destroying Manitoba
5. Americans OPENLY DEFY COVID lockdown to celebrate Thanksgiving, Democrat Hypocrisy Sparks Defiance
6. Your Body, Your Choice, The Beginning of Vaccination
7. Explaining Black Crime and Violence on Buses is Exhausting
8. NINTENDO BANS POLITICS

White men hosted seven out of eight videos, a white woman hosted one video.

Yea, the money for Bit Chute is sure to be rolling in any day now.

Of course the people who got evicted from YouTube would go elsewhere to post their drivel, that shouldn't surprise anyone and I was already quite aware that there's a lot of stupid garbage on BitChute. You don't see that content on YouTube because those users have either been banned already or the algorithm doesn't allow them to show up. I know some creators are using both YouTube and BitChute to try and get traffic to the other site, while increasing visibility for legitimately good videos, just to help get the traffic to BitChute up and to improve the video quality there. I do concede that it's still very much trash and I wish they'd have some standards about what gets posted there. But there aren't a lot of good alternatives that are reliable.

@Endus But even Patreon has it's faults. I know plenty of artists have had issues with them trying to restrict where their art is shared to. Since Patreon has an affinity for banning NSFW art, some creators put that content on Pixiv, only to be kicked off Patreon for violating the rules of platform exclusivity, even though that content does violate their own rules about mature content.

- - - Updated - - -

Even if you managed to make a non dogshit youtube alternative thats not flooded by alt right... guess who controls the search engine for people to find your website.

There's plenty of other search engines aside from Google. Duck Duck Go is pretty good actually.

[Very Tired]

Because most people understand that content creators have to be supported in some way, and don't want to come across as freeloaders.

You can configure your ad block to allow ads from certain channels you want to support.

[Fencers]

Of course the people who got evicted from YouTube would go elsewhere to post their drivel, that shouldn't surprise anyone and I was already quite aware that there's a lot of stupid garbage on BitChute. You don't see that content on YouTube because those users have either been banned already or the algorithm doesn't allow them to show up. I know some creators are using both YouTube and BitChute to try and get traffic to the other site, while increasing visibility for legitimately good videos, just to help get the traffic to BitChute up and to improve the video quality there. I do concede that it's still very much trash and I wish they'd have some standards about what gets posted there. But there aren't a lot of good alternatives that are reliable.

I work in market research as my day job. About 8 years now working with clients such as Samsung, Pepsi Co., Frito-Lay, Nestle (who are trash btw), Motorola, LG, Disney, McDonald's, and other major brands and corporations.

Brother, these corporations will NEVER support anything less than the most mainstream and strict platforms for content.

I can not stress enough, how much of an immediate no-go it would be for Pepsi (for example) to advertise on Bit Chute knowingly just even had X million number of users nowadays. Brands position themselves to the tenure of the culture they are trying to reach and 'anything goes' sites with open policies on racism, sexism, and bigotry and conspiracy theories are not it chief.

[Rennadrel]

I work in market research as my day job. About 8 years now working with clients such as Samsung, Pepsi Co., Frito-Lay, Nestle (who are trash btw), Motorola, LG, Disney, McDonald's, and other major brands and corporations.

Brother, these corporations will NEVER support anything less than the most mainstream and strict platforms for content.

I can not stress enough, how much of an immediate no-go it would be for Pepsi (for example) to advertise on Bit Chute knowingly just even had X million number of users nowadays. Brands position themselves to the tenure of the culture they are trying to reach and 'anything goes' sites with open policies on racism, sexism, and bigotry and conspiracy theories are not it chief.

Sure, they aren't, at least until the point when they aren't getting a reasonable return on their investment. If YouTube lost an insurmountable amount of viewers, or even content creators who drive clicks on the site and by that extension ads, they'd have no choice but to change their marketing strategies. I doubt it'll happen, but there's always that possibility.

[select1a]

You can configure your ad block to allow ads from certain channels you want to support.

You can but most don't.

[Fencers]

Sure, they aren't, at least until the point when they aren't getting a reasonable return on their investment. If YouTube lost an insurmountable amount of viewers, or even content creators who drive clicks on the site and by that extension ads, they'd have no choice but to change their marketing strategies. I doubt it'll happen, but there's always that possibility.

No, it's not. I am telling you it would NEVER happen. There is no scenario corporations are going to advertise on any platform which does not have strict guidelines for terms of use. There is no possibility. They will NEVER advertise on such a platform- a divisive platform at that too?

Companies are more likely to send ads via print magazines, even if YT collapsed utterly than advertise on a platform that would harm, split or associate the brand with anything controversial such as "Covid and the Jewish Agenda".

It would NEVER happen.

[Endus]

Sure, they aren't, at least until the point when they aren't getting a reasonable return on their investment. If YouTube lost an insurmountable amount of viewers, or even content creators who drive clicks on the site and by that extension ads, they'd have no choice but to change their marketing strategies. I doubt it'll happen, but there's always that possibility.

It's not just about return on investment for campaigns on that site.

It's the public backlash when it turns out their ads are supporting that content.

They won't invest a couple million into a Parler ad campaign if that campaign is going to lose them tens of millions in sales from non-Parler-using customers, angry that they're implicitly endorsing that kind of content.

Sometimes, you can blow through that outcry, because there's enough bigots to back you to make it up. Happened with Chik-Fil-A a few years back. Not usually, though. And likely only possible for Chik-Fil-A because they're not truly a national chain yet, let alone multinational, and their market stronghold is in States where such views see more popular support.

[Fencers]

There wasn't even a Chik-Fil-A in my hometown till like, 2010.