To be honest, Anduin is the cancer of story.

[loras]

Considering that everything you mentioned is unlikely to have any consequences whatsoever, as is generally the case every time the Alliance does something... less than heroic, we can safely write them out of the equation.



Not only the entire Alliance leadership, with the sole exception of Tyrande and maybe Malfie, is fawning over Anduin, but also all of the Horde leadership as well. The only two characters (Rokhan and Talanji) who reject Anduin's ideals of white peace are written as unreasonable, stupid warmongers.



It isn't as odd when you consider that Sylvanas was pretty much the only OG character remaining (aside from Bob and Thrall, who are currently non entities and are likely to remain so) in the Horde, only to be turned into a crappy remake of Garrosh.

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Some people mistake predictability and good writing. Yes, Andy is consistent and predictable, but that doesn't make him any better. After all, all (non evil) Mary Sue's (or Gary Stu's, if you prefer) are consistent and predictable, since the world is written around them, not the other way around.

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Yeah, Saurfang discussing deep historical issues of the Horde with the leader of the enemy faction, out of all people, was one of the most facepalm-worthy moments in the entire story.

Well yeah, the horde has a way of constantly one-upping the alliance on the scales of evil, kinda makes it hard to even notice those sorts of things when it just doesn't stand out next to the horde.

I've seen little unexplained fawning, Velen has that mentor thing, Genn sees himself as his surrogate father and the Bronzebeards were rather close to him and his family beforehand.
That leaves pretty much no one to fawn over him without reason, and few enough to do so with reason.

Bob seems quite influential, and it's not that hard to see why new characters might defer to the OG's and their stance on Anduin.
And Sylvanas is not exactly the sort to inspire trust of any sort, even if just because of her undead nature, though i assume many of her schemes and fiasco's might be well known through the world by now as well, further reducing any trust and deferment to her stances on matters.

[Ealyssa]

Mary Sue is a term used to describe a fictional character, usually female, who is seen as too perfect and almost boring for lack of flaws

Anduin has many flaws de facto puting him out of the definition.

[Soon-TM]

Anduin has many flaws de facto puting him out of the definition.

The problem is that none of those supposed flaws have any actual consequences for him - for all intents and purposes, he is perfect. Furthermore, like every single (non evil) Mary Sue, he's almost universally loved, and the very few characters who aren't already drooling for him are depicted in a very negative way. Just google "Purity Sue" and tell me with a straight face that it doesn't fit Andy boi like a glove.

[nonameelf]

He's a very typical chosen one teenage hero archetype and it's incredibly boring and bland at this point. Kill him off and stop turning WoW into a poorly written YA novel.

[omeomorfismo]

I can't believe people are saying Anduin is the most well-written character in the game. Like....what? You legitimately think this? Because he's a predictable Gary Stu who can never do anything wrong. The fact that Golden, who writes for Anduin, is in charge of him means he will always be a boring as fuck Gary Stu.

you know, when the alternative are constantly retconned character (like sylvanas or genn) or ones that not appease any fanbase (baine) its easy to be the most well written, even being bad written..

[deenman]

This boy king and the other human kings like him play at leadership, when they have so few years of experience! It is in Tyrande we must place our faith, by the Light of Elune, we are guided!

For Teldrassil.

UGHHHH...Ishnu-alah, weary traveller ! (ﾐዋ ﻌ ዋﾐ)

[Caerule]

I don't get this perception of Anduin Wrynn as a Mary Sue or the new Thrall.

What annoyed us about Thrall is that he was everywhere. Too much of the story became about him. To the point where he solved every problem. I don't think Anduin's been too present or too useful.

I don't think he's been too Mary Sue either. He's not taking our kills. He's not succeeding despite incredible adversity. He's not universally liked. He's a peacekeeper in Warcraft. That makes him a doomed and tragic character, destined only to fail. As the war is inevitable. The most Mary Sue thing to happen to him is inheriting his position as High King.

I don't think he's too pure and flawless either. He punched Wrathion. He's been showing hints of dark power. Sure, he generally means well. But unless he wins Sylvanas over to his side in the next patch, I'm not seeing it. So people just don't like him because he represents the "good" side, making characters they like more, look bad?

[therealbowser]

Anduin is one of the few likable, honest characters in WoW, if that makes you think it's 'cancer' that says a lot about yourself tbh.

He's a bit boring at times sure, but you really seem to hate him for reasons unlisted here.

PS: You literally have no clue what a Mary Sue is.

[Thage]

I can't stand him either... and when you think that they killed Varian for Anduin to step up... Remember Varian and Garrosh? Damn, this were characters, I could not wait for them to meet in combat and they never did. Blizz really has all the capabilities to make the lore great but they somehow make it... not great.

I remember that Varian and Garrosh were plot tumors pretty much every time they showed up on-screen. Garrosh went from simpering by a bonfire to insulting the hero single-handedly responsible for stepping up and saving his clan from extinction while he was too busy feeling sad because Daddy turned out to be a bad person, when literally everyone around him was screaming at him to man the fuck up and lead. I'm supposed to believe that crybaby suddenly became some badass who deserved his position as Overlord of the Northrend operation? (well, no, odds are he got the position through pure nepotism and Blizzard crammed in justifications that he wasn't an abject fuckup after the fact in The Shattering and Heart of War once they realized nobody would rally behind a lobotomy patient as Warchief)

Varian wasn't much better. He's missing for a decade, and the second he comes back, Blizzard pushes him harder than the WWE pushes Roman Reigns. They hand him the Onyxia kill in-lore (something that caused an uproar among players since it was the first time a lore character decisively stole our accomplishments and got singular credit), and as soon as he shows up, all of a sudden literally the rest of the Alliance give him unilateral command over their forces. Magni and Tyrande, who were helping hold the Alliance together while Varian was missing and Prestor was ripping Stormwind apart from within? Completely written out of the plot until Magni got turned to stone, and the next time Tyrande did anything meaningful it was to be patronized by Varian on basic military tactics you'd think someone who's been running a military for ten thousand years would have stumbled across by pure accident if nothing else.

And every time these two shared a screen, idiocy ensued. What's that? We're fighting the Lich King and literally every dead soldier reinforces his army? Let's fight! What's that? An ancient Titan facility opened up and there's an Old God buried deep within that's been causing serious problems for both of us? Fuck that, we have shitty one-liners and penis-waggling to engage in. What's that? The Horde is carrying out a full-scale invasion of Ashenvale? Let's do nothing as the king of Stormwind runs headfirst into an oncoming army to satiate his ego against the Warchief of the Horde.

They sure were characters alright, but let's not pretend they were any better-written than Anduin, or that Blizzard wasn't just as obnoxious in relentlessly shoving them down everyones' throats as him, or that they were any less guilty of twisting and warping other characters around them so nobody had enough functioning brain cells to tell them they were being retards when they put their penis-waving match as a higher priority than the Scourge or Yogg-Saron.

[Frozen Death Knight]

I like Anduin. I really like how he grew over the course of the expansions and the dynamic he had with Varian. The way he became his own man in Legion with the lessons passed on from his father by finding a balance between his old values and the lessons Varian bestowed upon him I think was done pretty well. Probably one of the more well rounded characters written in WoW with most of his major development being possible to follow in-game from expansion to expansion.

[therealbowser]

Honestly I’m very curious, who was worst in 94?

Also, this please. I'm curious too now.

[Thage]

Also, this please. I'm curious too now.

Pick a character written by Rob Liefeld out of a hat, I s'pose.

[therealbowser]

Pick a character written by Rob Liefeld out of a hat, I s'pose.

I'm curious who the OP was referring to. That's a specific date so they had someone in mind.

[geco]

Anduin is one of the few likable, honest characters in WoW, if that makes you think it's 'cancer' that says a lot about yourself tbh.

He's a bit boring at times sure, but you really seem to hate him for reasons unlisted here.

PS: You literally have no clue what a Mary Sue is.

The guy who betrayed the Kaldorei laughed at his dead has the position of "leader of the alliance" when he did not earn it.
And all this is taken to mean that he is good and the rest are bad.

That's a Merry Sue and besides, he's not a lovable guy.

Anduin is the Judge who frees the rapist and rewards him and then sends him to live alongside the victims. And apart from how the judge is, they say everything is fine.

Anduin has many flaws de facto puting him out of the definition.

Which?
Which does not automatically become that he is right and everyone else is wrong?

[Soon-TM]

you literally have no clue what a Mary Sue is.

I'm hearing this line very often ITT from the handful of Anduin lovers, but almost no one bothers to elaborate. The most I see is hE hAz fLaW tHeN nOt MaRY sUe LuL

The whole point of Anduin's particular variant of Sue-dom is precisely that: a character made to be overly positive. Whatever flaws he may have are purely discursive (i.e. they don't carry any consequences at all, at least not for him) and as @Fleugen put it, his virtues are nowhere to be seen, other than being a handsome, blonde idealistic teen. Which is apparently enough to command the univocal admiration from almost every. Single. Major. Character - and the few who don't unequivocally love him are depicted as "edgy", or straight up evil.

[geco]

The best example of Anduin being a Merry Sue is everyone saying that Tyrande went crazy with revenge.

Tyrande. Who is willing to give the Horde a chance if they prove themselves worthy. That she is following a peace treaty that she did not sign. The one who spares Sira's life even though she used to just kill Wardens. The one who listens to her councilors before making her decisions, even if they are councils that she does not like.

Tyrande has never shown herself to be blind with revenge. But she opposes Adnuin so she has to be bad. No?

[Powerogue]

Can you name an instance where an of these "mistakes" haven't ultimately been proven right in the end?

Trusting Sylvanas.

[loras]

The best example of Anduin being a Merry Sue is everyone saying that Tyrande went crazy with revenge.

Tyrande. Who is willing to give the Horde a chance if they prove themselves worthy. That she is following a peace treaty that she did not sign. The one who spares Sira's life even though she used to just kill Wardens. The one who listens to her councilors before making her decisions, even if they are councils that she does not like.

Tyrande has never shown herself to be blind with revenge. But she opposes Adnuin so she has to be bad. No?

At what point did they say that though?
Most i've heard is comments that she's likely to lose herself in revenge - which is hardly unfair given the nature of the night warrior ritual, and it's not exactly unheard of for very emotional people to be blinded by said emotions regardless of how good a reason they have for such emotions.

Also i've seen no one consider her bad other than a few people on this forum that pretend she is so for melodramatic or comedic purposes.

[Powerogue]

Minor point here:

That wasn't Anduin who trusted Sylvanas, that was Varian

Because of Anduin. I thought that was obvious by the fact he monologues the entire cinematic as a letter to Anduin talking about how much he's learned and changed because of Anduin, but apparently that wasn't clear enough.

[geco]

At what point did they say that though?
Most i've heard is comments that she's likely to lose herself in revenge - which is hardly unfair given the nature of the night warrior ritual, and it's not exactly unheard of for very emotional people to be blinded by said emotions regardless of how good a reason they have for such emotions.

Also i've seen no one consider her bad other than a few people on this forum that pretend she is so for melodramatic or comedic purposes.

Well but the ritual still didn't show us anything about her being crazy either.

Trusting Sylvanas.

They had not made it more than clear that all this happened because they had deceived the spies of the alliance?
But if not. Does anyone even blame Anduin?