1. #16501
    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    I asked YOU why the risk of breaking in unnanounced.

    Yes, it was a no knock warrant.



    Lecturing by itself is not wrong and it does not matter if someone is from a different country. Most people should be aware by this point that the USA is seen as a joke regarding obsession with guns/gun laws and for a reason.
    Before you go REEEEEE let me note that I am not exactly supporting his way of lecturing, in case you can't tell.
    It becomes an issue when they ignore literally everything people from the country are saying about the police structure in the country.

    White Americans are tone-deaf to this issue enough already let alone some semi-racist European.

  2. #16502
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    I find troubling that the Police Officers would take that risk because everyone can be armed and they have the right to shoot intruder, as you said. So why the risk ?

    And was it a no knock warrant ?
    If you don't know this shit, you should probably look it up before you make a fool of yourself.

  3. #16503
    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    001100010010011110100001101101110011
    Posts
    22,952
    Quote Originally Posted by Krakan View Post
    Words are a tricky thing I admit. Try reading mine rather then trying to pass off yours.

    The issue is genuine I've seen some rather disturbing videos of cops doing horrendous things from shooting a man who surrendered to having the audacity to plant a taser on a body of a person they wrongfully shot.

    The problem with these riots and yes they are riots is none of these cases are these. Yes the message they trying to forward is a valid one but they hitch their carts to the worst possible examples for it.
    No the issue is you think minor crimes deserve death as a punishment. While the rest of us say we have a legal system for a purpose.
    MMO-Champ the place where calling out trolls get you into more trouble than trolling.

  4. #16504
    12/6/2009 -23/11/2020 rip little deathstalker Ferretti. proud forsaken, enemy of the livings

  5. #16505
    At least, they did not shot him.

    Joke aside, even "if" he rebelled, he should have not ended up in that state. Those Police Officers should be sanctioned then cast off the "Police Nationale".

  6. #16506
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    At least, they did not shot him.

    Joke aside, even "if" he rebelled, he should have not ended up in that state. Those Police Officers should be sanctioned then cast off the "Police Nationale".
    they are suspended in fact and macron even said that france cant accept this police conduct (or something like this, im translating from france->italian->english).
    but this in a situation where, from my understanding, macron's government is trying to push some shaddy law against the diffusion of photo and video of french policemen
    12/6/2009 -23/11/2020 rip little deathstalker Ferretti. proud forsaken, enemy of the livings

  7. #16507
    Quote Originally Posted by omeomorfismo View Post
    they are suspended in fact and macron even said that france cant accept this police conduct (or something like this, im translating from france->italian->english).
    but this in a situation where, from my understanding, macron's government is trying to push some shaddy law against the diffusion of photo and video of french policemen
    That law, in fact the "article 24" of that law, states that you can't post video of Police Officers if we can see their face (so they can't be recognized by any shaddy individual). Though you can still post that video if you blur their faces.

    It is a gross sum up, the issue is far more complex than that.

  8. #16508
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Ottawa, ON
    Posts
    78,910
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    That law, in fact the "article 24" of that law, states that you can't post video of Police Officers if we can see their face (so they can't be recognized by any shaddy individual). Though you can still post that video if you blur their faces.

    It is a gross sum up, the issue is far more complex than that.
    They're in public service. In public spaces. Doing official work. They shouldn't have any expectations of privacy.

    I assume they have to identify themselves to members of the public, and have their names and badge numbers on their uniforms. How is their face any different?


  9. #16509
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    They're in public service. In public spaces. Doing official work. They shouldn't have any expectations of privacy.

    I assume they have to identify themselves to members of the public, and have their names and badge numbers on their uniforms. How is their face any different?
    Because a Police Officer face can be recognized, thus his family becoming a target.

    Obviously, any Police Officer should always have his badge and "ID number" on him (though it is unfortunately non mandatory) and they should have body cam as well always running (they are becoming more and more mandatory).

  10. #16510
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Ottawa, ON
    Posts
    78,910
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    Because a Police Officer face can be recognized, thus his family becoming a target.
    Names and such can be recognized, too.

    I do not see why police officers should ever expect anonymity on the job. It runs directly counter to their civic responsibilities.


  11. #16511
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Names and such can be recognized, too.

    I do not see why police officers should ever expect anonymity on the job. It runs directly counter to their civic responsibilities.
    Police Officers do not wear badge with their name but with an ID number which can't be recognized.

    So you do not mind putting innocents at risk ?

  12. #16512
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Ottawa, ON
    Posts
    78,910
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    Police Officers do not wear badge with their name but with an ID number which can't be recognized.
    I've literally never had an interaction with an officer where they refused to give me their name. Nor do I see any grounds under which they shouldn't be obliged to give out their name, rank, and ID number when asked by a citizen.

    So you do not mind putting innocents at risk ?
    Stuff that noise. A police officer identifying themselves puts no one innocent at risk. It doesn't even put the officer at risk. The only reason to fear giving out that information is if you're engaging in unlawful conduct as an officer and don't want to have it reported to your superiors.

    The only real exception to this is undercover work with organized crime, where the officer both has a false identity they're supporting, and the people they're undercover with are dangerous enough to warrant such considerations.

    If you're just engaging in normal beat cop stuff, managing protestors or conducting normal arrests or the like? You have no need for anonymity. You, and your family, are already protected from unlawful persecution.


  13. #16513
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    I've literally never had an interaction with an officer where they refused to give me their name. Nor do I see any grounds under which they shouldn't be obliged to give out their name, rank, and ID number when asked by a citizen.



    Stuff that noise. A police officer identifying themselves puts no one innocent at risk. It doesn't even put the officer at risk. The only reason to fear giving out that information is if you're engaging in unlawful conduct as an officer and don't want to have it reported to your superiors.

    The only real exception to this is undercover work with organized crime, where the officer both has a false identity they're supporting, and the people they're undercover with are dangerous enough to warrant such considerations.

    If you're just engaging in normal beat cop stuff, managing protestors or conducting normal arrests or the like? You have no need for anonymity. You, and your family, are already protected from unlawful persecution.
    A Police Officer should refuse to give his name to any citizen but should give his ID when asked, simple as that.

    And as I guess, you do not care about what can happen to families of Police Officers. Even if the Police Officer did some unlawful action, and is properly reported, he will (depending of his actions): lose his job and do prison time. That is punishment enough. You do not need to put his family in danger.

    Same if he did lawful action, and some people are trying to get revenge on him.

  14. #16514
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Ottawa, ON
    Posts
    78,910
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    A Police Officer should refuse to give his name to any citizen but should give his ID when asked, simple as that.
    That's . . . the same thing.

    And as I guess, you do not care about what can happen to families of Police Officers.
    I said stuff that noise.

    This is you being baity, dishonest, and abusively misrepresenting my points. I'm not giving it further consideration until you start playing fair.


  15. #16515
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    A Police Officer should refuse to give his name to any citizen but should give his ID when asked, simple as that.

    And as I guess, you do not care about what can happen to families of Police Officers. Even if the Police Officer did some unlawful action, and is properly reported, he will (depending of his actions): lose his job and do prison time. That is punishment enough. You do not need to put his family in danger.

    Same if he did lawful action, and some people are trying to get revenge on him.
    You are aware they are public workers and their names and salary information is often available online because they are public workers who serve the public

    the problem is that doesn't happen... it's as though you have no fucking clue what thread you're in. Is this like the affliction of clueless kind of racist Europeans?

  16. #16516
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Aelia Capitolina
    Posts
    59,338
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    A Police Officer should refuse to give his name to any citizen but should give his ID when asked, simple as that.
    Why do you have a problem with accountability?
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  17. #16517
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    That's . . . the same thing.



    I said stuff that noise.

    This is you being baity, dishonest, and abusively misrepresenting my points. I'm not giving it further consideration until you start playing fair.
    With ID, I am talking about their ID number which is not something that is publicly accessible.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Themius View Post
    You are aware they are public workers and their names and salary information is often available online because they are public workers who serve the public

    the problem is that doesn't happen... it's as though you have no fucking clue what thread you're in. Is this like the affliction of clueless kind of racist Europeans?
    Name of Police Officers are not available onliney. I do not know where you get that from. I wonder who is clueless here.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Why do you have a problem with accountability?
    Right when I was talking about someone clueless..

  18. #16518
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    Name of Police Officers are not available onliney. I do not know where you get that from. I wonder who is clueless here.
    https://www.oaklandca.gov/staff

    They appear to be in Oakland, along with every what looks like every other public city employee. Which kinda makes sense considering they're all technically employed by the local taxpayers, after all. And the city email addresses for them, too

    It seems that you keep getting at that officers and their families would be at risk from the broader public if they were known to be police officers, or something? Or am I way off the mark here.

  19. #16519
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://www.oaklandca.gov/staff

    They appear to be in Oakland, along with every what looks like every other public city employee. Which kinda makes sense considering they're all technically employed by the local taxpayers, after all. And the city email addresses for them, too

    It seems that you keep getting at that officers and their families would be at risk from the broader public if they were known to be police officers, or something? Or am I way off the mark here.
    And they are not in my country, should I remind you we are talking about a law of MY country ?

  20. #16520
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Aelia Capitolina
    Posts
    59,338
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    And they are not in my country, should I remind you we are talking about a law of MY country ?
    Cool, this thread is about the United States.

    French law is only relevant insofar as it provides a cautionary tale in terms of rampant antisemitism or of generating a chronic terrorism problem by being imperialist and then brutalising the people you import.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •