Spying in Torghast - Sylvanas and The Jailer Cutscene

[Lucetia]

We are, he sees the entire Shadowlands as HIS realm and judging from the disarray its in due to his influence he is correct in thinking this.

Except it's not, not even close. That's like me saying I think an entire country is mine and meaning that it is, or calling dibs on something and still not getting it. The only thing the Jailer has control of or can manipulate is The Maw and anything in it, currently. It might expand later but right now he doesn't

Right now we are doing what ...collecting anima, what does he need? Anima,

Except none of that anima is going to him at all. It's all being funneled to the convenants to separate chambers that won't make it to the Maw. If he was later to invade these realms and break the containment chambers then sure. Also, nothing in the maw indicates he needs anima or wants it. He just wants souls to fuel and become his weapons. Even the "mobs / weapons" in the mob don't contain Anima and are known to contain Stygia as Ve'nari mentions.

also he didn't capture Anduin as he never lost him, he seemed far more interested in us being able interact and use the ancient tech than he did with what Anduin was doing.

He did lose Anduin. He had each of them chained up and in cages. Jaina kept escaping only to be captured again along with Thrall. Anduin was chained up and protected by another lesser jailer. He even thought he had killed Baine. We freed each one of them and they were recaptured later on.

It's not that he was "more interested" in what we did. He was there to reclaim what he had taken and in the process saw us activate the waystone which he found interesting. Doesn't mean it changes his plans or was his intention at all. He saw what Anduin was capable of in a weakened state and found that to be a lot more interesting and how he can mold it to because his weapon.

Ever since I stepped foot in the Shadowlands I have had the feeling I am doing exactly what he wants, going around and collecting Anima and storing it, fighting and killing anything that could oppose him, finding legendary plans and restoring them to the Runecarver, training and honing my skills in the Maw fighting his best combatants.

We are his weapon and everything we are doing is part of that "Honing" he talks about.

(it is so similar to what The Lich king had us doing in Wrath, everything we were doing was a test, Arthas wanted the best Azeroth had to offer, The Jailer does too)

That can be your interpretation but nothing story wise has even came close to giving off that vibe or stance. Arthas in Wrath it was known that he always wanted to add the best and he never strayed from telling us he wanted us in his armies.

If anything, I've gotten a different feeling altogether. Right now the story has shown that the four covenant leaders we see (as there are more realms, but the story mentions how these four did it) have imprisoned the Jailer (I think they said how, but I can't remember exactly how off hand). We also know that they created the Arbiter to replace the Jailer's original role. Those are the definite things and the rest is mostly speculation.

Though one thing I've felt is that the vibe given off is that the covenant leaders we see could possibly be corrupt and felt like the Jailer wasn't giving them what they wanted so they condemned him to the Maw. Then they created the Arbiter who would do their bidding essentially.

[TheFirstOnes]

D-d-d-dare I say.......

human potential?

Anduin is a Saiyan CONFIRMED. Nah, jk. But yeah, it's not even Human Potential anymore. Bwonsamdi literally tells Mueh'zala that Mortals were never as weak as he claimed, and that they had "potential". Note that this is after we beat Mueh'zala. We're all Super Saiyan Blues LMAO

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maybe he just wants to escape the maw, and he needs some light guidance for that.

Except the Light literally has no power in the Shadowlands. The Anima is the thing empowering the Jailer enough to escape the Shadowlands. Besides, the Jailer literally said he was wanting to prepare Anduin as "an ultimate weapon". AN ULTIMATE WEAPON!

[HitRefresh]

Except the Light literally has no power in the Shadowlands.

What about the dungeon with the Naaru who says something like "The Light shines even here" and the last two fights revolve around using the Light ability with her?

[Lurker1]

Maybe it's because im 40 year old now but im just not feeling it this expansion heck i rather play any new games or old by now vs wow i think im just tired of the gameplays not the expansion its amazeing to me love the cut scences sorry for the random venting was just wondering if i was the only one thinking this way.

[Vakir]

Anduin is a Saiyan CONFIRMED. Nah, jk. But yeah, it's not even Human Potential anymore. Bwonsamdi literally tells Mueh'zala that Mortals were never as weak as he claimed, and that they had "potential". Note that this is after we beat Mueh'zala. We're all Super Saiyan Blues LMAO

Yeah, considering the very eyebrow waggle way he said it and the wording, it felt like all but a wink to the audience of the human potential meme.

[TheFirstOnes]

What about the dungeon with the Naaru who says something like "The Light shines even here" and the last two fights revolve around using the Light ability with her?

The Shadowlands consists of no Light, so I don't think the Maw has light either. However, beings such as the Naaru can still wield the light, as they're not native to the Shadowlands, and can still call upon their magics based on their beliefs and whatnot. It's why we got Demons in the Shadowlands wielding Fel, or why the Void nearly destroyed the Shadowlands during their invasion with the Light.

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Yeah, considering the very eyebrow waggle way he said it and the wording, it felt like all but a wink to the audience of the human potential meme.

Yeah, it's wacky, and kinda irritating.

[Biomega]

Fixing faction imbalance by creating new factions?

Only possible way to fix faction imbalance is to eliminate factions.

Factions are integral to the way the game is set up. The problem right now isn't that we have factions, it's that they're GROSSLY unequal for various reasons, mostly historic. And now we're trapped in the situation where there's very little incentive for the big faction (Horde) to swap to the small faction when they're already enjoying all the various perks - game and social - that come with being the big faction. Top guilds for example have repeatedly said that while they might switch temporarily for a faction-specific perk (like racials being super useful on a particular raid boss) to them the fact that their recruitment pool is so much larger, the economy is so much deeper, etc. on Horde simply means they'll never permanently switch.

Redistributing players into a new faction system would be a very elegant solution to this. That's not to say I think it's LIKELY they'll do this - but it certainly would be a good way of addressing faction imbalance.

[Sentynel]

Factions are integral to the way the game is set up. The problem right now isn't that we have factions, it's that they're GROSSLY unequal for various reasons, mostly historic. And now we're trapped in the situation where there's very little incentive for the big faction (Horde) to swap to the small faction when they're already enjoying all the various perks - game and social - that come with being the big faction. Top guilds for example have repeatedly said that while they might switch temporarily for a faction-specific perk (like racials being super useful on a particular raid boss) to them the fact that their recruitment pool is so much larger, the economy is so much deeper, etc. on Horde simply means they'll never permanently switch.

Redistributing players into a new faction system would be a very elegant solution to this. That's not to say I think it's LIKELY they'll do this - but it certainly would be a good way of addressing faction imbalance.

"Redistributing" players into new factions solves dogshit.

Players will choose the faction that has more population and/or better perks. Same shit will start again.

Also factions are in no way integral to the game. Story wise factions unite every other expansion against the current bad guy. Battlegrounds have Mercenary mode for years. They just need to flip the switch to allow cross-faction play in PvE content and change Mercenary mode to the same shit they had for BoD where you automatically switch factions after the loading screen.

[Maljinwo]

The Jailer is the most uninteresting villain this game has produced so far

[Biomega]

"Redistributing" players into new factions solves dogshit.

Players will choose the faction that has more population and/or better perks. Same shit will start again.

You do realize that if they just make people choose new factions those factions will have.... no people in them to start with? And as for perks, that's just a balancing issue - they got that pretty wrong in the past and it snowballed into what we have now, but perks have actually been fairly balanced in recent times and in any event there wouldn't even have to BE any perks beyond RP and identity. In fact if factions are no longer centered around races, that would solve the racial issue before it even starts.

[Sentynel]

You do realize that if they just make people choose new factions those factions will have.... no people in them to start with? And as for perks, that's just a balancing issue - they got that pretty wrong in the past and it snowballed into what we have now, but perks have actually been fairly balanced in recent times and in any event there wouldn't even have to BE any perks beyond RP and identity. In fact if factions are no longer centered around races, that would solve the racial issue before it even starts.

In the age of live streaming and "twitch influencers" people will pick the faction that their favorite streamer chooses. And from that point it's herd mentality and snowball all over again.

Faction exclusivity and creating artificial barriers in a 16 year old game is suicide.

[Biomega]

In the age of live streaming and "twitch influencers" people will pick the faction that their favorite streamer chooses. And from that point it's herd mentality and snowball all over again.

Faction exclusivity and creating artificial barriers in a 16 year old game is suicide.

It took nearly half a DECADE at least for things to spiral out of control.

Unless there's some strange, overwhelming reason, there is simply no way that ALL the streamers would go for one faction only. There's simply too many of them to make that a reality without existing biases.

[Verdugo]

Seems the Jailer wants Anduin because he's got a ton of Potential, especially with the LIGHT...

But why does the Jailer want someone that can use the LIGHT? Is it because he wants to stop something in the SHADOW so that he could claim the Cosmos for himself?

Mhm...

I think he is after different kind of potential when it comes to Anduin.

[bagina]

It's pretty cute. I couldn't help but have a little laugh (in a good way) when they were walking next to each other.

I know right? It reminded me of "don't talk to me or my son/daughter ever again" meme.

[Packmule]

It’s hinting for me that Tyrande is gonna be the new puppet of the jailer, she’s full of revenge and anger. And she is one powefull foe. Aka a good asset to bend the mind to the will of the jailer. Wouldnt know why else shed be so overshadowed while she is supposedly in the maw

[mingarrubia]

So now Sylvanas is protecting Anduin from the Jailer.

I think I got this all figured out.

Zovaal wants to forge a new Shadowmourne and a new Helm of Domination. He has kidnapped Azeroth’s leaders (Anduin, Thrall, Jaina and Baine) because (supposedly) they would be the perfect candidates to wield them.

Sylvanas on the other hand is secretly plotting against Zovaal, because ultimately she blames him for what she has become (Azshara vs. N’zoth all over again, but in this case Sylvanas wants FREEDOM, not just raw power).

So there are basically two possibilities: either Zovaal is a fool and his foolishness will cause his demise, OR he is tricking Sylvanas into believing that he wants Anduin and the others, when in truth what he really intends to do is to enslave her as the new Lich Queen.

Do we know anything about Arthas’ soul whereabouts, btw?

[ParanoiD84]

How original.

Jailer must be one of the worst baddies too.

[TheFirstOnes]

I think he is after different kind of potential when it comes to Anduin.

You sure? Because the Jailer was impressed by Anduin's massive power, especially in the light, during the Maw cinematic.

[Verdugo]

You sure? Because the Jailer was impressed by Anduin's massive power, especially in the light, during the Maw cinematic.

He was propably impressed by his mastery in human potential, Anduin must truly be blessed by a Golden god.

[Doffen]

Seems the Jailer wants Anduin because he's got a ton of Potential, especially with the LIGHT...

But why does the Jailer want someone that can use the LIGHT? Is it because he wants to stop something in the SHADOW so that he could claim the Cosmos for himself?

Mhm...

I like this one. Maybe the Void is their real big enemy too, just like The Burning Legion. The Jailer used them, and for that very purpose perhaps?

Maybe thats Kerr, eh Sylvanas redemption arc. Get rid of the Void and we live happily ever after in the realm of death for the rest of our eternity. I have been saying this for almost 3 years about Sylvis story, her redemption arc, the latest info do not make me doubt it for a second.