First raid overall difficulty?

[Cracked]

I’m not sure about the tuning but i’ve noticed torgast with 3-4 people is exceptionally easier than with 5. Maybe the same with raids?

Is it? I usually make 5 dps groups and we blast through it, thought it's pretty annoying that traps will oneshot you. Tank in a group adds a lot of health and damage to the mobs from what I heard.

[prwraith]

Eh they're definitley overtuned even 12/12m guilds are struggling right now. I want to struggle on mythic not heroic/normal. If this is how it's going to be going forward it will kill the raiding scene for anyone outside the top 500 or so. Nobody wants to smash their faces on these difficulties.

[Krakan]

Eh they're definitley overtuned even 12/12m guilds are struggling right now. I want to struggle on mythic not heroic/normal. If this is how it's going to be going forward it will kill the raiding scene for anyone outside the top 500 or so. Nobody wants to smash their faces on these difficulties.

They nerfed a boss by 60% because its abilites were doing more on heroic then mythic...

Their lack of testing is showing pretty hard this tier.

[Zaylin]

Most top guilds have 3 boss killed already (the very best are on the 7th) according to WoWProgress and America have had a whole day ahead of EU. Seems like they haven't tried normal.

From streams I've seen, playing with people discovering the raid in the most part while playing in a raiding guild, are getting a few boss kills, around 6 bosses, on the first day. Which is pretty good and doesn't seem overtuned since the majority of the raid never tried the bosses before that.

It's hard to say for now but it wouldn't be that surprising if the average raiding guild manages to clear around 8 bosses the first week, or even get to the final boss. But saying it's overtuned because your average joe can't clear the raid on normal difficulty, the first day within a few hours, all this while discovering boss mechanics each time, is kind of precocious.

Your contradicting yourself here. And your wrong. 6 boss kills would put you in the top 5 atm. The top 100 guilds in world are 2% 7 bosses, 2% 6 ,11% 5, 22% 4, 49% 3, 14% 2.

These numbers are insane. The majority of the best players in the world cant get past 3 bosses.

[msdos]

Yeah you can tell Normal is tuned up the moment you touch the boss, which is funny because the trash is rather weak so far, which is kinda how I like my raid. Numerous, weak trash, over tuned bosses.

I realized doing the raid that the span on my gearing just stretched out almost double. FDK is so so gear dependent and I need soooooo much of it and I don't feel like grinding dungeons all day.

I'm fine with this, but I can see my guild getting "antsy" and not wanting to wait 2 months for everyone (me) to gear to farm the raid.

[aceperson]

i knew normal was a bit overtuned but i didn't realize that even limit said screw this. i thought that maybe it was just being a bit undergeared since i'm in a new guild for this starting tier.

[Nynax]

people know they are bad at game.

thats why they have no problem to stick to lfr/normal .

its a fallacy that players 1 day will suddenly rise to the chalenge and decide that they want ot be hc mode raiders .

^ this is quite true. Players that like to be challenged, are generally already challenging themselves. People looking to games for stress free downtime will simply avoid things that cause frustration and stress.

[Twdft]

It's not overtuned. You don't have near heroic ilvl ready for when the raids open. You actually have to do normal first, then progress heroic with the loot you got from normal. Titanforging is no longer a thing and you can't do splits as efficiently anymore. Therefore you actually have to do normal in order to do heroic, and you need some heroic gear to finish the thing.

We're talking about world first guilds struggling halfway through heroic. The skill difference between them and everyone else is staggering. World first guilds never needed gear from normal to have a chance at heroic, they "got gud" and clear the place undergeared.

[Krakan]

i knew normal was a bit overtuned but i didn't realize that even limit said screw this. i thought that maybe it was just being a bit undergeared since i'm in a new guild for this starting tier.

I mean the content wasn't tested... there has already been a 60% nerf because a bosses mechanic was doing close to six times its damage it does on mythic...

I would read to much into it till blizzard does a balance patch just going by dungeon journal numbers a lot of bosses are hitting for significantly less damage on mythic then they are on heroic.

[rrayy]

and again - as was officialy stated by blizzard they admited years ago that players dont get better -nplayers quit playing WoW.

aparently you people want players to stop playing WoW.

Link to where they stated that. They never said that because unless they know every single palyer personally, they can't possibly prove it. You are outright lying.

[Scathan]

Overtuned. Limit just quit and did other shit. We did heroic shriek and went to normal

I don't think it's overturned people just don't have an inflated ilvl from tf

[Doffen]

w=1]
people who are skilled have mythic raiding to do.

people who are not skilled now have nothing to do and will quit game

they quit in past - they will quit now too.

unless your aim is to actually kill wow for good

its exackly the same bs that we seen in WoD - copied almost 1:1

Just make normal easy then but keep heroic harder.

On another note, its being naturally harder now because we don't get tossed gear after us in SL, which is a step in the right direction imo.

Legion and BfA:
Blizz: Here, take the gear.
Player: No, I don't want it!
Blizz: Take it!!
Player: No, piss off!
Blizz: Fucking take it and be fucking happy!

Shadowlands:
Player: Plz Blizz, give me gear, boss won't die.
Blizz: No, git gud.
Player: Pliiiis, just one item...
Blizz: NO!
Player: Just a couple of bracers? I take poor stats too, pleeeease?
Blizz: Uninstall.

[ClassicPeon]

^ this is quite true. Players that like to be challenged, are generally already challenging themselves. People looking to games for stress free downtime will simply avoid things that cause frustration and stress.

a 5 man normal dungeon with 185+ ilvl on everyone can cause stress if you dont know how to press ubttons on your keyboard

Its a fallacy because the perception of whats challenging is different for everyone. The people who dont want to push 15+ keys find their challenge in lower keys where they dont have to play aswell to beat the content but still be challenged. The people who dont like m+ find their challenge in mythic dungeons where knowing your rotation isnt nessesary. The people who dont like mythic dungeons find their challenge in heroic dungeons where having chosen a spec isnt nessesary to complete the content. And the people who dont like heroic dungeons find their challenge in normal dungeons where being able to breathe while hitting random buttons is a way of succeeding.

[Scathan]

Eh they're definitley overtuned even 12/12m guilds are struggling right now. I want to struggle on mythic not heroic/normal. If this is how it's going to be going forward it will kill the raiding scene for anyone outside the top 500 or so. Nobody wants to smash their faces on these difficulties.

Lmao. Pathetic. Is that what raiding has become? If its not mythic I don't want to be challenged while I am undergeared? So awful

[kamuimac]

^ this is quite true. Players that like to be challenged, are generally already challenging themselves. People looking to games for stress free downtime will simply avoid things that cause frustration and stress.

people who want to play stress free are exact audient of normal raids.

that was stated by blizzard numerous times

and yet they go at it again . again expecting different resoult

thats textbook definition of insanity - doing things exackly the same and expecting different resoult next time.

- - - Updated - - -

Lmao. Pathetic. Is that what raiding has become? If its not mythic I don't want to be challenged while I am undergeared? So awful

12/12 m guilds are 0,01 % of playersbase.

that how bad this tuning is .

[Justintime328]

Mannnnn, I dont want to hear this shit from any of ya'll. Cry when its hard , Cry when its easy. Lets just enjoy the damn thing who the fuck are you to say anything is over tuned it's tuned the way they wanted it tuned.

[hulkgor]

Normal Castle Nathria lasted infinitely times longer than Naxx did on Classic.

Weird world we live in.

Funny way to look at it, but completely accurate.

[prwraith]

Lmao. Pathetic. Is that what raiding has become? If its not mythic I don't want to be challenged while I am undergeared? So awful

Yea, clearly the top % players are the problem here. But please inject your clearly valued opinion more. Being intimately familiar with the expectations of normal / heroic / mythic. Having cleared all content *consistently* I can say either there's been a major policy departure in what these difficulties entail. Or they're overtuned.

[Baconeggcheese]

nah - they know they hae 0 content to offer to players so they went Cata/Mop route

they overtuned raids - gated them by lack of conduits / legendaries upgrades and made gear scarse

this way you average player will take 2 months to clear normal and rest of tier to clear hc unless they spam mythic + for gear

this plan will backfire so badly though it will be shocking - with cyberpunk coming out and milions of players playing that rather then boring like f... SL endgame .

overtuned normal difficulty will also kill the last remains of interest in this game that casuals have.

so gg blizzard - for making WoD 2.0 - greates Ion succes so far

Ya'll are weird, if guilds aren't pissing through the raid in 1 night for their respective difficulty then they're killing raiding for those players? Are we kidding here?

I absolutely love the tuning this xpac not just for the raids but for everything. I don't just walk into zones like a plague that just ravages through absolutely everything trivially. We were doing M+ yesterday and I actually have to pay attention on a 7, its fantastic.

[A Chozo]

if you've seen the pugs on twitch, half the player ain't even doing the mechanics, they just wanna power through it.

This is a big problem with modern raiders. Most players can't do their maximum DPS and mechanics, so they... stay in the fire doing DPS. Then the boss wins.