Torghast storyline -time-gating-

[vlange]

First, this game is not created purely to serve the type of person that likes to play it 16 hours a day 7 days in the week. The game is created with the average gamer in mind and the average gamer is far from what you'd call a hardcore gamer. There are millions of gamers and most of them probably have full-time jobs, go to school, have kids and/or have other plans. Most of them can't or won't take holidays for the release of a game. It wouldn't even be ethical to create a game for the hardcore gamer and Blizzard even communicates this in some tips. They might want your money, but they don't want you to waste your life on a game that only has entertainment as main goal.

So when you create something for thekind of gamer who has a few hours on three evenings in a week and a bit more time in the weekend, you don't want to give them the feeling they are missing out big-time. Without the gating it would be exactly that. Only the top % of players who level in no-time and did everything there was to do in the first three days of the first week might manage to keep up and not feel like they are being forced to keep playing when they can't afford it.

It may be a bummer for you, but you are one among milions and belong to a part of the target audience that does not have the main focus for Blizzard.

[centavo]

The worst part about Torghast storyline isn't that it's time gated, but that there is no catch up mechanic. I missed quest in first week, so I will save Jaina next week. Why? Just let me catch up!

[Mehrunes]

Well they aren't suppose to be super amazing or anything and are more for cosmetic type stuff. Which is funny because this is what people wanted. Anima / Souls aren't necessary for power grinds but still give stuff to work on for those that want it. You can completely bypass Sanctum upgrades if you wanted. You could skip the 1,000 Anima quest if you want and just catchup the following week or do the quest and ignore the upgrades.

Which is, you know, the point? They give no power, yet are more heavily gated than any prior or current "main base" mechanic that actually affects your strength. To max out all of them you'd need more than half a year. With there being no catch up for souls. Even though the cosmetics are still RNG drops from the stuff you unlock and aren't just given to you automatically once you max out a given structure.

People wanted more alt friendliness. Blizzard gives them more alt friendliness by toning down the stuff you do at max level. People then complain. Even then there is still plenty to do on your mains without feeling overwhelmed.

There really isn't that much time saved in Shadowlands compared to BfA on release. Farming a bit of Azerite for necklace each day is about all you had to do, aside from the usual dungeon/raid/pvp content.

Now you have to slog through Torghast, with no catch up for souls ash (unlike AP). And god forbid you get shit anima powers RNG, because then you likely have to repeat the thing on your alt that's likely less geared. And due to that, the upgrades from Venari are even more useful for your alts, meaning Maw slog as well.

[AcidX]

What? I pulled Jaina out of there yesterday.

Uhm no ? How ? wtf

[Kolvarg]

That is how it has always worked. The story doesn't stop in order for us to reach X rep and then everything continues. It is all a steady progress no matter what mechanics and stuff happen in between. Because that is just how a game works as opposed to a book or movie. It is silly to just start complaining about it now when it has been around forever.

It can be done better without attunements, though. For instance - simply don't make group content that's based on story that's timegated. For example: make the first dungeons and raid centered around story everyone experienced while leveling up, and save the raid that's based on the covenant campaigns for the next patches.

Think of it as a TV serial that drops a new episode every week...

The difference being that the majority of those don't ask for a monthly subscription, certainly not one just for that TV serial alone.

[Lucetia]

To max out all of them you'd need more than half a year. With there being no catch up for souls. Even though the cosmetics are still RNG drops from the stuff you unlock.

You might miss some weeks if you skip the redeemed souls (as I know you get the initial 5 if you skip intro on alts and can do that weekly too), but as you progress through the story you upgrade your soulkeeper at 15/24/32 with 32 capping at 20 I believe (I saw a few say 25 though; but 20 sounds better as it is a +5 upgrade each time.) and overall cap of 100.

So as the story progresses you'll get a lot more. In order to cap everything out it'll take 18.5 weeks which is only 1/3 of a year not more than half a year. If anything you might need more time to get all the anima unless you are actively farming it in mass quantities.

There really isn't that much time saved in Shadowlands compared to BfA on release. Farming a bit of Azerite for necklace each day is about all you had to do, aside from the usual dungeon/raid/pvp content.

Depends on the player and their goal. Some would try to farm as much Azerite as possible. More casual style players would do very little. The model they have now is both types of players aren't forced to constantly farm at all.

Now you have to slog through Torghast, with no catch up for souls ash (unlike AP).

I've heard you can catchup on Soul Ash, but I can't confirm as I haven't messed with my alts enough.

And god forbid you get shit anima powers RNG, because then you likely have to repeat the thing on your alt that's likely less geared. And due to that, the upgrades from Venari are even more useful for your alts, meaning Maw slog as well.

Anima powers can suck a lot sometimes as I've had my bad share of them. I've heard people clearing 1-3 floors and if they didn't like them they left and restarted. I haven't done that method yet as I try to push through.

With that said though since I'm not worried about my alts as much having their legendaries, as I would almost bet there is a catchup later if not one already, I've been doing Maw Weeklies on my alts and buying the Torghast upgrades on them since they are account wide. Then on my main by the Maw upgrades, individual characters. That way my alts still contribute to Torghast and when they start doing them more they'll have all the benefits unlocked which would include more Anima Power offerings, etc.

Uhm no ? How ? wtf

This week is freeing Jaina. Have you been doing all the quests? If not, I'm not sure if there is a catchup in some form or not but if you have done them every week then you free her. Launch week was freeing Baine, last week was searching for Jaina and this week was rescuing her.

[Vilendor]

Why three weeks later the story of Torghast is still closed? We don't have a quest to save Thrall, Jaina and Anduin. Closed cinematic "no more lies" and unknown cinematic, where The Jailer says "you know what must be done" why is it still hidden?

Lets be realistic here for a second (and im not a fanboy defending ShitZard):

The amount of content they were able to put into the game is finite. We can argue if they created enough or not, but that's not the main point. Without time gating no matter how much story they put in the game there would be a TON of people no-life it within weeks then cry on forums for more. Time gating is a necessary evil to give a healthy lifespan to the expansion. And so far it seems healthy to me. You have something to do every week and the plot line keeps going (also, we saved Jaina this week). Now compare that to BFA story telling...

[Lucetia]

It can be done better without attunements, though. For instance - simply don't make group content that's based on story that's timegated. For example: make the first dungeons and raid centered around story everyone experienced while leveling up, and save the raid that's based on the covenant campaigns for the next patches.

Well the raid is up to what everyone has done. Venthyr just get a "This happened behind the scenes" type deal, but everyone going into Castle has seen the story and know why we are there.

[valax]

it's timegated to retain the non-raiding , non-m+pushing crowds , at least for 2 monthly payments. You can expect to save thrall next week and maybe doing something involving anduin the 4th week after launch. They have been doing this since ToT back in pandaria either by timegating or damage-gating allowing you to complete some content weeks after you first start doing it.

[Malania]

The worst part about Torghast storyline isn't that it's time gated, but that there is no catch up mechanic. I missed quest in first week, so I will save Jaina next week. Why? Just let me catch up!

No, you sit your arse down and you play when we damn well tell you.

- - - Updated - - -

Uhm no ? How ? wtf

Weekly reset Bolvar has you go in for a quest to get some information and then when you've completed that you have to go back in to rescue our glorious Lord Admiral of whom, I will one day have pixel babies with.

[AcidX]

No, you sit your arse down and you play when we damn well tell you.

- - - Updated - - -



Weekly reset Bolvar has you go in for a quest to get some information and then when you've completed that you have to go back in to rescue our glorious Lord Admiral of whom, I will one day have pixel babies with.

So we will save them week for week.

[Queendom]

Pretty good when you think about it. Encourages people to do other things and leave peoples with a cliff hanger of how their covenant is going to play out. It's gated content what hasn't been gated in wow?

It's only a cliffhanger if the story is worth it, otherwise it's just gate. I don't think WoW story is interesting enough to use cliffhangers.

[rhorle]

It can be done better without attunements, though. For instance - simply don't make group content that's based on story that's timegated. For example: make the first dungeons and raid centered around story everyone experienced while leveling up, and save the raid that's based on the covenant campaigns for the next patches.

But that is essentially an attunement though because you are requiring X in order to see Y. The story leveling up has usually been skippable. This is the first time where Blizzard actually required you to do it all on your first character. In previous expansions you could move on as soon as you hit 60. Because story in WoW has never been linear that required you to turn the last page in order to see the next page. It also means the first raid will be disconnected from the story because it is just "filler" and the real story takes place in the next patch.

Also wouldn't your way require that a player see all four Covenants first before a raid can be released? Since all four have their own story that interweaves with what is happening in the Shadowlands? Its a video game not a book. Some things won't make sense if you treat it like a book.

[GreenJesus]

I just got the Bwonsamdi - Muezhala storyline yesterday that leads up to De Other Side - pity that I've cleared De Other Side several times already before I had that quest - this is just really bad writing. At least had the campaign unlocked to this point before you're able to do the dungeon or something like that. It just makes no sense at all the way it is done right now (and it's very obvious why it's done the way it is; and it's not to be more alt friendly).

This is the key part that is very frustrating with timegating/stories locked behind covenants. I've done all these dungeons that occur after the covenant campaign yet I have no context for what is going on or get spoiled about what happens in the campaign. For example: The Kyrian covenant campaign has a "big reveal" that Devos is the traitor... meanwhile I've done that dungeon like 10 times already. It is clear that these stories weren't planned to be gated this way when they wrote it originally. At least FF14 makes you progress the story to unlock dungeons that you are actually canonically able to be at at that point.

[Malania]

So we will save them week for week.

Yeah, pretty much. Thrall is next in a week or 2. Don't think Anduin is in the list as he's still in there and has that cutscene.

[Ratyrel]

This is the key part that is very frustrating with timegating/stories locked behind covenants. I've done all these dungeons that occur after the covenant campaign yet I have no context for what is going on or get spoiled about what happens in the campaign. For example: The Kyrian covenant campaign has a "big reveal" that Devos is the traitor... meanwhile I've done that dungeon like 10 times already. It is clear that these stories weren't planned to be gated this way when they wrote it originally. At least FF14 makes you progress the story to unlock dungeons that you are actually canonically able to be at at that point.

I must say I agree with this wholeheartedly. It is very awkward to be jumping around the story like this; the fact that the covenant campaigns explain dungeons also means that you never actually get an explanation for many dungeons unless you play alts. I wish the quest design had addressed this problem.

[Arwelsa]

Ok, assuming no time gating. People would just rush through it and then be whining that there isn't any content until 9.1 (6 Months?)

Lose/Lose situation really.

I think the best way to combat this would be to do two things, Rep gated AND time gated. So those who want to progress faster have to grind rep, but those who don’t the content will still be time gated. Because making people wait to play a storyline per week isn’t right (we pay to play the game, we should be given all the content that is available within that patch without having to wait). At the same time those who cannot hardcore game might not be able to reach the rep gates and should be still able to play the game (time gating).

Just a thought